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Everyone, if you wanted to tell folks about PbP and our awesome community, what would you say? I'd love to hear how you would sell PbP to your friends, loved ones and interested strangers.
Roleplay! Adverbs! Convenience!
I find that PbP allows for much more depth of roleplay, since you're not trying to finish a limited time slot at a con or FLGS - though this applies to non-PFS play as well. Whether you don't have time to really make a colorful speech during play at a table, or you're just not great at coming up with the right words on the fly, or you're shy by nature, or the room's too loud for your soft-voiced character to do anything but shout - PbP lets you craft the words and describe the reactions for much more thoughtful roleplay.
This also lends itself to more detailed description of things, what your character looks like, how he sounds when he talks - even using adverbs to say you do something 'adroitly' or 'zealously' or something in between, rather than 'I shoot an arrow at it.' I really enjoy the language that can pop up in some of the PbP's I've played, and I love when a particularly apt bit of phrasing occurs to me. I feel it's made me a better writer, which in turn makes me a better PbP'er.
And obviously, as others have said, the convenience is great. How else could I play Pathfinder on the bus, or at work? I've even signed up for wifi while on business trips and played on airplanes.
I guess one other thought I'd add, is it shows me another side of people. Some people I PbP with are folks I knew or gamed with before bringing them into PbP play, many more are people I've PbP'ed with and then managed to meet in person. And each form of play shows me different things about that person - I've learned my son is a quirky, funny writer when he sets his mind to it, that one person I've played with at PaizoCon, who presents as a bit shy in person, is one of the wittiest folks on the boards here. This is a more limited selling point than my first three, but how often in life do we write each other stories as a means of expressing ourselves?
I tend to GM way too much, so PbP is one of my few places to actually get to PLAY a game... and yet even here I GM way too much...
Shifty: I'd be happy to hold a seat in the next game I run for you.
Thanks mate!
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My interview date with Know Direction Podcast has been announced. I'll be talking about Play by Post! They'll be interviewing me at 8:30 EST. If any of you want to tune in and make encouraging noises or ask good questions in chat, please do.
Hmm
I picked up an orphaned game. It's time to report their success.
However, that game was part of Gameday V, so the form tells me "Prestige does not count. Player has already played scenario at session # x of event # 82317 PbP Gameday V on November 28, 2016."
Who do I get in contact with to resolve this?
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That would be me. Is this a PbP Gameday V game you picked up? Or a general play game? Does it give that error for every player, or just one?
If you can email me at Jesse@PathfinderSocietyOnline.com with all the details and we'll get it worked out - include the session so I know which session to look at.
- Jesse
Jesse R. Davis [IronHelixx]
PFS Venture-Captain, Online Play
Jesse@PathfinderSocietyOnline.com
http://PathfinderSocietyOnline.com
Discord Chat: PFSChat.com
Our Mission: To Champion, Serve, Support, and Build the PFS Online Community.
I picked up an orphaned game. It's time to report their success.
However, that game was part of Gameday V, so the form tells me "Prestige does not count. Player has already played scenario at session # x of event # 82317 PbP Gameday V on November 28, 2016."
Who do I get in contact with to resolve this?
That would be me. Is this a PbP Gameday V game you picked up? Or a general play game? Does it give that error for every player, or just one?
If you can email me at Jesse@PathfinderSocietyOnline.com with all the details and we'll get it worked out - include the session so I know which session to look at.
- Jesse
Jesse R. Davis [IronHelixx]
PFS Venture-Captain, Online Play
Jesse@PathfinderSocietyOnline.com
http://PathfinderSocietyOnline.com
Discord Chat: PFSChat.comOur Mission: To Champion, Serve, Support, and Build the PFS Online Community.
I picked up an orphaned game. It's time to report their success.
However, that game was part of Gameday V, so the form tells me "Prestige does not count. Player has already played scenario at session # x of event # 82317 PbP Gameday V on November 28, 2016."
Who do I get in contact with to resolve this?
It's a Gameday V game. I've sent you an email. Thanks for taking a look!
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I'm starting to do the groundwork to run my first PbP later this month. I want to make sure that I have everything in place first so that I have a successful game.
My current hurdle is extracting the maps from the pdfs. I'm on a Mac, so some common tools like Foxit don't work for me. Any other Mac-using GMs out there have some advice?
