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Prerelease Discussion

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Voss wrote:
Roswynn wrote:
Bardarok wrote:
Themetricsystem wrote:

Oracle as a Sorcerer (Or Spontaneous Arcane) Archetype would actually be a really cool way to handle the Class.

The first Dedication Feat could introduce the Curse, Mystery, and change their available Spellcasting to pull from the Divine list instead. The Mystery could in effect wholesale replace their Sorcerer Bloodline.

Additional Feats could tackle letting PCs choose from a list of Revelations applicable to their chosen Mystery and others which would improve how their Curse functions.

I don't think it is likely but I would enjoy if the sorcerer's spell list was bloodline dependent.

That would be AWESOME. A lightning sorcerer who actually uses LIGHTNING instead of fireballs, and a lot of storm-related spells. Restricted, but powerful in their bloodline's abilities.

The oracle-sorcerer parallel is very good too, Themetricsystem, I dig.

Storms would be nice. I'd just like to see an abandonment of earth/stone equals acid and water equals cold.

If the game system can't manage that, then the four elements need to actually be fire, acid, lightning and ice , rather than fire, air, earth and water.

Though the better option is realizing a damage type isn't the point of an element themed spellcaster.

Since spells (and most things in general) are relying on keywords, my hope is that the reasons for using acid=earth, ect will be gone. Resistance or vulnerability to acid based on elemental reasons could just be done with resistance or vulnerability to earth spells.

But elemental spellcasters being more tied to their element and not stuck with "this is your damage type" would be well appreciated, as well.


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I THINK I saw mention of a "water damage" somewhere. I think we may be getting some new elements, and water will no longer be linked to cold. In general we seem to be getting a new emphasis on thematic abilities and weaknesses on monsters, so I think this seems consistent.


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Tholomyes wrote:
Voss wrote:
Roswynn wrote:
Bardarok wrote:
Themetricsystem wrote:

Oracle as a Sorcerer (Or Spontaneous Arcane) Archetype would actually be a really cool way to handle the Class.

The first Dedication Feat could introduce the Curse, Mystery, and change their available Spellcasting to pull from the Divine list instead. The Mystery could in effect wholesale replace their Sorcerer Bloodline.

Additional Feats could tackle letting PCs choose from a list of Revelations applicable to their chosen Mystery and others which would improve how their Curse functions.

I don't think it is likely but I would enjoy if the sorcerer's spell list was bloodline dependent.

That would be AWESOME. A lightning sorcerer who actually uses LIGHTNING instead of fireballs, and a lot of storm-related spells. Restricted, but powerful in their bloodline's abilities.

The oracle-sorcerer parallel is very good too, Themetricsystem, I dig.

Storms would be nice. I'd just like to see an abandonment of earth/stone equals acid and water equals cold.

If the game system can't manage that, then the four elements need to actually be fire, acid, lightning and ice , rather than fire, air, earth and water.

Though the better option is realizing a damage type isn't the point of an element themed spellcaster.

Since spells (and most things in general) are relying on keywords, my hope is that the reasons for using acid=earth, ect will be gone. Resistance or vulnerability to acid based on elemental reasons could just be done with resistance or vulnerability to earth spells.

But elemental spellcasters being more tied to their element and not stuck with "this is your damage type" would be well appreciated, as well.

I *reallyreallyreally* hope they disassociate acid from earth (makes no sense!! XD ) and ice from water (makes sense but...) - I want to have element-benders as an at least marginally feasible concept: earth is earth, stone, rock, bludgeoning damage. Water is, again, bludgeoning damage - take a big wave face on and dispute that. Heat and fire are totes fine, and air ---> lightning is just logical (although sure, lightning is plasma, so fire, but air makes sense too, absolutely). Also air by itself, again, BLUDGEONING DAMAGE. I know it gets stale but if they wanna stay true to the actual classic elements, it's either that way or the highway - acid doesn't make a iota of sense, and ice is a different concept. Related, sure, but an undine and a Jadwiga White Witch have nothing in common.

OF COURSE, if WATER DAMAGE becomes a reality, and so do earth damage and air damage... dammit, all the better! Actually much better because water damage will automatically interact in a certain way against a wall of fire, and so on - right? It's a good chance to really give those presocratic elements a test drive, guys!

Liberty's Edge

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Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path, Companion, Lost Omens, Pathfinder Accessories, Rulebook Subscriber

IIRC Kineticist's blasts had damage types more in line with what the element actually did


The Raven Black wrote:
IIRC Kineticist's blasts had damage types more in line with what the element actually did

WEEE we're on the right track guys!

