Pathfinder Advanced Player's Guide

4.80/5 (based on 9 ratings)
Pathfinder Advanced Player's Guide
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Ready to go beyond the basics? Expand the limits of what's possible with the Pathfinder Advanced Player's Guide! This 272-page Pathfinder Second Edition rulebook contains exciting new rules options for player characters, adding even more depth of choice to your Pathfinder game! Inside you will find brand new ancestries, heritages, and four new classes: the shrewd investigator, the mysterious oracle, the daring swashbuckler, and the hex-slinging witch! The must-have Advanced Player's Guide also includes exciting new options for all your favorite Core Rulebook classes and tons of new backgrounds, general feats, spells, items, and 40 flexible archetypes to customize your play experience even further!

The Pathfinder Advanced Player's Guide includes:

  • Four new classes: the investigator, oracle, swashbuckler, and witch!
  • Five new ancestries and five heritages for any ancestry: celestial aasimars, curious catfolk, hagspawned changelings, vampiric dhampirs, fate-touched duskwalkers, scaled kobolds, fierce orcs, fiendish tieflings, industrious ratfolk, and feathered tengu!
  • 40 new archetypes including multiclass archetypes for the four new classes, Pathfinder favorites like the cavalier, dragon disciple, shadowdancer, and vigilante, and brand-new archetypes like the familiar master and the shield-bearing iron wall!
  • New class options for all twelve classes from the Pathfinder Core Rulebook including champions of evil, genie and shadow sorcerers, zen archer monks, rogue masterminds, spellcasting rangers, and more!
  • Even more exciting new rules, from rare and unique backgrounds to investigative skill feats, from spells and rituals like reincarnate and create demiplane to new items including special wands with unusual effects and exciting potions worthy of a witch's cauldron.

ISBN-13: 978-1-64078-257-0



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5/5

pathfinder has always been home to custom character concepts, this book is packed with new ways to get the build in your head to the table. and the build after that. love it.


Breath of Fresh Air, With New System Teething Issues

4/5

I've been tearing through the Advanced Player's Guide, and the book was a joy to read. The greatest complaint that there's been about Pathfinder 2 was a dearth of content, when it has to compare with more established games such as first edition and Dungeons and Dragons fifth edition. The Advanced Player's Guide handily combats that, adding new feats, rituals, spells, and more in a way that make the world feel a bit more real, and a bit less like one huge combat situation. I won't be commenting on heritages or the new classes as they don't catch my interest the way that the core set of classes did, but instead I'll focus on the material useful to existing players and tables.

1. New rituals like a balanced Simulacrum, Create Demiplane, Clone, Heroes' Feast and Teleportation Circle not only add a wealth of traditional dungeon-delving flavor back into the game, but also allow traditionally marginalized classes like the Ranger and Fighter to wield strong utility if they are so inclined. Rituals like Heartbond give guidelines to explore opening up permanent spells, without using the old Permanency spell and all the frustrations that caused.

2. The influx of new spells has added a huge wealth of character options, but also some areas of severe disappointment. Spells such as the iconic Lightning Storm and Ice Storm for Primal casters are limited to an area so small I had to reach out to friends to make sure it wasn't a misprint, and spells such as Spike Stones and Seal Fate have damage so weak for their level I'm not sure what the point of their inclusion was. Despite how sorely I missed Lightning Storm, Ice Storm, and Spike Stones coming from previous editions, I actually wish that they didn't get printed—then, at least, they'd have a chance to eventually exist in a usable state.

On the positive side, I have a friend who absolutely refused to touch Pathfinder 2 when it was released for the dearth of non-combat spells. I'm happy to say that new spells like Secret Chest, Familiar's Face, Pet Cache, Ghostly Tragedy, and Cozy Cabin have all scratched the itch for flavorful spells that make magic more than just a few tactical options in a board game.

3. Skill feats are a mixed bag. In concept, they're excellent, flavorful options. I love the new Influence Nature skill feat to bits, and the Battle Planner feat brings character concepts to life in a powerful way when, and only when, they play to the theme. These are exactly what I want from my feats. On the other hand, every skill only gained one or two feats from the book, and some of them appear to not empower, but curtail the existing uses of skills—Aerobatics Mastery, for example, allows an exemption to a rule that wasn't written. This leads to awkward situations where existing players realize they suddenly need a feat tax to do something they've been doing for months before—yikes.

