Time Bandits

Game Master Monkeygod

Yeah, in order for them to stack, like Loganic says they need to be typed bonuses.

For example my character, The Crimson Countess, only adds her Charisma to fortitude once Despite having the feat My Master's Vitality, and Unholy Resilience.

Agreed with the prior posters. If you remove CHA the second time from Fort / Reflex, that might be sufficient without tanking your charisma down... Having high saves isn't necessarily bad, even by the table. If you are the one person in the party that won't fail a Will save, great! No TPK solely from a group save or suck. But if everything you can do is equally past the 10th/11th blue marks, maybe tone it down then?

I guess what I'm saying is to look at the overall picture, and not necessarily jump to nerfing one of your primary scores just because one area is high.

Don't get me wrong: I am fully ok with nerfing the character! It's no fun to play if you're not all playing the same game. I'll have a look at the math and rules next week...

Thanks for your help!

Question for @VoA, and the group: I realized that spheres can almost entirely replace the Cryptic, so I'm looking at dropping the Cryptic in favor of a full-casting sphere class. Not sure which one yet, but I do not already have a full-casting class so that's fine.

The question is, do I need to give up the Hedgewitch leg of the Tristalt? If not, how does that work - stacking talent access and take the best caster level, or keep everything separate and track caster level by which side of the tristalt took the talent?

Looks like the Wiki says that
"*Class features that two classes share accrue at the rate of the faster class, except for sphere talents, which the character always gains the full amount of for both classes.
*Spherecasters only get the two bonus talents one time.
*Gestalt characters with more than one Spheres class combine their talents (and spell pools, if applicable) and use the higher of their caster and/or practitioner levels. Note that classes that give access to certain spheres at a higher level (such as the Shifter using their class level, rather than caster level, for the Alteration sphere) still can't get a 'basic' power level with that sphere higher than what a Full Caster could. In other words, a 5th-level Incanter/Shifter would only have CL 5 with the Alteration sphere.
*Multiple increases to a sphere's level from getting it as a class ability do not stack. This is most likely to come up when using archetypes. These abilities never intend to offer more than "full" progression, and gestalt characters should respect that intention."

So the first bullet seems to mean that you get to stack talent access, and the third and fourth bullets mean that you use whichever caster level is higher.

That's what I get for diving into an idea too fast... Thank you for pulling that up from the interwebs!

Hey guys sorry work has been busy with the site installation stuff. Got to go back this Friday. Looks like Hercules is too strong based on bench press stuff.

Saves are +25, +21, +25

I think he may just be a bit strong for this level. I'm going to think of a different idea. So he will just leave GP :)

He can also pounce with Dimension Assault with this full attack.

+25/+25/+25/+25/+20/+20 3d8+30 / 3d8+23,

AC 39. DR 10/- Artifact was Nemean Lion skin when worn doubled DR and any energy resistance so that would be DR 20/- Thought about it just adding a flat 10 to DR and Energy resistance as a minor artifact that would still be DR 20/-

So yeah back to the drawing board. Want to be strong but in line with everyone.

Am submitting my new race for my Necro

So yeah back to the drawing board. Want to be strong but in line with everyone.

That's tricky even in normal games. In ones like this keeping everyone near-ish the same power level is insanely difficult.

Hercules "Ruler of the Amazons" wrote:

So yeah back to the drawing board. Want to be strong but in line with everyone.

That's tricky even in normal games. In ones like this keeping everyone near-ish the same power level is insanely difficult.

I would agree however, with the bench press as a guide, it makes it a lot easier.

The harder part I think is for optimizers like myself to choose the non optimized choices.

And the hard part for people like me is to remember to be really good at something instead of just having a little of everything. XD

Nephre, Sekhmet's Wrath wrote:

Hercules "Ruler of the Amazons" wrote:

So yeah back to the drawing board. Want to be strong but in line with everyone.

That's tricky even in normal games. In ones like this keeping everyone near-ish the same power level is insanely difficult.

I would agree however, with the bench press as a guide, it makes it a lot easier.

The harder part I think is for optimizers like myself to choose the non optimized choices.

ditto!

Yeah.... My first go round was looking at all the different passive bonuses I could stack, leading to whopping high attack bonuses. Even for a 20th level character. I scrapped that one entirely.

On a not entirely unrelated note, I think I've made most of my mechanical choices now. Going with Fighter 10 / Cryptic 10 / Incanter 10, replacing hedgewitch instead of cryptic. Had to drop a few things and switch some stuff up to make the swaps, but I'm happier with it now and not dipping for select abilities anymore, which keeps the character sheet cleaner.

Question: when you calculate EDV, do you include precision damage and things like Smite? Or is it base damage only?

Question: when you calculate EDV, do you include precision damage and things like Smite? Or is it base damage only?

