Pathfinder Roleplaying Game: Ultimate Intrigue (PFRPG)

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Pathfinder Roleplaying Game: Ultimate Intrigue (PFRPG)
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Words Cut Deep

In the right setting, a single scathing word can prove deadlier than a poisoned dagger. Behind the scenes of heroic battles and magical realms lies a seething underbelly of danger and deception. This world of intrigue holds endless possibilities for adventure, as heroes duel with words instead of steel, plot daring heists, and engage in battles of wills against relentless nemeses. A high-stakes game of shadows and secrets is yours to master—if you have the wits!

Whether the heroes are taming the blood-soaked back alleys of their favorite metropolis or jockeying for the queen's favor alongside highborn nobles, Pathfinder RPG Ultimate Intrigue is an invaluable companion to the Pathfinder RPG Core Rulebook. This imaginative tabletop game builds upon more than 10 years of system development and an Open Playtest featuring more than 50,000 gamers to create a cutting-edge RPG experience that brings the all-time best-selling set of fantasy rules into a new era.

Pathfinder RPG Ultimate Intrigue includes:

  • The vigilante, a new character class that lives two lives—that of an unassuming member of the community, and a cloaked crusader with his own agenda!
  • New archetypes for alchemists, bards, druids, hunters, inquisitors, investigators, mesmerists, rangers, rogues, slayers, spiritualists, and more!
  • New feats and magic items for characters of all sorts, granting mastery of street-smart combat, impenetrable disguises, and misdirection.
  • Dozens of spells to manipulate tense social settings, whether to reveal adversaries' secrets or hide the truth.
  • A complete system of influence, providing new goals and rewards to challenge players and link their fortunes to nonplayer characters and organizations.
  • Systems and advice to help Game Masters introduce a variety of new encounters into their games­—daring heists, extended pursuits, and tense searches for buried secrets.
  • Rules for social combat and verbal duels, allowing characters to use words as weapons to sway hearts and humiliate foes.
  • ... and much, much more!

ISBN-13: 978-1-60125-826-7

Other Resources: This product is also available on the following platforms:

Hero Lab Online
Fantasy Grounds Virtual Tabletop
Archives of Nethys

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A Must-Have for Heavy RP Games

5/5

Okay, let's get into Ultimate Intrigue! As the title implies, the purpose of this book is to help flesh out more subtle elements of the game: things like spreading rumors, rallying a crowd, stealing secrets, and other classic cloak-and-dagger stuff. I've used bits and pieces of it in previous campaigns, but read through it carefully (and incorporated a fair bit of it) for my current Curse of the Crimson Throne campaign, as that adventure path is designed around urban political strife. Boiled down to brass tacks, the book is a 256 page hardcover comprised of six chapters. The full-colour artwork is very strong throughout, and the cover is great (though Merisiel's legs are like three times longer than her torso!). There's a very short two-page introduction that summarises each chapter--which is what I'm going to do anyway.

Chapter 1 is "Classes" (60 pages). The big deal here is a new base case, the Vigilante. The concept is that the character has both a normal (social) identity and a masked identity, with certain class options only working while in the associated guise. There are also several safeguards to help keep anyone from figuring out that Bruce Wayne is really Batman. I have a Vigilante character in Pathfinder Society, and one of my players runs one in Curse of the Crimson Throne. I think the class is perfect for an urban campaign mostly set in a single city (especially with lots room for intrigue), but it doesn't work as well with the more traditional "travelling adventuring party" campaign. It's a bit too obvious when five newcomers arrive in town, only for one of them to "disappear" and a new costumed avenger show up. I know there are also some gamers who dislike what can seem like the awkward introduction of comic book super heroes into their fantasy role-playing. For me, I think the concept works well--though as I said, only in particular types of campaigns.

