Time Bandits

Game Master Monkeygod


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Ouachitonian wrote:
I’m actually thinking the opposite from most of y’all. I’d much rather go Monster-as-1/3-of-triatalt than limit it to PC races. Now, admittedly that’s because I build in HeroLab, which supports Gestalt but not tristalt, so going straight tristalt would make my build vastly more complicated, since I’d have to hammer it out partially by hand. Besides, for the suicide squad vibe monster races makes a lot of sense. I’m just sad we can’t play dragons or awakened dinosaurs or something else nonhumanoid. lol

there are some nonhumanoids in Co7S. im thinking of a spider just gotta figure out how i wanna do it. probably not good for my build but the thought of a spider amuses me


gyrfalcon wrote:

From the Races section of the first post "custom races are allowed, up to the power level of a Noble Drow." ...and Drow Noble is a 41 pt race.

I don't think Monkeygod has said yet if one can start with a lower point buy race and add to them...but presumably that's implicit, since one could just say "I'm playing custom race that's a lot like a more powerful goblin or grippli or whatever".

uh. I really want a Dwarf Noble


Dotttt


Okay, if peoples are cool with just using the custom race builder, we can do that, and drop the whole monster races, as it does seem to be getting awfully tricky.

And yes, if we go that route, you may absolutely boost an existing race.

As for power level, the Bench Press numbers seem like a good range.


Tenro wrote:
Ouachitonian wrote:
I’m actually thinking the opposite from most of y’all. I’d much rather go Monster-as-1/3-of-triatalt than limit it to PC races. Now, admittedly that’s because I build in HeroLab, which supports Gestalt but not tristalt, so going straight tristalt would make my build vastly more complicated, since I’d have to hammer it out partially by hand. Besides, for the suicide squad vibe monster races makes a lot of sense. I’m just sad we can’t play dragons or awakened dinosaurs or something else nonhumanoid. lol
there are some nonhumanoids in Co7S. im thinking of a spider just gotta figure out how i wanna do it. probably not good for my build but the thought of a spider amuses me

I thought the GM said that races needed to be humanoid. I mostly saw that dragons were ruled out, may have missed some nuance there.


Voice of Awesomeness wrote:

Okay, if peoples are cool with just using the custom race builder, we can do that, and drop the whole monster races, as it does seem to be getting awfully tricky.

And yes, if we go that route, you may absolutely boost an existing race.

As for power level, the Bench Press numbers seem like a good range.

Okily-dokily. How many race points?


Ouachitonian wrote:
Tenro wrote:
Ouachitonian wrote:
I’m actually thinking the opposite from most of y’all. I’d much rather go Monster-as-1/3-of-triatalt than limit it to PC races. Now, admittedly that’s because I build in HeroLab, which supports Gestalt but not tristalt, so going straight tristalt would make my build vastly more complicated, since I’d have to hammer it out partially by hand. Besides, for the suicide squad vibe monster races makes a lot of sense. I’m just sad we can’t play dragons or awakened dinosaurs or something else nonhumanoid. lol
there are some nonhumanoids in Co7S. im thinking of a spider just gotta figure out how i wanna do it. probably not good for my build but the thought of a spider amuses me
I thought the GM said that races needed to be humanoid. I mostly saw that dragons were ruled out, may have missed some nuance there.

Oops you are right. I just decided in my head that since it is Co7S that those races are OK with no OK from the GM.

So, GM, are Co7S races like telepathic jellyfish and spiders OK? And if on the fence, it may help my case that I intend to be a mech suit pilot so maybe that part is humanoid (though I didnt intend it to be initially)


Oh and I'm thinking my signature item will be something of hammerspace


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Oh! I'd expected to keep monstrous PCs...but the more I think about it, the more I think that 41pt custom races + 38pt buy stats + trisalt + custom weird artifacts should really let me build just what I was thinking of...and I suspect it makes balance a good deal easier. The more I think about it, the more I like it!


Okay awesome, I’ll get to work in the race part. I much prefer the idea anyway.

Is it actually 41 Race Points?


I am definitely interested in this! Had a character put together for another game around City of Seven Seraphs that hasn't started up yet (still hoping it does), and all but two of my other games seem to have died off...

