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Organized Play Member. 38 posts. No reviews. No lists. No wishlists. 1 Organized Play character.


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What are the player options if I may ask?

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Many of the Dedication feats grant you a skill, possibly Expert in that skill as well as an additional benefit. Yet the Firebrand Braggart skill doesn't give you any skills and in fact can hinder you. I love the flavor of the Feat but mechanical wise it's not worth the effort.

So I was curious why the Feat doesn't grant a skill or constant beneficial bonus.

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Honestly I just rolled up a 1st level Witch and Wizard and you can barely tell the difference. At this point the Witch could be a Archetype as said by others.

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Investigator should have been a Archetype.

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It makes them less MAD.

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I feel like it could have an additional benefit added to it. Like, Once a Day you can Sustain a Spell as a Free Action.

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So it would be really cool if the Hair could apply the Hex.

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I feel like the Braggart gets the short end of the stick for a little while seeing as he can only demoralize a target once before they become immune. Where as you can Tumble Through a target and Shove/Grapple/Trip a target multiple times. Later on the problem gets solved but until then "Feels bad man"

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I think the Revelation should be more powerful if you're gonna get punished for using them. I know you get extra benefits as well but they in no way balance out the negatives.

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I agree with Ezekieru, You should be able to use Int for Attack and Damage with Finesse weapons, or at the very least let Int be used for Damage.

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I was mostly referring to the Scroll Master, as for the goblin being able to set your self on fire is neat and all but hardly groundbreaking. It's bland when it's a D6, but I see my words fall on deaf ears.

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So you have to take a certain Heritage, A 5th level Ancestry Feat, and a 9th level Ancestry feat just to get a mediocre attack, sounds like a terrible chain to me. It feels like they are being overly cautious. Monsters have these cool, amazing, and interesting abilities but man my goblin gets to spit a 1D6 damage that depends heavily if I built for it, and even then its meh.

If people keep defending these bland and uninspired feats and choices then the developers are never gonna try something exciting or inventive. They said multiply times they wanna make new options and make each choice you make important, this is not that design.

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It's kinda crazy to me the lengths some will go to to justify a terrible feat. Say Rysky and Cyouni are right and it has some value. That value is extremely niche and does not compare to other dedication feats. So honestly it feels like a feat tax to access some of the semi interesting feats within the Scroll Master Archetype. Looking at the Archetype I can think of dozens of other things it could have done and the Scroll Master Dedication feat could have been a ribbon tacked on to them.

After reading the comments here I'm extremely worried that this is just the same old song and dance and nothing has improved. People say it's better then the Player Companions, but just barely. The developers have to do better, challenge them selves and creating exciting options for players to take. Cause being able to remember something from the past 24 hours without making a roll isn't exciting in the least.

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What type of Forest is the Fangwood? Is it just a bunch of open plains or are there other geographically areas that just aren't big enough to make it on the map. Can the Hungry Mountains be seen from anywhere in the Gravelands, like a looming specter? Or just when your closer to them.

Running a campaign there and just want to be able to capture the ambiance of the area.

Also in the LOCG book there is a feat mentions unnatural weather events and blighted areas, what might those be?

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I also wanted to thank everyone for a good back and forth discussion.

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If it's that important of a fact for my players to know I'm not gonna risk it on a random roll, if some one has a decently high Int or Wis I'll just share it with them to prevent a derailment, or if it's not that important it can be fun for the fact to pop up later.

As for the Mask Familiar thematically it's amazing. Who doesn't want a cool talking Tiki or Animal mask. Thinking Crash Bandicoot here. How ever that's all it really is, is a thematic familiar. When you take it off it still takes the form of an animal. So people who take it litterly wasted a feat so their familiar can look like a mask. That's not worth a class feat, and as a DM if someone really wanted a mask familiar I'd give it to them, but that's me.

Rysky once again your comparing it to a House rule, there is noting in the rules that says you can't take notes, it's not a house rule. Like I said I could be a bit more understanding if it was a Skill feat, but it's not.

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It's a Meta game feat really. The player forgets outside the game so their character gets to automatically remember, but only the last 24 hours. You can say most characters that would take this feat either have a pretty high Intelligence or Wisdom, if they have a 16 or 18 Wisdom I'd hope they'd be able to remember crucial elements to a mission told to them in the last 24 hours, and if they have a high Intelligence I'd hope the character is smart enough to write it down. It'd be different if this gave to photographic memory, or a bonus to Recalling Knowledge of all types cause you might have seen it in a book somewhere.

As for Joana's example that's a house rule, what I'm talking about is generally just being a good player and keeping notes about important details even if it's a quick scribble in your note book.

To Rysky there's a difference between trying to memorizing the Bestiary stat blocks and take notes so you don't forget important campaign related topics or names. One is trying to cheat the system and the other is information I've already freely given to you.

Scroll Master Dedication is a terrible feat. It does what a Skill feat could do, not what a Class feat should do which it is replacing.