A large chunk of the chapter is devoted to new archetypes for other classes. More specifically, alchemists, bards, cavaliers, druids, inquisitors, investigators, mesmerists, rangers, rogues, skalds, spiritualists, swashbucklers, and vigilantes get some love. Frankly, a lot of the archetypes are fairly forgettable, but there are exceptions--for example, a Daring General Cavalier would be great in military campaigns, the Dandy Ranger could be really useful in an urban campaign, and a couple of the vigilante archetypes are perfect if you want to play the Hulk or Spider-Man. Although the rogue archetypes aren't very good, there are several excellent rogue talents that focus on making the character harder to track through divination, etc. It's worth nothing that this book came out during the period when the hardcover line was still setting-neutral, so there won't be any Golarion-specific flavour with the archetypes (for better or worse depending on your preferences).

Chapter 2 is "Feats" (24 pages). There's something like 110 new feats in the chapter, and probably something for everyone. Given the book's theme, many of the feats are related to sneaking around, hiding and disguising spells, stealing stuff, making plans, figuring out when you're being to lied to, etc. A few that I particularly like include Brilliant Planner (giving you the chance to have just what you need just when you need it), Call Truce (giving a slim chance to actually end combat peacefully when its underway), and Drunkard's Recovery (silly but fun). A couple of important feats are Conceal Spell (which hides the pesky manifestations that spells create in Pathfinder) and Fencing Grace (adding Dex to damage with rapiers, a favourite of swashbucklers everywhere). Overall, I thought the options presented were well-written and plausible in terms of desirability.

Chapter 3 is "Mastering Intrigue" (68 pages). This is probably the most important chapter in the book for GMs. It offers tons of useful advice, as well as clarification on some tricky game mechanics, to help run intrigue-based games. The pages about how common magic spells can be handled while still preserving mysteries, secrets, and misdirection is pure gold. The chapter also introduces seven new rules sub-systems, any or all of which can be incorporated into a campaign to flesh out certain aspects of gameplay. "Influence" is a sub-system that deepens the process of persuading a person or organisation to support you. Instead of a simple single Dipomacy check, PCs need to make certain skill checks to learn a person's interests and weaknesses, and then other skill checks to take advantage of what they've learned. The process operates through multiple phases of tracked successes and failures, and can be tied to mechanical favours and benefits. It's become a very popular facet of many Pathfinder Society scenarios, and I think it's a pretty clever way to handle things--though it can be a bit clunky at first. "Heists" is a sub-system that contains some excellent advice to GMs on how to structure things so players don't obsess over unimportant trivia and are willing to violate that old canard of "don't split the party." "Infiltration" contains some quick advice, but that's about it. "Leadership" deepens the feat of the same name, adding lots of rules for interacting with other sub-systems both in this book and in Ultimate Campaign. I'm personally still not persuaded that the Leadership feat chain is a good inclusion to the game. "Nemeses" is all about adding a recurring villain; I think it's trying to systematise something that could be handled just fine without it. Though there are some fun suggestions on evil plots to foil. "Pursuit" is a little like the Chase sub-system from the GameMastery Guide but stretched out over hours and days cross-country instead of in minutes through alleyways. I could imagine using it. "Research" is probably my favourite of the sub-systems, and one I've used in multiple campaigns. In essence, it gives the PCs a reason to use things like libraries and archives by giving them bonuses to their Knowledge checks, but then makes gaining different thresholds of information the result of multiple successful checks. Overall, a great chapter--I wish the Influence and Research sub-systems had been in the Core Rulebook, because they really add a lot to the non-combat aspects of the game.

Chapter 4 is "Social Combat" (25 pages). The idea here is to present GMs with options on how to handle social conflicts--things like debates, trials, cutting repartee, etc. There's also a "verbal duels" sub-system. I'm just not sure about it--it's something I'd have to see in practice. However, a really useful part of the chapter is advice to the GM on how to handle the various social skills in the game--Bluff, Diplomacy, Intimidate, and Sense Motive--as well as the intrigue skills like Disguise, Perception, and Stealth. The advice here is excellent, and I just stopped in the middle of this review to reread it.

