Dark Archives PCs - what are you making?


Pathfinder Second Edition General Discussion

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While this book is still quite a few months out, new Classes are always fun to start imagining around; I want to hear about your Psychics, your Thaumaturges, and your Time Oracles! Happy to chat about speculative builds or actual fluff of who they are.

There's several Psychic characters I'm chewing on that all occupy a similar space; leaning hard into the gonzo, sci-fi-adjacent parts parts of the setting. Android with hyper-empathic programming? Fleshwarp with an special mutant brain? Azarketi with some especially profound algollthu influence on their biology? Elf from Sovyrian, trained in ancient Castrovel-style mental magic? I'm smitten with all the /weird/ options this class enables, it has me giddy.

I don't have a Time Oracle concept just yet, but it's the first Mystery that's piqued my interest - especially with what we know about in Outlaws of Alkenstar.


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First I'm heading of the time oracle. Sounds wild. I'm mostly interested in the thaumaturge. I had an idea with the playtest for a kitsune that used esoteric antithesis with foxfire and wielded the lantern and amulet. The spiritual source of foxfire would make great flavor for esoteric antithesis.


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Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber

Lantern and Wand Thaumaturges are pretty cool, but I'm also interested in the Psychic that shapes objects with their powers, I've always loved dream shaping stuff.

But I suspect the killer apps for me will come from other stuff in the book, rather than the classes, as cool as they are.

I could be wrong though.


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aobst128 wrote:
First I'm heading of the time oracle. Sounds wild. I'm mostly interested in the thaumaturge. I had an idea with the playtest for a kitsune that used esoteric antithesis with foxfire and wielded the lantern and amulet. The spiritual source of foxfire would make great flavor for esoteric antithesis.

A kitsune with a magic lantern is /such/ a fun visual.


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For a serious character I'd make a poppet psychic bc a creepy little doll or plush moving stuff with it's mind is a fairly alarming image. For the character I actually wanna make?.............. Gnome version of doctor Orpheus from Venture Bros (also psychic). Crazy hair, permanently raised bushy eyebrow, constantly pointing at his temple and yelling "uuuuuweeeeeeuuuu" (theremin noise).


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Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber

The immediate thought with Time Oracle for me is someone who has the potential to become one of the many incarnations of Shyka, or even just an agent of them.

I also want to play a Dhampir Elf thaumaturge who is searching for a cure to vampirism ( her father being a human who foolishly became a vampire to stay with his beloved. and for awhile he was able to control his vampiric hunger but as time went on it became more of struggle)

Another idea is a catfolk geniekin of some-kind who fluffs her esoteric antithesis as tiny wishes. maybe with a sorcerer dedication.


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keftiu wrote:
aobst128 wrote:
First I'm heading of the time oracle. Sounds wild. I'm mostly interested in the thaumaturge. I had an idea with the playtest for a kitsune that used esoteric antithesis with foxfire and wielded the lantern and amulet. The spiritual source of foxfire would make great flavor for esoteric antithesis.
A kitsune with a magic lantern is /such/ a fun visual.

The lantern is the medium by which their esoterica is used. They throw in a piece, burn it up and mix foxfire into it, causing it to change color as it attunes to the targets weakness and is blasted out of the lantern.


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So far I have two ideas. I want to recreate my time oracle from 1E, who was a halfling oracle who acted like a kind of janitor for the timestream, even going so far as to fight with a battle-broom.

Then I want to make a supremely Cha-heavy, deception-focused Thaumaturge who either takes a bevy of pact feats, or enters the Pactbound archetype, and has their soul sworn to so many different entities nobody actually knows who their soul really belongs to anymore.


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My playtest Infinite Eye Psychic was based on the Guides from Tower of God, so I'd probably make something akin to that again as a support GMPC. I might re-re-re-remake my Witcher style character as a Thaumaturge if the end product fits the Monster Hunter style oddly specific "screw you" that it had in the playtest in a more convenient manner. The "make tangible matter with your mind" Psychic might FINALLY let me make Heroic Spirit EMIYA since the Soul Forger didn't really pan out too well for that character idea (he has SO many different weapons to swap between). And what's this about a "time oracle"? First I've heard and it sounds weird and neat


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probably gunna build trevor belmont from castlevania as a wepon thamaturge. or a plauge doctor chalice plauge monster hunting thamarurge with the alchemist archetype


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I’m curious if this is going to have the Synthesist summoner in it (the product page leads me to think so). If it does, I’m probably going to use it as a pseudo shifter and medium class to cover those themes.

My kobold weredragon will come back to life!


