Coldwater's Abomination Vaults

Game Master Quentin Coldwater

How high up is the spider?

The cavern ceiling is 50 feet high. The spider is 20 foot tall, so if you stood right under it, you'd need to have 30 foot reach.

Rough side view (each character is 5 feet):

SSSS------------ Ceiling (50 foot from the floor)
SSSS
SSSS
SSSS
.
.
.
.
.
X
------------- Floor

X is your position, right below the spider S. Since you measure distance from the corner of your square, even though the spider is exactly 30 feet from the ground, the edge of your square is 5 feet high, meaning if you're directly below (or one square adjacent) it, you could reach it with a spell that has 30 foot reach. If you'd want to hit it from a distance though, you'd need a spell with 60 foot reach at least (60 feet is the next increment from 30, right?).

In a few short hours, I will be getting on a flight to Spain and quite likely won't be able to post anything until later tomorrow CET (UTC/GMT+1). I will remain in Europe until mid-April, so you may find that during that time, the times of the day that I post will change accordingly.

Oh!

That is a long trip!

;)

Posting tonite for sure

Cherry Berry, Forbidding Ward is two actions. Do you want to do something else instead?

His staff has a one action +1 AC I think - perhaps that is what he meant

His AC is 32 or higher - anyone have anything to soften him up?

Cherry has a couple of big booms, but just one of each.

Quick note: Fast healing +8 (4 rounds) is for Kka!

Thanks for the correction! Read too quickly, assumed it was on self. Edited post.

When an odd number of damage is divided, I usually give the leftover to the original target. If you disagree, feel free to say so. And thanks for the reminder to heal Kka. -5 from the stare, +8 form the heal, so effectively +3 HP.

Also, escaping takes MAP, so your shortsword attacks would be at -4. That makes the first attack still hit, but the second misses.

According to the Doubling and Halving Damage rules, partial HP damage gets rounded down. So the original 19 HP should have been halved and rounded-down to 9 HP. The only question then is what happens when it gets halved again due to Shield Other (thus the ? in my comment). RAW it would seem that half of 9 should be rounded down to 4, but I agree that that seems a little off in this case, so I'm fine with the principal recipient getting the rounded-off point of HP in these cases.

Good catch on the Escape triggering MAP. It's been a long time since I last tried an Escape, so I forgot about that aspect.

Ah, sorry, poor phrasing on my part. I agree that half of 19 is 9. I was just wondering how that 9 is split. But upon reading the spell, it clearly says this:
The target takes half damage from all effects that deal Hit Point damage, and you take the remainder of the damage.

Half of 9 rounded down is 4. Ths remainder is 5, which goes to Cherry Berry. So technically you get 1 HP back, but I'll leave it as is for now.

Should we try and sneak past the spider, you guys?

I might be skipping too many fights. If you feel like I'm giving you the win too easily here and there please say so, I do want you to feel like you get your level's worth of fights. There will (potentially) be several more fights, so it's not like this is an empty level, I'm just cutting out some of the filler and preventing us from being here for half a year (again). I can tell you what I've cut after we've finished this level, if you want.

You're quite far away from your allies. Do you wanna call them over?

I also want to notify everyone that Follow the Expert is a good option if you're not trained in Stealth. It allows you a +10 plus DEX on your Stealth check instead of your own Stealth mod (assuming Kka is Expert in Stealth, which her bio reflects). I've seen this used only once, and it's super useful.

And here I thought Kka was "leading the way" :)

Generally speaking, when Kka heads off to scout ahead, she's kinda expecting the others to follow closely, or at the very least offer an alternative suggestion. In the end though, she has no control over what the rest of the group actually decides to do... or not do.

I can also vouch for Follow the Expert; in other adventures it's been super useful for things like sneaking around as a group. And, yes, Kka is an Expert in Stealth (and Thievery).

As a general rule, Lough always follows Kka.

There have been like two times Kka said “I’ll be right back” that has been the exception to this general SOP.

I already stopped my mini at the spider because I know Lough will set it off.

=)

I specifically asked here where the others are because they might not want/be able to sneak past the spider and wanted to check in what they wanted to do. But yeah, in general, I assume they follow when the coast is clear.

