The Cleric Remastered

Well, a Dwarf Champion of Torag with Emblazon Armament, Shield Ally, and Dwarven Reinforcement will have upwards of 4-6 more Hardness on a given shield, at the cost of a class specialization, 2 class feats, an ancestry feat from a specific ancestry, and Expert to Legendary in Crafting.

Dwarven Reinforcement doesn't work on shields as they are not "thick objects". I'm pretty sure this has been clarified by a Designer years ago.

EDIT: Found it. It was Mark Seifter on reddit.

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With no need for Charisma, max Wisdom Warpriests will be the new baseline in most cases. That makes the class have a pretty good power baseline on 80% of all levels, when you look at its proficiency progression.

1-4: Full martial AND caster proficiency.
5-6: Full caster proficiency.
7-10: Full martial proficiency.
11-12: Full martial AND caster proficiency.
13-14: Full caster proficiency.
15-18: The only "gap" with no full proficiency. Master Fort saves are nice, though. And you're still an 8th level caster by that point. Plenty of power to be found here.
19-10: Full marital proficiency.

So I think the trick for playing warpriest is adjusting your playstyle depending on your current proficiency situation. You still lack max strength/dex and greater weapon specialization so you will lag behind the martials, but you also got lots of powerful spells, including various buffs. Emblazon Symbol/Energy and Align Armament (preferably Extended) should keep your damage per Strike roughly on par with a fighter - although you do lack his chance to hit and crit of course, as it should be.

Darksol the Painbringer wrote:

Well, a Dwarf Champion of Torag with Emblazon Armament, Shield Ally, and Dwarven Reinforcement will have upwards of 4-6 more Hardness on a given shield, at the cost of a class specialization, 2 class feats, an ancestry feat from a specific ancestry, and Expert to Legendary in Crafting.

Dwarven Reinforcement doesn't work on shields as they are not "thick objects". I'm pretty sure this has been clarified by a Designer years ago.

EDIT: Found it. It was Mark Seifter on reddit.

-----------------------------------

With no need for Charisma, max Wisdom Warpriests will be the new baseline in most cases. That makes the class have a pretty good power baseline on 80% of all levels, when you look at its proficiency progression.

1-4: Full martial AND caster proficiency.
5-6: Full caster proficiency.
7-10: Full martial proficiency.
11-12: Full martial AND caster proficiency.
13-14: Full caster proficiency.
15-18: The only "gap" with no full proficiency. Master Fort saves are nice, though. And you're still an 8th level caster by that point. Plenty of power to be found here.
19-10: Full marital proficiency.

So I think the trick for playing warpriest is adjusting your playstyle depending on your current proficiency situation. You still lack max strength/dex and greater weapon specialization so you will lag behind the martials, but you also got lots of powerful spells, including various buffs. Emblazon Symbol/Energy and Align Armament (preferably Extended) should keep your damage per Strike roughly on par with a fighter - although you do lack his chance to hit and crit of course, as it should be.

Then the feat needs errata, because it specifically references enhancing an item, of which a shield is an item, and there is nothing to suggest a Sturdy Shield, for example, shouldn't qualify for the feat outside of arbitrary balance concerns not expressed anywhere in the rulebook.

As for the whole "proficiency" thing, other classes in the game do not need to do this playstyle dancing around based on their proficiency, why does the Warpriest have to be this class and not, say, a Swashbuckler?

No, the feat says it enhances "thick objects and structures". A shield is not a thick item, but a thin one, as per the material statistics table.

Could it be more explicite? Absolutely. But it does what it say in RAW and shields are not included.

As for the whole "proficiency" thing, other classes in the game do not need to do this playstyle dancing around based on their proficiency, why does the Warpriest have to be this class and not, say, a Swashbuckler?

Because the Warpriest is a caster/martial-hybrid (sub)class and being equal to both casters and martials all the time would be too much, I guess?

It's similar to how a wild druid has to decide between casting spells or using wildshape in combat. For the warpriest it's a bit more of a strategic decision compared to the relatively spontaneous tactical one of the druid.

The druid has more encounter-to-encounter flexibility, but the warpriest doesn't lose one of his capabilities just because he wants to use the other one. So I think it kind of balances out.

I really like that both the options previewed this time is reasonably low level.

It's much more exciting for me to see options I'm much more likely to get to play with.