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So you think being able to recall knowledge about something that happened in the last 24 hours is worth a 6th level feat? My players take notes which automatic nulls this feat. As for the added +2 it's nice but not worth a feat. At 6th level a Wizard can gain Advanced School Spell, Bard can get Harmonize or Dirge of Doom, and the Sorcerer their Advanced Bloodline, would you honestly pick Scroll Master Dedication over any of those? The Core class feats are far Superior to Scroll Master Dedication. I don't expect Dedication feats to be more powerful then class feats but I at least expect them to be on par with them.

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Ok Worthless may have been a tad harsh I mean after all they still do something. So I'll rephrase it to terrible feats.

Masked Casting, Signifer's Sight (lvl 10 is a little late in the game to get darkvision, the other benefit will rarely come into play), Fear No Law, Fear no One (It's fighters bravery, fighter's are probably the most common Hellknights next to champions), Mask Familiar (At this point anyone that wants a familiar will have one, yes they can retrain but this is a 4th level feat that feat can be better used elsewhere), Adaptive Mask Familiar (It's improved Familiar but at a 6th level feat cost, this could be worth it if it stacks with improved familiar but that's a hefty investment), Rain-Scribe Sustenance (Super Situational), All Uzunjati Feats (Though they are Skill feats so there's some leeway), Every Single Scroll Master Feat but Lore Seeker, Swordmaster Dedication (Disarming is aweful and I doubt many NPC's or Monster would take the time to do it).

I didn't touch the lack luster Heritages and some questionable Ancestry Feats.

If this was a 20 door soft cover I could maybe see it, but it's not. Many options in these book are uninspired and just plain boring. However as previously said the Art, Writing of the Fluff, and few fantasy provoking and just cool sounding feats are good.

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I'm honestly surprised at how many people are absolutely OK with just absolutely worthless feats. I see people comparing it to 1E stuff but I thought the goal of 2E was to be better and have more meaningful choices. Whats the point of creating something if barely any one will use it? With a little more effort these feats could be made better and become worth taking.

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Well if you want to go off the 1st Edition Hellknight we can, in that case we are missing a Bunch of elemental resistances, the ability to Smite Chaos earlier then 12th level, and at cap their weapon suddenly gets magical powers. Not very mundane is is that? Now let's look at the orders and how many of them give spell like abilities.

The developers said in multiply videos and streams that they don't want to just spew out the same material as they did in 1st edition. They had a chance here to make the Hellknights stand out more and give them unique and interesting abilities in the form of Focus Powers.

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Thanks you Evilgm! I just think it's a pretty harsh setup to have to take a feat to get there, then you have to be on fire in order to even benefit from the feat. I mean was a D8 or D10 going to break the game at lvl 9?

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Pardon my lack of knowledge about the forums this is one of my first posts around here and I don't know how to apply the Quotes, but in regards to Gleeful Grognard and Paradozen why add lackluster feats at all then? Why tread old ground and just aim for par? This is Paizo's own edition and their chance to set their own precedents instead of having to tread the ground laid out by 3rd edition. People around here have become so accustomed to lackluster options and only parts of the book being useful that they just shrug and accept it. I see the brilliant design Paizo is capable of and honestly I expect them to bring it to every piece of mechanic and design they make.

Little off topic but I've watched the live streams and see how passionate the designers are about the game, specially Mark Seifter. You can see the twinkle in his eyes when he gets to talk about his designs and the things he's created. I love seeing that and want to see that passion brought to every archetype and feat they publish, but as it stands Devil's Advocate, Scroll Master Dedication, Warrenbred Hobgobiln and several others don't hold up to that.

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Exaggerating? Can you really compare being able to Avert your Gaze to a Wizards School's Greater Power? Let's take Scroll Master Dedication a 6th level feat, it grants you the ability to recall info for 24 hours without needing a check, and an added bonus if you have another feat... how often is that really gonna come up? At that level the Sorcerer gets their Advanced Bloodline. I'm not expecting ultra powerful abilities, but I am expecting useful, interesting abilities. The Scroll Master Dedication feat could have maybe allowed you to use a certain level spell scroll without using it up once a day.

As for the Hell Knights, they are Hell Knights! Where's the hell powers? At this pointy they are just people in spooky armor that yells at kids to stay off their law (Putting it mildly). You can't tell me after all these years they haven't learned a hell trick or two to up the ante? I mean one of their lvl 8 Feats grants them what the Fighter got at lvl 3. And for a organization that HATES Chaos they don't get anything to harm it until lvl 12.

I'm just saying this is a fresh start, and there's a lot of exciting things in the Core book I wanna see that carry over to the other books. Cause as it stands I can almost guarantee no one in my group will be part of the Pathfinder Society or take many of the Hell Knight options.

Regarding the races I agree most of them are great but there are still a few dudes (looking at you Hobgoblin Warrenbred, and Warmarch). I also can't understand the Goblin feat Scalding Spit, you have to take persistent Fire damage enable to use it, and it does a pitiful 1D6 damage at lvl 9. At that point why would you ever use it over say a Produce Flame?

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Thank you for the clarification good sir!