Standing by to roll a check to Lie to gain temporary allegiance - lemme know if we wanna go that way

If "passing back up" is going to be a problem, let's revisit activating at least one of the teleport rooms please. (Before we go down anywhere)

If "passing back up" is going to be a problem, let's revisit activating at least one of the teleport rooms please. (Before we go down anywhere)

Best as I can tell, we've found at least one other way (probably two) to access the next level the old fashioned way. There's a set of stairs going down at the end of the hallway to the west from the caligni room though the secret door. There's also the ladder leading down into the chasm near the giant spider.

Not sure if the drow's way down is the ladder in the chasm, but the way they're talking, I suspect it is yet a third way down guarded (or at least with access controlled) by drow in some manner. I suspect it will be behind one of the black boxes in the drow area we're currently exploring.

Assuming that the next level is somewhat connected, we should be able to reach one of the other ways up from whichever way down we use, so I'm not worried about the drow stopping us from leaving.

My main concern is that the next level is likely designed for 9th level PCs and unless we magically level-up on the way down the stairs, we may find ourselves a little unmatched by whatever critters are down there.

Cherry really doesn't want to supply weapons to someone, lets us remember, is preparing to attack their town.

However, as a reminder, it is Anathema for Cherry Berry to tell lie.

Hey all, you might've noticed that the PbP has been stagnating lately. Kka has even messaged me privately, and I have her permission to mention that here (pretty sure Kka's player is male, but I'll keep referring to her as female, for ease). I will use the points she raised and add in my own comments, to show this isn't just me complaining as a GM. Also, Kka, if you feel like I'm putting words in your beak you do not agree with, please say so. Don't want you to feel like my puppet.

Note that I do not wish or intend to point blame to anyone in particular. If you feel like I'm singling you out, please say so.

Well, the big thing is, Kka feels like she's been pulling the adventure a lot lately. At the start there was a nice interplay between all the characters and while more characters were more proactive than others, characters interacted more with each other and progressed the story as a group. But lately, it feels like Kka is making all the decisions by herself and the rest is just following along. I raised this point during last level up, but people were content to continue. But now Kka feels like her interest in this campaign has run out, and frankly, I echo her sentiment. I liked the banter between everyone, but everyone now mostly just follows in Kka's footsteps. Maybe it's just that we've been doing this for over 3 years. Maybe it's because of the repetetive nature of the AP. But I get the feeling people aren't as invested in this game anymore (and I don't blame anyone for that!). Maybe it's time to wrap up this campaign.

I also said this to Kka: level 9 is basically a big turf war between three deadlocked factions and some random monsters in between. Storywise it isn't too interesting. The drow here are open to an alliance, but you don't seem to keen on that (completely understandable from your characters, again, no blame), but that would mean another faction to wipe out. Level 10 is relatively short with several nasty monsters and Belcorra herself, but nothing really to RP with. I think you've encountered the most interesting things down here so far. I could let you level to 10 and jump straight to the final boss battle, but that would mean a lot of effort just for the sake of a lukewarm conclusion to a campaign that has gone cold. I mean, I'm up for it if you want to, but it seems perfunctory.

Again, I don't blame anyone for losing interest. We've been going at this for 3,5 years now, and a lot has changed. The pandemic is over, people have partners and offspring, life just goes on. I'm definitely interested in finishing this campaign, but not as it currently is. People have been noncommital about this for several levels now, and I think it's just a good moment to pull the plug. Do people agree?

If GM wants to step down, I support the move.

If GM wants to run a slog of battles from 9th to 11th, I am keen to fight or die.

If GM wants to join as a player while another GM takes the reins, and the other players agree, I volunteer to GM the remainder of the AP, as I am motivated to see this through. In such a case, I would probably attempt to recruit a 5th as well, pulling first from people I have games with in PFS.

Lmk!

GM Kwinten relayed my thoughts accurately, and, yes, for the record, I (the player) am male.

For several levels now, the feeling of burnout for this adventure has been creeping up on me and I've been slogging on hoping that it might take a turn for the better (or at least not get worse), but that hasn't happened. I appreciated the changes made by the GM a level or two back to try and improve the situation, but in the end it didn't make enough of a difference; the dungeon-crawl nature of the AP and the increasing lack of enthusiasm and interest from the players with every passing month (me included), have finally and definitively tipped the scales from enjoyment to chore.

At this point, I don't think there's anything that would make me want to continue with this adventure. My druthers is to just call it a day and relieve us all of the burden of continuing. The fun I get from Pathfinder isn't in the mechanics of the encounters but in the role-playing and character development, so the thought of finishing up this adventure with a string of battles is not appealing in the least. Changing up GMs doesn't seem like a viable solution either as my issues have nothing to do with the GM, who has done a great job and continues to do so against all odds.

