Pathfinder Lost Omens World Guide

3.60/5 (based on 14 ratings)
Pathfinder Lost Omens World Guide

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This indispensable 136-page guidebook to the world of Pathfinder presents everything you need to know for a lifetime of adventure in the uncertain Age of Lost Omens. The god of humanity is dead and prophecy is broken, leaving adventuring heroes like you to carve their own destinies out of an uncertain future!

This gazetteer features 10 diverse regions packed with thrilling and deadly possibilities and is accompanied by a giant two-sided poster map depicting the heart of the Pathfinder setting.

ISBN: 978-1-64078-172-6

Online Resources: Rules and mechanics from this book can be accessed for free on Paizo's official online resource: Archives of Nethys. Click here!

Note: This product is part of the Pathfinder Lost Omens Subscription.

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3.60/5 (based on 14 ratings)

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Not a Good Value Unless You're New to Pathfinder

1/5

Against my better judgment, I've been excitedly looking forward to the Lost Omens World Guide.

I should have known better.

Before delving into the issues here, let's focus on a couple of the positives:

- The art is gorgeous and very high-quality
- The layout and appearance of the books is excellent
- The section on Absalom is especially well-written - flavorful, evocative, and inspiring
- For those who have been following the changes that have taken place to Golarion since the Inner Sea World Guide was released, it's nice to have everything condensed in one place

Ready? On to the myriad issues:

- Why is Tanya Depass involved with this book? You would be forgiven for not knowing who that is. As far as I can tell, her only qualification is that she's a self-proclaimed "diversity consultant" to the gaming industry. What exactly does that mean, you ask? Tanya is a Queer Woman of Color (TM), checking three virtue-signalling diversity boxes for Paizo, and she wants to see more people like herself in gaming. You might be asking whether this is self-serving or perhaps racist and sexist, as Tanya herself would likely conclude if a straight white male was fighting to see more like himself in gaming. Well, no, of course it isn't! Why? Shhh...don't think too hard...

- The book bills itself as a "World Guide" and is 135 pages long. Compare this to Pathfinder first edition's "Inner Sea World Guide", which focused on the Inner Sea, a portion of Golarion's "world" at 318 pages and you'll begin to see the lack of detail in this book. Bear in mind, D&D 5E's Sword Coast Adventurer's Guide is 159 pages. That's 24 more pages for a small area of the Forgotten Realms. Yikes. So, one wonders why Paizo chose such a small page count. Would Paizo fans have not purchased a 300 - 400 page World Guide? Of course they would have. They just purchased a 620 pound doorstop of a Core Rulebook. A cynic might say that Paizo was looking out for their bottom line and wanted to hold a lot in reserve to sell again to their fanbase.

- There is a startlingly low amount of new information in this book for existing players of PF who are porting over to 2E. As a comparison, the section on Varisia in the ISWG from 1E was 4 pages. In LOWG? Try 1.5.

- The Paizo team decided to break the world down into "zones", where ostensibly, things are similar and you can explore certain adventure themes. So Varisia is now part of a zone called "The Saga Lands" for some reason. The book focuses on each of these zones while paying short thrift to countries or city-states within them. The one exception is Absalom.

- No map for Absalom? Very unfortunate considering the neighborhood by neighborhood breakdown for the city. It would be nice for readers to know where in the City a 'hood is located. Visuals people, visuals.

- Apparently, all countries are exemplars of racial and gender equity. Yes, even city-states that just banned slavery. Yes, even devil-bound nations - "We may be evil, but we aren't /monsters/!"

Will update as a read more.


5/5


A Fresh Coat of Paint on Old Ideas

3/5

It's hard to review a book like the Lost Omens World Guide. It's an update to the already extant Inner Sea World Guide published many years ago and made the choice to incorporate the events of 10 years of adventure paths into the metaplot.

Without spoiling the content for the book, many of these choices are going to ruffle some feathers of players from 1st edition (Nirmathas, I'm looking at you) but by and large retained 1E players aren't the core demographic of the book. The mechanical content is sufficient and well-written but feels necessary to replace the decade worth of options and versatility thrown out with the coming of 2nd edition. It feels like there's nothing here for a returning customer.

A solid 90% of this book is made from content originally written years ago and provides little new perspectives. That said, the new content offered is good -- especially the Mwangi Expanse which receives a much needed overhaul in the ways it depicts people of color and their civilizations -- but new content is so few and far between as tobe easy to miss. It's a shame, because the parts in the book where the authors try something new or delve into new ideas are its best features, but when the book is retreading old concepts and locations it seriously falters. I can't help but feel setting Second Edition in a new part of the world would have been a more creatively fruitful and longer-lasting endeavor.

The choices for maps in the book are both curious and frustrating. The poster map included with the book features two versions of an Inner Sea map. One of which was originally created as a fan product and available in a higher-resolution quality (literally 10x the resolution in the book) for free in a thread on Reddit. Since Paizo purchased the rights to these maps they're no longer available in their original form, taking something that was free and made to the community and turned it into something locked behind a fee and only available at a lower quality. I question the choice to do that in as much as it impacts not only the art but also Paizo's relationships with its fans and customers.

All in all, this feels like a 97-page softcover spread out over a larger hardcover. The layout and overall design are solid, but the content is challenging to excite a long-time customer. This was a chance to draw me in with the world and keep my buying products, and it didn't manage to accomplish that task.

For someone who is a returning customer or has been a supporter of Paizo content since the Dragon Magazine days, this book feels superfluous which -- unfortunately -- much of 2nd edition seems to feel. Newer players may find more use in this.