Chapter 5 is "Spells" (40 pages). You can judge from the length of the chapter that there's a ton of new spells, and every spellcasting class will find something. One of the fun things the chapter introduces is a new "ruse" descriptor for spells, which means the spell is easily mistaken for another even by observers trained in Spellcraft or Knowledge (arcana). It's a good way to mislead folks who have played way too much Pathfinder. There are some really clever spells in this section, with a couple of my favourites including false resurrection (instead of bringing back a soul, you stuff a demon into the body!) and the hilarious shamefully overdressed.

Chapter 6 is "Gear and Magic Items" (22 pages). There are some new mundane pieces of equipment (weapons like the cool wrist dart launcher, alchemical items, etc.) but most of the chapter is new magic items with an intrigue theme. The one that really stuck out at me was the launcher of distraction, which is perfect for assassination attempts because it makes it seem like the attack is coming from somewhere else.

Overall, I think Ultimate Intrigue is an excellent book. It's pretty much a must-have in my opinion for any campaign that's going to involve a lot of role-playing or that moves beyond traditional dungeon crawling and wilderness encounters. Even readers not involved in "intrigue campaigns" per se are sure to find plenty of material they can use.


1/5

Don't get me wrong I love Paizo books, I love their work, and I'm proud to own almost all of their publications.

However, Ultimate Intrigue is the one book I regret buying. It's even more than that, it's the one book i regret they ever published.

We need rules and systems, ok. We need a magic system because magic isn't a real thing. We need a combat system otherwise playing with your grilfriend become home abuse. But we don't need a social system because it's a ROLEPLAYING game. Either you want intrigue heavy campaign and you roleplay them, or you want to dungeon crawl or investigate (that's fine too) and you don't play intrigues. You can even do both and it's great.

Aside from that massive problem, the book suffers from "a turn normal actions into feats/class ability" syndrome. I can't count the number of time where players made me fighters to wizards or rogues with a dual identity. We didn't need the Vigilante, and still don't. And I loved when wizard use to get clever and ask for linguistics/bluff roll to blend a spell into a phrase. Now you need a feat for it. Thanks, Ultimate Intrigue. If that was not enough, some of these nonsense feat are built in feat tax chains.

But the one thing I hate the most about this book is the stupid FAQ it bestowed upon us to promote itself (https://paizo.com/paizo/faq/v5748nruor1fm#v5748eaic9tza). That makes a whole school of magic (illusion) utterly useless, and destroys a lot of others (enchantment).

Now I know I can just refuse to use it. But i use to love pathfinder for the clarity and perfect sense with out need to houserule much.

Now it's gone.


I'm tired of paizo trying to stuff this book down our face

1/5

If I was playing a home campaign this book might be more fitting,

For society play this verbal debate and other ideas for this book really bog down the game play. I like social aspect of games and role playing but as I said society play it slows the game way down to try and get people up to snuff on the mechanics


An amazing new class in a hit and miss supplement

4/5

So, Ultimate Intrigue took a long time for me to come to a complete opinion on.

The Vigilante class introduced in this book is, in my opinion, easily the best non-spellcasting class Paizo has ever created. It breaks up its social options and combat options in such a way that you have a great character able to participate in all areas of the game without having to choose whether you want to be competent in combat or in the myriad other facets of the game like exploration, social encounters, etc. It has deep and well-designed talents that allow you to pick any of a variety of different ways to participate in combat, with or without weapons, and numerous tools for allowing players to influence the story with safe houses, contacts, and more.