(I wouldn't remember because I only had a cursory glance at occult classes, like once, and promptly forgot most of them... although there were some genuinely cool concepts in there! I hope we'll see them again soon!).


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Roswynn wrote:
Tholomyes wrote:
Voss wrote:
Roswynn wrote:
Bardarok wrote:
Themetricsystem wrote:

Oracle as a Sorcerer (Or Spontaneous Arcane) Archetype would actually be a really cool way to handle the Class.

The first Dedication Feat could introduce the Curse, Mystery, and change their available Spellcasting to pull from the Divine list instead. The Mystery could in effect wholesale replace their Sorcerer Bloodline.

Additional Feats could tackle letting PCs choose from a list of Revelations applicable to their chosen Mystery and others which would improve how their Curse functions.

I don't think it is likely but I would enjoy if the sorcerer's spell list was bloodline dependent.

That would be AWESOME. A lightning sorcerer who actually uses LIGHTNING instead of fireballs, and a lot of storm-related spells. Restricted, but powerful in their bloodline's abilities.

The oracle-sorcerer parallel is very good too, Themetricsystem, I dig.

Storms would be nice. I'd just like to see an abandonment of earth/stone equals acid and water equals cold.

If the game system can't manage that, then the four elements need to actually be fire, acid, lightning and ice , rather than fire, air, earth and water.

Though the better option is realizing a damage type isn't the point of an element themed spellcaster.

Since spells (and most things in general) are relying on keywords, my hope is that the reasons for using acid=earth, ect will be gone. Resistance or vulnerability to acid based on elemental reasons could just be done with resistance or vulnerability to earth spells.

But elemental spellcasters being more tied to their element and not stuck with "this is your damage type" would be well appreciated, as well.

I *reallyreallyreally* hope they disassociate acid from earth (makes no sense!! XD ) and ice from water (makes sense but...) - I want to have element-benders as an at least marginally feasible concept: earth is earth, stone, rock, bludgeoning...

Yes, I'm pretty sure the context of water damage was had to do with use on fire elementals or something of that nature.

Personally, I'm still holding out hope that elemental damage carries riders as a regular thing, as sort of an equivalent to critical specializations on weapons.


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Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Based on Jason Bulmahn's comments in the Paizo Friday Stream from 2 weeks ago (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4LI7Wo5Jtms&feature=youtu.be), my money is sorcerer this week.


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It sure is.


Captain Morgan wrote:
Personally, I'm still holding out hope that elemental damage carries riders as a regular thing, as sort of an equivalent to critical specializations on weapons.

I'd really like that. I'd also like for slashing and piercing weapons to more often inflict bleeding, but I'll take what I can grab.

So, you seen in the sorcerer blog post the damage types listed for that feat are fire, lightning, acid and ice? -__- Not a mention of water, air and earth...


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Roswynn wrote:
Captain Morgan wrote:
Personally, I'm still holding out hope that elemental damage carries riders as a regular thing, as sort of an equivalent to critical specializations on weapons.

I'd really like that. I'd also like for slashing and piercing weapons to more often inflict bleeding, but I'll take what I can grab.

So, you seen in the sorcerer blog post the damage types listed for that feat are fire, lightning, acid and ice? -__- Not a mention of water, air and earth...

Or heart.


Gregg Reece wrote:
Roswynn wrote:
Captain Morgan wrote:
Personally, I'm still holding out hope that elemental damage carries riders as a regular thing, as sort of an equivalent to critical specializations on weapons.

I'd really like that. I'd also like for slashing and piercing weapons to more often inflict bleeding, but I'll take what I can grab.

So, you seen in the sorcerer blog post the damage types listed for that feat are fire, lightning, acid and ice? -__- Not a mention of water, air and earth...

Or heart.

C-C-COMBO BREAKER!!


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I'm going to guess Friday's blog is rituals, since we got the spellcaster who would most benefit from that this week.


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Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path, Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
Fuzzypaws wrote:
I'm going to guess Friday's blog is rituals, since we got the spellcaster who would most benefit from that this week.

You might be right, but we have 5-6 blogs left, and 2 classes, a few ancestries, exploration mode, and multiclassing to cover. If you're correct, I wonder what of that will get put to the wayside. I've already given up on combat maneuvers, for instance.