I'm thinking a Bloodrager / Inquisitor (with the Pact Protector Archetype from Spheres Wiki) and maybe 1-2 levels of Pactmaker / Harbinger (Path of War). Main role/theme will be the "clever / lucky fighter" - Matt Cauthon, with a little more evil outlook. I'll have to think about race, and depending on where on the benchpress table we are falling (level 10?) I may need to switch it up to not be too overpowered.

EDIT: Also, if your Bat-Belt utility example is actually workable, I would love to make that my artifact.


If we want to use a race from Co7S, like the spiders, how would we calculate how many Race Points we have to modify them?


Hi, everyone! I'm making a doppelganger character, and I was hoping for some feedback about race points.

These abilities do not appear to have an equivalent on the Creating New Races page. Any ideas about potential cost? Or if there are options available and I'm just missing them? I would really appreciate it.

+4 Bluff while using change shape ability.

Immune: charm, sleep

Mimicry (Ex): A doppelganger is proficient in all weapons, armor, and shields. In addition, a doppelganger can use any spell trigger or spell completion item as if the spells were on its spell list.

Perfect Copy (Su): When a doppelganger uses change shape, it can assume the appearance of specific individuals.

Thanks!


Wait, actual Outsider isn’t an option in the Race Builder? That cuts down my build idea immediately.

Maybe I can fix it so that Native Outsider works.


I’m tinkering around with idea of a custom half-elf, half dragon character from the Tolkien middle earth universe. He’d be a creation of Morgoth mixing dragon and elven features somehow with a Mesmerist (Hate-monger)/(?)Antipaladin(Fearmonger) of Morgoth/X. I’ve fiddled around with a bunch of different options for the other class. I’m really torn between a natural attack build to emphasize the dragon (possible bloodrager or barbarian?) or maybe a switch hitter somehow.

For my item, I’m leaning toward a mithral collar that gives some sort of bonus on will saves unless he is being targeted by someone with a keyword/control device in which case he has a severe negative and he can’t take it off.

Any thoughts? Ideas on a class that fits thematically with elves or dragons from middle earth? I’m avoiding draconic bloodlines because I want some of those benefits baked into the race. Ideas on what sort of bonuses for the collar are reasonable? I would like for whoever controls the collar to be able to very reliably control/influence my character.


I'd say +6/-6 for the collar. Maybe 8. Roughly equivalent to a curse spell


Aww, no bogeyman for me, I guess.

I think the 41 is because that's what Drew Noble is?

If probably 'vote'for some version of monster characters or prebuilt races. Race builder just ends up being everyone getting stat bonuses and SLAs and less flavorful in general, IMO.


Gonna have to agree on that. Race Builder has a lot less options available, in terms of abilities and stuff.


I'm thinking of using my artifact to get some of the Shaitan qualities I can't get through the race builder.


My recommendation for the monster races would be to use that one exactly from the Riftwarden recruitment. I thought it was fairly well balanced. I was going to use the legion archon I submitted there and add a couple classes to it. I'll keep an eye out for your final decision and modify my submission as necessary.


Is Trinity Knight a valid prestige class for the game?


Hmmm. Moving up to level 10, does that mean we can use CR 10 monsters? Or even higher, with 4 levels of CR free, then replacing class levels the rest of the way (I think that would be kind of crazy, though)?


Ouachitonian wrote:
Hmmm. Moving up to level 10, does that mean we can use CR 10 monsters? Or even higher, with 4 levels of CR free, then replacing class levels the rest of the way (I think that would be kind of crazy, though)?

As of right now, he’s restricted it to 41 race points of the race builder.


Okay, giving it some more thought, we're going to stick with 41 points and either a custom race, or boosting an existing one.

It's just simpler, it won't cost you any levels(you'll still be a 10th level tristalt, as I don't feel Noble Drow deserves a level hit, *especially* at this power level) and it will cause less confusion for both players and myself.

That being said, I will absolutely work with you guys to try and build the best race possible. This includes making outsider a type, because if undead or construct can be one, so can outsider.