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AnimatedPaper wrote:

I’m curious if this is going to have the Synthesist summoner in it (the product page leads me to think so). If it does, I’m probably going to use it as a pseudo shifter and medium class to cover those themes.

My kobold weredragon will come back to life!

I'd be very surprised to see Synthesist this quickly. Would love to be wrong, but it's a popular-enough option that I think they'd advertise it front and center if this was the book.


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1. a Kitsune Thaumaturge with a war flail (lantern staff)
2. PFS a poppet psychic
3. PFS a human time Oracle refugee from Rahadoum with the medic dedication. He gave up his name and is just called "The Doctor"


Cowardly kitsune conman Thaumaturge, drop some feats or free archetype into an animal companion. Go for a superstitious warding vibe, maybe get some scrolls in there.


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Loving that "Kitsune Thaumaturge" is apparently a winning combo! That's our third in this thread.


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keftiu wrote:
AnimatedPaper wrote:

I’m curious if this is going to have the Synthesist summoner in it (the product page leads me to think so). If it does, I’m probably going to use it as a pseudo shifter and medium class to cover those themes.

My kobold weredragon will come back to life!

I'd be very surprised to see Synthesist this quickly. Would love to be wrong, but it's a popular-enough option that I think they'd advertise it front and center if this was the book.

If I’m right about this particular line, that’s almost exactly what is happening on the product page, given it is almost dead center of the description:

Quote:
the secret of becoming a living vessel for an eldritch being


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I'm also hoping Psychic plays nice with archetyping. It'd be really fun to make a Pathfinder-style Jedi.


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Perpdepog wrote:
I'm also hoping Psychic plays nice with archetyping. It'd be really fun to make a Pathfinder-style Jedi.

Whatever limited melee psychic has is gonna get paired with a monk archetype for my first psychic PC. It's another reason why I wish they had a wisdom option. Honestly wisdom and intelligence seems a better fit than charisma and intelligence.

Liberty's Edge

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AnimatedPaper wrote:
keftiu wrote:
AnimatedPaper wrote:

I’m curious if this is going to have the Synthesist summoner in it (the product page leads me to think so). If it does, I’m probably going to use it as a pseudo shifter and medium class to cover those themes.

My kobold weredragon will come back to life!

I'd be very surprised to see Synthesist this quickly. Would love to be wrong, but it's a popular-enough option that I think they'd advertise it front and center if this was the book.

If I’m right about this particular line, that’s almost exactly what is happening on the product page, given it is almost dead center of the description:

Quote:
the secret of becoming a living vessel for an eldritch being

My thought exactly.


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The ultimate "i have just the thing" character. My group always plays with free archetypes, so i am going to do a Thaumaturge/Talisman master/Scroll trickster merchant character. He has accumulated a veritable trove of useful and less useful stuff over the years, but he knows that adventure is the only way to get the truly powerful objects. He wants to make the family business truly soar, even if he has to risk his life for it.

Liberty's Edge

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For the playtest, I wanted to do a Lantern Thaumaturge based on the Tangent Green Lantern lady who could pierce the veil between the living and the dead. But she just could not be done in a playtest efficient way. So I hope I can create her with the final version.

I ended up creating my first ever Gnome PC. I went all out for the one-hand fighting style of the Thaumaturge. Her motto is "Gnomes should not be afraid of things that go bump in the dark. Things that go bump in the dark should be afraid of Gnomes."

I look forward to updating her to the final version :-)

And I'll just have to create John Constantine as a human Thaumaturge, as a mix of the Legends of Tomorrow / Books of Magic versions.


We'll have undead PCs by the time this is out: skeletons, vampires, mummies, ghouls, ghosts, and liches. Any of those catch your eye for this?


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I was considering making a psychic lich-like character whose Memoir is literally just their memoir. Like they aren't even particularly evil, just incredibly egocentric and prone to talking about themselves. I'm hoping there is a psychic path that will fit that playstyle.

Now I type it out I could make them a Runelord of Pride wizard, as well, and flavor their spellbook as their Memoir.


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Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber

Depending on how the archetype looks, I am really interested to try an esoteric bard with a thaumaturge dedication. I hope that there would be an interesting interaction between all the lore focus of the most unloved of muses and the thauma abilities.

A changling human foundling raised by a secret cult who was going to use him for an unspeakable ritual. The cult was wiped out by a group of Iomedean paladins who left the child buried in the catacombs where the cultists had their secret meetings. Survivng on rats and lichen, the boy read the volumes of the forbidden library left behind. Were the whispers the guided him from the dead, a power beyond time, or his own fractured psyche? Only time will tell.

Edit: ouch, I cut myself on all edge in my post.