It's hard to get excited about the world of Lost Omens because it feels like there's very little new under the sun.


Overpriced, under delivered

2/5

You don't need this book.

The mechanics take up too much space, and are not very good. Wait for them to be free (a fair price) online.

The campaign stuff that is the meat of the book is surprisingly sparse and is just an avoidable update to the cheaper and longer products that came before. Buy the APs that will give you the context you need, this big picture stuff at a too big price isn't necessary.

The art is...fine. Much is good, some is bad, some is recycled.


I had trouble deciding between 4 or 5 stars...

4/5

...But decided finally on 4 star. Not because of the 26 dollars for pdf vs 1e's setting book being 10 dollars, but because I'm not sure how useful this book is for newbie GMs in comparison to the original 1e setting book. More on that later since I will first go through stuff I liked.

So let's start with art: I think this is one of prettiest and most evocative Pathfinder books art wise. My only complaints is that Amiri's spine seems twisted in one pic and I recognize Lion Blade art being recycled character art from War for the Crown.

What this book is great for is for veteran Pathfinder GMs to learn new information about places not detailed(Isle of Kortos is most obvious example of this) as much before and learning 2e's default setting state for APs(and how some APs always affect world). Like learning how Worldwound's closing and Whispering Tyrant's return affected the world is really useful. Its also nice how Mwangi Expanse region is actually written from perspective of people native there.

I don't personally like all changes(nor do I really mind them), for example, I kinda hope Lord-Mayor Grobaras isn't actually dead :D He is such fun jerk to love to hate and humiliate. Maybe there was Lord-Mayor between him and current one? Also I'm bit confused by default state of Kevoth-Kul and "mysterious death of Technic League's captain". Like, it seems default canon party ignored Palace of Fallen Stars and sneaked to Technic League compound and assassinated Ozmyn? That is... Really hard thing to do and not really intuitive. Also, Zernebeth isn't mentioned at all :D Also find it weird that Gorilla King got killed during Serpent's Skull, but they didn't use continue the campaign article where he comes nascent demon lord.(its seems none of them are treated as canon outside of Lord of Runes pathfinder tales book referring to Shattered Star's one :P)

I also find it bit annoying that Hell's Vengeance article on war's effect on politics seems to be ignored in the book.

But yeah, my favourite articles to read were Golden Road, Impossible Lands and Mwangi Expanse :D Maybe its because I haven't read all 1e setting books, but something about these three articles especially resonated with me.

Now onto the thing I mentioned before: I'm not sure this book is as good for newbie GMs because this is more of macroscale politics book than small scale gazetteer book as original one 1e setting book was. Meaning that while you can spot names of settlements on map, newbie gm might still want to buy old 1e setting books to know more about cities and villages and towns and such. So while book is awesome, I don't think its as helpful to newbies as the "main" setting book. Still this is normal scale for lots of different setting books in different systems, so I guess lots of newbies might actually not feel like that.

But yeah, regardless, I love the book and feel hungry for more books and info :3


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Sovereign Court

I'm not sure if this is the right place or not: I ordered Lost Omens through Amazon, and it said it would be released on Sep 10, today. That is several weeks after Paizo buyers got there's, but today, instead of saying the book is shipping, or has already shipped, they sent me an email saying it is delayed for an unknown length of time and asked if I wanted to cancel my order? The books are printed already, tons of people say they have them, they have been seen in videos from Paizo, so what's going on? Why does Amazon say they have no copies and don't know if or when they might get them?

Silver Crusade

1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Shouldn't you be asking Amazon this? Paizo doesn't deal with them directly, Amazon takes their books from a distributor. Could well be that they placed an order there that was well below demand and when they wanted to order more, it was already out of stock.

Sovereign Court

Gorbacz wrote:
Shouldn't you be asking Amazon this? Paizo doesn't deal with them directly, Amazon takes their books from a distributor. Could well be that they placed an order there that was well below demand and when they wanted to order more, it was already out of stock.

Amazon claims not to know anything so I figured I'd ask the publisher and see if they knew. I have no idea which distributer sends Amazon their Paizo books or how to contact them, but maybe Paizo does? I at least want to bring the situation to Paizo's attention. I ordered the book back in early July, so if they did them by order date I should have been pretty close to the front, I think. But I've found publishers sometimes don't know about problems actually getting the books they've made.


5 people marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber; Pathfinder Companion, Maps, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Maps, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber

The general rule seems to be this:

If you want Paizo products cheap, order them from Amazon and be very patient.

If you want Paizo products fast, order them directly from Paizo (preferably via subscription, since that gets you a PDF the moment they ship) and be prepared to pay more than Amazon charges.

Your FLGS or local bookstore is probably somewhere in between.

Silver Crusade

2 people marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
Samurai wrote:
Gorbacz wrote:
Shouldn't you be asking Amazon this? Paizo doesn't deal with them directly, Amazon takes their books from a distributor. Could well be that they placed an order there that was well below demand and when they wanted to order more, it was already out of stock.
Amazon claims not to know anything so I figured I'd ask the publisher and see if they knew. I have no idea which distributer sends Amazon their Paizo books or how to contact them, but maybe Paizo does? I at least want to bring the situation to Paizo's attention. I ordered the book back in early July, so if they did them by order date I should have been pretty close to the front, I think. But I've found publishers sometimes don't know about problems actually getting the books they've made.

Again - Paizo isn't dealing with Amazon directly. They deal with the distributor, who has their own say as to who gets the books they take. And as a general rule, distributors don't really deal in the "publisher X wants retailer Y to have more books faster" micromanagement.

