Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber
Well, speaking of robot feet, how about we touch on some non-robot fins! The high Seas and deep oceans od Golarion!
High Seas:
Adaro - The predatory shark-people of Golarion typically act as enemies due to their frightening and aggressive bloodlust. But they sometime manage to put their need to feed aside in order to adventure and achieve a long-term objective. Just hope they don't turn as soon as you've completed it. Playable in PF1.
Azerketi - Expanded Gillfolk options seems like a fin-in, especially in regards to their more seafaring members. Learning about some of their communities would be quite swell.
Beastkin (+ Werecreatures) - Aquatic and amphibious types specifically. Weresharks in particular are likely ones immediate thought; but there are also Wereray. There are a plethora of ocean animals that make for compelling options here.
Cecaelia - The octopus-like Cecaelia have a lot of potential to be very interesting. They live and travel in a roaming consortium, hunting, scavenging, and trading with others. They do, however, make up a portion of Xidao as well. Their own alleged kingdom, Sihuw, is said to reside within the center of the Embaral Ocean. Playable in PF1.
Ceratioidi - This one I find to be one of the least likely, bit would make for an interesting addition. The symbiotic relationship between the males and females of their species would be fun to roleplay. Their sexual dimorphism may strike this one from the list, but they felt worth mentioning.
Deep One Hybrid - More likely to be featured in a "Aberrations Book" imo, but Deep One Hybrids present at least one Lovecraftian PC option, having been playable in PF1. I could see them make them thier own Ancestry, just as much as I can see them being Versatile or only Half-Human. It is hard to say given the lore.
Elves (+ Half-Elves) - Aquatic Elves are the most obvious choice, if there was ever one. Could function as a special Elf specific Heritage, a "Derivative Heritage" if you will; but could just as easily be their own Ancestry; one that i hope gets a more creative name. This could be a good place to bring up Mordant Spire Elves as well. Playable in PF1.
Goblins - Another sort of "Derivative Heritage", Grindylow make a great option to include the "Goblins of the sea". Grindylow were playable in PF1
Ichthyocentaur - If we ever see the inclusion of Centaur, Ichthyocentaur don't see that far off. I feel the easiest way to handle this would be as a "Derivative Heritage" for a Centaur Ancestry. But they would be fine by themselves as well I think.
Iku-Turso - Probably the least ikely on the list. The eel-like Iku-Turso are largely evil in scope. They have been mentioned a fee times when speaking on the denizens of the oceans depths, and being from a mostly evil society doesn't mean you can't be the exception. So I figured they were owed a mention.
Kalo - First Starfinder Species here; there exists a small settlement of them situated in the Antarkos Ocean after a magical accident took them from their home planet and left them stranded.
Leshy - Given that Leshy are made from plant material, I don't expect any new Heritage options here. Anemone and coral are animals, in case anyone thought otherwise. But, the Seaweed Leshy Heritage is perfect here. I COULD maybe see Heritages based on Algea or Driftwood, ideas definitely stol from the upcoming Botanical Bestiary 3pp. Or maybe even a Water Lily. But this is mostly to remind folks that Seaweed Leshy exist.
Locathah - If they aren't introduced in a Tian-Xia book, they'll definitely make it in here. Otherwise, I can see them being expanded on in one or the other. Playable is PF1.
Merfolk - Likely the quintessential aquatic Ancestry, Merfolk are the most likely to make a playable appearance imo. Alongside basic Merfolk, I can see them having a Deep Merfolk Heritage as well. I can also maybe see them having a Heritage or Feat that allows them to trade their fins for legs, a la the Little Mermaid.
Planar Scions - In particular, Undine I'm this case. I could see them getting an expansion in such a book.
Sahuagin - My most wanted option here. Sahuagin have always been a staple of seafaring campaigns. Playable in PF1, I would hope that they make the transition. I can see a Heritage or Feat line for four-armed Mutant Sahuagin, or even Aquatic Elf looking Melanti!
Siyokoy - Another one I'm not too sure about. They, at the very least, seem maybe more likely than the Iku-Turso; as far as eel-like people go anyways. They aren't wholly evil for a start. They are allied to people like Cecaelia and Locathah, and actually enemies of the Iku-Turso. So, they could have a shot.
Skum - One of the more popular asks I've seen from people here; the aberrant Skum may have a decent shot at inclusion. Could make for an alternative to Sahuagin. Their divided into the "masterless" and "loyal" groupings, depending on their relationship to the Alghollthu. I can easily see a masterless Skum adventuring for a positive cause or to retain their freedom.
Song of the Deep Ancestries - This is less a probability thing and more an informative one. The Song of the Deep Background makes any land based Ancestry a viable option for underwater campaigns and adventures. Between this and various Equipment, Feat, and Spell options, every Human or Dwarf can suddenly survive the drink. It is likely to get a cursory mention in a High Seas or other aquatic book. I'd even be willing to wager there will likely be a Baclground that works in reverse, allowing water breathing Ancestries to survive on land.
Triton - Last, but certainly not least, are the Triton. Once native to the Plane of Water, they migrated as a whole to the Material Plane; although some are still found there. They often ally with Merfolk and Locathah, as well as surface-dwellers of heroic countenance.
Impossible Lands BONUS:
Wyvaran - I somehow managed to the most important residents of the Impossible Lands: the Wyvarans!!! They are native to the peaks of the Shattered Range and are known to roam Garund. With the changes to Wyverns as members of the Drake Family of monsters, I am wildly interested to see what sort of lore and mechanical implications might stem from that! I think they could possibly work as a "Derivative Heritage" for Kobolds, but would otherwise be their own Ancestry. Here's hoping we wee them here!!
And there you have it! These lists aren't even including any entirely new creatures, and are still expansive!! Next, I shall dive into the depths of Golarion's darkness caverns and spacious vaults. What lies hidden in the Darklands!?
Well, speaking of robot feet, how about we touch on some non-robot fins! The high Seas and deep oceans od Golarion!
** spoiler omitted **...
Sahuagin are one I want as well. Eberron’s had them be people for ages now, including a big new infusion of lore recently, and I’d love to play one here. I’ve mentioned somewhere before that there’s precedent for them getting along with other Ancestries - Outsea in the River Kingdoms have some living with other aquatic folk.
I’d also LOVE a good look at the Mordant Spire elves from a PC perspective. Any High Seas book is likely to also be an Azlanti ruins book, and the spooky weirdos who live inside Acavna’s corpse have to be a part of any of that.
Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber
I was actually considering a Azlant book as a separate product, possibly including particular coastal regions like the Shackes, as well as islands such as Iblydos and Mediogalti. Otherwise, I'm not sure where the could possibly include some of them without being either shorthanded on lore or making the High Seas book massive.
If so, perfect place to include some of those Ancestries confined to such sealocked places.
I actually think it would be kind of neat if Aquatic Elves were presented as in-universe examples of Elven Undines. I felt like the geniekin heritages felt kind of disconnected from Golarion until the Mwangi Expanse book which had some good lore of Dwarven Sylphs.
Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber
Ventnor wrote:
I actually think it would be kind of neat if Aquatic Elves were presented as in-universe examples of Elven Undines. I felt like the geniekin heritages felt kind of disconnected from Golarion until the Mwangi Expanse book which had some good lore of Dwarven Sylphs.
Like, as in being an Undine Elf is what makes them Aquatic Elves? Kind of takes away from the Elves ability to adapt to almost any environment as the reason for their evolution. Great to emulate an Aquatic Elf atm. But, it's kind of like saying Azer are just Ifrit Dwarves.
Then again, I know that's just a quirk I have. Never really been okay with preexisting options leading to lack of future options.
A Worg ancestry or similar non-anthropomorphic animal ancestries would be awesome.
Winter Wolves have precedent for shifting between their natural wolf forms and a humanoid shape. I’d love to see them, especially with better support for playing in animal form than Anadi and Kitsune have.
I would love to see a Worg option, potentially with options for heritages such as Winter Wolf or even Hell Hound or similar concepts.
It would enable creating some potential cannon PC-esque representations of some key characters from my pathfinder path. (a Worg mother, who at least one of her cubs eventfully moved away and mated into a Winter-wolf and built a family/tribe together)
I have to admit I was really saddened the day I verified information on the Pathfinder first edition Worg and saw it listed them as having only a 6 INT. (that by the way was 1 less than my first D&D characters' intelligence as I recall) I know Int for Worg was just legacy coming from 3.5, but I loved the concept of Worgs being perfectly capable of being quite clever. So they represented an option for a very imaginable non-humanoid intelligence, with quite interesting options for a culture to build across for them. (tying them to not only Goblinoids but also their smaller less intelligent canine cousins)
While I think it would be interesting to see an ancestry that allowed them to take a humanoid form sometimes... I would hope there would also be the option for them to remain a sentient quadruped, quite capable of human speech and communication, but potentially limited in some of the tools it might be able to use itself.
edit to add the following:
keftiu wrote:
Ly'ualdre wrote:
Well, speaking of robot feet, how about we touch on some non-robot fins! The high Seas and deep oceans od Golarion!