If the rest of the players wish to see this through in some manner, then I am happy for Kka to be killed off, replaced, or botted by someone else.

I've enjoyed this adventure, and this is my first PF2 and first online long-term campaign. It's had its ups and downs, but overall I've enjoyed it and the characters we have. This is also the only online campaign I have on the forums here which adds it's own technical issues.

Since we've started, I've gained 2 kids, which is the primary chaos-vector of my life. It's definitely been hard to keep up, and sometimes I posting *anything* seems better than not. Especially the last five months for me. Even writing this I was interrupted multiple time, so likely parts of this will be rambling/out of order.

I think part of it is definitely just the dungeon crawl aspect of it. As a caster, Kvit is naturally not going to lead ahead and doesn't have the face skills to be the party speaker. Going to "whatever door is next" doesn't leave much of a choice to make or debate. There doesn't seem to be room for much in the way of "creative" solutions either to avoid fighting the next thing. It definitely improved based on the last discussion and skipping uninteresting fights or scene that would be too drawn out. I appreciate the efforts and it's been noticable.

In the grand scheme of this adventure, there doesn't seem to be any reason (except for a few barriers) to clear a floor completely. Just find the stairs and move down. As players we only need to do that to level up and get loot. If our main goal is to take out Belcorra, it would make most of the rest of the shenanigans going on down here a moot point. Instead of making and alliance or whatever, it seems like we should just be able to take out one faction enough to find the stairs down. I think my difficulties in RPing are lack of character motivation. Or at least the player not having a good idea on why Kvit is doing this, and being so meticulous in clearing out every bad thing down here on the way. Kvit has brought up a few times variations of "just leave it alone and let's keep moving". He and I have brought up at several points we should get the teleport rooms started up to crickets.

I do see Kka's point. And they definitely put in more effort in their posts as far as descriptions and dialogue than me. I will be really sad to see you go but understand the issues. I do want to continue this adventure, even just to finish it however. If nothing else, just to complete my first AP. I can't promise I will post more often or more detailed, but I can promise to try.

I enjoy GM Kwinten's GMing and don't think that's the issue. I am also okay with Lough/Rainzax GMing if that's what it comes down to. I love your character as Lough and could see that creative effort coming through well as GM.

Just in case any of the above isn't worded clearly, maybe this will help.

- I've enjoyed playing with each and every one of you
- Part of this is definitely my fault for not posting more often or more comprehensively
- Part of my inability to post comprehensively is lack of character motivation or my creative ability to figure something out for them day-to-day during clearing floors.
- I want to and am willing to continue on, but I can't promise I'll be able to post more, but I will try, and as the youngest kid is getting a little older things are starting to get to a little bit of a more consistent routine for me IRL here.
- I'd prefer to have GM Kwinten continue on since they've been doing such a good, but am fine with Rainzax taking over if needed.
- I don't want to see Kka go, but I understand and wish you well if you go. I'm sorry for my part in making you feel this way. This is supposed to be a fun game and diversion, and it shouldn't feel like work.

I'd just like to re-state (or clarify, if I wasn't clear) that I don't plan on quitting as GM if the others still want to continue. It's just that I can see Kka's frustrations with the game, in that Kka's the only proactive player. I would also like to see this through to the end, but my fear is that, if worst comes to worst and Kka drops, it won't solve the problem of the lack of people participating.

I dunno, maybe a change of GM would be a nice change of pace, breathe a little fresh air into the campaign. I hate to put it to an ultimatum like this, but I feel the bottom line is this (speaking for Kka more than me): something needs to change, otherwise this campaign can't continue.

And it's fine if things can't change. As said, people are busy and I don't blame anyone for participating less than others. But right now it feels like we're just stuck in place.

I have tried to start this post 4, now 5 times, nope 7 times.

I've been trying to think about what to say and I agree that I've been slacking a lot lately.

Cherry was always designed to be passive, a naive being in over their heads, and I don't think they've really grown away from that in any real way. Also not helped by Cherry being unable to lie on a floor where I think deception is going to be the easiest way.

It's also helped much by me hoarding spell slots way too much considering the size of a floors I really should be casting one or two leveled spells every floor, but we completed floor 8 with less than half my spells used.

That being said, this is my second longest AP run ever, only beaten out by a remote game that went PbP, has almost stalled out several times, and is finally going back to remote this week.

I would like to see this to the end, with whatever changes need to be made to make it there.