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I understand the Situational feats but they need to be tied into a benefit that can come into play more often, even if it's a minor one.

Side note what's wrong with fire chains and making people explode? I feel those two have a very Hellish vibe lol.

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Sun Blade says to make a Ranged Spell Attack. But also says on a Critical you deal double damage, on a failure you still do Full Damage so does Sun Blade just deal automatic damage and your just rolling to see if you Crit? Or was it supposed to be a Save?

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The more I read the more disappointed I get. A lvl 8 Feat allows you to Avert your gaze and cast at the same time... that's it... If you're a Wizard why would you Ever pick that over getting your Advanced School ability?

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I agree with you Strill, Devil's Advocate for Example again could have been a regional General Feat.

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For example: Devils Advocate a 1st level Human Feat. The name is amazing, then you get to the heart of the feat and realize it is only beneficial if your trying to talk to, or deal with a Devil. Now for a campaign set in Cheliax it could be a good feat, but honestly whose gonna choose that over a extra Class Feat? Or being able to use a crazy weapon? Now if there was a none Devil related ability added to it it could be worth it. Say, you get a +2 vs being mentally persuaded. Or maybe even you spent so much time around devils you can cast Charm.

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The art is amazing. The fluff of the book is outstanding and invites players into the world. However the mechanics in the game do not by any stretch reinforce that fluff. I left PF1 because of the highly useless bonuses, or extremely niche abilities. Now there can be a place for those benefits but it has to be tied to a useful ability, or fantasy provoking power.

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To start off with I love the core book, it has some issues but it's pretty close to the perfect system for me. I loved power option choices, as well as multiple paths I can lead a character down. So I was extremely excited when I realized how quick we were getting new content.

I ordered LOWG from Amazon (Had had to wait longer then I expected...) and when I finally got the book and cracked it open to the Archetypes I was... severely underwhelmed. Some were pretty good, like Red Mantis Assassin, and the Rune-scarred. However many of the feat choices are situational at best, or don't feel like they live up to the fantasy of the Archetype. Even more some require harsh requirements to even join them, preventing a lot of cool builds with out deep investments feat wise. The Hell Knight Armiger doesn't even feel like it's complete, one feat gives you resistance based on your Reckoning but that knowledge isn't even in the book. I chalked it up to being kinda rushed to be released with the Core book.

Once more I waited and today finally got to see the LOCG! Very quickly it became abundantly clear that not all feats and heritages are created equal. A level 9 Goblin feat lets you spit fire for a whopping 1D6, and you have to be on fire to do this, yet a level 9 human feat lets you take a Multi-class dedication feat. A elf heritage gives you a multi-class dedicate at level 1, but my monkey goblin gets a bonus to climbing and a situational climbing feat... what would be cool is if that tail could hold a item, so I didn't have to draw it. The Hobgoblin heritages feel like a joke for the most part and don't come close to the power or flexibility of the human or elven feats.

Now there are good parts to the book. I feel the Lizardfolk, and Leshys are well done. The Knights of Last Wall as a whole have a bunch of really cool feats that allow them to shoot sun beams, use shields two handed, and cone attack with their weapon! Then you get to the Hell Knights are it gets extremely boring. Most of the Order abilities are very uninspiring and honestly not worth picking over your class feats. Order of the Chain could have had ghost rider style flame chains, the Order of the Pyre could have been able to combust their foes, Order of the Nail could have had some crazy Iron Maiden like ability! They don't.

Pathfinder 2E has a chance to reinvent it's self and be better then every before. I saw that when I bought the Core book and every book since. I hope the Dev's take bold chances and give us crazy fun abilities, like the Sun Blade.

That's my 2 cents.

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Finally received the book from Amazon... However I noticed random paragraphs are Bolded and the Write up on Ustalav is in a reddish brown ink. The reddish brown gives a nice flare to the spooky lands that are Ustalav but I figured I'd say something.

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Two of the Hell Knight Feats require you to know information that isn't in the book.

Ardent Armiger requires you to know what your orders tenets

and

Mortification requires you to know what their Reckoning is.

This is kinda ridiculous that this information isn't in the book when it's clearly required to have to even use the feats. Sure I can look it up, but I shouldn't have to. The information I need to use the Hellknight Armiger should be in the book I purchased to use it. Paizo you're better than this.

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I have a weekly group as well. If your interested. Just drop me a message or e-mail me at drake_ruinheart@yahoo.com.

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Hey man. I've been running games for a long while as well. Started in AD&D but wasn't there to long before I started into 3rd. I've played every edition in between. And now Pathfinder. If you'd like to share info or maybe meet up message me back.

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Thank you. And Thanks for the quick response. Now I'm torn. Limited budget, do I get the PDF or suffer and wait for the hardcover... Ugh.

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This my first time posting so please bear with me.

I have called the local bookstores and hobby shops, and they tell me they won't have Ultimate Combat until the 23rd of August. Would I get it faster if I ordered it here? Second if I order the hardcover would I get the PDF free? I have been waiting for this book since it was announced.

Thank you.