** spoiler omitted **...
Sahuagin are one I want as well. Eberron’s had them be people for ages now, including a big new infusion of lore recently, and I’d love to play one here. I’ve mentioned somewhere before that there’s precedent for them getting along with other Ancestries - Outsea in the River Kingdoms have some living with other aquatic folk.
I’d also LOVE a good look at the Mordant Spire elves from a PC perspective. Any High Seas book is likely to also be an Azlanti ruins book, and the spooky weirdos who live inside Acavna’s corpse have to be a part of any of that.
Couldn't potentially the Sahuagin fit in as a further corruption/specialization of the Azerketi? A potential set of further corrupted set of heritages for them that might be able to fill their niche. Or maybe there could be a 'argument' on their actual origin. Could they think they were a Humanoid form of the Alghollthu, perhaps one that rebelled against the greater masters, and the masters took and modified the humans to make the Azlanti to make new servants to replace the rebellious ones. Or maybe they claim to be some sort of mixing of Alghollthu and Azerketi heritages... a better form... potentially to server as masters of the slave kind... only subservient to the pure Alghollthu?
The lack of an absolute answer one way or the other, and the potential insult upon being described as what one didn't believe might easily help explain their history for being hostile to most other cultures.
I believe there was a fleeting mention in either Guns & Gears or Luis Loza’s Altameda book on Infinite, but the idea that Arcadia’s Orcs and Dwarves get along has been floated before and excites me greatly.
That bit made it into Guns & Gears!
Guns & Gears wrote:
Ages ago after banding together with a group of dwarves to defeat a massive gogiteth threat, the orcs of Arcadia teamed up to assist the dwarves in achieving their quest to find the surface. The two have been on good terms ever since.
It's official: Arcadian dwarves and orcs are friends!
keftiu wrote:
I’m less sure if Elves are known in Arcadia, though a player in the Valiant AP is playing one who I believe is native - but like the Altameda book, it isn’t technically canon.
I'm running under the assumption that all Core Rulebook ancestries exist in Arcadia, though they might not all be common. Much like we did with making gnomes and goblins uncommon in Mwangi Expanse, if and when we take a look at Arcadian ancestries, we would note the regional rarities for CRB ancestries.
I'm running under the assumption that all Core Rulebook ancestries exist in Arcadia, though they might not all be common. Much like we did with making gnomes and goblins uncommon in Mwangi Expanse, if and when we take a look at Arcadian ancestries, we would note the regional rarities for CRB ancestries.
I loved this touch in the Mwangi Expanse book, and would be very happy to see it for other regions. The idea of skewing what the average adventuring party looks like is super fun to me: seeing an Orc Gunslinger and a Wyrwood Shaman instead of a Dwarf Fighter and a Halfling Rogue really makes a place pop.
Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber
I think it would make more sense that Sahuagin could have potentially evolved from the Skum, given their similar appearance; or that they were created by some Deity or other Divinity.
----
Also, here is the full list of all Ancestries being added in BattleZoo Ancestries: Year of Monsters:
Spoiler:
Centaur (secret 13th option, present as a stretch goal)
Demon
Doppleganger
Dungeon (expanded)
Gremlin
Intelligent Weapon (who have "Wielders")
Mimic
Minotaur (w/ Med & Lrg Heritage options)
Nymph (of all gendars; w/ Dryad, Naiad, Lampad, and Hesperid as confirmed Heritages; and Hora & Asteriai, aka Star Nymphs, as stretch goals I believe)
Oni
Sidhe (aka Sith; such as Baobhan Sith or Leanan Sidhe, described as "Fey nobles")
Slime
Stheno
Not to mention Dragons or the Indigo Isles Ancestries.
Really happy about the last two additions. I definitely want to make sure we hit the stretch goals so we get that super (not-so-) secret 13th ancestry. Can't wait to see how the KS is funded this coming Tuesday!
Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber
I believe Mark said there are like 7 or either stretch goals that will be known and several hidden, including the Centaur as one of them. Some others were things like extra Heritage options for each.
Can't wait to pitch in on this one. Looking forward to it greatly.
I believe Mark said there are like 7 or either stretch goals that will be known and several hidden, including the Centaur as one of them. Some others were things like extra Heritage options for each.
Can't wait to pitch in on this one. Looking forward to it greatly.
Yep, 7 are visible including the "We're funded" for the initial amount, the light element, and more. Many more (including centaurs) are ready to go if we can beat those first stretch goals though!
I certainly wasn't expecting Sidhe on the list, but I'm down for that ^^. Cat Sith best Sith. I randomly stumbled across it ages ago and loved all of it, especially the artwork - so I'm pumped!
Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber
The Darklands:
The tenebrous depths of Golarion's World Below are as unknowable as they are vast. And yet, entire nations and kingdoms call the Darklands home. Swaths of fantastical biomes, rich in possibly and life outside of the suns rays. The Darklands are divided into three distinct layers; each home to their own people, monsters, and mysterys. Of all the regions, the sheer size of Golarion's Darklands make it the most likely place to see a plethora of Ancestries. So much so, that there is absolutely no way that half these make it as playable options, but are worth boting for their influence within the Darklands.
Alghollthu - The Alghollthu once ruled over a considerable portion of Golarion's surface, so it isn't surprising they'd have a hold in its Darklands as well. Particularly, within the Sightless Sea, Inverted Sea, and Land of Black Blood in Orv. Certainly unlikely to be playable, but their place within the Darklands is worth notong.
Beastkin - Beastkin of various lineage can be found within the Vault of Deep Tolguth, taking the forms of the myriad of animals that live there, particularly dinosaurs.
Black-Blooded Heritage - The Land of Black Blood is one of the most interesting Vaults within Orv. The substance for which the area was named, the Black Blood, has the capability of mutating almost any living creature is strange ways. Should any of those creatures should survive the mutation, they have the potential to possess strange and unusual abilities. This has the makings of a potential Versatile Heritage of Creature Archetype imo.
Blightburn Geniekin - The Black Desert of Orv is home to a great many creatures, including those Genie corrupted by the Blightburn phenomenon unique to the region. Geniekin Lineages tying back to Blightburn Genie would be interesting, if given the opportunity.
Caligni - Derisively know as "Dark Folk", the Caligni are the decendants of an Azlanti settlement know as Calignos, whosenresidents dug deep underground to avoid the destruction of Earthfall. In its aftermath, they would come to find themselves trapped, forced to explore deeper and deeper into its depths; until they were discovered by the Deities known as the Forsaken. The Forsaken gave to them an ancient artifact, the Cradles of Night, which provided them the power they needed to survive, but ultimately irrevocably changed them into the Caligni. Residents of Nar-Voth, the Caligni are essentially the "Humans of the Darklands" and are broken down I to different castes, which would make for decent Heritage options.
Charda - The Charda live exclusivley within the Land of Black Blood. Overall, they aren't too interesting, but their immunity to Black Blood and the fact they aren't inherently evil may make them worth exploring.
Clockwork Constructs - Below the continent of Tian-Xia, there lies their own Darklands, inhabited by their own unique residents. Of these are the hounted clockwork constructs of the Clicking Caverns and Pan Majang, possessed by the souls of the dead. These alone don't make for a compelling enough argument to include a new Construct or Golem Ancestry; but it presents for an interesting plot device for such a character.
Dark Fey - There are a number of malevolent Fey creatures who made a place for themselves I'm the Darklands, just as the Court of Ether. This presents less opportunity for new Fey Ancestries, but rather seems a good place to include current options for Darklands campaigns.
"Darklands Halflings" - Of all the Core Ancestries, the fact that there isn't a Darklands take on Halflings is interesting. The most worldly and travel prone of the lot don't have people in Golarion's underground? Seems fishy.
Denizens of Leng - Oddly enough, the strange Denizens of Leng have an interesting presence within the Darklands. In particular, they trade often with many of its inhabitants, like the Intellect Devourers of High Ilvarandin. Thus, they also frequent the waves of the Sightless Sea as well. Unlikely to be playable. Not here anyways. Maybe in a Dreamlands book?
Dero - Dero are one of the best known resident of Nar-Voth, even if they aren't the most populous. Originally known as Pech, their exposure and ingestion of the fungus known as Cytillesh, or Brain Mold, cause irreversible damage to their mental capabilities and eventual mutation into Dero. Their madness and obsessions make them ill-suited as a playable option, but could make for and interesting connection to a playable Pech.
Dhampir - Vampires are an uncommon sight within the Darklands, but certainly aren't unheard of. As such, their mortal progeny are at least a rare occurrence within the mortal Ancestries that call the region home. Particularly, the Land ofBlack Blood is known to house Vampires; although what kind is unclear. It would be interesting to see if Vampires gain any benefits from Black Blood.
Duergar - Also known as Gray Dwarves, Duergar are the decendants of those Dwarves who refused to leave their Ancestral home of Nar-Voth. Those who remained faced potential genocide due to their lack of numbers and the danger possessed to them. As a result, the Dwarven Deity of Toil too advantage and offered them a chance to survive, by swearing unquestioning devotion to him. As a result of this, much of their society turned to evil and developed several supernatural abilities. Could function as an entire Ancestry, or a "Derivative Heritage" with Duergar only Feats to compound it.