@GM Hmm I know you were working on some guides, but I'm having difficulty finding them. The only link I could find on this board is in you Google Docs trash, so appears to be obsolete. Are there more updated copies somewhere?
Thanks!
I'm starting to do the groundwork to run my first PbP later this month. I want to make sure that I have everything in place first so that I have a successful game.
My current hurdle is extracting the maps from the pdfs. I'm on a Mac, so some common tools like Foxit don't work for me. Any other Mac-using GMs out there have some advice?
@GM Hmm I know you were working on some guides, but I'm having difficulty finding them. The only link I could find on this board is in you Google Docs trash, so appears to be obsolete. Are there more updated copies somewhere?
Thanks!
If you come from the linux world and you're comfortable with command lines, you can install pdfimages and then strip all the images from the PDF file. That's what I do but I'm a computer programmer.
If you have Adobe Acrobat Pro, you can export the PDF to a PDF and select "Extract all Images". Easy peasy, but you need to buy Adobe Acrobat.
Finally you can just use Shift+Cmd+4 and then drag the mouse over whatever image you want to copy. That will save the image to your desktop. You can then edit the images in GIMP, Photoshop or some other program to isolate the picture.
I hope this helps!
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If you come from the linux world and you're comfortable with command lines, you can install pdfimages and then strip all the images from the PDF file. That's what I do but I'm a computer programmer.
I have some Linux background, but not in a while and only as a hobbyist (and a hobbyist who really favors a GUI, at that). But I will look into this. This sounds like the end result I'm looking for, so maybe I should just get more comfortable with the command line.
If you have Adobe Acrobat Pro, you can export the PDF to a PDF and select "Extract all Images". Easy peasy, but you need to buy Adobe Acrobat.
$15/month for Pro! Too rich for my blood. I would be willing to pay once for a good software tool to do this work, but giving Adobe my bank account in perpetuity is beyond my needs or means right now. :)
Finally you can just use Shift+Cmd+4 and then drag the mouse over whatever image you want to copy. That will save the image to your desktop. You can then edit the images in GIMP, Photoshop or some other program to isolate the picture.
This is good for support images (NPCs, etc.) but not for maps, as this will capture the "secret" information (secret doors, room labels, monster positions) that the PCs aren't supposed to see.
I hope this helps!
Absolutely! Thanks for chiming in. I'll take a look at pdfimages and see how my command line skills are. :)
Homebrew for Mac will set you up with pdfimages. Make sure you add jpeg and png support, or use GIMP to convert the tiff images so Google can display them. Also pdfimages will export EVERYTHING, so prepare to delete 100 images of page borders and grayscale shadows.
Some chronicles have spoiler-free maps, but others don't. I think there's a Paizo generic map PDF you can use for screenshots. If I have free time I'll try to write this up in a guide so we can add it.
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Greetings all.
I'm looking to see if anybody would be willing to run my Dragon's Demand game for a couple weeks starting the beginning of March? I'm going into the backwoods, so PbP would be difficult and I don't want my game to die from inactivity.
This game isn't being run under PFS, but I know the Flaxseed is where all the great DMs gather. =v)
Any interest or questions, feel free to post them here or PM me.
Thank you in advance.
It's in my trash? How did that happen? Let me rescue it.
One thing that might work for you is one of the online image extracting websites. There's several listed in the document.
Meanwhile, what game are you running? If I own it, I could extract some images for you.
Hmm
I'd certainly be interested in playing through the Confirmation if you are recruiting! I've GM'd it once a while back but never played it, and I've got a Dapper Fox that needs building.
Also as a note, for most scenarios capturing images in acrobat will leave the secret door and trap markers behind since those are usually text on a separate layer.
Yep, most of the time you can get the image without traps and secret doors. There are some exceptions.
(*grumble* Murder's Mark *grumble*)
I had to find my own way to cover secret doors for that module. So does Nitro work? There are a number image extraction sites that should do it for you.
And if not...
Yes, I can get you a Confirmation slideshow. Even though I have yet to GM it, I've helped others put together that slideshow and likely still have a copy somewhere.
Hmm
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As chadius mentioned, PDF-Images is what I use, though it does extract a lot of junk along with the real stuff.
Most of the pdf's allow you to select the map image, then a simple copy (CTRL-C) and paste (CTRL-V) in google presentations is all that is needed
The Know Direction interview went well, but it caused me to realize something. I had no real numbers to give, because we have never done statistics on how many PbP games GMs average a year. We have some numbers from PbP Gamedays, but other than that... we don't have any statistics for our community.