At PAX Prime 2016 I had the opportunity to visit Paizo's Pathfinder demo area and play their pregenerated vigilante character. I honestly didn't expect it to go terribly well; after all, the vigilante is a class built around balancing two identities and moving between different social strata, so you'd think that this would require a more controlled environment where you know the other players in advance and have time to plan out how your character fits into the game world with your GM ahead of time, right? Turns out, I was wrong. The vigilante class is well-crafted enough that even while playing a 1st level pregen I was able to easily deal with situations in and out of combat, and it took me about 60 seconds of conversation to establish with the group that I had a secret identity they were privy to and might need them to cover for my character from time to time if he needed to swap identities. It didn't hurt matters that the only downside to anyone learning a vigilante's secret identity is that, well, they know his or her secret identity. You can go all Tony Stark if you want, announce that you are Iron Man, and carry on as normal. Very few of the vigilante's abilities actually require you to maintain truly secret identities, and the only real hit you take is that you're a bit easier to find by magical means (though even this can be addressed with clever use of the Safe House Social Talent).

The book also elaborates on the intent behind numerous spells that often prove problematic for GMs in games where they want to have a focus on gritty investigation of mystery, such as the various detect spells, speak with dead, etc.

I think my biggest disappointments with the book, and the reason I can't give it 5 stars, lie in the feats and archetypes. I'll start with the feats, and a bit about why I see most of them as representative of missed opportunities.

To start with, Pathfinder's skill system is heavily dated. When Paizo brought it over from 3.5, they combined a few extraneous skills, but otherwise did little to update things, meaning the core area of the rules covering everything in the game that isn't casting spells or hitting things is now well over a decade old and out of date. Several skills don't even actually work, or work well, as written, have interactions you're just supposed to kind of assume or make up (Ride and Handle Animal are a mess, Stealth requires one to check out FAQs and blog posts online to use as intended, Bluff and Diplomacy have more than a few vague areas and inconsistencies, etc.), so what better book to address, update, and expand these core components of the game than a book about playing skill and intrigue heavy campaigns? Unfortunately, Paizo chose not to go that route, instead relying on feats to stretch skills over their gaps and issues, leading to many of the feats in the this book providing skill uses that I've seen GMs at hundreds of tables houserule as basic functions of those skills to begin with. Instead of formalizing intuitive uses of existing skills into their basic function, they added a feat tax to allow characters to do things many people already thought they could do. While there is a section in the book going over several of the vague areas in a few key skills, these are primarily common sense clarifications instead of the full address the skills could have used.

The archetypes, like many Paizo hardcovers, are all over the place. Some of them are interesting and dynamic, like the Masked Performer bard archetype, some show an attempt at embodying a cool and modern concept but fail to achieve that concept in the actual execution, like the Magical Child vigilante archetype, and some are just plain bad, so obviously terribly designed that you almost wonder if the person who wrote them has ever actually played Pathfinder, like the Brute vigilante archetype.

Now, don't let the above wall of negativity mislead you; there is a lot of great stuff in this book, including perhaps the most inspired and well-crafted class Paizo has ever produced, a class that introduces really interesting design concepts, plays with components of the class chassis we haven't seen classes treat as quite so malleable before, and is a genuinely fun and interesting class to play in and of itself. Despite many of the feats ranging from useless to frustrating, there are still quite a few that are interesting and viable, and while the archetypes are very hit or miss, that's generally true of Paizo books in general and probably shouldn't be held against this one in particular.

My final verdict on Ultimate Intrigue is 4 stars, and a strong recommendation to pick it up, if for no other reason than to add the Vigilante class to your game (though there definitely are other reasons to add this book to your collection).


Pathfinder presents Batman!

4/5

No seriously. The vigilante class is freaking batman. Look at the art for chapter one and for the character. HE'S BATMAN. Of course they also have archetypes if you want to make Hulk, Sailor Moon, even He-Man. With the archetypes from other books the list goes on.
My favorite part, and I cannot wait to test this properly in a game, is the social combat. It works a lot like playing craps or roulette. You get a pool of Determination points which you use to place a bet then you roll off with your social skills check! Seriously it sounds like lots of fun!


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Axial wrote:

Besides being LE, what does the Tyrant do?

And what are the rules for having a nemesis?

Spoiler:

They're shtick is manipulation. They get Diplomacy as a class skill. Their fiendish servant must also be LE.

Maybe I'm missing something, but there doesn't seem to be much more than that.