I'm increasingly certain skipping druids on the logic that they were already basically covered would be a mistake. Look how many have been surprised by information that had been covered in various places weeks ahead of the blog post, like the fact that archetypes were devlivered via class feats, or Sorcerers didn't get to freely upcast? Even if its mostly a rehash, I think a druid post placing all the info on the blog would be appropriate.

Edit: My mental count of "what SHOULD be covered" was why I was so nonplussed by traps.


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AnimatedPaper wrote:
Edit: My mental count of "what SHOULD be covered" was why I was so nonplussed by traps.

Amen to that, origami friend. Amen to that.

Liberty's Edge

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I'm betting either Rituals for reasons already stated, or the remaining Ancestries due to the Ancestry/Bloodline thematic connection.

Next week would then probably be Bard. With either Rituals or Ancestries on Friday (whichever they neglected this week).

I'd then bet Druid the Monday after that, with Exploration Mode on Friday, then Multiclassing the final Monday, revealing it right before the release.


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Deadmanwalking wrote:

I'm betting either Rituals for reasons already stated, or the remaining Ancestries due to the Ancestry/Bloodline thematic connection.

Next week would then probably be Bard. With either Rituals or Ancestries on Friday (whichever they neglected this week).

I'd then bet Druid the Monday after that, with Exploration Mode on Friday, then Multiclassing the final Monday, revealing it right before the release.

Were you a cleric of Pharasma in life, with all these prophecies?


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I'd guess the Starfinder deity Yaraesa instead. It's not prophecy, It's a predictive model from known information.


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Deadmanwalking wrote:

I'm betting either Rituals for reasons already stated, or the remaining Ancestries due to the Ancestry/Bloodline thematic connection.

Next week would then probably be Bard. With either Rituals or Ancestries on Friday (whichever they neglected this week).

I'd then bet Druid the Monday after that, with Exploration Mode on Friday, then Multiclassing the final Monday, revealing it right before the release.

I think that is a pretty reasonable trajectory.

I hope we get multiclassing before the end because I want to do some preliminary theorycrafting but I know it is probably gonna be hella controversial no matter how it is implemented and--as such--I imagine it will take up a monday blog.

I maybe doubt multiclassing will be last merely because that kind of controversy might sour people's reception of the game's ultimate release. One thing that is good about this slower drip of info leading up to the release is that some of the impact of some of these hot topics is diffused over time rather than all of the topics hitting enthusiasts all at once.

On another axis, I think it might be wise of paizo to move up multiclassing from the end if only so DMs and other "mechanical ambassadors" have a little time to learn this system before people run it. As far as my group goes: I know my friends are gonna wanna try the game right away and I know at least one person is gonna wanna multiclass.


Excaliburproxy wrote:
Deadmanwalking wrote:

I'm betting either Rituals for reasons already stated, or the remaining Ancestries due to the Ancestry/Bloodline thematic connection.

Next week would then probably be Bard. With either Rituals or Ancestries on Friday (whichever they neglected this week).

I'd then bet Druid the Monday after that, with Exploration Mode on Friday, then Multiclassing the final Monday, revealing it right before the release.

I think that is a pretty reasonable trajectory.

I hope we get multiclassing before the end because I want to do some preliminary theorycrafting but I know it is probably gonna be hella controversial no matter how it is implemented and--as such--I imagine it will take up a monday blog.

I maybe doubt multiclassing will be last merely because that kind of controversy might sour people's reception of the game's ultimate release. One thing that is good about this slower drip of info leading up to the release is that some of the impact of some of these hot topics is diffused over time rather than all of the topics hitting enthusiasts all at once.

On another axis, I think it might be wise of paizo to move up multiclassing from the end if only so DMs and other "mechanical ambassadors" have a little time to learn this system before people run it. As far as my group goes: I know my friends are gonna wanna try the game right away and I know at least one person is gonna wanna multiclass.

Agreed on all the line. I really hope we'll see multiclassing! And I concur that releasing info bit by bit diffuses the shock of a new edition pretty well - these canny Paizo devs...


Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Yea i kinda think we are not going to get multi classing since that would be the Monday of Gen-con. It's going to be Controversial and they will have all of the last minute stuff to do. I actually doubt we are going to get a blog on the 30th. could move druid to that Monday though we have seen most of it so it should't be as controversial.

Liberty's Edge

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Roswynn wrote:
Were you a cleric of Pharasma in life, with all these prophecies?