Drow (+ Half-Drow) - Also known as Dark Elves, Drow are THE quintessential Darklands Ancestry, if there ever was one. During Earthfall, it was their ancestors who chose to remain on Golarion, rather than flee back to Sovyrian. Those who remained fled into the Darklands, settling in the Caves of the Craven, where the tremors or Earthfall briefly woke Rovagug, whose thoughts tainted and warped the Drow into their current form. Most of Drow society tends to veer towards evil. Half-Drow, also known as Darkborn or Thinblood by other Drow, are born from the rare mingling of Drow and Humans, and could function as a Half-Human Heritage.
Fleshwarp - Along with Drow comes Drow Fleshwarping techniques; often considered "True Fleshwarping". Through these techniques, a number of unique Fleshwarps have been devised by the Drow, based on the base Ancestry used. Most interesting implication for this is by far Fleshwarping to the Drow themselves, resulting in the Drider. This could be a interesting place to implement some interesting Fleshwarp options to play as these distinct creatures, like the Drider. But I'm not sure it would be done.
Goblin - Plenty of Goblins call the caves and caverns of Nar-Voth home. Those few who manage to make it deeper are likely to adapt into something else altogether, given their environmental adaptability. This could likely result in a Heritage, even a Derivative one if they chose to make a new creature related to them.
Gremlin - Going to be playable, thanks to BattleZoo Ancestries; many Gremlins are commonly found within the Darklands. Could be a good place to make them playable in an official capacity, or even if a Fey book. Can never have too many Fey imo.
Gug - Another unlikely example, Gug and their ties to the Rough Beast (and the Elder Mythls) are ever present throughout the Darklands. Seem likely to be a common adversary to encounter. But probably not playable.
Hobgoblin - Darklander Hobgoblins are more likely to be found in Tian-Xia's Darklands than anywhere in the Inner Sea region. Rumors persist that a Hobgoblin nation exists directly underneath the nation of Kaoling.
Humans - While unlikely to be residents, many a Human can certainly be found under Golarion's surface. Most likely victims of abduction or endentured servitude, the Humans found in the Darklands are certainly capable of grand heroics where their own and others freedom may be involved. It says a lot about their adaptability, given four distinct people evolved from them in the Darklands.
Intellect Devourer - One of the powerhouses of the Darklands, Intellect Devourers have entire subterranean cities under their control. An unlikely Ancestry option; but can you imagine playing as one with a "Sub-Ancestry" being whatever creature you're using as a host? Would be gnarly.
Kobold - Kobolds are commonly found within the layer of Nar-Voth. Good place to expand on them. What would be super interesting is if we ever see a sept of Dragons exclusive to the Darklands.
Mongrelfolk - The most civil and friendly of all Darklands residents, Mongrelfolk (or Myx/ Myxling as I've taken to calling them) are decendants of Humans and most often encountered in Nar-Voth, where they have city under the Barrer Wall of southern Thuvia. They have the most mechanically interesting potential, being capable of mixing the DNA and capabilities of various Ancestries.
Morlock - Another Human decendant, Morlocks unfortunately degenerated thanks to a number of factors, including the combined effects of blightburn and lazurite. What I would love to see from them is tying them to Grimlocks somehow. There is some potential for playable here, I think. Their engineering skills could make them great Inventors.
Munavri - The most interesting decendants of of Azlanti survivors, the Munavri possess innate psychic abilities and seafaring skill. Most often found within the Sightless Sea, where they make their home on a series of jade islands; Munavri are likely first on the list of playable options here.
Myceloid - The closest thing to fungusfolk, outside of Fungus Leshy, these creatures survive off the decaying organic matter and procreate via living hosts. This likely makes them too volatile to most civilized Ancestries, but I can see certain groups attempting to coexist.
Neothelid - 1000% unlikely to be playable, Neothelid make up one of the superpowers that rule the Darklands. Operating out of Vault of Denebrum in Orv, these immortal creatures seek to take over the entirety of Orv and eventually Golarion. They seem to pose a threat to most, if not all other residents of the Darklands; making them a perfect choice as antagonists.
Orc (+ Half-Orcs) - Like Dwarves, Orcs originally lived within the Darklands. When the Dwarves sought their Quest for Sky, many Orcs eventually came to be displaced and adapt to life on the surface. There may still exist Orcs within its layers, however, and seems like a great opportunity to expand on that idea. There are several pockets of them living in other Ancestry's settlements, as well as Half-Orcs.
Pech - Originally brought to the Plane of Earth by the Vault Builders, Pech wpuld eventually be abandoned and evolve into the Dero. Like Gnomes, they would come to lose their connection to their home planet. Would love the chance to play these guys. Could have a Heritage that basically makes them Dero as well.
Ratfolk - The largest population of Ysoki can be found in Tian-Xia's Darklands, in the empire of Diguo-Dashu in Sekmina, and is likely the source of Tian-Xia's Ratfolk. Perfect place to expand on them and their war with Imperial Lung Wa.
Sahuagin - Sea Devil's have a minor presence in Orv's Sightless Sea and Inverted Sea. If they become playable in the High Seas, could be a good place to expand on them. Can't imagine what the various forms of radiation and mutative substances could do to their forms.
Sekmin - Likely the most wanted from the community on this list, playable Serpent would fit perfectly well in a Darklands book. Having once ruled the entire layer of Sekmina, which is named after them, I can see disparate groups of Sekmin scattered throughout the Darklands and developing different mindsets and philosophies. Not to mention just trying to survive.
Seugathi - Unlike their masters, the Neothelid, I can see Seugathi being playable, if only because their size is more reasonable. Just as mindbending, however, they aren't likely to play nice with most of beings. Especially when sanity is their favorite food.
Skum - Maybe the second most wanted on the list; groups of Skum have long prior been freed from the yolk the Alghollthu once had on them. A group of rather technologically advanced Ulat-Kini reside within Orv's Sightless Sea.
Svirfneblin - Also known as Deep Gnomes, Svirfneblin's ancestors settled into the Darklands around the same.time Gnomes came to Golarion. This may have been to keep an eye on the Dark Fey that call it home; they eventually were changed by the energies found beneath. One of the few examples of a subterranean society that isn't inherently vile; they do have a habit of being emotionally erratic and volatile. So, still not great company.
Tiefling - A number of Fiends find their way into the Darklands for one reason or another. In fact, many of its inhabitants worship Fiendish Divinities. So every lineage of Tiefling can probably be found within the Darklands.
Trox - Originally from Nchak, one of Liavaran's many moons, they arrived on Golarion via shepard moons, altered and tasked by the Forever Queen with Interplanetary expansion. Upon their arrival, they became enslaved by the Duergar and bred as brutal living weapons. Several isolated groups managed to escape their captivity an establish small enclaves.
Undead - The Darklands lack of Positive Energy enriched rays from the sun make in perfect for the myriad of Undead that exist on Golarion. Key amongst them are the Ghoul's of Nemret Noktoria in Sekmina. Many other populations exist throughout the Darklands, presenting the potential for some truly monsterous beings.
Urdefhan - "Orvian Vampires", as they are often called, are warlike offspring of Daemons,who suck blood and have clear skin. Legends state that they were created by the Forst Horseman themselves, from the Abaddon's Hunted Petitioners; in an effort to seed the Material Plane with Daemon worshipers. When the Bound Prince of Abaddon was defeated and imprisoned by the other Four Horseman, they lost their ability to procreate. The Horseman of War granted them the ability to mage with Daemons, while the Horseman of Famine cursed them with a list for blood. They now spread throughout Orv, wrecking death everywhere they go. Unlikely to be playable.
Vegepygmy - Vegepygmy, or Moldfolk, rise from creatures infected and killed by Russet Mold. Originally Fey from the First World, they became trapped on the Material Plane with no means of reproducing their kind. This eventually led them down a path where a Drow Sporecrafter began experimenting on them in an effort to save their kind; their spores infecting the dead and giving rise to new members. For their part, Vegepygmy remain largely neutral in alignment. What this means for t continued existence of their people is unknown atm.
Worms that Walk - Worms that Wolk, or Walking Swarms as I call them (given they arent all made of worms), have the capacity to be featured as a Creature Archetype. They tend to serve the Neothelid of the Darklands.
Xiomorn - Oiginally from the Plane of Earth, Xiomorn were the Builders and Keepers of the various Vaults of Orv within the Darklands. Few Xiomorn remain today, most of which continue to tend the Vaults they helped create. This may make them unlikely as a choice.
Xorn - Another resident of the Plane of Earth, Xorn seem more likely to come up in an Inner Planes book than anything I feel. That said, they do frequent the Darklands and would make for an interesting addition to groups.
Xulgath - Last, but not, are the Xulgath, or Troglodytes. Originally from the Vault of Vask, Xulgath are one of the oldest people on Golarion and once held immeasurable power, who came into frequent conflict with the various other residents of Golarion's Darklands. It wasn't until AR 1, when Aroden came to Vask and took five of the six Aeon Orbs which maintain their ecosystem. Theis lead to the region becoming a wasteland and Xulgath's degenerating into what most are today. While there do still exist Englighted Xulgath, or Thoughtmaws, in Deep Tolguth, most of their current people reside in Nar-Voth.
