Pathfinder Advanced Player's Guide

… this book has only been shipping this month.

I love my PF1 slayer, such a fun hybrid class that cherry picks cool stuff from half a dozen other classes. If you're unfamiliar, it's a sort of rogue-assassin-ranger-ninja with options that allow massive archery buffs and melee glass cannon. Mine is a sylph and I love her.

I hope the slayer gets revived and refreshed in PF2.

Honestly, I wouldn’t worry too much about class names. Based on your description I bet you can find a class and maybe an archetype that facilitates your vision.

Suggestions for Errata related to APG:

- Eldritch archer should require 14 in one of the caster abilities to be in line with other dedications that are aimed towards giving martials spellcasting. Probably charisma if the spells are charisma.

- Animate dead spell's wording is ambiguous, and convinces GMs to rule that you require a corpse to use the spell. Clarification needed.

- Ancestry feats that give familiars are not clear about what will happen if your class gives you a familiar, such as Witch.

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Suggestions for Errata related to Core Rule Book:

- All summon spells are ambiguously worded on whether the intent is to allow access to the entire bestiary's common list with X trait.

- Trainers for learning spells do not have any sort of rubric for how much they might charge to teach a player character a spell.

- Recall knowledge is not specific in regards to what information it ought to give on a creature, and to what degree.

- Automatic Knowledge skill feat does not make clear if you can or can't recall knowledge should it fail.

- It is not clear whether a wizard could learn a spell from a bard if they share spell lists.

- The way lore functions in skill checks could be more clear. Would it have a lower DC?

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Thank you for your time. Love the book. Love investigator. Love all the art. Love witch, and oracle.

If I purchase the pdf now and they release a second printing later on, is the pdf updated automatically to the second printing?

If I purchase the pdf now and they release a second printing later on, is the pdf updated automatically to the second printing?

It sure is!

So I am finally reading the APG, and I got to the section on 'Rare Backgrounds' and I have to say... They're not rare. They're the most common backgrounds that new players give their characters!

GM: So where is your character from? Do you have your backstory written yet?

Sorcerer Player: Er... I'm an amnesiac! I woke up one day, with no memory of where I was...

GM: And that's why you have no background written up?

Sorcerer Player: Yup.

GM: [sighs and turns to next player.] And what about you?

Champion Player: I'm a paladin who was found next to a fairy hill. In fact, my birth family did their research. They wanted the prestige that comes with having a paladin in the family, so they abandoned me near a fairy hill. Actually, they had to abandon me three times, because other folks from the village would find me and lead me home. But finally the fairies took me, and raised me. So now I am an awesome paladin who thinks that my family are all jerks. *

GM: Sigh. Right. Another fey foundling. And you?

Fighter Player: My mother the queen was deposed and we had to run for our lives, so now I'm making a living as an adventurer hoping to raise an army to regain my throne!

GM: Okay.... Anyone else?

Oracle Player: I grew up on a farm.

GM: [relieved] Great!

Oracle Player: Then ghouls attacked my farm, killing everyone, including me. Did I tell you that I came back from the dead? That I am still haunted by their ghosts? I SEE DEAD PEOPLE.

____
*This story actually came from one of my favorite players, Rosc, who liked making fun of how mechanics might influence the gameworld.

So I am finally reading the APG, and I got to the section on 'Rare Backgrounds' and I have to say... They're not rare. They're the most common backgrounds that new players give their characters!

GM: So where is your character from? Do you have your backstory written yet?

Sorcerer Player: Er... I'm an amnesiac! I woke up one day, with no memory of where I was...

GM: And that's why you have no background written up?

Sorcerer Player: Yup.

GM: [sighs and turns to next player.] And what about you?

Champion Player: I'm a paladin who was found next to a fairy hill. In fact, my birth family did their research. They wanted the prestige that comes with having a paladin in the family, so they abandoned me near a fairy hill. Actually, they had to abandon me three times, because other folks from the village would find me and lead me home. But finally the fairies took me, and raised me. So now I am an awesome paladin who thinks that my family are all jerks. *

GM: Sigh. Right. Another fey foundling. And you?