Nah, in Pathfinder, I'd be a Cleric of Desna. For a whole host of reasons. :)

But Clerics in general still get Augury and Divination...

Excaliburproxy wrote:
I maybe doubt multiclassing will be last merely because that kind of controversy might sour people's reception of the game's ultimate release. One thing that is good about this slower drip of info leading up to the release is that some of the impact of some of these hot topics is diffused over time rather than all of the topics hitting enthusiasts all at once.

Swapping it and Druid is very possible, I just have a feeling it's gonna be the way I suggested. I could easily be wrong.


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Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path, Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
Emeric Tusan wrote:
Yea i kinda think we are not going to get multi classing since that would be the Monday of Gen-con. It's going to be Controversial and they will have all of the last minute stuff to do. I actually doubt we are going to get a blog on the 30th. could move druid to that Monday though we have seen most of it so it should't be as controversial.

If we weren't getting a blog at all on multiclassing, they wouldn't be so darn cagey about it. They've been extremely disciplined on not revealing information before they are good and ready. If it wasn't going to be covered via blog or interview ahead of the playtest, they'd have simply let it fly on either the archetype blog or in one of the multiclassing threads, and taken the heat then.

Edit: Of my little list, I can see exploration mode not getting the attention of a blog post. *I* want one, but there's far more interest in the other four topics


They've mentioned the possibility of Wednesday blogs in the past. I know we haven't gotten any yet, but that could still change, could it not?


Crayon wrote:
They've mentioned the possibility of Wednesday blogs in the past. I know we haven't gotten any yet, but that could still change, could it not?

They also said if they did Wednesday blogs, they'd primarily be artwork blogs.


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Gregg Reece wrote:
Crayon wrote:
They've mentioned the possibility of Wednesday blogs in the past. I know we haven't gotten any yet, but that could still change, could it not?
They also said if they did Wednesday blogs, they'd primarily be artwork blogs.

Which by the way I would totally be in favor of... Wayne's concept art is astounding.


Ngl, the biggest reason I'm all antsy for the multiclassing blog is because I'm looking to round up my absurdly high-power 5e campaign and start a PF playtest one, and I know I'll have fun playtesting if I try and push the system to the snapping point. I kind of want to see which rules I need to take apart in order to let everyone play gesalts.

Paizo Employee Designer

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Elleth wrote:
Ngl, the biggest reason I'm all antsy for the multiclassing blog is because I'm looking to round up my absurdly high-power 5e campaign and start a PF playtest one, and I know I'll have fun playtesting if I try and push the system to the snapping point. I kind of want to see which rules I need to take apart in order to let everyone play gesalts.

It should be pretty easy to do a gestalt. That said, much as I love modding (check any of my posts on Unchained to see that I may love it an unhealthy amount) for the playtest I hope most people will consider not modding. Knowing how every group's different modding went is still kind of nice, but it's much less useful than building up a big set of data from many groups that didn't mod.


Elleth wrote:
Ngl, the biggest reason I'm all antsy for the multiclassing blog is because I'm looking to round up my absurdly high-power 5e campaign and start a PF playtest one, and I know I'll have fun playtesting if I try and push the system to the snapping point. I kind of want to see which rules I need to take apart in order to let everyone play gesalts.

I am actually currently playing in a gestalt 5e game. It is my first time being a player in ages. That is a cute little coincidence.

Paizo Employee Designer

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Excaliburproxy wrote:
Elleth wrote:
Ngl, the biggest reason I'm all antsy for the multiclassing blog is because I'm looking to round up my absurdly high-power 5e campaign and start a PF playtest one, and I know I'll have fun playtesting if I try and push the system to the snapping point. I kind of want to see which rules I need to take apart in order to let everyone play gesalts.
I am actually currently playing in a gestalt 5e game. It is my first time being a player in ages. That is a cute little coincidence.

It would be so much funnier if you guys found out that Elleth was your GM and you never knew the other's forum handle.


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Hey Elleth. My friends call me Max. That mean anything to you?


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Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path, Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

I've seen romcoms start this way *grabs the popcorn*


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Excaliburproxy wrote:
Hey Elleth. My friends call me Max. That mean anything to you?

That would be cute, but alas, I'm not actually running a gesalt 5e game.