Paizo is aware that the book is out of print (obviously) and they're aware that this means some people need to wait, among others because the retailer they ordered with miscalculated the demand. The best thing they can do is print more of the book and ship it, which is what they're doing.

TL;DR - you wanted the book cheap, you ordered with a lumbering world-dominating juggernaut which runs on algorithms and doesn't really care what you think, the lumbering juggernaut is out of stock and waiting for a reprint and you'll have to sit back and wait. Like David said, ordering with Paizo or with a specialised retailer who is better at gauging how many books it needs is usually the better course of action for having the books in your hand as fast as possible.

Sovereign Court

Gorbacz wrote:
Samurai wrote:
Gorbacz wrote:
Shouldn't you be asking Amazon this? Paizo doesn't deal with them directly, Amazon takes their books from a distributor. Could well be that they placed an order there that was well below demand and when they wanted to order more, it was already out of stock.
Amazon claims not to know anything so I figured I'd ask the publisher and see if they knew. I have no idea which distributer sends Amazon their Paizo books or how to contact them, but maybe Paizo does? I at least want to bring the situation to Paizo's attention. I ordered the book back in early July, so if they did them by order date I should have been pretty close to the front, I think. But I've found publishers sometimes don't know about problems actually getting the books they've made.

Again - Paizo isn't dealing with Amazon directly. They deal with the distributor, who has their own say as to who gets the books they take. And as a general rule, distributors don't really deal in the "publisher X wants retailer Y to have more books faster" micromanagement.

Paizo is aware that the book is out of print (obviously) and they're aware that this means some people need to wait, among others because the retailer they ordered with miscalculated the demand. The best thing they can do is print more of the book and ship it, which is what they're doing.

TL;DR - you wanted the book cheap, you ordered with a lumbering world-dominating juggernaut which runs on algorithms and doesn't really care what you think, the lumbering juggernaut is out of stock and waiting for a reprint and you'll have to sit back and wait. Like David said, ordering with Paizo or with a specialised retailer who is better at gauging how many books it needs is usually the better course of action for having the books in your hand as fast as possible.

I hadn't heard anything about reprinting any of the 2e books, I figured whatever they are going to make has already been made. I didn't know it was "Hey, we need 1000 more copies of L:ost Omens for X distributer so that Amazon can get some more (if they ever got any, I don't know). Maybe I'm just more old fashioned, I think of the print runs as a finite thing, 1 and done unless there is overwhelming demand requiring more to be printed or a second print run. But typically, as far as I know, the set up costs are so large that they print all they will need so they don't need to go back for more for a long time. Id just like to hear a straight answer from someone who knows something concrete, not "we don't know if or when we'll ever get any copies."

Silver Crusade

2 people marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
Samurai wrote:
Gorbacz wrote:
Samurai wrote:
Gorbacz wrote:
Shouldn't you be asking Amazon this? Paizo doesn't deal with them directly, Amazon takes their books from a distributor. Could well be that they placed an order there that was well below demand and when they wanted to order more, it was already out of stock.
Amazon claims not to know anything so I figured I'd ask the publisher and see if they knew. I have no idea which distributer sends Amazon their Paizo books or how to contact them, but maybe Paizo does? I at least want to bring the situation to Paizo's attention. I ordered the book back in early July, so if they did them by order date I should have been pretty close to the front, I think. But I've found publishers sometimes don't know about problems actually getting the books they've made.

Again - Paizo isn't dealing with Amazon directly. They deal with the distributor, who has their own say as to who gets the books they take. And as a general rule, distributors don't really deal in the "publisher X wants retailer Y to have more books faster" micromanagement.

Paizo is aware that the book is out of print (obviously) and they're aware that this means some people need to wait, among others because the retailer they ordered with miscalculated the demand. The best thing they can do is print more of the book and ship it, which is what they're doing.

TL;DR - you wanted the book cheap, you ordered with a lumbering world-dominating juggernaut which runs on algorithms and doesn't really care what you think, the lumbering juggernaut is out of stock and waiting for a reprint and you'll have to sit back and wait. Like David said, ordering with Paizo or with a specialised retailer who is better at gauging how many books it needs is usually the better course of action for having the books in your hand as fast as possible.

I hadn't heard anything about reprinting any of the 2e books, I figured whatever they are going to make has already been made. I didn't know it was "Hey, we...

Sara Marie's post that there's a reprint is literally 9 posts above yours.


Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber; Pathfinder Maps, Pathfinder Accessories, Starfinder Accessories, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Maps, Starfinder Society Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber
Samurai wrote:
I'm not sure if this is the right place or not: I ordered Lost Omens through Amazon, and it said it would be released on Sep 10, today. That is several weeks after Paizo buyers got there's, but today, instead of saying the book is shipping, or has already shipped, they sent me an email saying it is delayed for an unknown length of time and asked if I wanted to cancel my order? The books are printed already, tons of people say they have them, they have been seen in videos from Paizo, so what's going on? Why does Amazon say they have no copies and don't know if or when they might get them?

From past reports, it’s not uncommon for people to be told a book is delayed by amazon only to get an “its on the way!” email shortly thereafter.

Everything is automated and as I understand it (though I never shop there) the algorithm has a habit of getting confused when milestones arrive and things aren’t happening according to plan.

I wouldn’t cancel your order, if I were you. I’m sure amazon will order more if they’ve sold out and it wouldn’t surprise me if your book ships next week either. From what I’ve seen in the various Amazon posts over the years, they’re cheap but totally unreliable and uncommunicative with niche books (ie any rpg book).