No, the feat says it enhances "thick objects and structures". A shield is not a thick item, but a thin one, as per the material statistics table.

Could it be more explicite? Absolutely. But it does what it say in RAW and shields are not included.

Quote:

As for the whole "proficiency" thing, other classes in the game do not need to do this playstyle dancing around based on their proficiency, why does the Warpriest have to be this class and not, say, a Swashbuckler?

Because the Warpriest is a caster/martial-hybrid (sub)class and being equal to both casters and martials all the time would be too much, I guess?

It's similar to how a wild druid has to decide between casting spells or using wildshape in combat. For the warpriest it's a bit more of a strategic decision compared to the relatively spontaneous tactical one of the druid.

The druid has more encounter-to-encounter flexibility, but the warpriest doesn't lose one of his capabilities just because he wants to use the other one. So I think it kind of balances out.

The feat also references items to receive the hardness increase, of which a structure is not an item, hence the confusion; there are no "thick objects" clearly defined in the game, so it's ultimately table variation at-best and outright useless at-worst. And not every GM is going to come across the clarification when reading the Rulebook, so it's still poorly handled.

As for Mark saying it makes the feat too powerful for shield users, not really IMO. It blocks an additional 1-3 damage per block, which is 2-6 additional damage reduced per round for a shield-specialized character. Compared to Shield Champions who get a flat 2-4 per round, with no investment (plus double Shield HP), it is hardly overpowered. Really, when it is all stacked up, it is 6-12 damage at 15th level, which, when facing enemies who deal 50+ damage an attack at this level, it's not extremely powerful. And given that Hardness is really only a relevant mechanic for shield users and animated objects, it's already niche enough as it is; cutting half of the relevance out makes it a trap feat.

So is the Magus, but their progression is pretty mainstream, and all they had to pay for it was Wave Casting. All I'm saying is I would rather they mainstream their progression, give them a focus cantrip to Channel Smite with (while having Channel Smite at 1st level), and force them to Wave Casting like the Magus, than have their progression force them to play a certain way. We already have a class that does this mechanic better (the oracle), we don't need a second class that does it worse.

I already viewed Warpriests as pretty hekkin great, and now they're just getting all around better.

Being able to free up Charisma is fantastic. I can't decide if my Warpriest goes back into Wisdom, or bumps Int for potential offensive Wizard multiclass stuff, or shores up Con...

It would be nice if rather than the divine list just being offensively weak it had a specific role related to attacking the spirit and discriminating between the holy and unholy.

Isn't that the way the Divine list has always been though? I played a Divine blaster in Abomination Vaults, and it worked great because there were so many undead and fiends running around. Holy Cascade is just better than Fireball depending on what you're fighting. One time a boss Devil critically failed his save against Divine Wrath, and I felt so bad for the poor guy.

The Divine spell list has never been offensively weak, it just excels at a very specific niche.

Solarsyphon wrote:

It would be nice if rather than the divine list just being offensively weak it had a specific role related to attacking the spirit and discriminating between the holy and unholy.

Isn't that the way the Divine list has always been though? I played a Divine blaster in Abomination Vaults, and it worked great because there were so many undead and fiends running around. Holy Cascade is just better than Fireball depending on what you're fighting. One time a boss Devil critically failed his save against Divine Wrath, and I felt so bad for the poor guy.

The Divine spell list has never been offensively weak, it just excels at a very specific niche.

Yep, and that niche is being further improved upon here (do yourself a favor and look up Divine Immolation if you're prepared to change your underwear) while also now working more effectively on a significantly broader chunk of the bestiary with alignment disappearing.

bsmith709 wrote:

Solarsyphon wrote:

It would be nice if rather than the divine list just being offensively weak it had a specific role related to attacking the spirit and discriminating between the holy and unholy.

Isn't that the way the Divine list has always been though? I played a Divine blaster in Abomination Vaults, and it worked great because there were so many undead and fiends running around. Holy Cascade is just better than Fireball depending on what you're fighting. One time a boss Devil critically failed his save against Divine Wrath, and I felt so bad for the poor guy.

The Divine spell list has never been offensively weak, it just excels at a very specific niche.

Yep, and that niche is being further improved upon here (do yourself a favor and look up Divine Immolation if you're prepared to change your underwear) while also now working more effectively on a significantly broader chunk of the bestiary with alignment disappearing.