It's high powered for a couple of different reasons:
1. I use magic items as a way to play with rules. Examples include hand wraps that let the monk turn his fists into fire and parry barehanded for a ki point (this rule actually rocks IMO and I love it), the dreaded Wand of War Crimes (turns magic and blood sacrifice into absurd amounts of single target and AOE damage) and Orion's Brush (an item I helped a player craft. Bit strong, very complicated, but par for the course by this point).
Orion's Brush:
Orion's Brush
25 charges - regain upon long rest

A beautiful and well-polished wooden brush, ending in a very broad brush-head that tapers gently inwards. Set behind the brush-head into the wood is a gleaming silver-blue orb, within which floats scenes of spiralling blue clouds above myriad and phantasmal shapes -both animate and inanimate- constantly shifting between forms. The tip gains and loses pigment as the situation demands, shifting through varied and kaleidoscopic colours. When used to paint, the brush calls up strange shadow-stuff from the soul within it, giving life and form to illusory and transient shapes. While proficiency in painter's tools is not required to use the brush, attempting to use the brush without proficiency will produce only flawed creations.

For any creations of the brush that require either an attack roll or a saving throw, the to-hit bonus is equal to charisma mod + proficiency bonus + 2 and the DC is equal to 10 + charisma mod + proficiency bonus. If a creation would require a spell to be cast, the brush acts as an arcane focus (such a spell also uses the to-hit bonus or DC stated above). If a creature uses its action to examine the creation with an intelligence (investigation) check against the DC, it recognises the creation as illusory on a success. A creature does not make such a check unless it otherwise would in the situation. If a creature recognises the true nature of the creation as a result of an investigation check or true sight, the creation becomes faint and intangible to it and the creature cannot interact with it. A creature that recognises the true nature of the creation via true sight cannot choose to ignore this.

As an action, the user of the brush can paint an area approximately equal in size to a hand-held object. Otherwise, painting takes 1 minute for each 5 foot square it overlaps with (additional squares that would be present as a result of height or depth are included in the painting time). The user can choose to paint either an object (such as a bomb, a sword, a statue, or a chest), a modification to terrain (a wall, damaged tiles, a hole in the wall, a door (but not geometrically impossible modifications like an extra-dimensional room)), a creature (a lizard, an automaton knight, a floating ball of flame, a spooky skeleton) a permanent effect (a swirling vortex of flame, the floor is lava, an electrical moat, a window from which shines light), or a transient effect (a shower of sparks, a bolt of lightning, a spray of water, an exploding butterfly). Producing a transient effect does not require charges provided that the effect is instantaneous and took only an action to paint (in addition, the target of an instantaneous effect can be up to 30 feet away from the painting), otherwise a creation uses 1 charge for each 5 foot square it is considered to overlap with (including depth and height). A creation lasts for 1 hour from when it was painted. If a charge is spent, it can remain as a painting until certain conditions as specified by the painter are met. Time spent inactive still counts towards the 1 hour total. If a non-instantaneous effect would deal damage, the painter may specify the conditions under which a creature takes that damage (though the same creature cannot take damage more than once a round). Damage dealt by creations is d6 (this increases to 2d6 at level 5, 3d6 at level 11, and 4d6 at level 17), this damage source is magical. Each section of an inanimate creation that overlaps with a 5 foot square has 30 hit points and an AC equal to the DC. A created creature has 10 hit points, AC equal to 10 + proficiency bonus, 10 + proficiency bonus for all stats except intelligence and charisma (which are instead equal to proficiency), 30 foot speed (in types appropriate to the creature), and the construct type (along with immunity to poison damage and the poisoned condition). A created creature cannot speak but understands all languages known by the painter. For each size category above medium the creature gains +2 strength +2 constitution, for each size category below medium the creature gains +2 dexterity -2 strength -2 constitution. The melee to-hit bonus and damage are increased by the strength modifier, while AC and the ranged to-hit bonus and damage are increased by the dexterity modifier.

If the painter decides to create a consumable item usable by another person such as a potion or a scroll then they may place a casting of a spell within that item, to do so they must cast the spell. If the painter wishes to heal with such an item, they must either cast a healing spell or transfer some of their hit points (this lowers the painters maximum hit points as well) or unused hit dice into the item. The painter can also transfer some of their stat points (this cannot take a stat above 20 or a stat of the painter below 1), saves or proficiencies (expertise counts as a secondary level of proficiency) into a inanimate item to be worn by a benefactor (such as a crown, anklet, or robe) or into a creature. The painter may also transfer hit dice or hit points to a created creature. This list may not be exhaustive.