Okay. So, that was WAY more than I thought it would be. Hope there are some options here that people would enjoy. ^^
Obviously these all wouldn't work. But it gets the gears going on what could. Might do a smaller one next. Lol
EDIT: Apologies for the grammar and spelling. Typed all this on my phone. I'm not going back through to fix any of it. XD
Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber
Dou-Bral post.
For our next list, we will take a peek outside the confines of the Material Plane, into the Great Beyind. And, of course, where else would one start, if not the...
First World:
Awakened Animals - We will start with Awaken Animals; because, what says whimsy and magic more than talking animals? This could expand to established Ancestries of animal-like decent as well. Entire settlements of Awakened Animals exist both in the First World and on Golarion.
Bulabar - For all you entomophiles out there looking for a beetle-based Ancestry, look not further than the tinkering Fey known as Bulabar. Appearing as Sprite sized blue beetles, Bulabar are fascinated by the Inner workings of all things mechanical; so much so, that they can often be found disassembling machines just to see how they tick.
Brownies - Consumit tricksters, Brownies are happy little chatterboxes willing to help those around them for seemingly inconsequential things. They always pay back what they perceive to be a debt. Although they are pacifist by nature and honest to a fault, Brownies could make for decent adventurers, willing to do good as long as good is done to them.
Choxani - The faceless Choxani could make for an incredibly interesting Ancestry; if for no other reason than they consume the color from organisms for sustenance. They embody they weirdness that is Fey creatures in appearance alone.
Dark Fey - Fey are unpredictable tricksters at best and, at worst, malignant and wicked creatures. These "Dark" or "Unseelie" Fey are what cautionary tales are made from. Evil PCs are hardly unheard of, and playing a vile Fey, especially one that goes against their basic nature, is certain to be a common trope.
Faerie Dragon - While we do have the likes of Draxie as decendants of a powerful Faerie Dragon; Faerie Dragons themselves could make for excellent adventurers. Battlezoo’s Dragon Ancestry showed how great standard Dragons can be. So the chance to play one of the cutest Dragons in existence? Yes please.
Feyborn - Also known as Fetch, First Children, or Wildbloods; Feyborn are people born of Fey decent or influence. This could be utilizes as a Versatile Heritage, where your parents or ancestors were Fey. Could represent those Ancestries said to have versions of themselves native to the First World. Or, it could represent a person who, at some point in their life, was stolen away by Fey and raised in the First World, and were changed as a result.
Gathlain - Said to be the first people awakened during the First World's creation, Gathlain's grew from the seeds of an enormous magical tree, whose mistletoe developed an almost symbiotic relation with they Fey, developing into their wings. Like most Fey, Gathlain are inquisitive pranksters who act to sate their own curiosity and need for entertain. Playable in PF1, they make for an interest Plant and Fey Ancestry option in PF2.
Gerbie - Nothing says cute and adorable than a half-mouse, half-lizard Fey Creature of friendship and harmony. Want to play a adventurer whose only purpose is to spread the joys of friendship and togetherness? Play a Gerbie.
Gnome (Expanded) - Another a large portion of Gnomes migrated from First World, a great many of them stayed behind and reamin to this day. A First World specific Heritage for Gnomes who didn't leave their ancestral home seems inevitable to say the least. Discovering how different Fey Gnomes differ from their mortal kin is something I've wondered for a long while.
Gremlin - Playable soon thanks to BattleZoo Ancestries, Gremlins can be found throughout the First World, doing the things they do best. All the various types of Gremlin make for great Heritage options, to say the least, and could create an interesting party dynamic for one trying to avoid the stigma of their kind.
Huldra - One of the .ore popular asks I've seen, and for good reason. Huldra are essentially what you'd get if you took and Dryad and cow and mashed them together. Guardians of nature, Huldra have a natural enmity toward Trolls. Excellent choices for Druids and Rangers, they could make great options for those campaigns that seek to protect cold wooded environments.
Komaswin - Only ever mentioned by name, Komaswin are described as grub-people from the First World; living in spiral-bored cities within the Blind Lands. Not much else is said. I've mentioned them here if only to remind people that there are still a plethora of plot hooks left untouched from 1st Edition. Any one of them could potentially evolve into something grand; like maybe an Ancestry.
Leprechaun - Most certainly a caricature, Leprechauns have the capacity to be handled poorly for sure. But, as long as they are given the respect they deserve, they could make excellent character choices. I just have this idea of a Leprechaun Champion of Abadar that I simply can get out of my head.
Leshy (Expanded) - As Vitae, or Nature Spirits, it is not surprise that Leshy are prominent it the First World. On top of fleshing out some of the remaining Heritage options for 1e, there are a myriad of unique plants that can only be found in the Feyrealm that could make for interesting choices.
Nereid - Different from Naiad, Nereid aren't confined to a singular body of water as the Nymph sisters are. This makes the excellent choices for adventures. Their water shawls definitely help them standout as well.
Nixie - One would think that a Nixie would be a kind of aquatic Sprite, but that isn't the case. Despite that, a veritable pool of aquatic Ancestries to choose from is certainly not without it's merit.
Nymph - Playable soon thanks to BattleZoo Ancestries, if you looked at the way Nymphs are handled in 2e and said you DIDN'T want to play them, you are a liar. Their new family categorization works wonderfully with each type of Nymph as a Heritage option. And many more options to come! Oceanids immediately jump to mind for me.
Pech - Native to the Plane of Earth first and foremost, populations of Pech to live within the First World as well. The more I learn of these little guys, the more I want to protec them. And the Earth part of nature isn't something is see covered by Fey often.
Plant & Fungus Creatures - With such strong ties to nature, and Primal Magic, the First World could be home to any number of intelligent or awakened plants and plant-like creatures; including fungus. Living Topiaries come to mind; as do Vegepygmy and Myceloid, who make their living in the First World's Darklands: the Blind Land. There is certainly no shortage of sentient and sapient fungus and plants within the First World, all of which could make for interesting Ancestries.
Reflection - Included less because I feel they could see an expansion here; it is more due to the fact that within the city of Anophaeus, there are an incredible number of twins. This likely has something to due with Imbrex the Twins, whose feet the city is settled around. Seems like a perfect opportunity to include a Reflection or two on order to represent this in a fun, mechanical way.
Satyr -or- Faun - Satyr and Faun are my most wanted Fey option on this list. As Satyr don't have females in their species, Faun are probably more likely to be playable. Not much else to say about the world's first Bards.
Sidhe/Sith - Being made playable in BattleZoo Ancestries, this was one I had not considered and I'm eternally grateful to have. There are a number of creatures that fall in this family. Leanan Sidhe, Baobhan Sith, Cultures Sith, Cat Sith. How they'll be handle stands to be seen. But, if you allow 3rd party content at your table, these will make a fine addition to your option pool.
Sprite (Expanded) - Sprites are no doubt everywhere in the First World, and an expan comes natural to them. Atomie fall into the Sprite family and would make a greay Heritage, as would the Roseblood Sprites as well. And there are certainly many more potential options to be seen.
Spriggan & Svirfneblin - Not Fey and pro ably don't exist in the First World, but as offshoots to Gnomes, it couldn't hurt to include them here.
That's all I got on that front. Still managed to be a pretty big list. One of these is bound to be tiny, certainly. Lol
Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber
Dou-Bral post. I hope these posts aren't bothering anyone too much. I literally start typing up ideas at a given time and post them as they come to me. I'll refrain from posting another for a bit.
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"Behold, dear reader, the collective culmination of my life's work! Centuries of study and research, bound into a singular informative tome; with no shortage of personal anecdotes written in as well. For who can speak on the certainty of Dragons with such authority besides a Dragon? Within these pages lie the ecology and secrets on one of Golarion's most powerful and intelligent creatures; and their lesser cousins of course. You shall find no shortage of mental and physical examinations on Dragonkind and their kindred, as well as.... Oh? I'm so sorry. Come again? You wish to know the name of such a publication? Oh, well I can assure you that it isn't anything so drab as the 'Draconomicon'. That piece of work is child's play in comparison; to say nothing of the blatant and thinly veiled instances of plagiarism! Nay! The name of my magnum opus is as awe inspiring as those creatures contained within its bindings. I present to you, dear reader, the Drachiridion! And I do declare that here... THERE BE DEAGONS!!!!
Drachiridion, the Book of Dragon:
Moving on from regional and extraplanar books, wanted to discuss the idea of another "Creature Codex" in the line of the Book of the Dead. And what better creature to discuss than THE quintessential TTRPG monster out there: Dragons. Pathfinder doesn't handle Dragons the same way most other systems do. This is largely due to Paizo's efforts to separate their system and setting from a particular Wizards of some reknown. But, with the evolution of Bestiaries moving into the territory or themed books, based on location or subject matter; now seems like a perfect time for Paizo to establish Dragons in their own unique light within Golarion. There is certainly no shortage of draconic creatures within the setting, True or otherwise; so there is a lot to work with if they so choose! And some potential Ancestry and Heritage options as well. So, let's discuss:
Dragon - I don't see Dragons themselves ever being handled in an offical capacity by Paizo. But BattleZoo does na excellent job of making a balanced Ancesrty out of them. This is more a reminder or advertisement to the community that, should you ever want a campaign with True Dragons as a focus, it is possible in a psuedo-offical capacity. Thanks again Mark.