I'll admit to a spiral of shame when it comes to posting.

I've been in the shame spiral, and it sucks. Hope you get out of it! And even if you don't, I still enjoy Cherry Berry's contributions a lot, so don't feel pressured. This is still supposed to be fun.

Passive characters are tricky, I've had the same thing happen to me as well. Without proper investment, you don't feel attached to the story. Could I help in any way to help facilitate that? I have some ideas in the back of my head about this. Or maybe this is the level where Cherry Berry finally snaps and realises being proactive is the way to go. For several levels you've only encountered creatures that don't want to live peacefully, and CB's finally fed up with it. Character growth doesn't have to be external, you can just decide now to change. Again, I'm willing to help if you need it.

---

I got a message from Farol. Apparently they've been contacted by rainzax* and they would like to join the campaign, if people want to have them. They've played up to most of book 2, so they're familiar with the story. They could easily slot in after this level and change up party dynamics a little. I've been in several PFS scenarios with them, they're a fun player and from what I know they put effort in their posts.

* I don't mind you talking to other people about this, but it does feel a little "behind my back." No bad feelings, but in the future I would appreciate a "hey, I think I know someone, mind if I give them a nudge?"

... something needs to change, otherwise this campaign can't continue.

...

If this is the main sticking point, what needs to change or what can I/we do? What is it that you want to change, if you can put your finger on it?

Not buying or selling anything, mainly brainstorming things that could change. Some bigger than others

I didn't see GMs post just before I posted

Seconded about Cherry's character, they are enjoyable, even though they're quiet. Perhaps you could do more with just describing what they are doing instead of talking. (Hiding behind Lough, silently shaking their head in disapproval of the Drow, etc)

I'm okay with this Farol character from that but if info. They sound like a good fit, especially since they're familiar with what's happened so far. (Though I also feel the party should talk about potential recruits before. If only especially since we're working through communication issues here, so it's probably better to over communicate)

Heh, I think our posts just crossed. I think Farol as an extra player would already help, but I really appreciate your input, Kvit! I'm gonna comment on some of these. I might sound negative regarding some of them, but I don't mean it as a critique on you. Again, really happy you're thinking along.

I think mostly people need to post more, and make decisions. That takes the load off of Kka, and gives people more to interact with. With more interaction, people will be inclined to post more, leading (hopefully) to a positive spiral.

Adding an NPC could help with the former, but again, it requires interaction. I can just drop a clown in, but that would break immersion and if no one comments on it, it's still a moot point.

Changing platforms wouldn't help, I think, but if people say they'd much rather play using a different platform, I'm definitely open to that.

Picking a day of the week to post is a good idea, but I don't want people to feel forced to post if they don't have the time. And skipping a day due to real life could reinforce that shame spiral I'm trying to avoid. Other suggestions in a similar vein (posting frequency/party leader of the week, and so on) also seem more punishing than rewarding, IMHO.

I'm sort of doing maximum wait times already. I try to gauge when a conversation is over or when a consensus has been reached, but I could be off. Please say so when I am.

Similarly, posting a schedule seems to put more pressure on the game than I'm comfortable with. Positive reinforcement like extra awards would be cool, I just need to think of what, exactly.

I'm okay with this Farol character from that but if info. They sound like a good fit, especially since they're familiar with what's happened so far. (Though I also feel the party should talk about potential recruits before. If only especially since we're working through communication issues here, so it's probably better to over communicate)

Yeah, definitely this. If Farol gets added (that's still an "if"), they would need to fit the party. Is there a specific build or class you'd like to see added (or don't want added), or can Farol just drop in with whatever?

EDIT: I've been keeping things in the back of my head just for funsies. Potentially interesting characters to add could be:
- One of the mitflit gang (and one morlock) from the first level that are still wandering around.
- Dorianna Menhemes could join as a fully-grown Psychic (we'll just handwave how she just jumped to level 8).
- Carman Rajani could join as a second Rogue (or Rogue-type).
- The wolf guy from a few levels back hasn't been dealt with. You could "recruit" him.
- Maybe one of the drow, caligni, or the mad urdefhan on this level could become a party member through shenanigans (I'll need to homebrew some ancestry feats, but could be cool).
- Murmur?
- Borbo in his own new body.
- Some person from the bar a few levels back, maybe even a band member.

No worries on critiquing the ideas, I just brainstormed some things that would be a "change" to how we're going currently.