4. Finally, the big one—Archetypes. I love them. Some are short and sweet (such as the Scroll Trickster) and some are almost full classes in and of themselves (such as the excellent Cavalier). Some act as a patch to multi-classing, such as the Martial Artist, and some such as the Sentinel and Viking allowing characters to get scaling proficiencies they otherwise couldn't.

All in all, I had high hopes for the APG, and on the whole, it delivers. So many new concepts and ways to think about the game, so many new options, so many more unique spells for flavoring both fights and roleplaying. Rituals were an unmitigated success in my eyes, while skill feats and spells were a mixed bag. When they're good, they're GOOD. When they're Lightning Storm/Ice Storm/Spike Stones bad, they single-handedly knock a star off the review. Nearly two, but that would be unfair to the rest of the book. First book since the core rules that I'd call essential, and it sets the bar for future releases.


Came in looking for just one thing, left loving it and soo much more

5/5

I bought this book mostly for just the Swashbuckler so I could use it in Society Play, but as I read more I found it has soo much more to offer in this book and when I found out Society Play is going to be making much of the book legal for play, I fell in love with this book.

The Ancestries blew me away at the options. I knew about some of the races we were getting and that was cool (love that we got Orcs!) but the addition of the Versatile Heritages was what nailed it for me. Being able to mix options like Kobold and Dhampir? So many new RP options opened up! This is what I love about roleplaying games. Getting options AND being able to use these options for play in the games I play. I’ve got so many new character ideas in my head I have to limit them down.

For the classes, like I said, I was here mostly for the Swashbuckler and I’m very happy with it. I’ve looked a bit at the others but once again, I’m very happy with more options for players. I loved that I found out that they are continuing the support for the original classes too. I did not expect them to do that but loved that they did. They even added in more Animal Companions and Familiars.

But the main thing that amazed me about the book was the Archetypes. Soo many options and they brought back some like Assassin and Shadowdancer but made them much more accessible to other core classes. An Assassin that can be lawful good. I love this stuff. This for me turned into the biggest part of the book I fell in love with and often I just jump to this section for new ideas.

Those three options are the major benefits of the book for me, but then I found there was one more that I must call out. Pathfinder Society Plays authorization for use in Society play. Anything not uncommon or rare is allowed for play. My goodness....I love Society play but it always felt like it was an after thought in 1e in how they would allow new material. Often, I would avoid buying books because I was never sure if I could use the items at the table. But seeing what they are allowing from this book, if you play Society this becomes a must buy. If you are playing a home game, this is a amazing addition for your game.


5/5

This book was everything that I wanted and more. I absolutely love this book and the Witch class is 100% perfect.
Congratulations to the team that made this book.


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2 people marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber
The Raven Black wrote:
People keep asking for changes to feats, classes ..., but errata are not that.

Errata to the alchemist either says otherwise or gave people entirely the wrong perception.

I get the disappointment though. A lot of folks feel that the class is basically a lot of wasted potential and without errata a lost cause. I've yet to have a class at my table elicit such strong and immediate frustration from people playing one (not the alchemist nor oracle). But the concept of the witch, or even the mythological value of a witch, just seems to make the class's perceived or actual weakness to irritate people more.

So I guess the question is, if the witch will not receive any improvements via errata, is it just stuck where it is forever?


Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

I don't think anything I'd said was hoping for a buff, since it was unclear either way. I've read a lot of people that assumed dragon breath from dragon disciple used class DC, for example. Hell, even making it innate would be nice, so it scaled for classes like monk (even though it would be scaling off of charisma which is a little less ideal but better than having to spend four class feats on a caster dedication)

Paizo Employee Marketing & Media Manager

4 people marked this as a favorite.
David knott 242 wrote:


Any idea when the FAQ page will be updated to include the Advanced Player Guide errata? It currently has errata for the Core Rulebook (2 sets), Bestiary 2, and several Lost Omens books, but not yet the Advanced Player's Guide. I would find that more useful than the updated PDFs for the purpose of locating everything that changed.