Fighter Player: My mother the queen was deposed and we had to run for our lives, so now I'm making a living as an adventurer hoping to raise an army to regain my throne!

GM: Okay.... Anyone else?

Oracle Player: I grew up on a farm.

GM: [relieved] Great!

Oracle Player: Then ghouls attacked my farm, killing everyone, including me. Did I tell you that I came back from the dead? That I am still haunted by their ghosts? I SEE DEAD PEOPLE.

____
*This story actually came from one of my favorite players, Rosc, who liked making fun of how mechanics might influence the gameworld.

I do think its meant as rare in universe ;D

Question regarding the Eldritch Archer
In the fluff text it states "you achieve rare heights with the bow or crossbow" but all Talents seem to be only usable with the bow. How does this translate to the Crossbow? Is the Fluff Text wrong, or should you replace every notion of "bow" with "bow and crossbow"?

So I am finally reading the APG, and I got to the section on 'Rare Backgrounds' and I have to say... They're not rare. They're the most common backgrounds that new players give their characters!

GM: So where is your character from? Do you have your backstory written yet?

Sorcerer Player: Er... I'm an amnesiac! I woke up one day, with no memory of where I was...

GM: And that's why you have no background written up?

Sorcerer Player: Yup.

GM: [sighs and turns to next player.] And what about you?

Champion Player: I'm a paladin who was found next to a fairy hill. In fact, my birth family did their research. They wanted the prestige that comes with having a paladin in the family, so they abandoned me near a fairy hill. Actually, they had to abandon me three times, because other folks from the village would find me and lead me home. But finally the fairies took me, and raised me. So now I am an awesome paladin who thinks that my family are all jerks. *

GM: Sigh. Right. Another fey foundling. And you?

Fighter Player: My mother the queen was deposed and we had to run for our lives, so now I'm making a living as an adventurer hoping to raise an army to regain my throne!

GM: Okay.... Anyone else?

Oracle Player: I grew up on a farm.

GM: [relieved] Great!

Oracle Player: Then ghouls attacked my farm, killing everyone, including me. Did I tell you that I came back from the dead? That I am still haunted by their ghosts? I SEE DEAD PEOPLE.

____
*This story actually came from one of my favorite players, Rosc, who liked making fun of how mechanics might influence the gameworld.

Maybe the idea was to make them rare by force.

Humbly,
Yawar

I am confused about the archetypes and want to make sure I understand how it works

A) Archetype Distinctions: There are apparently 4 types of archetypes

1) Multiclass Dedication (MCD) - all of the dedications in the CRB
2) Class Dedication (CD) - Mentioned that these will have the "Class" tag but none exist
3) General Dedication (GD) - These are the dedications like Beastmaster which have no tags other than "archetype" and "Dedication"
4) Magical Dedication (MD) - Eldritch archer has the "Magical" tag so I have to assume it is a unique type (esp. since no other dedication which grants magical abilities has the tag)

B) Ancestry feat usage: Ancient Elf and Human Multitalented can only pick MCD feats for their special.

C) Satisfying archetype completion: Dedications require you to take 2 archetype feats in addition to the dedication. These feats do NOT need to be archetype class feats, just feats in the archetype. Thus, you could satisfy the Medic (GD) archetype with a single class feat and using 2 skill feats (Rogues and Investigators are the dedication specialists)

Another question - The Vigilante. It implies that you have a set of vigilante and a set of social skills/feats. I am missing where it says how you pick the skills and feats for the social and the vigilante

They're the Archetypes Feats, some have the Social Trait and some have the Vigilante Trait.