Dragonkin - Just as likely to appear in a Dragon book as they may in a Planetary/Triaxus book; Dragonkin are Pathfinders closest approximation to a Dragonborn in-setting. Native to Triaxus, Dragonkin share a almost symbiotic relationship with the planets Ryphorian/Triaxian population.
Half-Dragon Heritage - This, by in large, strikes me as the most like, if not the only, option I think could make it into such a book. As far as anything new actually making it in. PF2 has [i]seemingly[/b] done away with the sort of "Half-Blooded" creatures. At least, at this point they have. They may not have had great opportunity or reason to add the likes of Half-Celestials, Half-Dragons, and Half-Fiends; which, in my opinion, has a place as Creature Adjustments still. But a true "Dragon Hybrid" in the same vien as Tiefling/Assimar would be a nice addition. Now, there is BattleZoo's Dragon Scion, which is exactly this. But this is one of the instances of something I think is very likely to become offical.
Kobold/Wyvaran - Kobolds, on their own, are already relatable to Dragons. But when you throw Wyvaran's into the mix, they become truly draconic. Wyvarans could function as a "Derivative Heritage" for Kobolds. Their relations to Wyverans, and Wyverans being made a part of the Drake family, has some rather interesting implications. Further, their Dragonscaled Heritage can be expanded via any of the various septs of Dragons available. An Unbral Kobold. A Sovereign Kobold? A Toadstool Kobold? Enables a lot of story telling potential.
Linnorm - This one is certainly a stretch, mostly because Linnorm sent to be more serpentine in shape. But, it got me wondering about a playable Ancestry for them. Unlikely to ever be done officially, but maybe a future BattleZoo product perhaps? Mark, you listening? We have ideas!!!! Lol
Other Dragons - The above mentioned are about the extent of the ideas I have that seem interesting. But there are a few others I can think up, that I feel are a bit less likely. First are Drakes. Their various subspecies lend themselves well to Heritage options. However, most of them tend to be a bit more animalistic and vile. Not a hard line, but one that may be made. Then there are all the "Pet Dragons". Faerie Dragons, Psuedodragons/wyverns, House Drakes, Calligraphy Wyrm, Nycar, Pyrausta, etc. The could make for some rather adorable party additions. But, I can see some issues rising at certain tables about their tendency to serve as Familiars or Companions. Fair, to a degree. You can literally have Leshy with Leshy Familiars. So not that pressing I feel. Then there is the very unlikely chance they make a new Draconic Ancestry altogether. I doubt this one myself. But it could happen.
Undead Dragons - Another auggestion of sorts than a solid option. BattleZoo's introduction of playable True Dragons make it possible to play a few Undead Dragons as well. Not exactly a Ravener or Wyrmwraith. But could make for compelling stories.
Outside of these possible Ancestries, the Mechanical and lore implications of a Dragon focused book would be amazing imo. Probably my most wanted "Creature Codex" I want to see sooner rather than later.
Also, I saw that Ginny Di will be designing another Dragon on Roll For Combat. Likely another Leshy Dragon.
Mark.... I'm just saying.... Dragon Fruit Dragon.... I will keep pushing this matter till it happens!! With love of course. ^^
Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber
Ly'ualdre wrote:
If Owlbears exist, are there too Owlcats?
Actually yes, at least if you consider the PC games canon! :P
Quote:
Beware Headchomper, the all-mighty owlkitten! Owlkittens are rumored to steal the hearts of their masters, and this one surely mastered this ability. Yet his presence in your life compensates any inconvenience he might cause.
Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber
Owlkitten in the PF2 Kingmaker release or we riot. D:<
Keiftu. Iirc, Aberrations are yout thing. You have probably said before, but are there any particular ones you'd like to see make the jump to playable?
Keftiu. Iirc, Aberrations are your thing. You have probably said before, but are there any particular ones you'd like to see make the jump to playable?
Seshes/Bog Striders are non-Evil aberrations that we know can get along with humanoids, and would scratch the itch for some more insectile Ancestries (though Formians are what I really want there) - they would be a fun curveball.
My real desire is some kind of aberration-touched Versatile Heritage, akin to Eberron’s Daelkyr Half-Bloods, or some of the gnarly bloodline Feats in the old 3.5 Lords of Madness book. Let me play a Dwarf warped by something she found digging too deep, or someone tainted by a brush against alien intelligences on some psychedelic pesh journey.
I’d also welcome some kind of curveball aberrant Ancestry that’s more accepted into the local culture, somewhere beyond the Inner Sea. If Wyrwood constructs can be people in Arcadia, who’s to say some tentacled, telepathic weirdos can’t find a niche in Casmaron or Southern Garund?
Actually yes, at least if you consider the PC games canon! :P
Quote:
Beware Headchomper, the all-mighty owlkitten! Owlkittens are rumored to steal the hearts of their masters, and this one surely mastered this ability. Yet his presence in your life compensates any inconvenience he might cause.
Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber
I interrupt you regularly scheduled nerdom to bring to you this breaking news:
Spoiler:
For those interesting, the next BattleZoo Kickstarter just went live. I personally plan on trying to purchase the PDF Everything bundle.
Two cool take aways from the page that I wasn't aware of: BZ:B - Strange & Unusual will have the "Aberrant Soul" Archetype, which will slowly (or quickly) change characters into an Aberration. Not an Ancestry, but could certainly scratch that itch Keiftu!!
Second thing, one of the known Stretch Goals will add the "Doppleborn" Versatile Heritage to BZ:A - Year of Monsters for those born of a Doppleganger or develop Doppleganger like abilities!! And I never knew I need something so badly.
If I can manage it, I may even purchase both systems. Partly so I can maybe introduce my 5e group to use them; but mostly for the simple desire to support the team. ^^
Now, back to your program!
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I actually completely forgot about the Ses'h/Sesh/Bog Stiders being Aberrations. More Insectoid Ancestries are a must for me. I'm certainly not an insect guy, but I like how much they stand out to Humanoid creatures. Plus, that one line in Strength of Thousands really implied the potential for more of them down the line.
Basically any Starfinder Species that also exists (or could exist) in Pathfinder would work fantastically as well. Working on a full list of those, but some examples include the Barathu/Brethedan and Ilee (which may be the genetic Ancestors of the Astrozoan). Plus, several others that are Monsterous Humanoids in 1e and SF, but would likely be Aberrations in 2e; like the Contemplatives and Kalo.
Then there are 1e options, like Beings of Ib/Ib Shades and Yaddithians. Some other good options could be Children of Yog-Sothoth, Elder Things, Flumoh, Grick, Grindylow, Merlucent, and Yithian; to name a few. Although, Merlucent have some unsettling implications some might find discomforting.
I'm also beginning to lean more and more on the idea of having a Fleshwarp Versatile Hertiage; if for not other reason than to apply it to certain Ancestries to enable those "True Fleshwarps", like Driders. I don't think it would be too odd having a proper Ancestry and a Heritage. I also want a proper Mutant Heritage or even Archetype. Could be a lot of fun. 100% want a Black-Blooded Heritage or Archetype. Maybe even a Sinspawn Heritage.
Some others I'd find interesting would be Chuul/Chu'ulothis, Ettercaps/Web Lurkers, Faceless Stalker/Ugothol, Mimics (which we got in BZ), Naga, Otyugh, Reefclaws, Seugathi, and Siyokoy.
Definitely some new, more widely accepted options would probably work best. I would LOVE something with tentacles arms and/or legs, that isn't aquatic would be fun.
Sorry, I'm gonna bring it back to Darklands stuff because I wanna play a drow so bad. I even have a whole backstory that works perfectly with the psychic and everything.
As for other stuff, I mean, I have 0 experience with Pathfinder 1E, so all of this is gonna be stuff that I just find cool:
-Darklands Stuff (Drow, Duergar, Xulgath, Dero, Serpentfolk, Svirfneblin, the like)
-Big stuff (Minotaur and Centaur would be super fun)
-Stheno (WHY ARE YOU TEASING US PAIZO I WANNA PLAY ONE)
-Wyrwood (yes keftiu, you've convinced me, that'd be awesome)
-Samsaran (I mean, duh)
-Water stuff (sahuagin, locathah, aquatic elves, sahuagin, adaro would be fun, oh and did I mention sahuagin?)
I'm going to be honest, I'm a little worried that the Battlezoo Monsters stuff will scare Paizo off of tackling any of the names on the list, and that really bums me out - I'm not interested in PF2 content that doesn't have Golarion lore. I really don't want to be in a situation where Pathfinder 2e never gets official playable Minotaurs and Stheno because someone else got around to it first.
I'm going to be honest, I'm a little worried that the Battlezoo Monsters stuff will scare Paizo off of tackling any of the names on the list, and that really bums me out - I'm not interested in PF2 content that doesn't have Golarion lore.
For me it's not the lore but the fact that 3rd party material isn't allowed for a lot of games I play in. So 3rd party stuff is cool but I'll most likely not get to actually use it.