-Skeld

Dark Archive

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On the Kineticist utilities

Kineticist:

For Earthmeld, it lets you use burn to turn duration to 'until you recover burn' and it lets you use it on willing targets that aren't the user. I actually see a fair bit of stealth use (and store-in-danger-target-for-safety use) from it on some builds.


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Pathfinder Companion, Maps, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Maps, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber

I think UR is a reference to Ultimate Relationships from Legendary Games.


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KaveDweller1349 wrote:
The Courtly Knight sounds interesting, could you give me information on its abilities?

Spoiler:

They gain a bonus to social skills and some advantage to social combat, plus an extra Diplomacy ability. And they have a Grand Boast ability, which is a special use of Challenge.

-Skeld

Dark Archive

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On the Tyrant

Tyrant:
I'm *glad* there isn't much to it. I've wanted Paladins in the other two corner alignments, and a fairly-straight port of the Antipaladin to LE makes for a good baseline that other stuff is more likely to be able to build off of.


My phone, laptop, and tablet refuse to download the pdf for this book. -_-


Hey, does the warlock still have Arcanist-likke spellcasting?
*crosses fingers for luck*

Dark Archive

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On Warlock Casting

Warlock:
Casts as a Magus but uses the Sorcerer/Wizard list up to 6th Level.


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Cruel Illusion wrote:

Hey, does the warlock still have Arcanist-likke spellcasting?

*crosses fingers for luck*

Spoiler:

No; casts as a Magus.

-Skeld


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The NPC wrote:
Skeld, PDF Prophet wrote:
Hrothdane wrote:
Skeld, PDF Prophet wrote:
Hrothdane wrote:

Which stats do the Magical Child use?

How does their henshin transformation sequence work?

** spoiler omitted **

-Skeld

Ah, so charisma for casting then, it sounds like?

How long does the transformation sequence take?

** spoiler omitted **

-Skeld

So the same amount of time as Princess Tutu. I can dig it.

I might agree with you if I had any idea what you were talking about. the whole magical girl / magical child thing is lost on me.

-Skeld


What abilities does the fey eidolon get?

Does the magical child get anything other then the familiar, transformation, and summoner spells?

What is the fey caller like?


:o
Nooooo! Why dear heavens, why?


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Dragon78 wrote:

What abilities does the fey eidolon get?

Does the magical child get anything other then the familiar, transformation, and summoner spells?

What is the fey caller like?

Spoiler:

Counts as fey; woodland stride, choice of some spell-like abilities at various levels, DR5/cold iron (upgrading to DR10), flight, among other things.

Magical Child also gets more skill ranks.

Fey Caller gets some extra skills and can cast summon nature's ally instead of summon monster.

-Skeld

Dark Archive

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On the Magical Child

Magical Child:
Can cast arcane spells in light armor without spell failure chance.

The familiar also gets some assorted upgrades.

That's mostly it, though.

(As a general aside, I think it's generally awesome that we have an official Magical Girl class in the game. I've been pondering running a Madoka campaign for a while.)

Grand Lodge

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Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
Cruel Illusion wrote:

:o

Nooooo! Why dear heavens, why?

Because reasons.

-Skeld


Dragon78 wrote:

What abilities does the fey eidolon get?

Does the magical child get anything other then the familiar, transformation, and summoner spells?

What is the fey caller like?

I just realized that the Summoner spell list is more than light on blasts and other evocations which are what Magical girls and affiliated are known for, magic wise. So, do they get some other feature to correct this?


What kind of upgrades for the familiar?


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Cruel Illusion wrote:
Dragon78 wrote:

What abilities does the fey eidolon get?

Does the magical child get anything other then the familiar, transformation, and summoner spells?

What is the fey caller like?

I just realized that the Summoner spell list is more than light on blasts and other evocations which are what Magical girls and affiliated are known for, magic wise. So, do they get some other feature to correct this?

No blasters! No blasters!