I am confused about the archetypes and want to make sure I understand how it works

A) Archetype Distinctions: There are apparently 4 types of archetypes

1) Multiclass Dedication (MCD) - all of the dedications in the CRB
2) Class Dedication (CD) - Mentioned that these will have the "Class" tag but none exist
3) General Dedication (GD) - These are the dedications like Beastmaster which have no tags other than "archetype" and "Dedication"
4) Magical Dedication (MD) - Eldritch archer has the "Magical" tag so I have to assume it is a unique type (esp. since no other dedication which grants magical abilities has the tag)

B) Ancestry feat usage: Ancient Elf and Human Multitalented can only pick MCD feats for their special.

C) Satisfying archetype completion: Dedications require you to take 2 archetype feats in addition to the dedication. These feats do NOT need to be archetype class feats, just feats in the archetype. Thus, you could satisfy the Medic (GD) archetype with a single class feat and using 2 skill feats (Rogues and Investigators are the dedication specialists)

A) This appears correct. Class Dedications will mess around more with the chasis of the class more than providing feat options, much like the archetypes in first ed did. None created yet. Don’t think the Eldritch Archer is a special type of archetype, just a magical version of the general archetype.

B) Yup. They’re explicitly only for multiclass archetypes.

C) This also appears correct. Some of the feats will be Skill feats and taking those will count for the dedication.

So it seems you’ve got a pretty good handle on how it works, Was anything confusing you specifically?

They're the Archetypes Feats, some have the Social Trait and some have the Vigilante Trait.

I see that now. Then I am at a loss as to what the Vigilante dedication feat gives you. It does not provide or increase any skills or feats. It appears that you can make up a second identity and you make it difficult for people to figure that you are the same person. That is it. Am I missing soemthing or is the dedication feat a pure and simple empty feat tax

Garulo wrote:

I am confused about the archetypes and want to make sure I understand how it works

A) Archetype Distinctions: There are apparently 4 types of archetypes

1) Multiclass Dedication (MCD) - all of the dedications in the CRB
2) Class Dedication (CD) - Mentioned that these will have the "Class" tag but none exist
3) General Dedication (GD) - These are the dedications like Beastmaster which have no tags other than "archetype" and "Dedication"
4) Magical Dedication (MD) - Eldritch archer has the "Magical" tag so I have to assume it is a unique type (esp. since no other dedication which grants magical abilities has the tag)

B) Ancestry feat usage: Ancient Elf and Human Multitalented can only pick MCD feats for their special.

C) Satisfying archetype completion: Dedications require you to take 2 archetype feats in addition to the dedication. These feats do NOT need to be archetype class feats, just feats in the archetype. Thus, you could satisfy the Medic (GD) archetype with a single class feat and using 2 skill feats (Rogues and Investigators are the dedication specialists)

A) This appears correct. Class Dedications will mess around more with the chasis of the class more than providing feat options, much like the archetypes in first ed did. None created yet. Don’t think the Eldritch Archer is a special type of archetype, just a magical version of the general archetype.

B) Yup. They’re explicitly only for multiclass archetypes.

C) This also appears correct. Some of the feats will be Skill feats and taking those will count for the dedication.

So it seems you’ve got a pretty good handle on how it works, Was anything confusing you specifically?

No, I just wanted to make sure I understood it. That summary took 3 intelligent people at least 15 minutes to argue and then come to an understanding using portions in three different books and some of it implied. Something basic like archetypes (which is a major portion of the rulebooks) should be in one place, take a minute to understand, and the only disagreement should be about corner cases, As it is, we still do not understand the reasoning why an ancient elf can take a full throttled multiclass dedication as a heritage thing but cannot take the more limited ones

I'm pretty sure that the inspiration for Ancient Elf Is D&D 1st edition where Elves (and Half-elves) were the only races that could multi-class into three classes. The Elves in that ancient game were master of multi-classing, so these Ancient Elves are still the best at multi-classing.

Similarly the Ancient-blooded Dwarves are magically resistant like the Dwarves in D&D 1st edition. It's a bit meta.

Rysky wrote:

They're the Archetypes Feats, some have the Social Trait and some have the Vigilante Trait.