I do not mean to beat a dead horse, but I am surprised that the Drow have not come out yet, being this “late” in the edition. From where I am around, they have to be one of the most popular ancestries in fantasy games... In the beginning of this edition’s lifespan I could swear that we’d see them pretty soon — sooner than most of the ancestries that we’ve already got! I know that we have the Cave Elf, but every time that I point the heritage out as a solution, fellow players just kind of seem to be bummed out about it.
Are the Drow not that big of an ancestry in the US?
keftiu wrote:
I'm going to be honest, I'm a little worried that the Battlezoo Monsters stuff will scare Paizo off of tackling any of the names on the list, and that really bums me out - I'm not interested in PF2 content that doesn't have Golarion lore. I really don't want to be in a situation where Pathfinder 2e never gets official playable Minotaurs and Stheno because someone else got around to it first.
Aw, hard same... I'm a fan of Mark's work, but I'd rather get content directly connected to Golarion. I think I recall him saying somewhere, maybe on the subreddit, that he himself was the loudest voice for Stheno content and with him gone, he didn't see them being released anytime soon... So there's that?
EDIT: Whoops, pressed sent before I should've! Anyways, I don't see Paizo not releasing content because a 3rd party already covered that. . . But, I am a little reticent that they never planned on releasing it on the first place and having it already covered dissuades them even more in contemplating the possibility. Don't mean to doomsay or anything, by the way! Sorry if it comes off as a little bummer-ey.
I do not mean to beat a dead horse, but I am surprised that the Drow have not come out yet, being this “late” in the edition. From where I am around, they have to be one of the most popular ancestries in fantasy games... In the beginning of this edition’s lifespan I could swear that we’d see them pretty soon — sooner than most of the ancestries that we’ve already got! I know that we have the Cave Elf, but every time that I point the heritage out as a solution, fellow players just kind of seem to be bummed out about it.
Are the Drow not that big of an ancestry in the US?
Drow are super popular in the states; copies of Drizzt Do'Urden were in vogue for a long while among players, they were added to 4e as a PC race in the first setting book that edition got, and they're all over 5e (between official books and a prominent role in Critical Role's second campaign).
I imagine they aren't in PF2 yet for a few reasons.
They might be seen as too much of a D&D thing to highlight, right off the bat - the team is really keen to see Pathfinder shake off a lot of it's old D&D-isms, and "the dark elves who live in the underground realm" isn't exactly original. Not helping things is their 1e baggage (presenting them as broadly evil and awful, elves who do grave misdeeds spontaneously becoming drow, Second Darkness being fairly disliked, etc), the backlash in the last few years over drow being villainized for their skin color, the counter-backlash from nerds who think Gygax and the rest of the old guard could do no wrong... I wouldn't blame any writing team who saw all that and decided their efforts were better spent elsewhere.
But I do think there is hope. Drow made it into the first PF2 Bestiary. They've featured twice in 2e Adventure Paths, both times as groups PCs could get along with amicably - and one of them wasn't even an Evil community! I think they'll eventually come over as an Ancestry, but they likely need a cheerleader within Paizo to convince them it's worth all the hassle, and they also need a proper book to go in. Maybe Kyonin has some drow buddies hidden away, and that's their way to sell everyone a Shining Kingdoms book? :p
I think "they just haven't gotten to it" is also a really valid answer. Because yeah, PF2's been out for a while, but the way they've done books is way different than PF1. We aren't getting as many grab bags and we aren't getting monthly handbooks or anything like that, so the books we have been getting tend to be more tightly themed, and even without considering other issues I'm not sure what book you would have placed them in anyways.
I think "they just haven't gotten to it" is also a really valid answer. Because yeah, PF2's been out for a while, but the way they've done books is way different than PF1. We aren't getting as many grab bags and we aren't getting monthly handbooks or anything like that, so the books we have been getting tend to be more tightly themed, and even without considering other issues I'm not sure what book you would have placed them in anyways.
That's all very true. I've been very impressed with the diversity and quantity of content that they've been able to produce in such a short time. I'm even more impressed that they've done so despite a multi-year, world-changing pandemic.
I think "they just haven't gotten to it" is also a really valid answer. Because yeah, PF2's been out for a while, but the way they've done books is way different than PF1. We aren't getting as many grab bags and we aren't getting monthly handbooks or anything like that, so the books we have been getting tend to be more tightly themed, and even without considering other issues I'm not sure what book you would have placed them in anyways.
I imagine they would’ve fit into the Ancestry Guide if Paizo had wanted them to.
I think "they just haven't gotten to it" is also a really valid answer. Because yeah, PF2's been out for a while, but the way they've done books is way different than PF1. We aren't getting as many grab bags and we aren't getting monthly handbooks or anything like that, so the books we have been getting tend to be more tightly themed, and even without considering other issues I'm not sure what book you would have placed them in anyways.
I imagine they would’ve fit into the Ancestry Guide if Paizo had wanted them to.
Indeed.
Though, tbh, I’m curious if Drow will be an ancestry archetype, now that we have those for undead. Makes a fair bit of sense to do it that way. If that winds up being the case, I’m glad they waited.
Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber
I doubt any 3rd party content will ever dissuade Paizo from making anything official, if it is their actual intention to do so. Mark had an AMA today that sort of made me assume as much. He did, however, point out that, of them all, Stheno is probably the most likely one, he felt, they may tackle officially; given how they were presented as one of the "Ancestry Ready" cteatures in the Bestiaries. That said, he has also stated he isn't certain how likely they are to be picked up, mostly because the Stheno were kind of his pet project, and him not being with Paizo anymore may hurt their chances.
I think Minotaur have a fairly decent chance of coming. Paizo knows how vocal the community is on wanting them, and have all but said they'll be considered if they find a good place for them.
The rest? Highly, highly doubtful we would ever see any of the others, aside from maaaaybe Centaurs. And maybe Nymph. The latter mostly because the new Creature Family part of their lore lends itself really well to Heritages, imo.
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I hope I'm correct in my assumption on 3rd party v.s. offical stance. Sinclair's Library is adding Cursed Archetypes to their product; which, I feel, is very similar to how 1e's Corruptions would likely work if brought to 2e. I was always intrigued by Corruption, and would love to see them officially. So it would be a shame if Paizo was all "well, someone else did them. Job done"
I'm personally starting to open up to 3rd party more and more, basically thanks to BattleZoo. But, I will always take more offical content if given the chance.
I think "there's a drow ancestry now" is just going to have a less noticeably positive effect on people's games than basically every other ancestry they've printed (except possibly the Shoony). It just doesn't seem like you get a lot from the column inches devoted to the Drow unless this is specifically in a darklands context.
I think "there's a drow ancestry now" is just going to have a less noticeably positive effect on people's games than basically every other ancestry they've printed (except possibly the Shoony). It just doesn't seem like you get a lot from the column inches devoted to the Drow unless this is specifically in a darklands context.
*shrug* they made enough room for the Drow Shootist archetype, so they aren't afraid to made drow themed material. It seems odd that an archetype where you learn "the secrets of these fabled drow shootists" comes out before the race does.
The Drow Shootist exists basically as a means to address "advanced weapons are pretty bad unless you're a fighter or it's an ancestry weapon". It's not that the hand crossbow is a great weapon, but it's kind of funny that actual drow would probably have it as an ancestry weapon anyway.
But it's easier to work in "A drow taught it to me" to a character's backstory than figure out why drow are appearing all over the world.
But it's easier to work in "A drow taught it to me" to a character's backstory than figure out why drow are appearing all over the world.
This makes no sense to me: there are as many drow in both situations, either as teachers or a players, so I can see the "easier part as in both cases you have drow appearing all over the world. I mean if they aren't appearing, then who's teaching the archetype?
The Drow Shootist exists basically as a means to address "advanced weapons are pretty bad unless you're a fighter or it's an ancestry weapon". It's not that the hand crossbow is a great weapon, but it's kind of funny that actual drow would probably have it as an ancestry weapon anyway.
But it's easier to work in "A drow taught it to me" to a character's backstory than figure out why drow are appearing all over the world.
The Drow Shootist exists basically as a means to address "advanced weapons are pretty bad unless you're a fighter or it's an ancestry weapon". It's not that the hand crossbow is a great weapon, but it's kind of funny that actual drow would probably have it as an ancestry weapon anyway.
But it's easier to work in "A drow taught it to me" to a character's backstory than figure out why drow are appearing all over the world.
The funny thing is that if I were to go for the drow shootist, it would be with a standard hand crossbow, which is simple, and the point would be their three action-efficiency feats. I wish that thing came in martial.
I do not mean to beat a dead horse, but I am surprised that the Drow have not come out yet, being this “late” in the edition. From where I am around, they have to be one of the most popular ancestries in fantasy games... In the beginning of this edition’s lifespan I could swear that we’d see them pretty soon — sooner than most of the ancestries that we’ve already got! I know that we have the Cave Elf, but every time that I point the heritage out as a solution, fellow players just kind of seem to be bummed out about it.
Are the Drow not that big of an ancestry in the US?
Drow are super popular in the states; copies of Drizzt Do'Urden were in vogue for a long while among players, they were added to 4e as a PC race in the first setting book that edition got, and they're all over 5e (between official books and a prominent role in Critical Role's second campaign).
I imagine they aren't in PF2 yet for a few reasons.