Idea that came to me the other night: a Mummy who is an Oracle with the upcoming Time Mystery, whose entire arc is that they're a being out of time - maybe created in some bizarre ancient rite to be an eternal servant?


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Perpdepog wrote:
I'm also hoping Psychic plays nice with archetyping. It'd be really fun to make a Pathfinder-style Jedi.

I'm sorry to come back to this so late, but there's a very good 2e Solarian (converted from Starfinder and contextualized to Pathfinder's time period) on Pathfinder Infinite.


keftiu wrote:
Perpdepog wrote:
I'm also hoping Psychic plays nice with archetyping. It'd be really fun to make a Pathfinder-style Jedi.
I'm sorry to come back to this so late, but there's a very good 2e Solarian (converted from Starfinder and contextualized to Pathfinder's time period) on Pathfinder Infinite.

Neat. What's it called?


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Perpdepog wrote:
keftiu wrote:
Perpdepog wrote:
I'm also hoping Psychic plays nice with archetyping. It'd be really fun to make a Pathfinder-style Jedi.
I'm sorry to come back to this so late, but there's a very good 2e Solarian (converted from Starfinder and contextualized to Pathfinder's time period) on Pathfinder Infinite.
Neat. What's it called?

Infinite Classes: Solarians of the Inner Sea.


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I'll be making trevor belmont from castlevania as a weapon thamuturge


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From the new classes I'm most interested in psychics. If the final mechanics are solid I would love to play a travelling future teller or a sort of kinetic knight.


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Psionics have always been very cool for me, I would have to look at the final result and especially at all archetypes in the book but I will for sure play around a lot with the psychic.


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Part of me is hoping psychic vampires make an appearance in Book of the Dead, the way the Dhampir heritage has a little support for the concept; given that they're linked to Vudra, it would make sense that Jalmeray and Geb's proximity would lead to lots of them being around.

Maybe a Jalmeri vampire psychic, acting as an emissary between the two?


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I want to see how well an Investigator with Psychic Multiclass can approximate the Psychic Detective from PF1.


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Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber

A Fetchling Thaumaturge and Kollector of all things, wielding a flail and lantern as implements. Ability comes simply from having a seemingly endless and veritable collection of esoterica and baubles, always having the right tool for the right job.

John Constantine expy, with levels in Thaumaturge and maybe Diabolic Sorcerer and Investigator Dedications. And, why not, screw it; a Holy Blunderbuss to boot. Power stems from Synchronicity, a series of happenstances that received through a deal with a Devil?

Vetala-Born Dhampir Infinte Eye Psychic, with a third eye, often seen with all of them closed. Not exactly sure what their shtick is yet.

Mysterious mute Monk with a Psychic Dedication, or vice versa, and Silent Whisper Conscious Mind. Capable of speech, but has taken a vow of silence, but maybe also has some kind of dangerous power tied to his voice.

A Psychic Summoner whose Eidolon is either their innermost self or some kind of psychic or astral being. Modeled after Sabrina from Pokémon, with the Eidolon appearing very similar to (Mega?) Alakazam, or even possibly Mewtwo.

A Psychic Thaumaturge whose very mind is so fractured, it warps the very fabric of reality with their own perception of it. Inspired my Legion and likely has a focus on Unleash Psyche.

A Time Oracle Thaumaturge whose very power come from the endless number or timelines and alternate realities that pervade the multiverse. One tiemline saw the God's abandon Golarion, cutting off divine magic. A separate reality gave Vampires a weakness to moonlight and werebeasts transform in the sun instead. By tearing into these various alternatives, they create temporary adjustments to their own surroundings.

A Cleric of Fate and Thaumaturge, capable of seeing the metaphysical threads that connect all things to destiny. They've learned to tug, cut, and weave these strands to nudge reality in near imperceptible ways. They can only hope that the Norns for which they follow don't decide to cut their strings.


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keftiu wrote:

Part of me is hoping psychic vampires make an appearance in Book of the Dead, the way the Dhampir heritage has a little support for the concept; given that they're linked to Vudra, it would make sense that Jalmeray and Geb's proximity would lead to lots of them being around.

Maybe a Jalmeri vampire psychic, acting as an emissary between the two?

Vampire is such a cool archetype for psychic! I can't seperate the two now!


WWHsmackdown wrote:
keftiu wrote:

Part of me is hoping psychic vampires make an appearance in Book of the Dead, the way the Dhampir heritage has a little support for the concept; given that they're linked to Vudra, it would make sense that Jalmeray and Geb's proximity would lead to lots of them being around.