I see that now. Then I am at a loss as to what the Vigilante dedication feat gives you. It does not provide or increase any skills or feats. It appears that you can make up a second identity and you make it difficult for people to figure that you are the same person. That is it. Am I missing soemthing or is the dedication feat a pure and simple empty feat tax

You get the Vigilante identity, that’s whole point of the Archetype.

C) Satisfying archetype completion: Dedications require you to take 2 archetype feats in addition to the dedication.

This isn't quite true, as you're only required to take two archetype feats before you take a second dedication. If you never take a second dedication, you don't need to take any more archetype feats after the initial dedication.

Rysky wrote:

They're the Archetypes Feats, some have the Social Trait and some have the Vigilante Trait.

I see that now. Then I am at a loss as to what the Vigilante dedication feat gives you. It does not provide or increase any skills or feats. It appears that you can make up a second identity and you make it difficult for people to figure that you are the same person. That is it. Am I missing soemthing or is the dedication feat a pure and simple empty feat tax

It gives you more reliable scrying protection than Mind Blank, an uncommon 8th-level spell, for a second-level feat. It allows you to maintain two separate alignments, potentially allowing for a more neutral cover to heavily aligned actions.

If you don't care about multiple identities or divination protections, then a most of the archetype's feats (Hidden Magic, Minion Guise, Safe House, Social Purview, Quick Change, Subjective Truth, and Many Guises) aren't worth anything to you either. There are only four feats that deal with something else, and of those, Quick Draw is available through more focused sources.

If you want to make Iron Man, Vigilante isn't gonna be of any use to you. If you want to make Batman, Vigilante allows that to happen in a setting where magic would normally quickly answer the question, "Where's Batman right now?" with "He's at Bruce Wayne's fancy cocktail party, and he's either invisibly standing next to Bruce Wayne, or he's Bruce Wayne."

Garulo wrote:

Rysky wrote:

They're the Archetypes Feats, some have the Social Trait and some have the Vigilante Trait.

I see that now. Then I am at a loss as to what the Vigilante dedication feat gives you. It does not provide or increase any skills or feats. It appears that you can make up a second identity and you make it difficult for people to figure that you are the same person. That is it. Am I missing soemthing or is the dedication feat a pure and simple empty feat tax

It gives you more reliable scrying protection than Mind Blank, an uncommon 8th-level spell, for a second-level feat. It allows you to maintain two separate alignments, potentially allowing for a more neutral cover to heavily aligned actions.

If you don't care about multiple identities or divination protections, then a most of the archetype's feats (Hidden Magic, Minion Guise, Safe House, Social Purview, Quick Change, Subjective Truth, and Many Guises) aren't worth anything to you either. There are only four feats that deal with something else, and of those, Quick Draw is available through more focused sources.

If you want to make Iron Man, Vigilante isn't gonna be of any use to you. If you want to make Batman, Vigilante allows that to happen in a setting where magic would normally quickly answer the question, "Where's Batman right now?" with "He's at Bruce Wayne's fancy cocktail party, and he's either invisibly standing next to Bruce Wayne, or he's Bruce Wayne."

In other words, I did not misread the quality of the dedication. Also, the ability is NOT a more reliable mind blank, it is a very narrow non-detection. The ability states attempting to detect a person based upon the other identity fails. You can still read a mind since that is NOT based upon trying to detect a specific individual (I have learned my lesson about assuming something does more than it says it does). As the devs are fond of saying, if you think a 2nd level feat will do better than a continuous 8th level spell, you are misreading it

If Batman is in his Bruce Wayne persona right now, then a magical "where is Batman right now" should return the result "nowhere".