I remember seeing that spell before, but I couldn't find it the other day because I couldn't remember the name, so thanks. I wasn't THAT impressed until I finished reading the heightening section...+1d6 damage per level AND +1d6 persistent damage? Yikes.

So as a level 8 spell it deals 9d6 fire damage PLUS 5d6 persistent fire damage? And if they're weak to Holy (And you're sanctified) OR immune/resistant to fire, then it automatically switches to Force instead. That's pretty sweet.

bsmith709 wrote:

Solarsyphon wrote:

It would be nice if rather than the divine list just being offensively weak it had a specific role related to attacking the spirit and discriminating between the holy and unholy.

Isn't that the way the Divine list has always been though? I played a Divine blaster in Abomination Vaults, and it worked great because there were so many undead and fiends running around. Holy Cascade is just better than Fireball depending on what you're fighting. One time a boss Devil critically failed his save against Divine Wrath, and I felt so bad for the poor guy.

The Divine spell list has never been offensively weak, it just excels at a very specific niche.

Yep, and that niche is being further improved upon here (do yourself a favor and look up Divine Immolation if you're prepared to change your underwear) while also now working more effectively on a significantly broader chunk of the bestiary with alignment disappearing.

Look it up where? It’s not on AoN.

Google works. Or reddit.

Look it up where? It’s not on AoN.

It appeared on a reddit. Google " "divine immolation" pf2"

Captain Morgan wrote:

bsmith709 wrote:

Solarsyphon wrote:

It would be nice if rather than the divine list just being offensively weak it had a specific role related to attacking the spirit and discriminating between the holy and unholy.

Isn't that the way the Divine list has always been though? I played a Divine blaster in Abomination Vaults, and it worked great because there were so many undead and fiends running around. Holy Cascade is just better than Fireball depending on what you're fighting. One time a boss Devil critically failed his save against Divine Wrath, and I felt so bad for the poor guy.

The Divine spell list has never been offensively weak, it just excels at a very specific niche.

Yep, and that niche is being further improved upon here (do yourself a favor and look up Divine Immolation if you're prepared to change your underwear) while also now working more effectively on a significantly broader chunk of the bestiary with alignment disappearing.

I remember seeing that spell before, but I couldn't find it the other day because I couldn't remember the name, so thanks. I wasn't THAT impressed until I finished reading the heightening section...+1d6 damage per level AND +1d6 persistent damage? Yikes.

So as a level 8 spell it deals 9d6 fire damage PLUS 5d6 persistent fire damage? And if they're weak to Holy (And you're sanctified) OR immune/resistant to fire, then it automatically switches to Force instead. That's pretty sweet.

Yeah, counting as whichever is better between fire and spiritual is so much better than the half-assed resistance bypassing Flame Strike has always had. And persistent holy damage is incredible for firnd busting. Even outside of fiends, with the persistent damage and versatility, divine casters will finally have a good reflex option without using the misprinted Inner Radiance Torrent heightening.

Google works. Or reddit.

Thanks. Interesting spell. I wonder what critters are more likely to take spirit damage. One that's immune or resistant to fire, maybe?

Even outside of fiends, with the persistent damage and versatility, divine casters will finally have a good reflex option without using the misprinted Inner Radiance Torrent heightening.

What? Fireball isn't good enough for ye?

Oh, so you don't worship Sarenrae, huh? Well that's your problem right there.

My flame Oracle will very much appreciate divine immolation. What a great spell. Fire resistance and immunity can go screw itself lmao.

Blave wrote:

Google works. Or reddit.

Thanks. Interesting spell. I wonder what critters are more likely to take spirit damage. One that's immune or resistant to fire, maybe?

Devils are the perfect use case: immune to fire but weak to holy. I would kill to have this spell on my battle oracle right now as he's fighting mad fiends.

Man, I do NOT get the point of sacred ground. I suppose it finally gives a cleric endless healing like a champion, plant Druid, and thaumaturge with chalice but, I mean, by level 4 someone usually has continual healing anyway, and champions and plant Druids get their free healing for free. Plus, hp per level? Even at level 20, that’s like, 18 uses (3 hours)to bring the Barbarian back to full.

Most GMs I know handwave healing unless there is a time crunch.

I just don’t get it. Either your GM is super stingy about healing, in which case you are just gonna heal with medicine and maybe get a slight boost from the field (cutting resting time down from maybe 3 hrs to 2 hrs) or he hand waves healing, in which case the feat is useless. Oh, and the healer animist does say better from level 1 onward (if their ability is kept as is.).