Would you guys be willing to do a short survey to help me collect a snapshot of our annual PBP statistics?
Stand up! Be counted! I would like numbers from everyone. If you have GMed (or are currently GMing) even one game this year, I want to know about it. Your numbers matter to us not only in planning, but also in selling PbP as a medium to PFS Leadership.
Hmm
GM HMM: Do you want to consider adding some questions about non-PFS PBP? I GM many PBP games here and elsewhere.
For number of Games GM'd, how do APs or Modules get counted? I'm GMing Iron Gods in person in addition to my array of PbP games, so by product I've probably run only a few games in the last year but by in person sessions it's been a much much higher number.
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I'm not sure if "Average" is helpful.
Especially with PBP games will often run between years. So being clear if you mean reported, started, or any involvement would be helpful.
Anyway, I did mine based on games reported in 2016. For those who are into comparing numbers, that came in at 29 (up on 23 from 2015 interestingly)
For the last year I have been tracking how long games take as well, and I've noticed my Core games average almost a week longer than my Classic ones. (overall average is between 37 and 38 days, but with some significant outlying figures, the average is brought down by a large number of Confirmation runs)
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Stand up! Be counted! I would like numbers from everyone. If you have GMed (or are currently GMing) even one game this year, I want to know about it. Your numbers matter to us not only in planning, but also in selling PbP as a medium to PFS Leadership.
Hmm
A word of warning: doing a survey like this, in a spot like this, will not be a random sample of the PbP participants on the Paizo Boards.
You will have what is called selection bias, or more precisely sampling bias. Those who frequent these boards regularly and are engaged in the community are also far more likely to participate in the survey for three reasons: willingness, time availability and potential to see your link.
Thus any statistics you calculate on the basis of this survey will oversample the diehard PbP GMs and lead to skewed results.
If you have any way to find out whether or not a game is a PbP game from the 'my campaigns' tab that will give you far more reliable numbers.
If you had a tech guy who could count the number of times new new game threads with the string 'PFS' goes up this would prolly also give you better information. I'm not really good at programming myself but I imagine that it should be possible to also collect string which includes the alias or the internal PaizoID of the associated user account. Then just count all games associated with an alias. This wouldn't be 100% precise but likely a better database than a non-random survey.
@Tarondor: Counting non-PFS PbP? It's an interesting idea, but beyond my current scope. We're mostly looking for any game that gives out PFS chronicle sheets (so this includes Campaign Mode games) because we are seeking statistics here.
@DeBug: PFS counts modules and AP levels as double tables, so I think it would be fair to do so here too.
@GM Aerondor: I want games in-progress as well as those completed. BTW, your statistics are very interesting to me, especially the observation on CORE.
@Alex Mack: Oh, I agree. These are imperfect statistics. Will there be selection bias? You bet. I am also going to be posting about this survey in the PFS GM forum, and elsewhere. (Unfortunately, I have a real world Con that I am leaving for... So I won't get back to this until next week.) You know that 'other' category for PFS sites? I hope to investigate those outlier sites and post there as well.
I am also going to be hitting up a whole bunch of GMs that I know who GMed something PFS (including Campaign Mode APs) with links to this survey. I am heading to a con this weekend, but I am hoping to get more GMs counted in here.
All lodges are supposed to report statistics to their RVC about the number of games played. Poor Jesse has been doing searches for PFS event names that mention 'PbP' or online and harvesting data there, but it is horrible. We're operating blind, here.
There is a new regional incentive program out that online would love to be a part of... But we have almost no information on how many games run through our "lodge". I know we're diverse. I know we're large. But how large are we?
Believe it or not... We've actually discussed the idea of trying to harvest data on new game threads. I lack the technical expertise. If someone else wants to try and do this project, I would be VERY interested in it.
A much better long-term solution would be to have all PFS PbP report to the same event number, one that shifted every six months or so. The problem that I see with that is that a lot of GMs love being able to do their own reporting. (Including me.) Being able to input my own numbers and look back on each game and see who was in it -- that's one of the perks of running a private PFS home game.
We've also considered the possibility of having an initiative where everyone registers their PBP event reporting numbers, so that Jesse could know where to look for the data, but I think that will *still* run into the problem of only catching the PFS PBP hardcore.