I’m not anyone official, but it is a common issue arising repeatedly over the last ten years. Amazon are always cheap, sometimes reliable and pretty much never helpful in providing accurate timelines or in replacing defective books.


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Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber; Pathfinder Companion, Maps, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Maps, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber
Samurai wrote:
I hadn't heard anything about reprinting any of the 2e books, I figured whatever they are going to make has already been made. I didn't know it was "Hey, we...

See this post. Paizo is indeed in the process of reprinting this book.


Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber

Yeah, I canceled my Amazon preorder when they bumped it out another month yesterday. Just gonna pay a bit more and subscribe here at Paizo. Everyone literally wins this way except my budget. I do wish I could access the PDF now instead of waiting till it ships, but I get why that's not an option.

Really hoping I didn't screw myself over by jumping out of the Amazon queue, where books might soon be showing, and into the Paizo queue, where they might have shipped all their printed books. I don't mind waiting another month, I guess, since my table hit a big delay, but I wouldn't hate finding out what the timeline looks like on Paizo's end to fulfill the order.


Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber; Pathfinder Companion, Maps, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Maps, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber

If you are really in a hurry, you can buy the PDF and get it immediately -- but of course that is more expensive than getting it when it ships from your subscription. The subscription is the only way to get a PDF before street date, but of course that no longer matters since we are past that date.

Paizo Employee Customer Service Representative

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The Lost Omens World Guide is indeed being reprinted.

EDIT: I initially accidentally wrote Core Rulebook instead of Lost Omens (lots of things being juggled in my head). The CRB is still available and is NOT being reprinted. My apologies for the mistype.

*Takes off Paizo hat and puts on former bookstore inventory manager hat*

For something like Amazon; The publisher prints a number of books based on their expected demand and them puts the books into distribution. Distributors order them based on whatever calculations they have for the expected demand. Retailers like Amazon order their books from their distributors, likewise by gauging their expected demand. None of these want tons of books sitting in their warehouse/back room taking up space. Distributors and retailers can sometimes be a little conservative with their orders, especially with things they consider niche products. Distributors want to fill all of those orders but do have to manage the stock they have. This sometimes means they can't or don't fill all of a retailers order (see video game consoles as this is why stores often only have a small handful, though that is very often due to the manufacturer creating small production runs and not due to small distributor or retailer orders). If a retailer orders too late (distributors usually have an order by this date so we can put in our own order), or too low a quantity they have to wait for the distributor to get more (my understanding is that for more niche products Amazon tends to order late, sometimes too late to get in their distributor's initial batch, but I'm not 100% on that).


Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber; Pathfinder Companion, Maps, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Maps, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber

Is the Core Rulebook sold out too? Wow!

Paizo Employee Customer Service Representative

It is not. I mistakenly typed the wrong thing. It has been corrected. My apologies.

Sovereign Court

Sara Marie wrote:

Just wanted to let folks know, we currently have all the remaining Lost Omen's World Guide books reserved for pending paizo.com orders.

We are doing a reprint of the book. If you want to start a Lost Omen subscription with the World Guide and the website gives you trouble due to its backorder status, start with the Pathfinder Lost Omens Character Guide and let customer service know you'd like to add the World Guide as well. You can do this up until the Pathfinder Lost Omens Character Guide becomes the "current" item to start (late Sept?) when we are generating October's items.

This is what I was hoping to hear. I hope Amazon gets some copies before October, they said something about automatically cancelling my order in that month if they don't have any yet. 3rd party sellers are trying to sell their copies on Amazon, and they are going for between $41-$69. This is the first RPG book that I've seen that demands a collector's premium price in many years. Lost Omens is the new AD&D Elric/Cthulhu Deities and Demigods!


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Paizo Superscriber; Pathfinder Companion, Pathfinder Accessories, Starfinder Accessories, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber
Steve Geddes wrote:

From past reports, it’s not uncommon for people to be told a book is delayed by amazon only to get an “its on the way!” email shortly thereafter.

^^This. Happened to me just recently. The original delivery time frame was 9 to 29 September. A few days after I placed the order, Amazon told me they hadn't heard from the distributor (US Book Depository, a UK company apparently owned by Amazon) and asked if I wanted to cancel the order. I ignored them, and received the book last Saturday, two days before the original best estimate.

Dark Archive

Question:

Any estimate on when the reprint is going to be available?

Late 2019 or early 2020?

Only half of the late august shipment arrived at my FLGS and this book is still missing.

We want to start "Age of Ashes" in november and i don't want to start without it.

Silver Crusade

1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

You could, you know, buy a PDF if you're in that of a hurry.


4 people marked this as a favorite.
Paizo Charter Superscriber; Pathfinder Companion, Pathfinder Accessories Subscriber; Starfinder Charter Superscriber
Marco Massoudi wrote:
We want to start "Age of Ashes" in november and i don't want to start without it.

I think you can safely start Age of Ashes without the need of this book. There isn't really much in the way of lore relevant to the AP in the book that isn't also talked about in the Adventure Toolbox in Hellknight Hill. If you want to use the backgrounds form the World Guide instead of the recommended ones from the Age of Ashes Player's Guide, or if your players want to look into the new archetypes, they're all up on Archives of Nethys.


Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber; Pathfinder Maps, Pathfinder Accessories, Starfinder Accessories, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Maps, Starfinder Society Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber
Marco Massoudi wrote:

Question:

Any estimate on when the reprint is going to be available?