In other words, I did not misread the quality of the dedication. Also, the ability is NOT a more reliable mind blank, it is a very narrow non-detection. The ability states attempting to detect a person based upon the other identity fails. You can still read a mind since that is NOT based upon trying to detect a specific individual (I have learned my lesson about assuming something does more than it says it does). As the devs are fond of saying, if you think a 2nd level feat will do better than a continuous 8th level spell, you are misreading it

You are absolutely right that Nondetection would have been a better comparison, yes, because that has the part of Mind Blank that deals with scrying at a much lower level. (I forgot that the spell covered scrying, or I would have used it for my example. As it stands, my statement about an 8th level uncommon spell is hyperbolic, and should be corrected to a 3rd level uncommon spell.) They both work on counteraction, though, and the Vigilante dedication does flat denial of somebody searching for one identity while you're in the other. So, you get a narrower Nondetection with a better success rate, as a constant effect.

You did not misread the quality, but I don't think a tax is at all accurate; the entire archetype is about blocking divinations and having multiple identities. If I don't like talismans, then the Talisman Dabbler dedication isn't a tax; the whole archetype is meant for somebody else who does like talismans.

Yeah, Vigilante gives you a magically secure secret identity that you almost never even need to put effort into hiding, and are superhumanly good at when you do need to put in the effort. If that doesn't sound awesome to you, you don't want to be a Vigilante.

If you want to wear a costume and say you are batman, you can do that without a feat, if you want to wear a costume and have secret identity without anybody being easily able to figure it out, you get the vigilante archetype.

Yeah, Vigilante gives you a magically secure secret identity that you almost never even need to put effort into hiding, and are superhumanly good at when you do need to put in the effort. If that doesn't sound awesome to you, you don't want to be a Vigilante.

I am not arguing that someone who wants to play Batman and really pushes keeping the secret identity secure will not like this archetype.

What I am saying is that the ONLY thing this dedication gives you is having this "superhumanly good" secret identity. It provides NO skills, NO abilities, NO training, nothing. Do I think this is even close to the other dedications which getting multiple skills, cantrips. AND access to a spell tradition? Is it on par with getting an animal companion or a familiar? No. Is this on par with Class feats like twin takedown etc? No

The problem is that this is a DEDICATION which requires a CLASS feat and not just a general or skill feat. This would work as a low-power general feat

Not all Dedication feats are equal in what they grant because they let you pursue a variety of completely different paths, the Vigilante archetype grants a very useful ability in being a vigilante.

On Vigilante, I think if you are interested in taking the Feat in the first place, it's a valuable enough ability for you that it is "worth the Feat". It's like Pirate Archetype... if you're not planning on spending alot of time on ships (or places with lots of hanging ropes to swing on), it really doesn't do much for you... so don't take it.

Of course, for campaigns heavily aligned to that theme (where the difficulty it overcomes is a persistent presence that may critically impede success for anybody lacking the ability), it's really perfect fodder for "Free Archetype Variant" to give everybody at least the base Dedication for free. Otherwise, it's the sort of thing that is less useful to individual characters if PCs normally do everything together, unless the GM is happy to run solo side missions and that sort of thing (I know many are at least to limited extent, but fair to mention). I don't have any problem with this, and AFAIK this is what everybody expected with Vigilante being posterchild for "not unique Class anymore, just archetype any Class can grab".

Technically speaking it might be reasonable to throw in a bonus Lore skill or 2 (and/or Language?) appropriate to identity. I suspect they didn't because a major use case will be granting every PC the archetype for free... in which case you don't want to escalate power too much. It already allows EVERYBODY to qualify for Quickdraw which is normally Rogue/Ranger unique, and is significant action economy boost for "hand juggling" (great for 2H weapons even outside of "actually drawing weapon from sheath"). If NOT doing Free Archetype, I could somewhat see changing the Dedication Feat Type to General or Skill... possibly also for follow-up Feat "Quick Change"?

I do like that the APG "opened up" the niche of Archetype Feats being "typed" as Skill Feats, which makes it easier to fulfill Archetype Dedication requirement / while not interfering with other Class Feats, and also doesn't "force" Archetype Feats to try to fill power expecations of Class Feats. Still seems like Dedication Feats are still all Class Feats, though...(???) Not sure if that is solid restriction Paizo intends to stick to always, or if they may be open to General/Skill Feat Archetype Dedications themselves in the future...?