Maybe a Jalmeri vampire psychic, acting as an emissary between the two?

Vampire is such a cool archetype for psychic! I can't seperate the two now!

Part of me is hoping for more Mesmerist-style stuff for the Psychic, beyond the one Feat in the playtest, for exactly this reason!


I am making a witch.

My players will encounter Rovalda, an 11th-level duergar psychic, in Siege of Stone in our next game session Friday. This is in the Pathfinder 1st Edition Ironfang Invasion adventure path, which I an converting to Pathfinder 2nd Edition. Alas, without Dark Archives available, I had to chose between converting her to a playtest psychic or another occult spellcasting class. I chose witch.

Bad timing cost me an opportunity to play with Dark Archives. Though I chose witch partly for the opportunity to play with a class I have not used yet.


Mathmuse wrote:

I am making a witch.

My players will encounter Rovalda, an 11th-level duergar psychic, in Siege of Stone in our next game session Friday. This is in the Pathfinder 1st Edition Ironfang Invasion adventure path, which I an converting to Pathfinder 2nd Edition. Alas, without Dark Archives available, I had to chose between converting her to a playtest psychic or another occult spellcasting class. I chose witch.

Bad timing cost me an opportunity to play with Dark Archives. Though I chose witch partly for the opportunity to play with a class I have not used yet.

You're having them fight a Player Character in 2e?

Grand Lodge

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A half-elf musical prodigy psychic (emotional acceptance/distant grasp) from Kyonin who sought to shine among the elves of their homeland in musical prowess despite their short lifespan, who after years of pouring their heart into every song, now moves more than just people's emotions with their music.

A tiefling acrobat thaumaturge (weapon implement, taking staff acrobat dedication) whose elven branched spear was passed down by the former ringmaster of the circus they grew up in. They see the idea of thaumaturgy, using forgotten items with interesting stories to fantastic ends, as a natural extension of a circus, where the extraordinary is the result of outcasts given freedom.

A thaumaturge (chalice implement, ancestry and background TBD, taking poisoner dedication) whose chalice was stolen from a serpentfolk enclave, and while it is most easily used to nourish life after being cleansed, they speak incantations of old every morning, filling vials with the resultant poison to prevent the implement from fell deeds.

A gnome raised by belief thaumaturge (follower of Nivi Rhombodazzle with an amulet implement) who swears up-and-down by their lucky coin, a strange n-dimensional object that has three faces despite looking like it should only have two.

A very kindly, motherly goblin thaumaturge (chalice implement, taking a TBD dedication, likely beastmaster or summoner) whose personal distaste for romance and a simple misunderstanding led to her going on a grand quest to adopt a goblin child, only to learn that that's not actually what a goblet is after taking the weird magic cup she found home in confusion.

I'm sure I'll make more fun things after we know more, but we'll see.


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I had a character concept lying around for awhile that's basically an angelic archivist that was stuffed into a construct body thousands of years ago, who, after a calamity went inactive and then reawakened with a large amount of their memory of their creation and creators damaged, and their quest is to unearth relics of said civilization to uncover the truth of their past and purpose. Ancestry was going to be Aasimar automaton, but none of the classes that existed really meshed; wizard or investigator came close, but the former wasn't quite skilled enough and needed a lot of archetypes to work, although the arcane bond as a relic they had felt cool, as did the overall scholar feel, but while I wanted to have a magical feel, I didn't necessarily want to be a mage, and Investigator had the skills and could be refluffed, but didnt feel supernatural enough.

Enter the thaumaturge. I can get a cache of scrolls for some magic, forge connection has a magical feel (I was going to skin it as using a combination of using small relics and long lost angelic power to rewrite the target's existance to include and exploitable flaw), a recall.knowledge on all subjects skill, implents to represent peticularly powerful relics, and assuming Wonder Maker made it in, I can pretend it's a janky Miracle


I have no idea what class they'd be, but I am now thinking of a character who takes lots of the monster-like feats that were mentioned in the retrospective on the playtest to model someone who is slowly replacing parts of themselves with monstrous grafts.

It was something I always wanted to do in 1E with the demonic implants, clockwork prosthetics, cybernetics, necrografts, and elemental infusion grafts, but it was always too gold-intensive to realize.


keftiu wrote:
Mathmuse wrote:

I am making a witch.

My players will encounter Rovalda, an 11th-level duergar psychic, in Siege of Stone in our next game session Friday. This is in the Pathfinder 1st Edition Ironfang Invasion adventure path, which I an converting to Pathfinder 2nd Edition. Alas, without Dark Archives available, I had to chose between converting her to a playtest psychic or another occult spellcasting class. I chose witch.