Soon, I am told. While I can't comment on the content of the errata, (that is beyond my wheelhouse,) I can say that we have systems in place to make future updates smoother, with print product distribution, the PDF update, and the FAQ posting happening together.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber
Sporkedup wrote:
The Raven Black wrote:
People keep asking for changes to feats, classes ..., but errata are not that.

Errata to the alchemist either says otherwise or gave people entirely the wrong perception.

I get the disappointment though. A lot of folks feel that the class is basically a lot of wasted potential and without errata a lost cause. I've yet to have a class at my table elicit such strong and immediate frustration from people playing one (not the alchemist nor oracle). But the concept of the witch, or even the mythological value of a witch, just seems to make the class's perceived or actual weakness to irritate people more.

So I guess the question is, if the witch will not receive any improvements via errata, is it just stuck where it is forever?

I don't think we'll ever see errata to the extent that we saw with the latest CRB errata. Like it or not. The other books are suplements, even if the APG is counted as one of the core four.

That said, I sympathize with those claiming for a Witch buff. I think the Witch is in a tight spot in that its overall kit can be seen and felt as lacklustre. If you pick the other contentious classes, like the Alchemist or the Warpriest, you still have a nice chassis that can be optimized with some system mastery. Heck, a class archetype changing some alchemical item types or uses of divine font for other goodies could even provide players with so called 'fixes'. The Witch, not so much, IMHO.

But then, I only had one Witch player in my table and I let them keep playing with the playtest version since they felt they liked that iteration of the class better.


2 people marked this as a favorite.
richienvh wrote:


That said, I sympathize with those claiming for a Witch buff. I think the Witch is in a tight spot in that its overall kit can be seen and felt as lacklustre. If you pick the other contentious classes, like the Alchemist or the Warpriest, you still have a nice chassis that can be optimized with some system mastery. Heck, a class archetype changing some alchemical item types or uses of divine font for other goodies could even provide players with so called 'fixes'. The Witch, not so much, IMHO.

Witch can absolutely be awesome with system mastery as is, that's never been the issue.

A witch built "correctly" is solid. The problem is the number of traps and "choose wrong" options the Witch has (Rune/wild patron cantrip, eldritch nails, basic lesson is mandatory, etc.)

I've defended WP as an option that works best when you stack spells that don't require saves (mainly heal spells) as a means to make it work at its chassis, and it's window of viability to me is way narrower than a Witch.

A Witch with Stoke The Heart/Evil Eye/Buzzing Bites + Basic Lesson + a good Specific familiar (like faerie dragon) that grabs Cackle is a great character.

A Rune Witch with Eldritch Hair and Nails and a toad is the issue.

So while I am also sad about no Witch buffs, the idea that Witch cannot be built to be effective to me is not at all true.

The issue is the power floor for a witch is way lower than it should be, but I'd argue the ceiling is just fine.

DMerceless wrote:


Being totally honest here, this mentality of "things being slightly too good is a huge problem, but things being bad is not an issue at all" that the designers and a big chunk of the community seem to have is slowly chipping away at all the excitement I once had about the game.

While I can't say it's chipping away at my excitment necessarily, I also don't see why "nerfing Dragon scales/independent/etc. is fine, but buffs are not" sentiment is being paraded around and it's super weird to me.

Buffs generally sell things (people buy champions in League of Legends because of buffs), so it's not only beneficial to the health of the game it's also financially motivating to some extent.

Silver Crusade

6 people marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Pathfinder Accessories, Pawns, Rulebook Subscriber

I mean, the level 16 witch in my Night of the Gray Death game is the bane of my existence, so I feel like it works pretty okay.


2 people marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber

I mean, witches are full casters. Smart spell selection and usage, especially later in the campaign, is really all you need to be functional and acceptably successful. It's the chassis bolted on top of that, in addition to the feat selection available, that marks the witch as a lesser light among the classes.