DJGaia72 wrote:

Are they going to release an updated character sheet pack with the new stuff?

I think this is what you are looking for.

Yes! Thank you so much! Awww, I'm starting a whole new campaign for one of my games ending, but it'll start before these are available. Oh well. I'll just print out new ones when I can get them. ^^ <3

I am not arguing that someone who wants to play Batman and really pushes keeping the secret identity secure will not like this archetype.

I mean, that is very specifically who the Archetype is for, so I think that's probably good enough.

What I am saying is that the ONLY thing this dedication gives you is having this "superhumanly good" secret identity. It provides NO skills, NO abilities, NO training, nothing. Do I think this is even close to the other dedications which getting multiple skills, cantrips. AND access to a spell tradition? Is it on par with getting an animal companion or a familiar? No. Is this on par with Class feats like twin takedown etc? No

It's much better than any of those things in its specific and very narrow sphere. Sure, it provides no Skills or Proficiencies or spells, but the sheer denial of any way to connect your identities is of a very high level. People trying to connect the two of you can easily be five or six levels higher than you and still fail. If they never meet and interview you, they can easily be 18 levels higher and never succeed at unmasking you.

Something that lets you defeat the abilities of a 20th level character as a 2nd level one is not to be underestimated, no matter how narrow the scope of that victory.

The problem is that this is a DEDICATION which requires a CLASS feat and not just a general or skill feat. This would work as a low-power general feat

I don't agree with this at all. This is more comparable to the Blank Slate Rogue Feat (a level 16 Class Feat) than it is to any Skill Feat or General Feat. It's obviously more limited than that, don't get me wrong, but then it's a level 2 Feat, not a level 16 one.

I understand the rationale of the Vigilante now. It is a specialized dedication for a specific type of campaign.

Another question then - If you have a familiar already and you take Familiar master, it becomes an Enhanced familiar. If you take Witch Dedication and have a familiar already, am I correct in my understanding that it stays a regular familiar (until 6th level when it gains 1 ability)? Thus, there would never be a reason to take a familiar before the dedication? (or you retrain the feat). You would also never take the familiar master dedication before taking the witch dedication

Can anyone explain to me why it is that Amazon is still showing this product as a preorder and my local store only received one copy because his suppliers do not have any in stock? This product did release last Thursday, right?

Can anyone explain to me why it is that Amazon is still showing this product as a preorder and my local store only received one copy because his suppliers do not have any in stock? This product did release last Thursday, right?

Amazon virtually always gets Paizo products a few days to a week late. Something to do with book-books releasing on Tuesdays and gaming books releasing on Thursdays and the way it interacts with their computer system only "looking" for new books on Tuesdays.

Game stores get their copies through a distributor, not directly from Paizo (usually, though I believe Paizo has started a program to deal directly with stores recently). It's possible the distributor or retailer didn't preorder enough copies to cover local demand.

At any rate, yes, the book is out, and street date was July 29th. You can order (not preorder) directly from Paizo above. ^

Actually, I think the street date was changed to July 30th.

Actually, I think the street date was changed to July 30th.

You're right; that's Thursday. I misremembered the date of the first day of GenCon and didn't look at a calendar to double-check myself.

Is anyone else’s subscription order still showing as “pending”? I reached out to customer service last week and I’m still waiting to hear back. My subscription went through on July 10th and the order still hasn’t shipped out... at this point my subscription order will be arriving AFTER people who just order today...

Is anyone else’s subscription order still showing as “pending”? I reached out to customer service last week and I’m still waiting to hear back. My subscription went through on July 10th and the order still hasn’t shipped out... at this point my subscription order will be arriving AFTER people who just order today...