-Skeld


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Actually many magical girls get a blast they can use all day like a kineticist. They also tend to get elemental or healing/curative powers or at least an ability to purity/dispel evil.


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Skeld wrote:
Cruel Illusion wrote:

:o

Nooooo! Why dear heavens, why?

Because reasons.

-Skeld

This is obviously the result of an evil vancian conspiracy led by Iuconu the Laughing Magician.

Dark Archive

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Magical Child Familiar

Familiar:

Upgrade to Improved Familiar, re-choose form a couple times when new Improved Familiar options open
Change Shape into four different forms
DR/Magic equal to Magical Child's level
Replaceable body for easier resurrection
Startling Appearance / Frightening Appearance / Stunning Appearance, using either its CHA mod or the Magical Child's
Vengeance Strike


Dragon78 wrote:
Actually many magical girls get a blast they can use all day like a kineticist. They also tend to get elemental or healing/curative powers or at least an ability to purity/dispel evil.

This.

Grand Lodge

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Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
Dragon78 wrote:
Actually many magical girls get a blast they can use all day like a kineticist. They also tend to get elemental or healing/curative powers or at least an ability to purity/dispel evil.

Just as a guess, I'd say all that added together would be too many goodies for a single class or archetype.

-Skeld

Designer

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Dragon78 wrote:
Actually many magical girls get a blast they can use all day like a kineticist. They also tend to get elemental or healing/curative powers or at least an ability to purity/dispel evil.

Yep, and you can cover that with the blasty thing with warlock, so between Chosen One from Familiar Folio, warlock, and magical child, you can cover a huge swath of possibilities for a magical girl.


Personally a magical archetype would have made more sense for the kineticist. After all most magical girls have a limited selection of powers but were mostly at will and they tended to have a theme or elemental focus.


Mark Seifter wrote:
Dragon78 wrote:
Actually many magical girls get a blast they can use all day like a kineticist. They also tend to get elemental or healing/curative powers or at least an ability to purity/dispel evil.
Yep, and you can cover that with the blasty thing with warlock, so between Chosen One from Familiar Folio, warlock, and magical child, you can cover a huge swath of possibilities for a magical girl.

I don't suppose Magical Child and Warlock are compatible? Or that Magical Children can get Mystic Bolts?

Contributor

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Ross Byers wrote:
Aura of the unremarkable is going to be fun.

Its so good at what it does that you didn't even know that it was originally printed in Cheliax, Empire of Devils. :-P

Dark Archive

Alas, they are not compatible. They both replace a lot of the same stuff, mostly with the casting.

I see no inherent way to give them magic bolts, but I'm betting something could probably be pulled using Samsaran ancestral casting or something else to import blast spells onto their list.


Skeld, PDF Prophet wrote:
jedi8187 wrote:
Can someone give details on the Zealot? Are there still the Celestial/Fey/Infernal/Abyssal sub specializations? What do they give up for spell casting?

** spoiler omitted **

-Skeld

Thank yous. Just to be clear is it just inquisitions, or can they take domains instead?


jedi8187 wrote:
Skeld, PDF Prophet wrote:
jedi8187 wrote:
Can someone give details on the Zealot? Are there still the Celestial/Fey/Infernal/Abyssal sub specializations? What do they give up for spell casting?

** spoiler omitted **

-Skeld

Thank yous. Just to be clear is it just inquisitions, or can they take domains instead?

Spoiler:

No mention of domains.

-Skeld


Skeld wrote:
Dragon78 wrote:
Actually many magical girls get a blast they can use all day like a kineticist. They also tend to get elemental or healing/curative powers or at least an ability to purity/dispel evil.

Just as a guess, I'd say all that added together would be too many goodies for a single class or archetype.

-Skeld

As Mark pointed earlier, the Warlock can probably do all of this.

Mystic Bolt for Blasting, Celestial/Infernal Healing for healing, Dispel Magic and Protection from Evil to purify. They can even get familiars.
Frankly they're closer to Magical Girls than Magical Children, since I don't think I've ever seen a Magical Girl who didn't blast things, while some don't have familiars.