The shield thing however looks REALY good and makes me wanna get a cleric with embalazon armorments for a shield! Damn, +2 to ac and all saves AND turns some saves into crit saves? How is that on the same as a tiny bit of out-of-combat healing?

Sacred Ground's healing is on top of whatever other healing is going on. If you're taking the time to refocus, then you're getting healing that can be done in parallel with that.

Yeah I mean it's not a super powered feat but it's cheap unlimited out of combat healing within the class, which is nice to have and always felt like kind of an odd missing piece for the class.

Man, I do NOT get the point of sacred ground. I suppose it finally gives a cleric endless healing like a champion, plant Druid, and thaumaturge with chalice but, I mean, by level 4 someone usually has continual healing anyway, and champions and plant Druids get their free healing for free. Plus, hp per level? Even at level 20, that’s like, 18 uses (3 hours)to bring the Barbarian back to full.

Most GMs I know handwave healing unless there is a time crunch.

I just don’t get it. Either your GM is super stingy about healing, in which case you are just gonna heal with medicine and maybe get a slight boost from the field (cutting resting time down from maybe 3 hrs to 2 hrs) or he hand waves healing, in which case the feat is useless. Oh, and the healer animist does say better from level 1 onward (if their ability is kept as is.).

The shield thing however looks REALY good and makes me wanna get a cleric with embalazon armorments for a shield! Damn, +2 to ac and all saves AND turns some saves into crit saves? How is that on the same as a tiny bit of out-of-combat healing?

I like the feat conceptually. It is set too low to take. Not sure why the designers set it so low with Continual Recovery and Ward Medic performing much, much better per 10 minute increment. It's not worthwhile. Feels like another one of those feats that is more RP than small group friendly. It would be cool if you were healing a whole army, but practically worthless if you have a trained medic in a small group like most PF2 groups.

I like the feat conceptually. It is set too low to take. Not sure why the designers set it so low with Continual Recovery and Ward Medic performing much, much better per 10 minute increment. It's not worthwhile. Feels like another one of those feats that is more RP than small group friendly. It would be cool if you were healing a whole army, but practically worthless if you have a trained medic in a small group like most PF2 groups.

1. It's the entire party at once.

Deriven Firelion wrote:

I like the feat conceptually. It is set too low to take. Not sure why the designers set it so low with Continual Recovery and Ward Medic performing much, much better per 10 minute increment. It's not worthwhile. Feels like another one of those feats that is more RP than small group friendly. It would be cool if you were healing a whole army, but practically worthless if you have a trained medic in a small group like most PF2 groups.

1. It's the entire party at once.

2. You can do it at the same time as Continual Recovery or Ward Medic

Ward Medic does the entire party at once as well for much more damage by level 7. That's if the entire party is even hurt.

The additional healing is likely overkill over what the medic will do.

The medic heals with a DC 20 2d8+10 per 10 minute period very early. This will increase 2d8+30 very soon.

It's not worth the feat unless you like the RP of it or you have an extra large party that gets hurt often. It doesn't scale very well and when competing against other feats, just can't see much of a reason to take it.

The advantages of this feat:

1. No roll required.

2. Targets entire party.

Disadvantages:

1. Doesn't even heal the hit points of a single attack in a 10 minute period until very high level.

It's a feat that I can't imagine taking compared to other feats. Not much bang for the buck.

Just you wait. Paizo will pull back on the oh so powerful existing healing abilities to make their new options look better in comparison.

Mundane healing was kind of out of control anyhow.

/snarkasm

So I get that it is free healing ON TOP of other healing, that's good, but like, the point is it doesn't matter. Either you you heal with medicine or you aren't healing much at all anyway. So you take 2 hours to fully heal instead of 3 . . . if there's no time crunch then it doesn't matter, if there is a time crunch, then that piddly bit of healing isn't going to tip any scales. So it doesn't work in either case.

Like . . . if it was a free class ability you got at level 1 then yes, love it, do it. But spending a feat slot on it, especially against 1 action, +2 to all saves and also some saves turn into crit-saves is just . . . no not good.

The ONE, ONE good thing about it is that it hands out negative healing if you have Dampiers/skeletons in your party. Those guys can be hard to heal, and you can't medicine them without a skill check. But you can't get it until level 4 anyway which . . . I mean, what are you supposed to do for the first four levels?