But that's all not really here nor there. The upshot is this errata did not include any sort of balance pass on any of the classes included, and it's not out of line to assume both that Paizo sees the classes as acceptable as they are and that no significant balancing tweaks are ever forthcoming. And I suppose that's very understandable, even if it's not what I'd prefer to hear.

Paizo Employee Marketing & Media Manager

8 people marked this as a favorite.

The Advanced Player's Guide Errata is live.

Liberty's Edge

Midnightoker wrote:

While I can't say it's chipping away at my excitment necessarily, I also don't see why "nerfing Dragon scales/independent/etc. is fine, but buffs are not" sentiment is being paraded around and it's super weird to me.

Buffs generally sell things (people buy champions in League of Legends because of buffs), so it's not only beneficial to the health of the game it's also financially motivating to some extent.

Power bloat is very definitely one of PF1's failures that PF2 wants to avoid whatever it costs.

And buffing without power bloat needs considerable time and effort (and likely playtest). So, very much out of an errata's purview.


3 people marked this as a favorite.
The Raven Black wrote:
Midnightoker wrote:

While I can't say it's chipping away at my excitment necessarily, I also don't see why "nerfing Dragon scales/independent/etc. is fine, but buffs are not" sentiment is being paraded around and it's super weird to me.

Buffs generally sell things (people buy champions in League of Legends because of buffs), so it's not only beneficial to the health of the game it's also financially motivating to some extent.

Power bloat is very definitely one of PF1's failures that PF2 wants to avoid whatever it costs.

And buffing without power bloat needs considerable time and effort (and likely playtest). So, very much out of an errata's purview.

So you think the mutagenist buffs were playtested then? I'd wager they were not.

And PF1 had more issues with feat traps than it ever did with power bloat. The overall balance between the best and worst feats was stretched in both directions.

Allowing feat traps like Eldritch Nails to continue to be options for players (as well as stuff like Eschew Materials) can be just as damaging to a system.


Aaron Shanks wrote:
The Advanced Player's Guide Errata is live.

Yay!

(The list is missing the changes to Eldritch Archer. The Dedication no longer grants an extra cantrip if you have pre-existing spell slots.)


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder PF Special Edition Subscriber
Sporkedup wrote:
The Raven Black wrote:
People keep asking for changes to feats, classes ..., but errata are not that.

Errata to the alchemist either says otherwise or gave people entirely the wrong perception.

I get the disappointment though. A lot of folks feel that the class is basically a lot of wasted potential and without errata a lost cause. I've yet to have a class at my table elicit such strong and immediate frustration from people playing one (not the alchemist nor oracle). But the concept of the witch, or even the mythological value of a witch, just seems to make the class's perceived or actual weakness to irritate people more.

So I guess the question is, if the witch will not receive any improvements via errata, is it just stuck where it is forever?

I was hoping it was going to get *something*, not necessarily buffed just,,,, made more in line with lore and the like?


4 people marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder PF Special Edition Subscriber
dmerceless wrote:
Being totally honest here, this mentality of "things being slightly too good is a huge problem, but things being bad is not an issue at all" that the designers and a big chunk of the community seem to have is slowly chipping away at all the excitement I once had about the game.

I have to agree, I love GMing for my players but after going from 2 to 12 as a blaster wizard and rarely if ever hitting with one of my attack spells (not hyperbole, I have landed 4 spells in all that time...rarely rolling below a 10), honestly broke my heart and I had to leave that campaign because I just dreaded rolling and wiffing all my slots again and being useless to the party :c. First time I ever dreaded playing a ttrpg, honestly (in sixteen years of experience, mostly as GM).

(I know CC is super strong and the like, but that wasn't my character and I don't like playing that type of class)

I just want my attack spells to hit, I don't want any damage buffs, I just want to hit in encounters.

I was extremely excited for pf2 and loved about every moment of pouring over the CRB, and with all the fun my players have, I was really looking forward to being a player in it.

I still host for my players because they have such a great time, but my fire is very much dimmed at this point, especially with how much of a let down Secrets of Magic was and how bad some of the BotD spoilers have been. Vampire is one of the worst archetypes in the game until like level 17; feels more akin a series of voluntary flaws without any real benefit until past 15 (which most tables don't see) and even then, that's going 9 levels of maybe not dying in sunlight immediately but being a sitting duck until nightfall or indoors.