2. The gods are active in the story and invested in the players. As a houserule, players can pray or swear themselves to a god for aid, and they might get a response in the form of a permanent or temporary boon. The issue is my entire pantheon has a strong case of blue and orange morality, and we've lost 4 PCs that way (one got his head chopped off by the rest of the party for being considered too dangerous to let live, one turned himself into a tree, one became a mass murdering lich and got banished by the rest of the party, and one realised that he was an aspect of the god of fate he prayed to all along and ascended). The boons are incredibly strong and usually intended to lure the PC into accomplishing the god's goals. Examples below:

The boon of the only survivor:
This one is absurdly powerful, and most of the effects are linked to legacy abilities he picked up which under the initial effect (more of a curse from the mother of monsters/patron of heroes).

By the touch of the Mother of Monsters, Aukan Thuliaga found himself blessed with tremendous powers, but at the cost of a grim and growing hunger. Fighting against this hunger, he showed tremendous restraint and resolve. Impressed, Yabasanaak handed to him salvation -a chance to earn the fate he deserved.
Time and time again, he continued to show his resolve. An endless righteous drive, he refused to give in to the way of the beast.
By this gift of god, Aukan found his power deep within -an unrelenting well of eternal might. His soul is bared -his power set free. And by his discovery, Yabasanaak is content to watch -the die is cast, greatness will surely come.

Aukan's "Blessing" ("the seven colours of death", all properties of the sword Choices are also summarised below) now works as follows:
-Aukan treats his pool of hit dice as a pool of residual power, this can be used as mentioned later. Any such powers can only be used while raging with the exception of Emperor's Oath. Aukan does not need any hit dice to use his powers, but each hit dice that cannot or will not be paid is instead taken as a level of exhaustion.
-At the end of a short rest, Aukan recovers any hit dice not absent due to the recovery of HP. Hit dice spent to recover HP are spent after this recovery of HD.
-At the end of a short rest, if Aukan has no remaining rages, he regains one.
-Aukan requires a normal amount of food a day, if he increases in size category, this amount will change appropriately.
-Choices is still a +2 magic greatsword that Aukan cannot be unwillingly made to drop (this includes both physical effects and mind control).

Aukan has access to the following powers (unless it states otherwise, Aukan can activate only one of these a turn):
-(costs 1HD) Sculpt the flames: Choices separates into shards of metal held together by bonds of crimson flame. As a bonus action, Aukan may transform Choices into any other weapon in the equipment section of the PHB until the start of his next turn. Regardless of the form it takes, it is treated as a heavy melee weapon for the sake of all spells, class features, or feats, and any attack it makes (even ranged attacks) are treated as if they were melee weapon attacks made with a heavy melee weapon. If the attack would normally count as ranged, it deals fire damage instead of its normal damage type. Ranged weapons count for threatened ranges as they normally would.
-(costs 1HD) Dance of death: Strokes of yellowy orange flame whip from Choices, increasing its effective reach. Until the end of turn, the reach of Choices is doubled and all damage dealt by the weapon is fire damage.
-(costs 1-4HD) Three-colour smite: With the spilling of blood, Choices crackles with eldritch flames -green, blue, and purple, they melt flesh and sear bone. This power is used on a hit against a creature with a melee weapon attack with Choices and adds 2d8 additional fire damage, if more than 1HD is used, each additional HD adds an extra 1d8 fire damage. This power may be used more than once a turn, but only on separate hits.
-(costs 2HD) Divine in blood: Aukan tears an enemy apart, from the remains, he reads a glimpse into the near future. This power can be used in the same turn as other powers, but only in response to him killing another creature. It functions as the augury spell, except that it can only predict within the next minute, and that it resets after a short rest instead of a long rest.
-(costs 5HD) Gift of a thousand arrows: With a slash, Aukan tears Choices through the air, scattering the copper orbs with immense speed. On contact with an object, the orbs explode into flames of all colours, leaving behind a glittering trail of death. As an action, Aukan may force all creatures within a 100 foot cone to make a dexterity save, on a failure they take 8d8 fire damage, taking half damage on a success. The save DC is 10+prof+str mod.
-(special: permanently uses 1-3HD) Emperor's oath: Drawing on his power inside, Aukan binds himself to an oath. The oath does not need to be complex, a more clearly defined single tenet from a paladin oath would be a good example. As part of this binding, Aukan selects an aspect of himself that could help towards the keeping of this oath (for example his blessing, his sword, or his powerful build trait), and in exchange the oath builds upon it. These changes, though permanent, are extremely powerful, and scale with the number of HD used. This power may be used again to enhance an existing oath by paying an additional HD (up to a maximum of 3). These changes only take effect after the next long rest.

