Nothing! Just figured you folks were better at melee. We really should beef up our ranged abilities.
Speaking of ranged weapons Rayse does have a sling which is OK I guess, you can add str mod to damage. But when we've got a bit more money I'd like to get him a composite bow.
Anyway I suspect going into the water is a mistake.
Yeah, we should aim for a composite bow for Rayse and a repeating heavy crossbow for Vormog. With Elephant in the Room, there's no prerequisite for Precise Shot, and it's the prereq for Rapid Shot, so either of you could become a ranged menace with a feat or two, especially since you get Deadly Aim for free.
Checking in.
All good here! I've been diving into the full release of Hades II, which is an excellent game.
So what's the game plan here, do we want to try and bait them to come to us? They're obviously not keen on that idea. I don't mind taking the fight to them, but not alone.
I think we should focus on the leader. Getting into melee combat with him will give you additional protection from missile attacks. Between that, your mage armor, and cover from the ship, you should be able to ignore the ones still in the water and just go to town on him. The same is true for Vormog. The rest of us can hang back and use our line of sight abilities to support you and frustrate our enemies from the edge of the mist.
Not much I can help with!
You might use your whip to Aid Another on the leader, or to Disarm the other tritons. (That won't put you in melee, but you could drop prone at the end of your turn as a free action to reduce the threat of missile fire.)
Whatever you choose, I suggest ending your turn further from the ship's railings.
I had to move where I did, to attack that elemental. And they're not up on deck, right? They're in the water.
The leader is apparently in the prow of the boat.
From the silver-grey mist, a figure rises. Bronze-skinned, glistening wet, with hair streaming like seaweed in the wind, he climbs fully onto the deck as if it were a natural extension of the sea itself...Nerianus plants his spear tip against the deck...
The others seem to be within whip reach.
Well, I don't know how high we're riding out of the water.
GM?
Frosthamar has been described as sitting heavy in the water, laden with iron. She is easy to climb in and out of. There is no height advantage one way or the other.
I have an idea for a post. Expect by Friday, mid-day.
My read on the Protective Luck hex is that, while Cackle may be used normally to extend the hex, it does not allow you to use Protective Luck on more than one target at a time. I happen to think witches are not otherwise OP, but the potence of this particular hex, at least how I've allowed it to be used so far, is too strong. We'll correct beginning with the next encounter.
Interesting. I've heard it argued that protective luck was similar to the fortune hex and therefore shouldn't be usable more than once per day on any one person. That is wrong because fortune covers all d20 rolls, not just physical attacks. Also that cackle should only be able to extend one instance of any hex. And finally that soothsayer shouldn't work with it. I prefer your limitation to any of those. The second is definitely wrong since you can hit one target with multiple applications of evil eye and extend all of them.
There are obvious weaknesses to hexes. Protective luck only affects physical attacks. No effect on magic. And I can't move, cackle and do another hex. Personally I hate that one. And, all of my hexes, including cackle are limited to 30'. And cackle is canceled if it isn't heard.
So, Would I be allowed to use protective luck on one ally, and evil eye on an enemy and extend both with cackle? And if/when I take soothsayer, can I use that with protective luck to cover one ally? I'm fine with the limitations. Just need to know before I choose my hex if we survive to reach third level.
So, Would I be allowed to use protective luck on one ally, and evil eye on an enemy and extend both with cackle? And if/when I take soothsayer, can I use that with protective luck to cover one ally?
Actually, re-reading Cackle, it can only be used for these hexes: Agony, Charm, Evil Eye, Fortune, and Misfortune. Soothsayer is even more limited.
The description of Protective Luck specifies that, "Hexes that affect the Fortune hex, such as Cackle, also affect Protective Luck", so Cackle extends it and Soothsayer works with it too. (It was published after Cackle and Soothsayer).
For what it's worth, I've seen witches use Protective Luck on multiple targets at the same time in organized play, either using Cackle or because it lasts longer at higher level.
Also FWIW, the hex can be placed on multiple targets in the Wrath of the Righteous video game.
It's strong in this particular fight because the enemy gave us so many rounds to buff. Also, it's a strong option at level 2, about as powerful as an untyped +4 or 5 to AC. Later on, Treesa will have other options that make spending literally every single standard and move action on that effect less attractive.
Nerfing it seems unnecessary to me, but since I doubt we'd want to leverage it like this very often, I don't think it will matter either way.
I've played witches and it never occurred to me to use Cackle on anything other than the hexes listed in RAW. Like I said, I don't think of Witch as an overly strong class, so I will probably allow it but Protective Luck may only be used on one target at a time. We'll play Soothsayer as written.
We'll play Soothsayer as written.
Whoops, I edited my post while you were writing your reply! Sorry about that. RAW, Soothsayer works on Fortune, so it works on Protective Luck.
Lines from:
Soothsayer: "When the witch uses the evil eye hex, fortune hex, misfortune hex, or retribution major hex, she can choose to delay the effect."