They might be seen as too much of a D&D thing to highlight, right off the bat - the team is really keen to see Pathfinder shake off a lot of it's old D&D-isms, and "the dark elves who live in the underground realm" isn't exactly original. Not helping things is their 1e baggage (presenting them as broadly evil and awful, elves who do grave misdeeds spontaneously becoming drow, Second Darkness being fairly disliked, etc), the backlash in the last few years over drow being villainized for their skin color, the counter-backlash from nerds who think Gygax and the rest of the old guard could do no wrong... I wouldn't blame any writing team who saw all that and decided their efforts were better spent elsewhere.
But I do think there is hope. Drow made it into the first PF2 Bestiary. They've featured twice in 2e Adventure Paths, both times as groups PCs could get along with amicably - and one of them wasn't even an Evil community! I think they'll eventually come over as an Ancestry, but they likely need a cheerleader within Paizo to convince them it's worth all...
In addition to all this, Drows were usually much more powerful than other humanoids. You can expect many people to be disappointed by a PF2 version no matter what just because it will need to be balanced with other ancestries.
Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber
Alright. So I decided to try and tackle Starfinder Species next! I focused primarily on those Species found within the Pact World star system. These are largely those who are native the the system, with a few exceptions. My criteria here was they had to also exist in Pathfinder. Inn certain cases, this was theoretical, but many of them have existent lore or mentions. A few of them are from outside the system, but are frequently found on Golarion. Many of these could see inclusion if we ever see books covering Golarion's star system or planets; or a Starfinder x Pathfinder book.
Spaaaaaaaaaace:
Akitonian Humans/Hylki - First of a number of Humans on this list; I separated them here in particular because their history as well as their appearance is likely to be fairly disparate between planets. Native to Akiton, the Hylki, as Starfinder calls them, have red skin, but are otherwise biological identical to other Humans. The thing I find most fascinating about the Hylki here is considering how their skin tone would effect Half-Humans of various Heritages. Red-skinned Half-Elves and Half-Orcs, just to name the most obvious.
Akitonian Ysoki - Ysoki native to Akiton are listed here mostly because they are implied to have thousands of years of separate history, but a virtually identical to their Golarion cousins. I am curious to learn more not only about their differences, but also the overall origin of the Ysoki as a whole.
Anacite/Aballonians - The Anicite, or Aballonians, are native to the planet of Aballon, and have been there since the age lf Pathfinder. Created by the enigmatic First Ones, the constructs are capable of modifying themselves and rarely possess a uniform form. Interestingly, they are said to be incapable of producing Divine Magic, citing their lack of souls. But I certainly feel like there are creatures lacking souls capable of producing Divine Magic. So that is something I'd imagine would be changed if they were made playable.
Anassanoi - The Anassanoi aren't mentioned in Pathfinder that I could find; but Starfinder implies that they arrived upon Matara, Golarion's Sun, well before the Gap took place. This could theoretically place them there during Pathfinder's age. They reside in the city of Kahlannal, the generational ship the Anassanoi used to flee their home planet of Anassan. Upon reaching Golarion's star system and it's sun, they were caught in a solar storm, which stranded them on the star. They've been there ever since.
Androffan Humans - It is all but implied that every Androffan on the Divinity perished when it crashed. While this isn't particularly accurate, as there was at least one survivor in stasis; it is possible some other Androffan stasis pods survived the crash and are maybe being held by the Technic League or something.
Androids - Now it isn't a particular secret that Androids are in Pathfinder. But, the interesting implication here could be opening their physical appearance to possible modification, allowing them to look like other Ancestries/Species other than the Androffan. This is stated to not affect their actual abilities, but would certainly be a fun addition to customization.
Barathu/Brethedan - Barathu are floating, jellyfish-like creatures with tentacles and the ability to rewrite their own genetic code. They are native to the gas-planet of Brethada, but can be found throughout much of Golarion's star system. They can also be found on the planet Liavara, where they are known as Dreamers and are more feral in nature; although, their Barathu kin would claim Dreamers are "enlightened".
Borai - The Borai are essentially still living undead, with deteriorating bodies and active souls, requiring them to still eat, sleep, and breathe to survive. They are created either through botched resurrection attempts or simply being to stubborn to die, and they are primarily concentrated on the planet of Eox. Nothing about them necessarily makes them a Starfinder only concept, so it is very possible to see them in Pathfinder.
Contemplatives - The Contemplatives of Ashok are native to the planet of Akiton and have been there for millennium. The uniqueness of some of Pathfinders recent Ancestries make them a perfect choice as a potential option. I mean, really, who doesn't want to play as a floating brain?
Dirindi The three-eyed Dirindi are one of two natives on the Liavaran moon of Akanen, with a penchant for humor and electricity. Along with the Sazarons, the two Species co-govern their home, complementing and respecting one another in their efforts. They were described as "Humanoids" on Pathfinder's Wiki, and therefore exist within that time frame.
Dragonkin - Dragonkin are natives to the planet of Triaxus, and live in a symbiotic relationship with the native Ryphorians. They are probably the closest thing to playable Dragons we will ever receive in an official capacity. I don't recall where I saw it, but I believe it is implied that Dragonkin are capable of mating with other people outside of their Species, resulting in Half-Dragon progeny.
Earthling Humans - The planet Earth is in a galaxy far, far away from Golarion; but there exist several links between the two planets. In fact, there are a small number of Earthlings that have come to reside on Golarion. Theoretically, plenty of Humans from Earth could find their way to Golarion, a could therefore be playable.
Elebrians/Eoxian Humans - Once thought to be Humans, the Elebrians were the natives of the planet of Eox before the apocalyptic catastrophe took place, resulting in the death of all life on the planet. Now populated almost exclusively by undead, there are in-fact several small populations of Elebrians who managed to survive by one means or another.
Formians - Native to the planet of Castrovel, the ant-like Formians posses psychic abilites and can be found on a few other planets as well. They have a pretty intense rivalry with the Lashunta on the planet. This seems like shoe-in option for an Ancestry. More insectoids please.
Gray - The exact origin of the Gray is completely unknown. But their existence is very real. They are known to travel theought the Material Plane in search of knowledge and creatures to experiment on, frequently abducting people from Golarion. They are almost exclusively evil and would be more fitting as antagonists. But, hey, they are playable in Starfinder.
Haan - The insectoid Haan are the only other natives to the planet of Brethada, alongside the Barathu. They fly about the gas-giant using web-ballons they create. Like the Barathu, they have lived on the planet since the days of Pathfinder. So they would make decent option to be playable.
Hallajin/Hallasian - Natives of Hallas, one of Liavara's moons; the Hallajin are described as beings of pure energy, eschewing their physical forms in an effort to achieve apotheosis. They can communicate telepathically, but sear the minds of other creatures in doing so. Unlikely to be an option, just given they seemingly weren't truly encountered until Starfinders age; but they have been mentioned in Pathfinder. So they are at least existent.
Ikeshti - The Ikeshti are basically a red-scaled derivative of Lizardfolk native to the planet Akiton. Their life cycle is very different from their kin, having stages of almost animal-like behavior. They seem like a viable, if not socially complex, option for an Ancestry, or even a Heritage for the Iruxi themselves.
Ilee/Astrozoan - The Ilee are a strange, heterogeneous Species native to Apostae. They share no universal traits between one another, causing their abilities and appearance to be wildly different. Interestingly, their DNA and that of Starfinder's Astrozoan are generically similiar, implying a relation or evolution. It is believed that the latter are the decendants of the former, possibly having unified themselves in order to survive extinction. This one seems unlikely, at least where the Ilee are concerned. The Astrozoan could be managed; but as it stands, they don't exist in Pathfinder's age.
Kalo - Native to the Brethada's watery moon of Kalo-Mahoi, there actually exists a community of Kalo on Golarion already, stranded within the Antarkos Ocean. They arrived there after a magical accident transported them from their home planet. Under those circumstances, I'd say they are more than viable as a Rare Ancestry.
Kasatha - Natives of the distant planet of Kasath, the Kasatha were playabe in PF1 and are likely to make the jump to PF2. The exact circumstances of how they came to Golarion are debated, but it is likely they have ties to the Divinity, as they are primarily found in Numeria. It is said that the Witchwyrd are their progenitors, having used their own genetic code to seed the planet of Kasath some millennia ago.
Khizar The Khizar are a Species of intelligent plant-people native to the jungles of Castrovel. They evolved from a kind of scavenging plant-life, eventually developing into telepathic beings of Humanoid shape. Their is no mention of them in Pathfinder that I could find, so it is possible their evolution didn't take place until sometime around the Gap. But, they could theoretically come into existence at any point, as no timeline was presented.
Lantanirian - According to the Anassanoi, the plant-like Lantanirians are an ancient Species residing on Golarion's sun, Matara, in their bubble city of Latanir. They believe that they may have been in Golarion's star system since the First Ones arrival on Aballon; although, they have no proof. Given their physiology, the Lantanirians are basically forced to stay within their bubble city, as they are not immune to fire. They are seem largely content with this; so probably not a great Ancestry option.