The parting gift to the party left by the PC that ascended:
At any one time you can have a maximum number of points of inspiration equal to your proficiency modifier, and you start each day with a number of points of inspiration equal to that number. In addition, you may choose to use inspiration after you see the results of the initial roll. You may still gain inspiration in response for actions, up to once a session.

You gain a number of additional uses for your inspiration.

Pick two of the following metamagic options. Instead of being applied specifically to spells, you may instead apply them to any action, movement, bonus action, or free action that you perform. Using one of the following options uses a number of inspiration equal to the normal sorcery point cost. These metamagic options can only be paid with inspiration, not sorcery points. You cannot use inspiration to pay for other metamagic options you already possess. If you pick a metamagic option that you would already have a version of as a sorcerer, you may choose a different sorcerer metamagic option to replace the sorcerer metamagic option you already possess. You may use inspiration and sorcery point metamagic options in conjunction. Along with examples, the metamagic options are as follows:

-Careful Spell (for the purposes of Careful Spell, assume your Charisma modifier is +5), e.g. setting off explosives or collapsing a tunnel, allowing chosen creatures to succeed on their saving throw.
-Distant Spell, e.g. performing melee attacks at a range of 30 feet, doubling the range of a longbow, or moving 60 feet instead of 30 for a non-dash movement.
-Quickened Spell (unlike normal Quickened Spell, the modified action does not have to have a time of 1 action), e.g. dashing as a bonus action, attacking as a bonus action.
-Subtle Spell (this extends V&S components to any perceptible physical or sound-based component. This does not give advantage), e.g. picking a pocket without being seen, appearing after your movement as if you had teleported, attacking without swinging your sword.

In addition, you may cast the following spells with the modifications given:

-(cost: 2 points of inspiration) Misty Step, no verbal component or silvery mist.
-(cost: 4 points of inspiration) Dimension door, no verbal component and you cannot teleport another creature. You do not take force damage on a failed teleportation.
-(cost: 6 points of inspiration) Arcane gate, no verbal or somatic components. The portals can only be seen by you or a creature able to perceive invisible objects, they resemble knots of twisted space. Only you and objects you are carrying can pass through the portals. The secondary portal is placed as the dimension door spell is targeted. However, if it would be placed in a location occupied by a creature or object, it is instead shunted to the nearest unoccupied space within range.

He also teleported in a dwarf who is convinced that he's on a mission from god. Which is... sorta true?

3. The current plotline involves serial regicide in fantasy WW1/2. Also the party has decided that their ultimate goal is to end circular time (TL;DR time is broken on the order of 10,000 years, so the rise and fall of civilisation repeats in roughly the same patterns).

Mark Seifter wrote:
It should be pretty easy to do a gestalt. That said, much as I love modding (check any of my posts on Unchained to see that I may love it an unhealthy amount) for the playtest I hope most people will consider not modding. Knowing how every group's different modding went is still kind of nice, but it's much less useful than building up a big set of data from many groups that didn't mod.

Thanks! I think that most people will run it as is, but I agree. The issue is that it has been traditionally hard to regularly schedule with my players so whatever I run next is what I'll probably be stuck with for a while. I'm not ruling out running the game as is, I just think it's likely that I'll end up running something a little bit further from the norm than expected. I'll be more than happy to feed back any of my findings though if things start getting wacky.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Deadmanwalking wrote:
I'm betting either Rituals for reasons already stated, or the remaining Ancestries due to the Ancestry/Bloodline thematic connection.

Rituals and ancestries are definite possibilities for the stated reasons, yet my gut tells me that we're going to get a blog about magical traditions which focuses on primal and occult magic. We already have a grasp on what arcane and divine magic do (material essence and mental essence as opposed to spiritual essence and vital essence), but we haven't heard about the other two. We can guess, and we have (it seems obvious to me that primal covers material and vital and occult mental and spiritual), but we haven't heard anything concrete. With the sorcerer being able to choose between the four, and to somewhat blend them, it seems like this would be the perfect time for a fuller explanation. Besides, if the bard is occult now like most of us think, then getting that info out there first would be a good segue. Also, it's been mentioned that some spells have been shifted out of the arcane tradition and into the others, so this would be a good time to get into that. What can wizards no longer do that other casters can? Is there maybe any vice versa? We shall soon see! ...soon being a time between this Friday and Thursday August 2nd.