According to the customer service forum, they have not reached the end of shipping. This was supposed to be yeasterday, but is now expected sometime today, or at least was so expected yesterday when Sara-Marie updated the thread. You are apparently one of the very unlucky ones who still hasn’t been sent out. It seems GenCon shipping in the time of Corona is even harder than people thought.

EDIT: Asking these sorts of questions on the customer services forum is much more likely to get an up to date and official response.

I AM SO EXCITED ABOUT DUAL-WEAPON RELOAD

PICAROONS ARE FINALLY (going to be) VIABLE!!!

As soon as guns and Kitsune are added, Lady Vulpina will rise again :D

I'm glad you like the Dual Weapon Warrior! When I wrote it, I felt it was really important that the archetype could serve multiple weapon types right out of the gate. A lot of the melee weapon tricks people wanted to do with TWF already existed in a bunch of different classes (which is why the archetype allows you to pick up feats from other classes), but there wasn't much for ranged weapons.

I hope you get to use your picaroon in the near future!

Hey Paizo,

Really like the new book, However I have a question regarding the new classes and the Character sheet classes. Will you update them to match the new classes you have added in this book?

Hey Paizo,

Really like the new book, However I have a question regarding the new classes and the Character sheet classes. Will you update them to match the new classes you have added in this book?

Would this be what you're looking for?

Pathfinder Advanced Player's Guide Character Sheet Pack

--C.

Hello all! This is now available for purchase from Fantasy Grounds or on Steam. Sync your FG account first to get it a discount equivalent to the PDF Price ($14.99)! Happy gaming!

Pathfinder 2 RPG - Pathfinder Advanced Player's Guide
Publisher: Paizo Inc.
System: Pathfinder 2.0
Get it on Steam

will this be getting a card set for the new spells and focus spells?

will this be getting a card set for the new spells and focus spells?

Yes

The Quick Contacts level 2 skill feat: the prerequisites state Underworld Connections, but there isn't an ability with that name. Was that meant to be Criminal Connections?

Hm. I just had a thought, which a quick glance through this book didn't answer: Presuming there is a multiclass archetype for evil champions, where is that covered?

Hm. I just had a thought, which a quick glance through this book didn't answer: Presuming there is a multiclass archetype for evil champions, where is that covered?

The Core Rulebook, under the Champion multiclass archetype.

Hm. I would have thought that one would be specific to good champions but maybe not.

Edit: just looked. Sho'nuff, it's non-specific. These devs are clever! :-)

Hm. I would have thought that one would be specific to good champions but maybe not.

Edit: just looked. Sho'nuff, it's non-specific. These devs are clever! :-)

We planned everything ahead to be futureproofed for non-good champions. We're sneaky like that.

So come to think about it, why are there no "Human Lore" ancestry feat? ;P

It's fun to recognize old "friends" besides the ex-iconics and ex-developer-pcs :D Such as the assassin, dragon disciple, eldritch archer, horizon walker, loremaster and shadow dancer

Indeed, kind of want to know their names and/or backstories too.

CorvusMask wrote:

It's fun to recognize old "friends" besides the ex-iconics and ex-developer-pcs :D Such as the assassin, dragon disciple, eldritch archer, horizon walker, loremaster and shadow dancer

Indeed, kind of want to know their names and/or backstories too.

According to my OCD notes, the Mystic Theurge is named Cambin, the Arcane Archer is named Secanus, and the Arcane Trickster is Jilis Quickfingers. (The two former were named together in a splash page paragraph of fiction between two chapters in a 1e book, IIRC, and Jilis, I don't even remember...)

But none of the others, AFAIK, have been named in a product yet.

So come to think about it, why are there no "Human Lore" ancestry feat? ;P

Seems to be like how you take 'Women's History' to learn about women's history, or 'Black History' to study the accomplishments of prominent black folk, but straight white men's history is just 'History.'

Human Lore seems to be the default that everybody is expected to know, since Humans run the planet and most of it's countries. Knowing anything at all about elves or dwarves is optional.