Include everything that you can reliably proc. If your precision damage triggers on flanking, and you have a way to "guarantee" flanking (companion, TW feat, spell, etc) that you intend to use, include that precision damage.

Got it! Thanks.

Just about done... I think!

@Monkeygod: does the build work for you? How about the artifact?

Just about done... I think!

@Monkeygod: does the build work for you? How about the artifact?

EDIT: I changed the artifact as, upon reflection, I figured that managing hordes of undead might not be so much fun with so many players involved in the game...

I already made a necro..........

Here is Noctia's Artifact, she herself is almost finished, should be up later today, what do you think, too OP?

@Icestormshadow: All good! The more (undead) the merrier!

Just a reminder, lots of this game will take place in dungeons and similar confined spaces.

Undead minions will be useful, but having a small platoon is probably not overly realistic.

I don't want or really need to have a small platoon, as that would would take too much work on your part, she would Animate Dead if she is desperate for troops, its a boss or powerful person who died, or as punishment. i should add this to her personality

Here is Icestormshadow's Submission, Too OP?

Here is Icestormshadow's Submission, Too OP?

Not at all. If you are concerned, you should check your stats vs the bench press.

Done! Here is my character. :)

I am curious where your giant dodge bonus to AC comes from, Also your AC is 1 highter than Level 17 Blue on bench pressing. I specifically reduced some of my earlier choices to get my AC and saves to where they are at.

And with a drumroll, Nikolsi is completely finished except for anything I've forgotten.

I'm having some serious creative block with Dr.Craven/Bash 's background.

What do you have written so far?

A series of facts.

Rattlebones wrote:

Done! Here is my character. :)

I am curious where your giant dodge bonus to AC comes from, Also your AC is 1 highter than Level 17 Blue on bench pressing. I specifically reduced some of my earlier choices to get my AC and saves to where they are at.

EDV also looks to be, uh, a bit high. I'm seeing 126 ish unless my math is wrong. That's blue at 15th, and better than green at 20th.

EDV is average damage or max?

my worst attack is +10 melee touch, [7d6 B or 7d4 Sonic]

my medium ideal (taking turns to set up first and getting 1 shot per round) is +23 ranged, 12d6+2 B/P + [7d6 B or 7d4 Sonic] + 1d8 B/S/P

my best attack (using a few turns of no damage to set up and thereafter only 1 shot per round) is +24 ranged, 12d6+3 B/P + [7d6 B or 7d4 Sonic] + 1d8 B/S/P [FB] [[SS] or [SF] or [MB] or [DD]] (those letters are damage and/or condition options)

It's a bit more complicated. It's hit chance vs typical AC for our level's CR times average damage, and factoring in crits.

Your medium ideal is about 55 EDV (maybe a bit diff depending how your crit works).

That's solidly between green and blue for our level per bench pressing.

Rattlebones wrote:

Done! Here is my character. :)

I am curious where your giant dodge bonus to AC comes from, Also your AC is 1 highter than Level 17 Blue on bench pressing. I specifically reduced some of my earlier choices to get my AC and saves to where they are at.

Canny Defense (Ex): At 1st level, when a kensai is wielding his chosen weapon, he gains the canny defense ability. This is identical to the duelist prestige class ability of the same name, save that his chosen weapon may be of any type. (+7 dodge)

Unarmored Specialist (Combat): As long as you do not have any armor bonus to AC (such as from wearing armor, or from the spell mage armor) you gain a +2 dodge bonus to AC. At 10th level, this bonus increases to +4. (+4 dodge)

Plus the Dodge feat. (+1 dodge)

"Dodge Bonuses: Dodge bonuses represent actively avoiding blows. Any situation that denies you your Dexterity bonus also denies you dodge bonuses. (Wearing armor, however, does not limit these bonuses the way it limits a Dexterity bonus to AC.) Unlike most sorts of bonuses, dodge bonuses stack with each other."

http://legacy.aonprd.com/coreRuleBook/combat.html#dodge-bonuses

The Crimson Countess wrote:

Rattlebones wrote:

Done! Here is my character. :)

I am curious where your giant dodge bonus to AC comes from, Also your AC is 1 highter than Level 17 Blue on bench pressing. I specifically reduced some of my earlier choices to get my AC and saves to where they are at.

EDV also looks to be, uh, a bit high. I'm seeing 126 ish unless my math is wrong. That's blue at 15th, and better than green at 20th.

This is my first time creating a tristalt character, and I'm not very familiar with EDV. Is 126... problematic? Like, I need to make major adjustments problematic?

The EDV is how much damage you're expected to do in a round. The blue/green/orange ratings are based on a typical amount of HP for our CR. Blue is doing half the monster's HP, green 25%, orange is 12.5%.

A typical Monster of our CR should have ~145 HP, so if you're doing 126, that's way overkill. Blue rating should be ~73 EDV.

edit:
tldr: yes, but good job on your character. There's a lot of games that don't cap via bench pressing, in which your child would be very welcome.