It does have unlimited targets, so it may have value in a party that has many minions or in campaigns where you expect to heal large groups of NPCs.

It does have unlimited targets, so it may have value in a party that has many minions or in campaigns where you expect to heal large groups of NPCs.

Thats super niche. As a skill feat triggered off religion its ok, as a clads feat its dead on arrival.

So I get that it is free healing ON TOP of other healing, that's good, but like, the point is it doesn't matter. Either you you heal with medicine or you aren't healing much at all anyway.

I mean if you want to look at it that way, CR-Ward Medic heals a party of 4 for three skill increases and two skill feats. The sacred ground medic can skip that entirely and still provide good out of combat healing for the party.

Like I said it's far from revolutionary but... that's fine?

VampByDay wrote:

So I get that it is free healing ON TOP of other healing, that's good, but like, the point is it doesn't matter. Either you you heal with medicine or you aren't healing much at all anyway.

I mean if you want to look at it that way, CR-Ward Medic heals a party of 4 for three skill increases and two skill feats. The sacred ground medic can skip that entirely and still provide good out of combat healing for the party.

Like I said it's far from revolutionary but... that's fine?

I don't know that it is good.

Level 5. Average d8 class with 14 Con has 50 hit points. That's 100 minutes of healing.

Level 10. Average d8 class with 16 Con has 110. That is 110 minutes of healing.

Level 15. Average d8 class with an 18 Con has 180 hit points. That is 120 minutes of healing.

D10 class is even worse.

It literally gets worse as you level up as players raise their Con up. Toss in Toughness and racial hit points, add another 10 minutes or so.

Just use Ward Medic and 10 minute focus spells if you have heal animal or something. You'll get it done much faster.

It's a cool concept. It scales badly and it feels like a feat tossed in that won't have much of a purpose in most builds. There are plenty of those in the game, so no big deal. I do wish they would scale feats like this better.

It scales badly

1HP per level per ten minutes is fine scaling.

It is the whole party.

It stacks with most other healing.

It is only 1 class feat not several skill feats and skill ranks.

It is a nice option as you say but nothing too spectacular.

I found the new healing feat underwhelming upon first reading and was quite surprised by many of the positive reactions in this thread.

I do agree that it fills that infinite healing niche that the Cleric was missing though.

If nothing else, it makes it abundantly clear that PCs are intended to start most combat encounters fresh, and that cure spells is for emergency combat healing.

Would be fun if it scaled with something more unusual like your spell DC or something.

I also don't really see why it needs a minute set up time. It could just as well be one or three actions and it would hardly change anything.

It's not one I'd take, but it's definitely something I'd recommend to any player who wants to go around doing miracles. Being able to go around healing masses of people with your deity's presence is fitting, and it's only a one-minute activity for the Cleric. They can either move on, or speak with a captive audience for ten minutes.

(In a much more limited sense over on the evil side of things, a Cleric can go around repairing the damage to hundreds of mindless zombies.)

In a dungeon, it's probably most useful when the Cleric needs to refocus, at least for those gods where giving medical treatment isn't a refocus activity.

But yeah, mainly I think it's there so Kineticist doesn't hopelessly outshine Cleric as a healer of the masses or getting members of an army back on their feet. I'm happy to have that in whatever form it takes, because it's a thing that felt off.

Deriven Firelion wrote:

It scales badly

1HP per level per ten minutes is fine scaling.

It is the whole party.

It stacks with most other healing.

It is only 1 class feat not several skill feats and skill ranks.

It is a nice option as you say but nothing too spectacular.

Considering that the "several skill feats and skill ranks" does a whole lot more for you, acting like it does the same effect doesn't really make sense. As it stands, this is about as helpful (and clunky) as Armor Assist, because it adds an additional minute to any other 10 minute activity, and the game is balanced assuming you will have invested in Medicine to its maximum capacity anyway. Activities are balanced around 10 minutes, not 1 minute.

Even as a supplemental feat it is pretty bad, and the idea it is non-magical is wrong as well, since it has the Divine trait, making it indeed magical healing. Maybe if it added your Wisdom to the amount healed, it would be good in the early levels (where out-of-combat healing needs the most help), and passable in the later levels, but it is otherwise extremely lackluster, and questionable as to whether it is worth a feat slot compared to, say, Blessed One dedication.