There is a problem of being dedicated to the same weaknesses but not even remotely emulating the power or survivability. Daywalker should have been slowed 1 at most with an attack penalty and/or dazzled.

I know balance is important but like... maybe tone down damage or something else to at least make it feel better? Lower HP to start but maybe a passive regen sans some of the offensive ability?

Apologies for the tirade, I'm just very crestfallen with how things have gone.


Paizo Superscriber; Pathfinder Companion, LO Special Edition, Pathfinder Accessories, PF Special Edition Subscriber; Starfinder Superscriber
Gisher wrote:
Aaron Shanks wrote:
The Advanced Player's Guide Errata is live.

Yay!

(The list is missing the changes to Eldritch Archer. The Dedication no longer grants an extra cantrip if you have pre-existing spell slots.)

Source?


2 people marked this as a favorite.
Ed Reppert wrote:
Gisher wrote:
Aaron Shanks wrote:
The Advanced Player's Guide Errata is live.

Yay!

(The list is missing the changes to Eldritch Archer. The Dedication no longer grants an extra cantrip if you have pre-existing spell slots.)

Source?

Second printing PDF.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Blave wrote:
Ed Reppert wrote:
Gisher wrote:
Aaron Shanks wrote:
The Advanced Player's Guide Errata is live.

Yay!

(The list is missing the changes to Eldritch Archer. The Dedication no longer grants an extra cantrip if you have pre-existing spell slots.)

Source?
Second printing PDF.

Yes. Specifically, Ed Reppert, they removed the paragraph that granted a second cantrip to those who already had spell slots.

APG, p. 172 wrote:

Eldritch Archer Dedication

You blend magic with your archery, leading to powerful results.
If you don’t already cast spells from spell slots, you learn to cast spontaneous spells and gain the Cast a Spell activity. You gain a spell repertoire with one cantrip of your choice, from a spell list of your choice. You choose this cantrip from the common spells on your chosen spell list or from other spells to which you have access on that list. This cantrip must require a spell attack roll. You’re trained in spell attack rolls and spell DCs for that tradition. Your key spellcasting ability for these spells is Charisma.

If you already cast spells from spell slots, you learn one additional cantrip from that tradition. If you’re a prepared caster, you can prepare this spell in addition to your usual cantrips per day; if you’re a spontaneous caster, you add this cantrip to your spell repertoire.
You also gain Eldritch Shot.

Given that the Beast Gunner and Cathartic Mage dedications copied that paragraph, I would expect them to get the same errata eventually.


4 people marked this as a favorite.

Paizo has a policy that all classes with “witch” in their name must be disappointing. The Witch must be lame so that the Starfinder Witchwarper can continue to suck.


Pathfinder PF Special Edition Subscriber
Xenocrat wrote:
Paizo has a policy that all classes with “witch” in their name must be disappointing. The Witch must be lame so that the Starfinder Witchwarper can continue to suck.

I can honestly 110% believe this.


2 people marked this as a favorite.
NikkiGrimm wrote:
dmerceless wrote:
Being totally honest here, this mentality of "things being slightly too good is a huge problem, but things being bad is not an issue at all" that the designers and a big chunk of the community seem to have is slowly chipping away at all the excitement I once had about the game.

I just want my attack spells to hit, I don't want any damage buffs, I just want to hit in encounters.

Electric Arc.


2 people marked this as a favorite.

I just made it so witches get a feat at first level as most spell casting classes like wizard, druid, or bard have a thing which basically grants them a feat.

No idea why witch missed out but we don't play PFS so we can tweak things as we see them.


4 people marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber

Admittedly, I think part of the issue is that the community picks up on ideas that I don't think are necessarily accepted as fact internally. Like the question of if the Witch even really needs buffs, I kinda don't think it does and I'm playing one right now as a dedicated healer with Life Boost and Flexible Preperation.

Some more lessons would generally be nice just to have more focus magic tailored to what role you want your witch to fulfill, the way Life Boost is ideal for my goals. But overall I think it succeeds in being a fairly average PF2e class-- I wouldn't say its particularly better or worse than the Druid really.


Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber
The-Magic-Sword wrote:

Admittedly, I think part of the issue is that the community picks up on ideas that I don't think are necessarily accepted as fact internally. Like the question of if the Witch even really needs buffs, I kinda don't think it does and I'm playing one right now as a dedicated healer with Life Boost and Flexible Preperation.

Some more lessons would generally be nice just to have more focus magic tailored to what role you want your witch to fulfill, the way Life Boost is ideal for my goals. But overall I think it succeeds in being a fairly average PF2e class-- I wouldn't say its particularly better or worse than the Druid really.

The druid having daily access to all common primal spells vs the witch having a spellbook is a pretty visible power divergence. But I do think beyond that they're fairly comparable. The witch gets more stuff at level 1 and the druid gets more flexibility over the long run.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber
Sporkedup wrote:
The-Magic-Sword wrote:

Admittedly, I think part of the issue is that the community picks up on ideas that I don't think are necessarily accepted as fact internally. Like the question of if the Witch even really needs buffs, I kinda don't think it does and I'm playing one right now as a dedicated healer with Life Boost and Flexible Preperation.

Some more lessons would generally be nice just to have more focus magic tailored to what role you want your witch to fulfill, the way Life Boost is ideal for my goals. But overall I think it succeeds in being a fairly average PF2e class-- I wouldn't say its particularly better or worse than the Druid really.

The druid having daily access to all common primal spells vs the witch having a spellbook is a pretty visible power divergence. But I do think beyond that they're fairly comparable. The witch gets more stuff at level 1 and the druid gets more flexibility over the long run.

Hmm, I'm not so sure, when I played a Wizard 1-17 (with some levels skips) I didn't even use all my spellbook picks-- while obviously being able to get a few of the interesting-but-situational utility spells is nice and probably not neutral, I'd be wary of overvaluing it, especially when a Witch/Wizard can still fit in a few of the most useful situational spells on top of their bread and butter spells for combat or other regularly occurring situations. Especially since normally a prepared caster (like the Druid) has to dedicate the slots at daily preparation, rather than right when they come up against a problem a given spell is perfect for.


Gisher wrote:
Blave wrote:
Ed Reppert wrote:
Gisher wrote:
Aaron Shanks wrote:
The Advanced Player's Guide Errata is live.

Yay!

(The list is missing the changes to Eldritch Archer. The Dedication no longer grants an extra cantrip if you have pre-existing spell slots.)

Source?
Second printing PDF.

Yes. Specifically, Ed Reppert, they removed the paragraph that granted a second cantrip to those who already had spell slots.

APG, p. 172 wrote:

Eldritch Archer Dedication

You blend magic with your archery, leading to powerful results.
If you don’t already cast spells from spell slots, you learn to cast spontaneous spells and gain the Cast a Spell activity. You gain a spell repertoire with one cantrip of your choice, from a spell list of your choice. You choose this cantrip from the common spells on your chosen spell list or from other spells to which you have access on that list. This cantrip must require a spell attack roll. You’re trained in spell attack rolls and spell DCs for that tradition. Your key spellcasting ability for these spells is Charisma.

If you already cast spells from spell slots, you learn one additional cantrip from that tradition. If you’re a prepared caster, you can prepare this spell in addition to your usual cantrips per day; if you’re a spontaneous caster, you add this cantrip to your spell repertoire.
You also gain Eldritch Shot.

Given that the Beast Gunner and Cathartic Mage dedications copied that paragraph, I would expect them to get the same errata eventually.

This change still isn't included in the Official Errata, and immanuel_aj has noted that Archives of Nethys still has the original text.

I know that we usually don't get official responses on errata, but given that the actual book contradicts both of the official online sources, some clarification on which is wrong would be great.

Paizo Employee Lead Designer

10 people marked this as a favorite.

Thanks for the note on the eldritch archer! The FAQ page was, in fact, missing the errata, and has now been updated.


Logan Bonner wrote:
Thanks for the note on the eldritch archer! The FAQ page was, in fact, missing the errata, and has now been updated.

Thank you!

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