The EDV is how much damage you're expected to do in a round. The blue/green/orange ratings are based on a typical amount of HP for our CR. Blue is doing half the monster's HP, green 25%, orange is 12.5%.

A typical Monster of our CR should have ~145 HP, so if you're doing 126, that's way overkill. Blue rating should be ~73 EDV.

So my damage AND armor class are too high? Hmm... let me think this over.

DeviousDevious wrote:

The Crimson Countess wrote:

Rattlebones wrote:

Done! Here is my character. :)

I am curious where your giant dodge bonus to AC comes from, Also your AC is 1 highter than Level 17 Blue on bench pressing. I specifically reduced some of my earlier choices to get my AC and saves to where they are at.

EDV also looks to be, uh, a bit high. I'm seeing 126 ish unless my math is wrong. That's blue at 15th, and better than green at 20th.

This is my first time creating a tristalt character, and I'm not very familiar with EDV. Is 126... problematic? Like, I need to make major adjustments problematic?

EDV is a statistical representation of how much damage you deal per turn. At 126, you kill creatures of CR 9 or lower in 1 turn and CR 16 or lower in 2 turns. The EDV doesn't factor into the metal ability damage you deal which could incapacitate almost any creature regardless of CR.

Your AC is at a point where rarely anything of appropriate CR will hit you.

In summary,
The character you've built is quite powerful, congratulations. It is so powerful in fact that there is a good chance that you can and would solo encounters. Which is perfect if that was the power level in which you were seeking. It is less perfect if you were desiring to play with other people, who, would probably like to play the game as well.

Disclaimer: This was intended with no malice, merely bluntness.

Mr. Rattlebones wrote:

DeviousDevious wrote:

The Crimson Countess wrote:

Rattlebones wrote:

Done! Here is my character. :)

I am curious where your giant dodge bonus to AC comes from, Also your AC is 1 highter than Level 17 Blue on bench pressing. I specifically reduced some of my earlier choices to get my AC and saves to where they are at.

EDV also looks to be, uh, a bit high. I'm seeing 126 ish unless my math is wrong. That's blue at 15th, and better than green at 20th.

This is my first time creating a tristalt character, and I'm not very familiar with EDV. Is 126... problematic? Like, I need to make major adjustments problematic?

EDV is a statistical representation of how much damage you deal per turn. At 126, you kill creatures of CR 9 or lower in 1 turn and CR 16 or lower in 2 turns. The EDV doesn't factor into the metal ability damage you deal which could incapacitate almost any creature regardless of CR.

Your AC is at a point where rarely anything of appropriate CR will hit you.

In summary,
The character you've built is quite powerful, congratulations. It is so powerful in fact that there is a good chance that you can and would solo encounters. Which is perfect if that was the power level in which you were seeking. It is less perfect if you were desiring to play with other people, who, would probably like to play the game as well.

Thank you, everyone, for the feedback. Like I said, this is my first time making a tristalt character, and I probably went a little overboard.

I'm almost tempted to make a new character entirely, as my to hit is yellow, i have two saves below yellow, my AC is yellow, even my spell DCs are below yellow

I'm almost tempted to make a new character entirely, as my to hit is yellow, i have two saves below yellow, my AC is yellow, even my spell DCs are below yellow

honestly, you'll probably be fine. blue is bascially "need a 20 to hit me or save vs me" and shouldnt necessarily be anyone's goal in more than one category anyway.

I'm almost tempted to make a new character entirely, as my to hit is yellow, i have two saves below yellow, my AC is yellow, even my spell DCs are below yellow

While you are absolutely allowed to make a brand new character,

Recall that this is a team based game. While all the PCs are 'bad guys' I would expect them to buff their allies, if for no other reason than it's hard to get rewarded/paid, if they fail.

yeah im sure we have some people that buff and we definitely have a lot of people who do debuffs

I will be doing quite a bit of buffing, and helping people get into their desired positions. And quite a bit of healing/temp hp granting.

Rattlebones, thanks for breaking down that dodge bonus for me.

Thinking about rolling with this, alongside a SoP based build - Conscript base, plus Incanter for spellcasting oomph, and the Nocturnal Predator archetype for Shifter to glue the two together into something hopefully terrifying.

Updated! Feedback is welcome.

There we go! Alias made (Hi this is Cloakable) and profile filled out with tasty things to see.

Well, time does indeed fly. I just looked back here and realized it's been far longer since I last posted than I thought.

Ah, well. It'd fit my character IC that he'd arrive late as well, so let's go with that. I assume the deadline hasn't passed, if my memory serves? I can get an alias up in the morning if we're still a go for newcomers.

You're good, still plenty of time. There's no true cut off.

Spectacular! Here we go then.