Protective Luck: "Hexes that affect the fortune hex, such as cackle, also affect protective luck."
I'm fine with limiting it to a single target. And I agree with Rendylyn. It's powerful at second level. But once our armor classes make it harder for us to be hit there are more useful things to be doing with hexes and spells.
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I second that. The witch class is very interesting because it fixes a classical problem with the wizard, who is very weak at early levels and very powerful at higher levels. The witch is a very strong class early on due to hexes. At later levels casting spells become better action economy, but the witch's spell list is not as powerful as the wizard's, fixing the power gap.
I'm also trying to play Treesa as growing in to her power with her situation. I chose evil eye and cackle first because she was alone and needed a way to weaken any enemies. Now she has team mates so she needed a hex to protect them, to make the team stronger.
I considered the slumber hex, but I've heard lots of complaints that it is over-powered. It really is a save-or-suck effect as long as someone can CDG the enemy if it falls asleep. I still plan to take it, but not yet.
Looking ahead at the major hexes and grand hexes.... There are some really powerful things there! Ice tomb, restless slumber, withering, animal servant, forced reincarnation....
...Cook People...
Lines from:
Soothsayer: "When the witch uses the evil eye hex, fortune hex, misfortune hex, or retribution major hex, she can choose to delay the effect."Protective Luck: "Hexes that affect the fortune hex, such as cackle, also affect protective luck."
This is lousy writing.
This is lousy writing.
LOL! Yes it is. They've never been known for great rules writing. That's why people are constantly hitting them for FAQs. If you've been playing for as long as I have you know that these rules are actually much better than the original. Those were pretty much, "the DM is in charge" and makes his/her own house rules for anything not covered, and "The rule of cool" sometimes covered anything! But, it's really mostly about having fun, and rules lawyers spoil that.
In a different game I have a witch that uses the soothsayer hex and protective luck but does not have cackle. All of the characters (except the witch since she can't use it on herself) start every encounter with protective luck active. When they get attacked, individually, it is active for one round. Then it ends. If I'm not doing anything else I can target one of the characters again.... This gets REALLY tedious as it makes my 1st level witch a 1-hit wonder for most encounters. Also, I find that I have to track who has been attacked so who still has the PL hex active.
But, it ruins any surprise attacks, so it's not all bad.
"What is best in life?"
"To crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentations of their women"
That's the fun of the game. Crush your enemies!
@Treesa, is it your intention to use Soothsayer with Fortune for the whole party and then Cackle?
So, what you originally said about it. ??
We'll play Soothsayer as written.
So you will not allow Soothsayer for anything other than the hexes listed in it? "evil eye hex, fortune hex, misfortune hex, or retribution major hex"
Just checking so I can leave it, or remove it from my "build plans". (Around level 8 considering other things that are more important....)
And thanks for your patience.
I'm having trouble finding the Hexes on your character sheet.
...Cook People...
You know, I had forgotten that one cause I never get to play evil characters. That one is really cool if you have a virtually endless line of people to kill/cook! And then it's just "Here's a cookie for you. Takes care of what ails you, or makes you stronger/faster/etc. for an hour!" Is it overpowered? not at that level. I might want to work that in on my list!
@Treesa, see my previous 2 posts.
...Cook People...I had forgotten that one cause I never get to play evil characters.
Yeah, its main appeal here is, "What other campaign would I ever get to use this in?" It requires the Cauldron hex, though, so it's only going to be appealing if the campaign gives us downtime for crafting. Which, if it includes a lot of boat rides, it might!
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Soothsayer with Fortune: No. I don't like the Fortune hex. I would only be using Soothsayer to put Protective Luck on one target.
Trouble finding the hexes on CS: They were under Class. I reorganized and put them under their own spoiler so it is easier to find. Also added how/when they were taken.
@Rendylyn: Hmm.... My very first witch took the cauldron hex, and a lot of points in craft alchemy. Got an alchemist's kit and a Cauldron of Brewing. Add a minor bag of holding and that sounds like fun! I think we might have to take crafting feats to make some of the magic items though. Being persona-non-Grata in the kingdom doesn't lead to just go waltzing into places where we can purchase magic items. The only issue then would be where we get the crafting supplies for crafting the magic items. The rules list gold piece cost for it. But I've never felt that you could just dump a pile of gold on as table and cast the spells, then 'bam' and the item appears? I mean, put a stick and 375 GP down. Say the magic words and the gold disappears and you have a brand new wand of Cure Light Wounds.... ??
RL got turned upside down this week. I'm not bowing out but just a warning that my stress level is high and I'm usually a low key guy. The games are a good distraction but I may be less inspired to fill in all the gaps in the AP. Roll with me.
All good
Sorry to hear you're having crazy times, GMT. The big advantage of having a prewritten adventure is that you can coast on it when you need to, so don't think twice about doing it.
How does XP work in this adventure? Since we're not tracking it, I'm guessing there's built-in milestones?
AP awards XP per kill or challenge. But the books have a range, per usual. Level 2 feels right yet.