Ward Medic does the entire party at once as well for much more damage by level 7. That's if the entire party is even hurt.

That feels like a bit of hyperbole mixed with ignoring costs.

A 5+ character party is not unexpected. I don't think I have ever seen a PFS game run with any number other than 6 players. And that isn't counting minions. So Ward Medic won't cover the whole party at level 7 with only Master proficiency. It will cover 4 characters of the party.

It also isn't accounting for the idea that this build costs two of your first skill boosts and the one and only Master skill that you get at level 7. And cost at least two skill feats (Continual Recovery and Ward Medic) and a third if you want Assurance. That is pretty much your entire character's skill budget at that level.

Level 5. Average d8 class with 14 Con has 50 hit points. That's 100 minutes of healing.

Level 10. Average d8 class with 16 Con has 110. That is 110 minutes of healing.

Level 15. Average d8 class with an 18 Con has 180 hit points. That is 120 minutes of healing.

Yes. Several people have mentioned that relying on Sacred Ground exclusively is not how the feat is intended to be used. So why continue to insist on comparing just the numbers healed in isolation as though that metric has any significance?

It does feel a bit like communal healing, in theory I like it quite a lot, but I don't really see it doing anything major in practice.

It looks like it is an okay boost when a party is in the field, but it really gets into its own when the cleric is spending time working wonders for a mass of NPCs, like a village saved or an army the group is accompanying or anything where it isn't looked at with ONLY whether or not it is going to help push the group through the next encounter.

Probably not the best choice for Abomination Vaults, but maybe good for some other path that has a larger group to support? Hells Rebels, maybe? Agents of Edgewatch, perhaps?

It might be a bit campaign-dependent, but it's also really good for healing on the move.

- Pray continuously for 1 minute. It's not entirely clear how much this limits your actions, but things like "walking" and "riding a horse" should be doable no problem.

- For 10 minutes, everyone who you want to be healing needs to stay within 30 feet of you. this is not hard to arrange, even on the move.

- Healing occurs.

- Feel free to repeat at this time.

For that matter, it also lets you heal people that you can't touch or otherwise get physical access to. Are they damaging to those that get too near? Locked in a cage/cell? Cowering in a corner, ready to stab you if you get close? All three? As long as you can get within 30 feet, and hang around for 11 minutes, this one works fine. Again, this is pretty niche, but it does account for the "wounded animal feeling defensive" thing that can happen.

I'm not saying that it's amazing. I'm not even saying that if I was playing a cleric (yeah, right) I'd necessarily take it... but it's not useless.

- For 10 minutes, everyone who you want to be healing needs to stay within 30 feet of you. this is not hard to arrange, even on the move.

This is the part of the ability that I find kinda disappointing. Not anything with the healing effect at all.

But it is a burst area.

Emanation should be centered on you.

Burst should be centered on a point on the ground.

Emanation should follow the caster around if they have a duration (Aura trait automatic).

Burst should be in a fixed location once cast.

But here we have a Burst centered on the caster. Does it follow the caster when they move, or does it stay in the original location? And how do you set up a Burst area on the map when it is centered on the caster? All of the Burst area templates are centered on a grid intersection point.

I still think we need to wait to see the entire remastered class to see where these feats land. Just on a basic level having something like Sacred Ground, and whatever resource-free healing feats follow, it's nice to free up your feats so every healing cleric doesn't also have to be Doctor House, MD. It helps to open up more skill focuses along with them freeing up charisma as your secondary stat.

I do wish it was level 2 but I get it being bumped to 4 to follow around when you'd get Ward Medic as a dedicated healer.

I don't think the area moves with the cleric since it has the consecration trait and not the aura trait.

It wouldn't be the first aura that lacks its trait, but the presence of the consecration trait makes it likely that it is not meant as an aura.

I don't think the area moves with the cleric since it has the consecration trait and not the aura trait.

It wouldn't be the first aura that lacks its trait, but the presence of the consecration trait makes it likely that it is not meant as an aura.

Well, in that case it's less useful for the party, but more useful for blessing folks while you're passing through... though it would be nice to know which it was supposed to be a bit more clearly.

Just you wait. Paizo will pull back on the oh so powerful existing healing abilities to make their new options look better in comparison.

Mundane healing was kind of out of control anyhow.