Some statistics are better than no statistics however. We need a starting point. I am trying to get one.
Hmm
Yes. I do. I also know that as a secondary reporter I do not have as much access to the event data as the primary reporter does.
Though, maybe I'm the only person who cares about such things? If people are amenable to reporting through a primary event number, that is a path that we could take that could solve the statistics issue.
How do you guys feel about a central reporting number? We'd probably have separate ones for Paizo and Myth-Weavers.
Hmm
I would not mind working with a central reporting number, I keep my game statistics in my own spreadsheet anyway.
Would not really make difference to me either. As long as I can report it and get the credit for running the game, it does not really change much.
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I wonder how easy it would be to add a simple check box or drop down on the reporting screen that would allow collection of the game type. Either a single check box that would mark it as a PbP game, or a drop down that allows you to choose PbP, F2F, VTC, etc. If this is information that Paizo as a company is looking to collect, I'm sure it would be easy enough to convince them to add that on there.
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Central reporting number? Can we call the event PbP Gameday Infinite? And get perpetual boon support?
The problem I have with letting someone else report my games is that it seems to take so long.
So. Long.
I'd prefer to do it myself and know that it's done.
A central reporting number would be fine, I rather like my current reporting number because it is basically my phone number so super easy to remember.
Though I am also not the best about reporting games and as a GM that's a problem.
I report my PbP and F2F games all under the same number, but have no problem with a central reporting number for PFS PbP.
Secondary reporting is fine as I can input the data and know 100% that it was submitted. I am less happy when its sending in spreadsheets or googleforms, as neither of those let me know there was an error (ie wrong player number) on the spot.
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Central reporting number will not work. Same problem with the survey is it is not a proper sample - you arent reaching the audience outside the regulars. You would also require people to request you give them permission to report, then wait until you add them. Not feasible on a global scale.
You also cant enforce it.
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I think you're missing the point. GM Hmm isn't looking for statistical accuracy so much -some- kind of numbers that show who we are. She'll know they're inaccurate, but they'll be a start.
From a statistical perspective biased statistics are actually worse than no statistics. Because they will lead you to wrong conclusions.
However, if you have any kind of reliable numbers from other sources these might help you assess the degree of bias in your sample.
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Very rough quick estimate.
there were 2300 pbp game forms posted to since January 2016.
That included all Pbp games non-PFS, Non-PF, testing post, some forms were used to run multiple modules ...
A quick count from one page of a 100 games 40 were recognizable from the title as PFS modules.
Give a very rough estimate of 920 PBP PFS forums running, dropped and/or completed on Paizo forums since the start of 2016.
Give that there are only 2300 games to look at it would be possible to do a better count, getting title, post count, start date, end date, GM, Completed, PFS Chronicles sent out, Estimated number of player.
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Hi everyone,
I was referred to this thread by Ghost1776. First let me start by saying I have never GM'd for a PBP or PFS scenario. However, I have read the the Pathfinder guide to organized play and am an experienced GM who loves to emphasize role play. So in essence I feel I could give this a try with some knowledgeable people to help me through it..
I have already begun the recruitment for "From under the Ice" PFS #6-18 From under the Ice
It was pointed out to me that I was recruiting in an unorthodox/questionable manor in regards to a PFS legal scenario. I think I have resolved these issues by clarifying that I intended to fully follow the guidelines for play as laid down in Pathfinder guide to organized play. That being said I could still use some help.
Some issues I could use some help with are:
1. How do you check characters for PFS legality in a PBP game (ie. chronicle sheets ect..)
2. How do I award chronicle sheets? (ie: should I email them to players once the scenario is complete? do they need to be approved by the PBP venture lieutenant?)
3. Am I recruiting in the correct place?
4. How do players join my campaign? (i've made a campaign thread a discussion and game play thread. However, I have yet to discover a way to invite players to the threads/campaign.
5. is there a PBP die roller or is it the honor system?
I'm sure I'll have more questions I'll just start with these
1. You can check sheets to see if they have only PFS legal options, right # of feats etc. (this is actually easier than in-person). You can check chronicles by asking people to e-mail or otherwise share images of them if you like, though generally that is more honor system in my experience.
2. e-mail, dropbox etc. are all good for giving out chronicles
3. This is a great thread for that, though I would recommend the recruitment branch of the Flaxseed Lodge
4. You just tell them to post in the discussion & gameplay threads (known sometimes as dotting). Once they do this on their campaign tabs they will see whenever there are new posts.