However, don't forget that there's plenty of 3pp races out there that mimic monsters that are acceptable. Like the ones from Rite Publishing, Dreamscarred Press, etc.


So are the non humanoid Co7S races like jellyfish and spider ok?


How many race points would you say these are worth (doppelganger)? I would love to be able to keep the unique abilities of the race, but if that is not possible, please let me know.

Immune: charm

Mimicry (Ex): A doppelganger is proficient in all weapons, armor, and shields. In addition, a doppelganger can use any spell trigger or spell completion item as if the spells were on its spell list.

Perfect Copy (Su): When a doppelganger uses change shape, it can assume the appearance of specific individuals.


I'd say mimicry 6, perfect copy 4, immune to charm I forget what immunities go for but I'd find a similarly common immunity and price it around there. Elven immunities are 2rp and slightly numerically better and approximately as common.


Goodness this thread goes fast. Alright, I'll endeavour to get my character up and statted formally tomorrow. To re-iterate:

Starting level is 10, 38 point buy, one main class that gives saves/BAB/HD and the rest give class features. Start with 3 feats, one extra per level. Pick or make one lesser artifact that is meant to serve as a sort of 'vessel' for whatever special theme or power the character uses, right?


Was it extra feat per level or just extra feat on the levels we normally dont get feats at?


I believe it's one per level, so the normal feat at every odd level, and then one on every even as well.


One feat per level(10) plus 3 bonus first level feats (13 total) plus any racial or class bonus feats.

I can agree with Ten's estimations, and I'll say immunity to charm(with is actually a pretty small subset of spells, as opposed to compulsion) is 3 RP.

However, there's also the Immicker race from In the Company of Doppelgangers from Rite Publishing, which is available for use.


Tenro wrote:
So are the non humanoid Co7S races like jellyfish and spider ok?


Alrighty! I think I'm just about ready then. I'll write up the basic idea before bed, just so people can make suggestions as they wish.

Douglas Everheart was originally a monk who sought the path to enlightenment, just as Irori did. He wished to become the perfect man, and pursue the path of perfection. He adventured, grew strong, and did great things with his life. His story has already been told, to a great degree, in the land he came from, and he's remembered fondly by the people of that land as a savior of countless innocents, incorruptible in his pursuit to higher functioning.

What few people knew what what went on behind closed doors. Douglas was a tyrant in his own home, demanding perfection from his wife, his daughter, and everyone who worked for him. He drove countless people out of his life, and pushed his wife and daughter to the very brink. It was on his daughter's 16th birthday when she was found in her room, having attempted to overdose on medication, that Douglas realized that he had completely missed the point of his god's teachings. Already in his 40s by now, Douglas simply left home, with nothing but the clothes on his back.

For 20 years after this, Douglas spent his time travelling, immersing himself in the seediest and most disreputable gigs you can imagine. He tried every drug he could find, indulged in his impulses far more than was healthy, and began to seek a completely new route to 'perfection', something that he could finally use to show the rest of the world a more realistic standard to follow than Irori's. He began to pursue the alchemical arts, but focused far more on physical augmentation than any nuanced magic. Now nearing the end of his natural lifespan, Douglas is determined to find the secret of immortality somehow, by whatever means necessary, no matter who pays the cost.

TL;DR: LE monk who tossed out Irori's teachings when he almost drove his daughter to suicide, went CN Sin Monk instead. Is now a worshiper of Haagenti, seeking the Divine Experiment his patron is known for. Old Aged human, but uses Mutagenic Warrior to get his physical stats back to the point that he can actually fight alongside the frontliners effectively.

Depending on the party makeup I may even go straight alchemist instead, to get more versatility and support options. TBD.

Scarab Sages

Pathfinder Starfinder Society Subscriber

Do you have a specific format that you'd like to see these submissions?

Also, for everyone's knowledge, I will be submitting a fairly 'Hulk'-y character. I'm going for a bit of an evil version and running with that.

Also, GM, can a slight variation of Pouldrons of the Juggernaut be acceptable for a minor artifact?


Saashaa wrote:

Do you have a specific format that you'd like to see these submissions?

Also, for everyone's knowledge, I will be submitting a fairly 'Hulk'-y character. I'm going for a bit of an evil version and running with that.