Late 2019 or early 2020?

Only half of the late august shipment arrived at my FLGS and this book is still missing.

We want to start "Age of Ashes" in november and i don't want to start without it.

I think there’s a negligible chance of the reprint getting to you in 2019 and zero chance of it arriving in October.

What’s the time lag from ordering a print run until it arrives in Seattle? Three months? Even if it were two, Paizo probably ordered it in September. I can’t imagine it getting to them, then to their distributor and then out to Germany in time.

EDIT: I guess if only half a shipment arrived and it had no copies of this book, there could well be the other half shipment on the way. Your FLGS would be best placed to know if that was happening, I think. That’s probably your best bet.


Pathfinder Card Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber
Zaister wrote:
Marco Massoudi wrote:
We want to start "Age of Ashes" in november and i don't want to start without it.
...if your players want to look into the new archetypes, they're all up on Archives of Nethys.

All the rules stuff from the book are at the Archives of Nethys at this link


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FYI: I received an update from Amazon that Lost Omens World Guide should arrive September 24th. I'm in the SF Bay Area.


I do like what I see in this book. The more Golarioney options are pretty neat.

Grand Lodge

I'm glad I resubbed. This book is awesome and well worth the money spent. I'm looking forward to so many more. It looked gorgeous as a PDF but a tablet doesn't do the art and layout justice. It's a feast for the eyes really functional as well as.


I really wish to make a pureblood Azlanti PC. Does this book allow me to do that?

Silver Crusade

Pathfinder Companion, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber

The Core Rulebook does, this does not.


Paizo Charter Superscriber; Pathfinder Companion, Pathfinder Accessories Subscriber; Starfinder Charter Superscriber

Pureblood Azlanti will no longer have a mechanical advantage over other human ethnicities, though, according to James Jacobs.

Paizo Employee Creative Director

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Zaister wrote:
Pureblood Azlanti will no longer have a mechanical advantage over other human ethnicities, though, according to James Jacobs.

Correct. If/when we stat them up as an ancestry, their flavor and advantages will come via their ancestry feats. They'll have different flavor than other human ancestries, but won't be intrinsically "better" than them. (That's a relic of the past we've abandoned as being gross.)

If you merely want more ability boosts than the core game normally gives you, chat with your GM about potentially playing a higher powered game, I guess.


James Jacobs wrote:
Ed Reppert wrote:
James Jacobs wrote:
We WILL finally have a detailed global map though, which I'm very excited and relieved about! :P
Me too. Heck, I'd probably buy an actual globe, if you made one.
We don't have the expertise to make globes, and I have no idea how much it would cost to make one and thus how much it would cost for a customer to buy... but the map we have now gives us an image we can use to decorate a globe with ease so this is now possible. I have an animated GIF version of said map on said globe here that I hope to some day show off.

So, I finally got my copy of LOWG today. I've thumbed through the entire thing from cover to cover and page by page. There is an Inner Sea map on page 11. There is an expanded fold-out map (still only of the Inner Sea) included with two sides, one more realistic, the other more stylized. I don't see a single "detailed global map". Was this not the book that was supposed to include it?


Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber; Pathfinder Maps, Pathfinder Accessories, Starfinder Accessories, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Maps, Starfinder Society Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber
Tectorman wrote:
James Jacobs wrote:
Ed Reppert wrote:
James Jacobs wrote:
We WILL finally have a detailed global map though, which I'm very excited and relieved about! :P
Me too. Heck, I'd probably buy an actual globe, if you made one.
We don't have the expertise to make globes, and I have no idea how much it would cost to make one and thus how much it would cost for a customer to buy... but the map we have now gives us an image we can use to decorate a globe with ease so this is now possible. I have an animated GIF version of said map on said globe here that I hope to some day show off.
So, I finally got my copy of LOWG today. I've thumbed through the entire thing from cover to cover and page by page. There is an Inner Sea map on page 11. There is an expanded fold-out map (still only of the Inner Sea) included with two sides, one more realistic, the other more stylized. I don't see a single "detailed global map". Was this not the book that was supposed to include it?

It was going to be included but it had to be cut for space. The map in the CRB is the only world map currently available (and this book was going to have a reprint of that one it wasn’t going to be enhanced or show greater detail or anything).

Ugh. The website isn’t linking that properly. The linked post is from James Jacobs, about halfway down the page.


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Steve Geddes wrote:
Tectorman wrote:
James Jacobs wrote:
Ed Reppert wrote:
James Jacobs wrote:
We WILL finally have a detailed global map though, which I'm very excited and relieved about! :P
Me too. Heck, I'd probably buy an actual globe, if you made one.
We don't have the expertise to make globes, and I have no idea how much it would cost to make one and thus how much it would cost for a customer to buy... but the map we have now gives us an image we can use to decorate a globe with ease so this is now possible. I have an animated GIF version of said map on said globe here that I hope to some day show off.
So, I finally got my copy of LOWG today. I've thumbed through the entire thing from cover to cover and page by page. There is an Inner Sea map on page 11. There is an expanded fold-out map (still only of the Inner Sea) included with two sides, one more realistic, the other more stylized. I don't see a single "detailed global map". Was this not the book that was supposed to include it?

It was going to be included but it had to be cut for space. The map in the CRB is the only world map currently available (and this book was going to have a reprint of that one it wasn’t going to be enhanced or show greater detail or anything).

Ugh. The website isn’t linking that properly. The linked post is from James Jacobs, about halfway down the page.