Bad timing cost me an opportunity to play with Dark Archives. Though I chose witch partly for the opportunity to play with a class I have not used yet.

You're having them fight a Player Character in 2e?

Rovalda is an NPC. However, I am the GM and highly individualized NPCs are the closest I get to playing a PC.

The party is currently traveling with two NPC allies built under PC rules, because the PC rules work best for recurring characters that associate with the party as equals. The NPC builds are best for characters that serve only a single role, such as an enemy fought in a single encounter.

Rovalda has three roles in her intended encounter, so I will start with a sketch of a PC build and then simplify it with the NPC creature creation rules. Thus, she will start as a witch and then become a simpler Duergar Socialite with occult spellcasting and a familiar.

If I kept her as a psychic, she would have Emotional Acceptance as her Subconscious MInd. But for Conscious Mind, Distant Grasp is too physical for a pampered socialite, Infinite Eye could solve the problem for which she wants to hire the party, and Silent Whisper could have prevented the trouble that led to the problem. The three playtest options don't fit. The psychic abilities of the PF1 version are mostly battlefield control to support her guards in combat.

Hm, maybe I could get Distant Grasp to work thematically for Rovalda if I drop Telekinetic Projectile and Telekinetic Rend.


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How about a swordmaster thaumaturge. Weapon implement. An old relic longsword from an age of heavy conflict. The blade has experienced more loss than success in battle. Some would think the rusty blade is cursed but you know how to evoke the history of it's past wielders. Your esoterica is remnants of wars. Particularly, failed ones. You take the lessons of failure and apply techniques of the fallen that wished they could have done differently. If they only used this move, if they only struck their foes weakness at the right time...
You take those feelings and connections and follow them to their conclusion, and finish fights properly.


I like the idea of your esoteric antithesis manifesting in almost entirely non magical ways. It looks like you're just using strange and specific techniques with your blade, but the way the blade shifts and changes its weathering gives it away. It could look like you're even possessed by it.

Dark Archive

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Having played a Thaumaturge all the way to 20th, from experience the Lantern implement really dropped off hard in usefulness once the game got beyond 10th.

Naturally this is only from the playtest material, so the release might spice it up, but I ended up asking our GM if I could swap it out for the chalice instead.


I'd like to play a time oracle, but I don't feel at ease because of the missing spells from the divine tradition:

- Time Jump
- Blink Charge
- Unexpected Shift
- Cast Into Time
- Time Beacon

and so on.

Didn't check if there's a deity which has almost all of them, but point is that the more the books come out, the more the time related spells ( more uses of the feat to steal spells from a specific deity ).

Something like "you are able to use transmutation/conjuration/teleportation spells the arcane tradition" or similar could do the trick, maybe.


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HumbleGamer wrote:

I'd like to play a time oracle, but I don't feel at ease because of the missing spells from the divine tradition:

- Time Jump
- Blink Charge
- Unexpected Shift
- Cast Into Time
- Time Beacon

and so on.

Didn't check if there's a deity which has almost all of them, but point is that the more the books come out, the more the time related spells ( more uses of the feat to steal spells from a specific deity ).

Something like "you are able to use transmutation/conjuration/teleportation spells the arcane tradition" or similar could do the trick, maybe.

Just pick a deity of time that hasn't been released yet. I'm sure they won't even notice. If you're a real time oracle, it should be easy.


Playing a chronomancer does sound fun though. The time traveler background would fit quite well if you can get access to it.

Paizo Employee Designer

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1. An absentminded tinker who doesn't realize she gets her ideas for new inventions from the dreams of those around her. She’s compelled to build... something...
2. A sacrifice sealed in a tomb ages ago with a demon to hold it at bay, until recently excavated during a routine archaeological dig. The two had come to an uneasy understanding during their long imprisonment, but how long will it last now that they are free?
3. A wanted thief and illusionist, who unbeknownst to authorities, is actually a well-coordinated team of two identical brothers who are never seen at the same time (with another player as the other brother).


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James Case wrote:

1. An absentminded tinker who doesn't realize she gets her ideas for new inventions from the dreams of those around her. She’s compelled to build... something...

2. A sacrifice sealed in a tomb ages ago with a demon to hold it at bay, until recently excavated during a routine archaeological dig. The two had come to an uneasy understanding during their long imprisonment, but how long will it last now that they are free?
3. A wanted thief and illusionist, who unbeknownst to authorities, is actually a well-coordinated team of two identical brothers who are never seen at the same time (with another player as the other brother).

#2 has me sitting up very straight, if it's implying what I think it is - and I love the character, too!

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