Lashuntas - Castrovel's primary Species, the Lashunta are psychic Humanoids with antenna on their heads. They belong to a matriarchal society and are divided into two distinct subspecies. Pathfinder lore implies that these subspecies are between their female and male genders; however, Starfinder cites them as the lithe Damaya and the muscular Korasha. If I had to guess, I'd imagine PF1's lore is likely to be retconned to be more in line with Starfinders. Of all the Species on this list, Lashunta strike me as being pretty high on the eventual Ancestry options.
"Light-absorbing Humanoids" - Native to Brethada's moon of Thyst, whose radioactive atmosphere and cancerous rivers make for a very hostile environment for most other creatures. Not much is mentioned about these people, not even a name; but their existence is cited in both settings. What is stated sort of implies that they rely on the conditions of the planet to live, so they probably aren't likely to be an Ancestry option. I'd love to know more about them though.
Maraquoi - The simian Maraquoi are native to the moon of Marata orbiting Brethada. Composed of seven biological genders, they possess a highly specialized reproductive system, one that places responsibility on each gender through its process. Due to their dangerous environment, Maraquoi are often skilled warriors, with many unique traditions maintained throughout their generations. Starfinder implies that they've only just begun developing, but Pathfinder makes mention of them. This is probably more to do with technological advancements than anything else, so they should be a viable Ancestry I think.
Necrovite - Originating on Eox, Necrovites are a unique form of Lichdom, wherein a spellcaster stores their soul in a magitech device called a electroencephalon. The technomagic necessary to complete this process has been present since the death of Eox, and therefore should exist within the age of Pathfinder. I can't imagine this would become an available option for players, unless we got a specific Eox dedicated book; for which I am hopeful.
Nuar - The Nuar have a rather unique placement within the timeline of the two settings. Claiming to have originated on Golarion, there is actually little evidence to rightly confirm this as fact. They do, however, have a progenitor in the way of Nuar Spiritskin. So, it is entirely possible to see them come into existence in PF2, but will very likely require some on-screen event to take place to do so.
Protocite - The Protocite are cousins to Aballon's Anacite. They reside in the bubble-city of Noma on Matara, where the eponymous Noma A.I. creates them. The history of the Protocite and the Noma A.I. are all but unknown, but what is clear is they have ties to the mysterious First Ones. This would imply that both have existed since before Pathfinder's age, and should still be present within its current year.
Reptoid - The Reptoids actually existed in Pathfinder before they did in Statfinder. A Species of reptilian shapeshifters, Reptoids are malevolent infiltrators whose origin is unknown. They've been known to terrorize Golarion and were even playable in 1e. I'm not sure if that position would continue forward in 2e, as they seem like great potential antagonists. But time will tell.
Ryphorians/Triaxians - Native to Triaxus, the Ryphorians are one of the prominent Species alongside the Dragonkin, who they share a symbiotic relationship with. Playable in 1e, they possess two distinct forms based on which season they are born in, as well as a third option born during the brief transitional period. Their are also those possessing dragon blood, thanks to the large populations of draconic creatures on the planet. They seem likely to make a return in 2e I feel.
Sarcesians - Living amongst the astroid belt known as the Diaspora, these golden-winged Humanoids claim to be the decendants of the lost planets of Damiar and Iovo. Capable of surviving the vacuum of space, they live within the belt on twelve magically enhanced asteroids. Not much is know outside of that. Playable in Statfinder; however, their immunity to space could bar them from Pathfinder.
Sazarons - The centuar-like Sazarons are native to the Liavaran moon of Arkanen. They, along with the Dirindi, co-govern their home together. Their lower body resembles that of an iguanodon, with a tail ending in a boney knob. Compared to their cohabitants, Sazarons tend to be more scholarly and responsible, balancing out the more mischievous Dirindi. If we ever see the likes of actual Centaurs as playable, I could see these guys potentially as well.
Shobhad - Native to Akiton, the Shobhad are a Species of four-armed nomads who roam the deserts and mountains of their planet. Decended from Witchwyrds, Shobhad tend to be more aggressive, placing importance on battle, honor, and survival. Similiar to Kasatha and other similiar beings, the biggest challenge for their inclusion is establishing fitting rules for their extra pairs of arms. Ones that feels meaningful, but not overpowered.
Sovyrian Elves & Half-Elves - Elves, for their part, actually originated on the planet of Castrovel, thus making them technically aliens to Golarion. When Earthfall took place, many of those Elves residing on Golarion would return to their homeland of Sovyrian. It isn't clear how many Elves were on Castrovel beforehand or how many may have returned to Golarion, but surely there were enough to remaining in Sovyrian to maintain their home. Starfinder, interestingly enough, makes mention of Half-Elves living within Sovyrian. This likely stems from those Half-Elves displaced during the Gap choosing to join their Elven relatives, as well as further mingling between Humans and Elves. Pathfinder doesn't, however. So it got me thinking, is it possible for Elves to mate with Lashunta to make Half-Elves? Normally this happens exclusively with Humans, but, as you'll learn, this isn't always the case.
Triaxian Adlets - I'm still a bit on the fence to whether I believe Adlets themselves have any chance of becoming playable. But, should they, there are also Adlets living on Triaxus. Not much is mentioned about them, but they are likely pretty similar to their Golarion counterparts. What I wonder though, is if they would also possess different adaptations for the two extreme seasons the planet undergoes regularly; as many of the fauna and flora present seem to.
Triaxian Dragons - Dragons are unlikely to be made playable in any offical manner, but they are through BattleZoo. For that reason, I placed them on the list. Particularly, it seems that Chromatic and Metallic Dragons are the primary examples here, but I'm curious if any others might call the planet home. Also curious if they undergo any changes between summer and winter, like many other residents of the planet.
Triaxian Elves & Half-Elves - A number of Sovyrian Elves would come to migrate onto Triaxus and settle there. Given their keen environmental adaptability, it is likely that they have summer and winter adaptations like their Ryphorian neighbors. One seemingly unique interation here is that Elves and Ryphorians and capable of producing Half-Elves through their union. This is what got me wondering about the Sovyrian Elves and Lashunta. What makes this different from other instances of Elves mating with other Ancestries/Species?
Triaxian Gnomes - The only other core Ancestry on this list, I have the same question about Gnomes and the Triaxus environment that I had with the others above. Furthermore, Gnomes tend to adapt to the magic accessible around them. So, I'm curious if there may be any unique magical footprint for them to attach to.
Trox - Playable in 1e, the Trox are native to Liavara, where they reside on its moon of Nchak. Similiar to arachnids, the Trox were originally a Species of eight-legged arthropods, until the Forever Queen, mortal incarnation of the Goddess Hylax, had them magically altered. They were then divided and placed into shielded transport asteroids, wherein they were ejected from Liavara's orbit to expand their empire on other planets. Golarion was one of these landing sites, wherein the Trox would be enslaved by the Duergar for a time, before many of them escaped. Still viable, stepping into PF2. However, they have six arms. So they may be a challenge.
Urog - The Brethadan moon of Dykon is home to many silicon-based lifeforms, the most intelligent of them being the Urog. Appearing as strange crystalline gastropods, they possess two modes of sorts, depending on their tasks. Their "everyday mode" they look like snails, and hover using electromagnetism to float. In their "engagement mode" they unfurl the multitude of limbs they have tucked away, so that they may interact with their environment or others, be that for combat or reproductive purposes. I'm not certain they would see use as an Ancestry option, but they are existent in the age of Pathfinder; and I hope to learn more about them.
Verthani/Vercites - The natives of the tidally-locked Verces, the Verthani are the dominant Species of the planet and bear a penchant for self-modification. They are broken into three castes: the cybernetically modified Augmented, the unmodified Pure Ones, and the religious God-Vessels. Even prior to the Gap, the Verthani were the most technologically advanced people in Golarion's star system; even developing space travel and visiting Golarion at one point. They seem largely similiar to a cross between Humans and Androids, and could likely be a viable Ancestry option.
Witchwyrds - Dedicated wanderers and consummate merchants, the four-armed Witchwyrds left their planet of Cyrune long ago to explore and trade throughout the entirety of the Great Beyond. They were responsible with seeding the planets of Kasath and Akiton with their own genetic codes, resulting in the birth of the Kasatha and Shobhad respectively. They are frequently found throughout Golarion, its star system, and the rest of the multiverse; so seeing them become playable isn't far from a stretch I think.
Yithian - Last on this list, the Great Race of Yith, are strange Aberrations with the ability to swap their minds with other beings through space and time, effectively taking over their bodies. They generally don't do this with evil intent; however, long ago they did enact a mass exodus, where everyone on their dying planet swaping their minds with another Species of being whose form they retain today. This resulted in the extinction of their previous bodies, and the minds of those whose bodies they claimed; which they believe was absolutely necessary to save their own species. Given their ability, one could easily suggest that any given person is, in-fact, a Yithian. But the strange, conical bodies they currently possess could be made playable as well.
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This one ended up super long. Longest one I've done so far. Many of these could comes as a result of having any number of books on things like Golarion space, it's neighboring planets, or even the Dark Tapestry. But the most interesting means would certainly be a crossover event kind of deal between the two settings. Whichever the do, I'd be excited to play, or just learn about, any number of these people. I think I'll do the Outer Planes next.
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