That is very disappointing. A fully detailed global map was a solid 50% of my entire interest in this book. After only having the world map in the ISWG for a decade and an entire edition, I was really hoping for some forward progress on that front. Exactly what future book do they have in mind that will be as appropriate a venue for such a global map as this was? Also, "cut for space"? The whole book is only 135 pages. They easily had room for this.

Paizo Employee Creative Director

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Tectorman wrote:
That is very disappointing. A fully detailed global map was a solid 50% of my entire interest in this book. After only having the world map in the ISWG for a decade and an entire edition, I was really hoping for some forward progress on that front. Exactly what future book do they have in mind that will be as appropriate a venue for such a global map as this was? Also, "cut for space"? The whole book is only 135 pages. They easily had room for this.

It's more than a map; it's detailing the regions on the map. We didn't have the space to give it the detail it deserved without cramping something else.

And just because we didn't do anything with the world map here doesn't mean we won't do anything with it ever. We'll get to it eventually.


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James Jacobs wrote:
Tectorman wrote:
That is very disappointing. A fully detailed global map was a solid 50% of my entire interest in this book. After only having the world map in the ISWG for a decade and an entire edition, I was really hoping for some forward progress on that front. Exactly what future book do they have in mind that will be as appropriate a venue for such a global map as this was? Also, "cut for space"? The whole book is only 135 pages. They easily had room for this.

It's more than a map; it's detailing the regions on the map. We didn't have the space to give it the detail it deserved without cramping something else.

And just because we didn't do anything with the world map here doesn't mean we won't do anything with it ever. We'll get to it eventually.

Ya'll were going to get to it eventually ten years ago. Ten years from now, will you still be getting to it eventually?

Dark Archive

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While it would be cool to have it, do you really have much use for detailed map without countries and borders and locations marked on it?

Like sure, you could see where mountains, rivers, deserts, etc are, but do you really have much use for it before they have all the offscreen nation borders figured out?

Also, if you checked the link, they were planning to reprint the world map from core book and not at larger size. So you would have gotten the same map either way :p

Paizo Employee Creative Director

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Tectorman wrote:
James Jacobs wrote:
Tectorman wrote:
That is very disappointing. A fully detailed global map was a solid 50% of my entire interest in this book. After only having the world map in the ISWG for a decade and an entire edition, I was really hoping for some forward progress on that front. Exactly what future book do they have in mind that will be as appropriate a venue for such a global map as this was? Also, "cut for space"? The whole book is only 135 pages. They easily had room for this.

It's more than a map; it's detailing the regions on the map. We didn't have the space to give it the detail it deserved without cramping something else.

And just because we didn't do anything with the world map here doesn't mean we won't do anything with it ever. We'll get to it eventually.

Ya'll were going to get to it eventually ten years ago. Ten years from now, will you still be getting to it eventually?

To be honest? Maybe. I'm probably more disappointed than you are that we didn't do more with the world already, but I'm glad we at least got what we DID get out there, if only a few pages in the core rulebook.

Not everything is the way I want it to be. Sorry. Just trying to let you know what's going on, but since it sounds like that just makes it worse, I'll bow out of the thread.


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CorvusMask wrote:

While it would be cool to have it, do you really have much use for detailed map without countries and borders and locations marked on it?

Like sure, you could see where mountains, rivers, deserts, etc are, but do you really have much use for it before they have all the offscreen nation borders figured out?

Also, if you checked the link, they were planning to reprint the world map from core book and not at larger size. So you would have gotten the same map either way :p

I did check the link. Before that (and reiterated by Mr. Jacobs above), it was going to be more detailed than the map in the CRB ("detailing the regions on the map", which he says would have had to come at the cost of cramping something else, because you can't just make a book with 137 pages instead of 135). So it would have been mountains, rivers, deserts, etc., AND offscreen nation borders.

And even if it wouldn't have had that, just the act of putting the names of those offscreen nations in their approximate places would have been a massive step forward. The Bestiary reveals the existence of a nation in Garund called Murraseth. Even without giving it distinct borders or a specific size, putting its name just underneath the city of Mechitar or just under Vidrian or all the way at Garund's southernmost edge is remarkably informative about who these people have relationships with and what issues in the Inner Sea region the would care about due to proximity. As opposed to:

"So you're an Amurrun?"
"Yep. From Murraseth. Nya."
"Is that way down in Garund? Where?"
*Shrugs* *Shrugs-nya*
"O... kay... Well, we've hired you because our sages are getting hints that wind surges from the Eye of Abendego are building up and threatening the Kaava lands, and possibly even further south. We believe we know how this is being accomplished, but we need you and others to corroborate our suspicions and quickly, before your own homeland is endangered. That is, unless it's on the opposite side, in which case, do it for simple altruism instead?"
"Look, I don't know if I have a vested personal interest or not. All I know is that Murraseth is in the same state as Springfield, with all the yellow-skinned humans. Nyow."

A map that left off specific borders but went far enough to put names down in approximate places avoids all that.

In any event, it would be progress towards further world-building. Even if teleporting isn't commonly available, it's still common enough that over the course of centuries or millenia, scholarly denizens in-universe would have world maps beyond the Inner Sea. Shipping and pirating most assuredly wouldn't stop at the Inner Sea just because our IRL maps do. Heck, Qadira is a major nation, but we're supposed to buy that everyone's in-universe maps stop at the little sliver of land that touches the Obari Ocean?

After ten years, I wanted to be able to finally see the world of Golarion the way denizens of Golarion can.