Also, GM, can a slight variation of Pouldrons of the Juggernaut be acceptable for a minor artifact?

Oh. That means, we're probably not going on missions together :)

Maybe one of my three classes will add some infiltration aka trapfinding and disable device...


So, I'm not sure I quite grok the Favored Class Bonus thing: if I'm a Human with the Fast Learner feat, do I get +1 Skill Point and +1 HP for every single favored class level?

Edit: I'm also a bit fascinated by the Kingsglaive class from FFD20, but being beholden to a king wouldn't really work well for the character I'm envisioning, so how's this for an Artifact?

Hand of the King: A prosthetic left arm made of crystalized magic, created by the sheer will of a former Kingsglaive turned high traitor, seditionist and rebel when he lost his arm in battle with his former king. The arm has full function, as though it were a flesh and blood arm, and also allows the wearer to utilize the class features of the Kingsglaive class and gain levels in the same without being sworn to a king (though obviously one does not gain the salary of the Kingsglaive Armament class feature). Additionally, when wielding a Glaive from that class, the hand of the prosthetic does not count as occupied for the purposes of Spellcasting and class features such as a Swashbuckler or Fencer's Precise Strike, a Duelist's Canny Defense, or similar.

The Hand of the King can be destroyed if its wielder freely swears loyalty to a king and is then lawfully (though not necessarily justly) executed by that selfsame king.


@GM How restrictive are you with traits? I'm looking at a campaign trait of a campaign we're obviously not playing and a deity-tied trait of a deity I don't want to worship.


So, due to an odd set of circumstances (namely my having an odd number of RP left over and hating increased stats via RP because they're bland and munchkiny), in addition to Common, I have 32 languages to pick.

Suggestions?


Ace has 35. Slacker :P lol


Kinda took the night off from the boards to watch Cloak and Dagger, and my RL friend stream on Twitch.

If somebody could comb the recruitment for all unanswered question and compile them into one post, I would greatly appreciate that. I'll have answers either tomorrow, or over the weekend, as I plan on streaming tomorrow night.


"Ace" wrote:
Ace has 35. Slacker :P lol

But is Ace's INT only 13? :P


What's in my mind:

The character I had ready for other submissions was Gabriel, Sol Invictus. An Aasimar, descendant from a powerful Solar, with powers akin to a bright Sun, etc...

Now, as the character hasn't gone Evil but is somewhat scarred, the idea is to turn him into Gabriel, The Black Sun, descendant of a powerful Solar but turned away from the righteous path, with powers related to darkness, cold and gravity, or whatever. He would be a Lightbringer, captured during the recent Lightbringer Incursion, if that's cool with you, but he would be Neutral and not Evil. Going back to Good would be part of the chronicle.

He'll be a ranged character, possibly infiltrator and we'll see what else. I'll use the Aasimar as a base, and add abilities to give it the proper crunch/fluff (substitute Daylight with Darkness and the like).


Bringing my unanswered question forward:

Tenro wrote:

So, GM, are Co7S races like telepathic jellyfish and spiders OK? And if on the fence, it may help my case that I intend to be a mech suit pilot so maybe that part is humanoid (though I didnt intend it to be initially)


Lets see... From me, I have the following questions:

1. Are we limited to Standard, Advanced, or Monstrous racial traits?
2. Is the innocent Blood Story feat approved for use?
3. What level of the Bench pressing table are we trying to keep to?
4. Is VMC approved?
5. Martial traditions from Spheres of Might/Power trade out your starting proficiency with weapons/armor for a themed set of proficiencies and talents... Are those ok to use?
6. I think we have had this discussion before; would you consider Omenwalker from Harbinger sufficient for Dimensional Agility and it's ilk, in this campaign?

I really like the idea of a Nodachi being wielded as a double weapon, just need to figure out a better solution than Spear Dancing style.

Some others:
Restrictions on traits; specifically deity and campaign specific ones;
A request from Josh Ingle for the minor artifact feedback;
That seems to be it, plus Tenro's question.


starting to build my character. never played in something this high-powered. my race build is looking super OP, but I guess that's the point right?