/snarkasm

I get you're joking, but Paizo has done that sort of thing before. Removed Con from Scarred Witch Doctor before Kineticist came out, needed Paragon surge before the Wizard archetype that could snag spells from other lists came out.

Sanityfaerie wrote:

- For 10 minutes, everyone who you want to be healing needs to stay within 30 feet of you. this is not hard to arrange, even on the move.

This is the part of the ability that I find kinda disappointing. Not anything with the healing effect at all.

But it is a burst area.

Emanation should be centered on you.

Burst should be centered on a point on the ground.

Emanation should follow the caster around if they have a duration (Aura trait automatic).

Burst should be in a fixed location once cast.

But here we have a Burst centered on the caster. Does it follow the caster when they move, or does it stay in the original location? And how do you set up a Burst area on the map when it is centered on the caster? All of the Burst area templates are centered on a grid intersection point.

It says "burst centered on you" not "emanation," so it's basically a 1 minute "cast time" with a 10 minute timer.

Otherwise, using emanation rules (or caster picks a corner) should be good enough.

Reading it again. This feat is not too bad. I see how it works now.

So you pray for a minute setting up, then the cleric uses medicine to heal, and the target gets additional hit points equal to the cleric level for the cost of an additional minute of time. So it's not level hit points per ten minutes like a focus point, it's level per ten minutes with a 1 minute set up time while the cleric can do other things including Treat Wounds. So it continues to build on the cleric as ultimate healer.

Ok. This feat would be good for someone that wants to be the ultimate healer in and out of combat. So over the course of use it might accelerate healing by 9 minutes or so per use given the 1 minute set up time.

So it is a decent feat. I misread that and thought the cleric would have to sit there for 10 minutes praying. But he only has to pray for a minute.

Yeah, that Feat smells like Garden of Healing except it is worse in every conceivable way other than the range which, outside of combat, is effectively meaningless anyhow. Spending a minute to cast a Focus Spell that requires the party to stay within spitting distance for a full 10 minutes in order to get HP healing equal to your level is a laughably small benefit for a 4th-level Class Feat.

I don't get it at all.

Yeah, that Feat smells like Garden of Healing except it is worse in every conceivable way other than the range which, outside of combat, is effectively meaningless anyhow. Spending a minute to cast a Focus Spell that requires the party to stay within spitting distance for a full 10 minutes in order to get HP healing equal to your level is a laughably small benefit for a 4th-level Class Feat.

I don't get it at all.

The difference is that you can still use your focus spells, and it works even if you already have used your focus spells.

Like, you can spend a minute casting this, and then ten minutes healing people, and if you follow the right deity, that time spent healing can also be your refocus time. Or for a different deity, you might cast this for a minute and then spend 10 minutes repairing your shield (which is also your refocus action). Feel free to fire off any focus points you might have left before you start the process.

In a short rest scenario the feat is sometimes going to save you 10 or so minutes so you don't have to refocus again or use medicine or whatever. Whether or not that' s worth a feat, I dunno I would have to see the other 4th level feats.

The other thing is that it also works when you're not in a short rest situation. Like if you're riding horseback overland, or exploring a ruin, or using some sort of victory point system to do research in a library you can heal everybody who sticks within 30' of you on top of whatever else you're doing.

It works fine for my group if someone wanted to bolster healing. You have to sit next to your group for ward medic. So this is a supplement to the cleric use of medicine if you focus that way costing a minute of prayer time per use. It allows the cleric to top off some lower damage targets, while performing medicine on the more damaged targets.

It probably won't be necessary too often. But I can see its value now for someone that likes being the ultimate healer type.

Its a feat to supplement cleric use of Medicine or any use of Medicine and not a replacement. A single feat investment for additional downtime healing while you refocus, do medicine, or stand guard or what not.

So a high level cleric healer, say level 15 or so with Legendary medic, could pray for a minute, ward medic wit a DC 30 check, and heal 2d8+45 over 10 minutes versus 2d8+30.

So a high level cleric healer, say level 15 or so with Legendary medic, could pray for a minute, ward medic wit a DC 30 check, and heal 2d8+45 over 10 minutes versus 2d8+30.

Hmmm...

total average healing of 54, so Sacred Ground is doing 5/18ths of the total work here. That's not nothing.

As a side note, the current lvl 6 cleric feat Magic Hands will increase the amount healed by an effective nonscaling 7 (or 14 if crit).