Dark Archive

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You still don't need to be that confrontational about it :P

And I hope you weren't being sarcastic, because while I don't know much about book production, evidence suggests that yes they indeed can't just have "two more pages", option is having 135 pages and either including the map and cutting other content or not including the map.

And even if they had world map with countries detailed in two pages(I don't have geography book right next to me, so I can't compare how much detail Earth's map would contain in two big pages :p I'd think shapes of Golarion's continents might make it bit harder though?), you do realize they have never actually decided on amount of offscreen nations and location of them relative to each other? I don't think they want to rush it and set it in stone before they have each of continents figured out.

That said, I don't think I want to continue the debate further because this is getting depressing, so I'm literally going to prevent myself from replying to any further replies.

Dark Archive

Finally received the book from Amazon... However I noticed random paragraphs are Bolded and the Write up on Ustalav is in a reddish brown ink. The reddish brown gives a nice flare to the spooky lands that are Ustalav but I figured I'd say something.

Dark Archive

Looks like my FLGS didn't re-order this after it got delayed from august 1st to august 28th.
As a result, i'll now have to wait until probably early 2020 to get the essential book about the setting, which frankly kills all of my interest in second edition(for the time being).

We don't use pdfs or archives of nethys while playing, we use lots of books, as electronic devices take you out of the spirit of a fantasy game imo (not true with Starfinder obviously).


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Paizo Charter Superscriber; Pathfinder Companion, Pathfinder Accessories Subscriber; Starfinder Charter Superscriber

Do you also not use electric lighting for your game?


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Pathfinder Card Game, Companion, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Charter Superscriber
Zaister wrote:
Do you also not use electric lighting for your game?

Candles, lanterns and blood sacrifice subs in for hero points.

Dark Archive

Marco Massoudi wrote:

Looks like my FLGS didn't re-order this after it got delayed from august 1st to august 28th.

As a result, i'll now have to wait until probably early 2020 to get the essential book about the setting, which frankly kills all of my interest in second edition(for the time being).

We don't use pdfs or archives of nethys while playing, we use lots of books, as electronic devices take you out of the spirit of a fantasy game imo (not true with Starfinder obviously).

I feel for you, Marco! I pre-ordered this book at my FLGS, and I got the [b]last* copy they received. However, my FLGS has never received their order of Deluxe/Special Edition core rulebooks; they have sold out two batches of the "regular" core rulebook, which I couldn't afford at this point (I've already spent something like 1000 euros on Paizo stuff in a couple of months, including quite a hefty sum on minis). Ergo, I have the Lost Omens World Guide and Deluxe/Special Edition Bestiary, but not the core rulebook!

This has not killed my interest in 2nd Edition, I'm just as excited about it as in july, if not even more! But it's a bit annoying to wait for a relatively expensive book (88 euros at my FLGS) that it floating somewhere in Limbo and nobody can apparently say when it will eventually appear. It's not Paizo's fault, though; it's likely the distributor has messed up.

(BTW, my FLGS is still waiting for the [i]Druma : Profit and Prophecy book as well; which means I haven't got it yet either. It's likely in that same Limbo with the core rulebook...)

Silver Crusade

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Do you wear any of those modern polyester fabrics during the game, or is it linen and wool only? Are carbonated drinks allowed? So many tantalising questions...

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Sin_Dark wrote:
Finally received the book from Amazon... However I noticed random paragraphs are Bolded and the Write up on Ustalav is in a reddish brown ink. The reddish brown gives a nice flare to the spooky lands that are Ustalav but I figured I'd say something.

Yep I noticed this too. Probably just an unfortunate side effect of rushing to get this book out.

Dark Archive

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I love the book, those full-spread illustrations are just gorgeous! I just wish those flags and faction symbols weren't so small, or rather that they had been printed in a bigger form somewhere in the book... I do have my Inner Sea World Guide and Pathfinder Chronicles Campaign Setting, but some of those countries and organizations are completely new. This is my only complaint about this book.

I also love the map; it's fantastic that on one side there's an almost hand-out like illustrated (and beautiful) map that is player-friendly. I tip my rusty dwarven helmet to whoever came up with this fantastic idea! :)

Dark Archive

Totally messed up the formatting, but didn't notice it at first because I continued watching Knights of Everflame right after hitting "Reply". I'm re-posting my reply to Marco; sorry about "spamming", guys, but just couldn't delete the earlier post anymore.

I feel for you, Marco! I pre-ordered this book at my FLGS, and I got the last copy they received. However, my FLGS has never received their order of Deluxe/Special Edition core rulebooks; they have sold out two batches of the "regular" core rulebook, which I couldn't afford at this point (I've already spent something like 1000 euros on Paizo stuff in a couple of months, including quite a hefty sum on minis). Ergo, I have the Lost Omens World Guide and Deluxe/Special Edition Bestiary, but not the core rulebook!

This has not killed my interest in 2nd Edition, I'm just as excited about it as in July, if not even more! But it's a bit annoying to wait for a relatively expensive book (88 euros at my FLGS) that it floating somewhere in Limbo and nobody can apparently say when it will eventually appear. It's not Paizo's fault, though; it's likely the distributor has messed up.

(BTW, my FLGS is still waiting for the Druma : Profit and Prophecy book as well; which means I haven't got it yet either. It's likely in that same Limbo with the core rulebook...)

Dark Archive

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Zaister wrote:
Do you also not use electric lighting for your game?

That depends on the nature of the game.

Sometimes when playing horror or special scenarios, we use candles, lanterns or lava lamps(but mostly LEDs). ;-)

Dark Archive

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Gorbacz wrote:

Do you wear any of those modern polyester fabrics during the game, or is it linen and wool only? Are carbonated drinks allowed? So many tantalising questions...