Yeah I think your right I think we will get rituals.


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We may get an explanation of how Occult spellcasting works. However, that could also be attached to a Rituals blog.


Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path, Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

I would expect a rundown of Occult to be placed after bards. Possibly right before druids, if they went over primal too, and rituals. They might juust have enough room left to put in some info on powers too, like how the spell point pool grows and how they scale for classes that have powers but no spell slots, like a paladin.

I could see them doing the remaining ancestries tomorrow. Kind of ties into sorcerers, especially since "Arcane" became "Imperial (Azlanti)." But I've no firm guess.


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Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber

We have some information on how occult casting works! It’s still verbal and somatic components, but individual classes can (as with other lists) make substitutions. Bard can provide verbal components with instruments, for instance.


Sad times for us; rarity blog. Did pf1 not have rarity?

Sovereign Court

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Common Ground

Anyone else notice the uncommon rarity on Kyra's domain power?

Liberty's Edge

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KingOfAnything wrote:

Common Ground

Anyone else notice the uncommon rarity on Kyra's domain power?

I did not, but that's pretty cool. I bet that's standard for Domain powers. All of them require a specific God, after all.


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Well this blog itself did say

Common Ground wrote:
For instance, all domain powers in the playtest are uncommon spells, but clerics are granted access to domain powers through their deities

Liberty's Edge

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Shinigami02 wrote:

Well this blog itself did say

Common Ground wrote:
For instance, all domain powers in the playtest are uncommon spells, but clerics are granted access to domain powers through their deities

I missed that! Still, glad I'm following the logic, anyway. :)


Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber

That’s... really cool, actually. You could potentially get access to domain powers as something you can cast through spell slots? It’d be really inefficient, but screw that, Wizards of Nethys do what they want!

Paizo Employee Designer

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QuidEst wrote:
That’s... really cool, actually. You could potentially get access to domain powers as something you can cast through spell slots? It’d be really inefficient, but screw that, Wizards of Nethys do what they want!

Powers are still powers, with their own associated rules, and they wouldn't be on the wizard's list. But a heretical sect of a particular deity might gain access to a particular domain power through a different means than the usual domain feat, for instance, but it would still be a power.


Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber
Mark Seifter wrote:
QuidEst wrote:
That’s... really cool, actually. You could potentially get access to domain powers as something you can cast through spell slots? It’d be really inefficient, but screw that, Wizards of Nethys do what they want!
Powers are still powers, with their own associated rules, and they wouldn't be on the wizard's list. But a heretical sect of a particular deity might gain access to a particular domain power through a different means than the usual domain feat, for instance, but it would still be a power.

Gotcha! Good to know, and thank you for the clarification.

Liberty's Edge

Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path, Companion, Lost Omens, Pathfinder Accessories, Rulebook Subscriber
Mark Seifter wrote:
QuidEst wrote:
That’s... really cool, actually. You could potentially get access to domain powers as something you can cast through spell slots? It’d be really inefficient, but screw that, Wizards of Nethys do what they want!
Powers are still powers, with their own associated rules, and they wouldn't be on the wizard's list. But a heretical sect of a particular deity might gain access to a particular domain power through a different means than the usual domain feat, for instance, but it would still be a power.

I got early on that this was the difference between the two and Powers have obviously been designed with this limitation in mind but I feel that the limitation by itself does not make much sense

It would be so much easier to research a spell that mimics a power if the latter was designed for this rather than belonging to another category which means you have to rebuild the spell from the bottom up


QuidEst wrote:
We have some information on how occult casting works! It’s still verbal and somatic components, but individual classes can (as with other lists) make substitutions. Bard can provide verbal components with instruments, for instance.

Really? That's a shame (I strongly wanted Thought/Emotion). Where's the source of this, please?

Liberty's Edge

Lucas Yew wrote:
QuidEst wrote:
We have some information on how occult casting works! It’s still verbal and somatic components, but individual classes can (as with other lists) make substitutions. Bard can provide verbal components with instruments, for instance.
Really? That's a shame (I strongly wanted Thought/Emotion). Where's the source of this, please?

You could easily get them. They just would be tied to a Class (or several Classes) rather than a spell list.

And the way components work being Class specific is in the Spells Blog.


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A new week, huh? Not many of those left.


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1of1 wrote:
A new week, huh? Not many of those left.

Thank the gods!

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