5. There is a dice roller. The format is shown under each post in the 'How to format your text' spoiler.
Welcome to the Lodge!
1. You can check sheets to see if they have only PFS legal options, right # of feats etc. (this is actually easier than in-person). You can check chronicles by asking people to e-mail or otherwise share images of them if you like, though generally that is more honor system in my experience.
2. e-mail, dropbox etc. are all good for giving out chronicles
3. This is a great thread for that, though I would recommend the recruitment branch of the Flaxseed Lodge
4. You just tell them to post in the discussion & gameplay threads (known sometimes as dotting). Once they do this on their campaign tabs they will see whenever there are new posts.
5. There is a dice roller. The format is shown under each post in the 'How to format your text' spoiler.Welcome to the Lodge!
Thank you! GM Cwethan
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Okay, question time. Not too long ago I received a complaint from one of the players in my PFS PbP about another player, regarding their "empty posts" and skimming of the (rules) posts, and as I was already a bit perturbed by those actions myself, I PM'd the player in question. An unfortunately contentious series of back-and-forth PMs later they appear to be thinking about dropping the game. I have tried to reconcile with them, offering an abridged set of directions for the scenario's special rules, as they have mentioned not having the time to read through all of the posted rules. I have also said that I would welcome them back with open arms, should they decide they can put this behind us and continue having a good time. I'm sure mistakes were made on both sides, as is inherent when it comes to an argument, but here we are now.
Anyway, in their latest reply they asked about the status of their Chronicle sheet, whether they would still receive it, in its entirety or otherwise. That is the question I ask of you experienced people. I've heard differing opinions on whether the Chronicle should still be given, and how much of the scenario need be completed before they earn it (I have heard 1/3 or 1/2, or three combat encounters, among other things). I have also checked the recent Guild Guides, to no avail. As the scenario is Bid for Alabastrine, they have passed the only combat encounter and are nearly done with the second social. I would say that is around one third or nearly half done, but I would like professional input on this one. Thoughts?
Step 3: Award the character XP based on his advancement track. A PC may receive XP only if he survives the scenario or is raised from the dead by the scenario’s conclusion and completed at least three encounters over the course of the adventure. A character using the standard advancement track earns 1 XP; a character on the slow advancement track earns 1/2 XP. Mark this value in the shaded XP Gained field and initial the adjacent box
For the scenario in question, I believe that several of the negotiations and diplomatic sections are marked as encounters, so you'd have to decide if they've been involved in at least 3 of them
Bid for Alabastrine is negotiation heavy, each round of talks definitely count as encounters. Combine that with the initial combat and you have your answer.
@GM Crunch:
Is the scenario still ongoing? Do you wish me to mediate with the player? I'm currently ending a convention and then going on a college trip, but I can see what I can do. If they drop completely and irreconcilably, they will have to have completed at least three encounters to get full credit.
___
@Statistics Fans:
We're talking with Oladan about her data-gathering program. If Paizo's TOS allows us to use data scraped from their forums, we'll definitely be using this too. We have to double-check first whether we are allowed to use it!
Meanwhile thank you to everyone who's replied to the survey so far.
Hmm
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@GM Granta: I checked the old guide, but it seems to be referencing longer than average sessions such as modules and APs. If it did still apply to normal scenarios, it would conflict with the "three encounters" ruling that other people seem to be leaning towards.
@GM Hmm: The scenario is still going. We have had radio silence for the past two days or so, but that is because there has been nothing to post. We had been waiting for the player's post since Wednesday, as after it was settled we could move to the third round. On Friday it came, but it was ill-worded, leaving me unable to tell who he was trying to Influence and using an incorrect skill for a different check. That was when another player PM'd me with concern over their empty posts. I will PM you further on this subject once I finish this post.
Overall, I'm not sure what to think. The PCs have completed the combat encounter and one social encounter, and after processing the player in question's post, the third encounter would have been over, all the PCs having made their checks. However, I could not decipher the target of their post, and then began the talks regarding the concerns of his fellow players as well as my own. Technically, they were not through three encounters when this happened, as we still did not know what the player was doing. On the other hand, that might just be me (subconsciously?) trying to get revenge on the player for their heated words. I don't feel like I would do that, but...Oh, never mind, I'll get myself into a loop if I keep trying to parse it out like this. What do you people think, was it three encounters?