I am going to be building an undead Gunslinger/Inquisitor/Sorcerer. basically an undead cowboy/bounty hunter pulled in from the Weird West. emphasis on luck, shadows and undeath.

for the artifact I am thinking of making the artifact his gun. either one or a pair, depending on your thoughts on the power level, based on the Pale Stranger's gun abilities.

thinking a pair of guns that magically reload/create their own ammo and never misfire. instead of taking a normal action, one gun can be used for a single powerful shot. if it threatens a critical it automatically confirms, and regardless of the confirmation roll always deals an extra 6d6 damage.

Alternative that might be more flavorful would be a single gun that automatically reloads, doesn't misfire, and once per day as a move equivalent action the wielder can speak the name of his target, granting the gun the effects of Greater Named Bullet on the next shot.

If those look like poor design for an artifact, I can work on picking a non-weapon artifact, or I welcome your help in tweaking this into a workable idea.

I will figure out the rest of the character and post it up soon hopefully.


River of Sticks wrote:

Lets see... From me, I have the following questions:

1. Are we limited to Standard, Advanced, or Monstrous racial traits?
2. Is the innocent Blood Story feat approved for use?
3. What level of the Bench pressing table are we trying to keep to?
4. Is VMC approved?
5. Martial traditions from Spheres of Might/Power trade out your starting proficiency with weapons/armor for a themed set of proficiencies and talents... Are those ok to use?
6. I think we have had this discussion before; would you consider Omenwalker from Harbinger sufficient for Dimensional Agility and it's ilk, in this campaign?

I really like the idea of a Nodachi being wielded as a double weapon, just need to figure out a better solution than Spear Dancing style.

Some others:
Restrictions on traits; specifically deity and campaign specific ones;
A request from Josh Ingle for the minor artifact feedback;
That seems to be it, plus Tenro's question.

Plus the question about the Trinity prestige classes. Pretty sure he will say they aren't allowed but it never hurts to ask.

Also, for races from Co7S how many RP should the base race eat up if we want to modify them?

And much like Tenro, I would like to know if the non-humanoid races from Co7S are allowed for a race.

And for skills, if a skill is considered a class skill for any of the classes does it count as a class skill, or only the class skills of whatever we are using as a base class?

Anyway, I'm looking at doing a Striker or Sentinel/Nexus/Theurge for a character. Might mix Striker and Sentinel, just want one thing from Sentinel lol.


I’m going to try to build a (somewhat runty) Fire Giant with the race builder. I’ve run into one problem already: it doesn’t want to grant elemental resistances unless you have the Outsider type. Normal Fire Giants are just Humanoid (Giant, Fire), but have Fire Immunity. So, can I take that without being an outsider? Alternatively, should I build the equivalent of a Giant Ifrit?

Thinking my artifact will be based on Garvok, the Sword of Wrath, albeit somewhat dumbed-down (and not loyal to a Runelord, obviously). Would that be acceptable?


I was thinking that a good compromise between race builder and monster races would be to allow people to choose either:

1. race build as we have been discussing or pick an existing base race and pump it up to 41 (would have to work with DM for abilities without listed costs for ad-hoc values)

2. pick a monstrous race, use the appropriate ability score generation for them (not point buy). allow either up to 5 free CR (do not get those HD, reduce skill/hp/save/feat values as appropriate) and any remaining subtracts from all 3 classes (still get skill/hp/save/feats from spillover as if they were levels); or NO free CR but the CR only subtracts from 1 class. (still capping HD if you want, though they arent that much in power mostly i dont think) this keeps people from being something CR 14 with gestalt levels on the side, but allows less-powerful beings to be fully tristalt, and the middle road of being a middle-power monster but less tristalt levels all around.

this would allow folks to not have to focus on making their special item special in some way other than just trying to get monster abilities from it that they couldn't otherwise get.


@JankInTheTank As someone also looking at playing a gunslinger myself I think the Spell Cartridges feat from Heroes of Golarion might be of interest to you.

Sovereign Court

I don't see if you have said if with the level increase, you are planning on a wealth increase.

Could we get an answer on that?

Also so folks know:
Building a mostly martial Leader type, lots of support, very high defense, very high face skills.

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