Damn so you can't have a transformation sequence and do blasting.


Are any of the cavalier archetypes mountless?


Well that's a problem. Inquisitions are tied to god's and my Zealot is a worshiper of Milani, don't think I saw her listed on any domains when I looked.

Hey Mark, can Zealots take domains? WHat if worshiping something that doesn't have inquisitions?


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Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Maps, Rulebook Subscriber; Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber

This book is extremely exciting. Going through the PDF now that my hardcover has shipped. It makes me eager to run Hell's Rebels even more!


jedi8187 wrote:
WHat if worshiping something that doesn't have inquisitions?

Take an inquisition that isn't tied to a god?

Designer

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SilentInfinity wrote:
This book is extremely exciting. Going through the PDF now that my hardcover has shipped. It makes me eager to run Hell's Rebels even more!

Awesome! There's a lot of great stuff in there for your Hell's Rebels game.

Dark Archive

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Cavalier Archetypes

Cavalier:
None are mountless.

One gets three full-BAB-class cohorts at level-4, though, and gives them minor special abilities.

Edit:

Just Caught Something:
The one with the multiple cohorts optionally gets an ability that lets one of the cohorts take the mount instead of the main cavalier.

RPG Superstar 2008 Top 32

Mythraine wrote:
ErisAcolyte-Chaos jester wrote:
Ross Byers wrote:
Aura of the unremarkable is going to be fun.
Oh do give me an idea of what it does.

Possibly a reprint/update of this:

LINK

Looks like. That doesn't mean it won't be fun.


So the magical child doesn't need a special item to transform?

Dark Archive

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Am I missing something on the Metamorph? I like what I've seen of the book in general, and shapeshifting-alchemist is something I've wanted, but I feel like it's giving up *way* too much for rather-limited shapeshifting.

Dark Archive

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The Magical Child doesn't need an item to transform, no. The one in the picture has a weird/nifty dagger-wand thing with glowy balls on it, though.


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I'm done for the evening.

-Skeld

Designer

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Lord Gadigan wrote:
Am I missing something on the Metamorph? I like what I've seen of the book in general, and shapeshifting-alchemist is something I've wanted, but I feel like it's giving up *way* too much for rather-limited shapeshifting.

Try mocking up some battle builds, remembering to stack up the alchemical and size bonuses from mutagen and the morph (take discoveries that synergize). It's a paradigm shift that also caught me off-guard at first when I saw the archetype, since my long-running alchemist in Curse of the Crimson Throne is focused on the exact things the archetype loses, but it makes a pretty solid martial shapeshifter.


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Skeld, PDF Prophet wrote:

I'm done for the evening.

-Skeld

Thanks for your efforts!


Milo v3 wrote:
jedi8187 wrote:
WHat if worshiping something that doesn't have inquisitions?
Take an inquisition that isn't tied to a god?

I guess. But that's like 4, two of witch convert your social skills to wisdom (which unless it changed from the playtest is actually a bad thing for the charisma casting vigilante), 1 of which (redemption) has a highly situational cap ability (at least it's other abilities are alright), and just in general not fitting my character.

Someone with the book do Zealot Vigilante's cast of charisma still? If not reformation/conversion is pretty good for my character. If not I guess I can make redemption work.

Dark Archive

Mark -> Thanks. Will do.

Zealot:
Casts as Inquisitor now, no mention of Charisma.

Designer

Lord Gadigan wrote:

Mark -> Thanks. Will do.

** spoiler omitted **

Not a problem! It's pretty non-obvious, which is why I was actually pretty impressed that Imbicatus saw it immediately and also why I didn't preview the archetype in the preview blog.


Lord Gadigan wrote:

Mark -> Thanks. Will do.

** spoiler omitted **

Thank you, in that case I assume wisdom then.

That is going to be a bit of a rebuild on my character. I guess he can still be the charming playboy just using wisdom instead.

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