We mostly play naked and only drink beer brewed after the Deutsches Reinheitsgebot, Jakub. ;-)

Dark Archive

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Asgetrion wrote:

Totally messed up the formatting, but didn't notice it at first because I continued watching Knights of Everflame right after hitting "Reply". I'm re-posting my reply to Marco; sorry about "spamming", guys, but just couldn't delete the earlier post anymore.

I feel for you, Marco! I pre-ordered this book at my FLGS, and I got the last copy they received. However, my FLGS has never received their order of Deluxe/Special Edition core rulebooks; they have sold out two batches of the "regular" core rulebook, which I couldn't afford at this point (I've already spent something like 1000 euros on Paizo stuff in a couple of months, including quite a hefty sum on minis). Ergo, I have the Lost Omens World Guide and Deluxe/Special Edition Bestiary, but not the core rulebook!

This has not killed my interest in 2nd Edition, I'm just as excited about it as in July, if not even more! But it's a bit annoying to wait for a relatively expensive book (88 euros at my FLGS) that it floating somewhere in Limbo and nobody can apparently say when it will eventually appear. It's not Paizo's fault, though; it's likely the distributor has messed up.

(BTW, my FLGS is still waiting for the Druma : Profit and Prophecy book as well; which means I haven't got it yet either. It's likely in that same Limbo with the core rulebook...)

Thanks, Asgetrion.

I hope you'll get your CRB & Druma CS asap.
The thing is, we have a few players who know Golarion pretty well, but most don't.
The old "Inner Sea Guide" had lots of information a 1st level character wouldn't have access to as it was mostly a GM book (that's what the "Inner Sea something Players Companion" was good for).

The Lost Omens World Guide seems to be much lighter on spoiler information and more geared towards players than GMs.
It also seems to allow a player to select a homeland flavor for his character in form of feats.
To not have access to something so basic for the start of a new edition seems bad for the new players.

I am trying to close the holes in my Wizards of the Coast D&D minis collection and have spent hundreds of Euros this month alone, so i can relate to your hefty minis sum. ;-)

Dark Archive

Marco Massoudi wrote:
Asgetrion wrote:

Totally messed up the formatting, but didn't notice it at first because I continued watching Knights of Everflame right after hitting "Reply". I'm re-posting my reply to Marco; sorry about "spamming", guys, but just couldn't delete the earlier post anymore.

I feel for you, Marco! I pre-ordered this book at my FLGS, and I got the last copy they received. However, my FLGS has never received their order of Deluxe/Special Edition core rulebooks; they have sold out two batches of the "regular" core rulebook, which I couldn't afford at this point (I've already spent something like 1000 euros on Paizo stuff in a couple of months, including quite a hefty sum on minis). Ergo, I have the Lost Omens World Guide and Deluxe/Special Edition Bestiary, but not the core rulebook!

This has not killed my interest in 2nd Edition, I'm just as excited about it as in July, if not even more! But it's a bit annoying to wait for a relatively expensive book (88 euros at my FLGS) that it floating somewhere in Limbo and nobody can apparently say when it will eventually appear. It's not Paizo's fault, though; it's likely the distributor has messed up.

(BTW, my FLGS is still waiting for the Druma : Profit and Prophecy book as well; which means I haven't got it yet either. It's likely in that same Limbo with the core rulebook...)

Thanks, Asgetrion.

I hope you'll get your CRB & Druma CS asap.
The thing is, we have a few players who know Golarion pretty well, but most don't.
The old "Inner Sea Guide" had lots of information a 1st level character wouldn't have access to as it was mostly a GM book (that's what the "Inner Sea something Players Companion" was good for).

The Lost Omens World Guide seems to be much lighter on spoiler information and more geared towards players than GMs.
It also seems to allow a player to select a homeland flavor for his character in form of feats.
To not have access to something so basic for the start of a new edition seems bad for the new players.

I am trying to close the holes in my Wizards of the Coast D&D minis collection and have spent hundreds of Euros this month alone, so i can relate to your hefty minis sum. ;-)

Thanks, Marco! I'm a bit worried about what is going on, because my FLGS has always had some kind of hunch about when they'll receive shipments. They've pre-ordered them on time and yet received no copies at all, even though it's been almost two months since the street date for both of these books. Usually they can make at least an educated guess, like "It's going to be max. 2-3 weeks and you'll have it in your grubby hands", but now they just don't have a clue. I may be reading between the lines a bit too much, but to me it sounded they are starting to become doubtful if they'll receive them at all, unless they're going to be reprinted.

I agree that the new Lost Omens World Guide is more player-friendly, but I'm a bit curious if there's going to be another World Guide for GMs coming up next year, or perhaps another product line similar to 1E Pathfinder Campaign Setting books? I have most of those, so I could run a game set in, say, Sarkoris Scar or Ustalav, but newbie GMs without those sources might find it more challenging.

Heh, I know *exactly* what you're talking about; I'm desperately trying to afford both new miniatures and to patch those "holes" in my collection, too! For example, I had pre-ordered both the Walking Statue and Jungle Shrine box, but had to prioritize all the 2E stuff, other miniatures (e.g. two sets of Pools and Pillars I got as a backorder), and several sets of flip-tiles this time. Maybe next month... ;)

(BTW, Marco, do you have any tips on where to purchase pre-painted WizKids D&D/Pathfinder singles in the EU area? I personally know only two online stores that have reasonable prices, but I know there have to be more than one in Germany and one in the UK)

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