I didn't even consider we could try to have someone create a character from "within" the adventure already. Thank would be pretty awesome and I like every one of those options. Murmur would be difficult to RP/communicate but it could be done, especially if we say, take them up to the dawn flower cathedral to get "restored".

Kvit has thievery and some lock picking abilities, kka was always able to handle things easily so I stopped having kvit try to aid her rolls. He could also pick up more stealth spells like invisibility. So we don't *have* to have a rogue necessarily.

Someone able to deal decent damage in a fight is probably the most important for a replacement I think. (Kvit has been a poor combatant but that's partially due to a consistent series of poor rolls and no scaling/item buffs to spell attacks/DCs I think.)

...

For the brainstorming ideas above, one thing to add/tweak. Instead of a schedule or timeline, maybe a "we're 50% through the book" update so we can see if we're progressing?

Oh yeah, Murmur definitely assumes you're breaking the Feeblemind, of course. And yeah, I thought adding a character you have some history with already gives you a closer bond with than "Wrin found someone, good luck."

A "progress bar" could be a good idea, gives you a sense of progress. Maybe with some goodies at certain intervals. Seems maybe a little too (meta)game-y, but could be a good idea. Also helps with preserving spells and such. The details of how much to show (increases of 10%? More? Less? Or X out of Y battles fought?), could be hashed out if we decide to use it.

Hey y'all, since my name was mentioned at least three times I will pop up as Beetlejuice ;)

So yeah, I was playing this AP till most of the end of book 2 when we stopped. I would like to finish the AP as I really liked it ;) I know, since we had exactly same conversation that recruiting someone for last book of 3 book AP is not easy, as either you get someone who does not care for the other part of the story, and it does not frequently feels right.

Since I believe in creating the opportunities I decided to go on a limb and reach out in here, that maybe old Farol is the answer to some of the doubts and troubles. I don't mind playing any character, diving into an NPC would be an interesting experience that's for sure. Wolf guy could be a bit easier for me to jump into, Dorianna wouldn't be bad either (maybe as a summoner or as mentioned psychic, altho I know the class very briefly). From the comp I feel that the group can be beefier on the front side. The NCP could be held in one of the rooms + any one who would be tortured/held/incarcerated would have a good reason to look for revenge (enemy of my enemy make a good start for joining).

Anyways, I don't want to impose myself, just present an option, I played few AP's on the boards and sticked till the end. My work turned a bit more messy, but as a result of that I tuned down the amount of tables that I play and GM at the same time to keep it under control. i like RP'ing and I like interactions with other players. I know Kwinten, who is an amazing GM (flatteries will get you everywhere), I know rainzax (who's PCs I really really enjoy, and I like playing with him), the same goes for Palandri (amazing player, highly engaged). I don't know Tarthrin nor Trscroggs but I would love to meet them and play with them (in the end a stranger is someone that you haven't met yet).

All in all, if you would be interested in me joining, I would be honored, if you don't want that, no hard feelings...

Looks like GM wants to remain in the saddle.

I’m down to play, down to run, either way.

Lmk!

I'd like to see Cherry's input on a new member just to get unanimous consent, but I think Farol seems like a good fit. Both in style and since they've done most of book 2. I agree someone more on the frontlines would be nice since Cherry and Kvit are full casters.

Progress bar might a simple enough option (even without extra benefits, but that could just be for funsies). I wouldn't make it too granular because that'd make it more work to keep updated. Even 25%/50%/75% might be sufficient.

One thing I can do is try to post if I'm waiting on someone else, for more clarification, have nothing to add, planned update time, etc. (instead of not posting)

One thing I can do is try to post if I'm waiting on someone else, for more clarification, have nothing to add, planned update time, etc. (instead of not posting)

Yeah, this is a good suggestion. I hope this also incentivises people to post more, even an "busy right now, hope to post tomorrow/the day after" would be helpful. And indeed, an "I have nothing/don't want to add anything" also helps to know people are at least keeping an eye on things, and is hopefully low effort enough that it doesn't feel like a burden to people.

Indeed, I would like unanimous agreement on adding a new player. But in case Cherry Berry agrees, I'd like to provide a little more information on the NPCs I mentioned earlier so maybe Farol can start brewing. Or they can make their own character, I just think it's cool if it's a character you've already met.

- The party "freed" a couple of mitflits on the first level, and they've been running around the Fogfen, and they became a recurring background thing in the first book, after which I faded them out. I think I had one turn into a Druid/Ranger type with a pet bear. The other two I don't remember as much. A morlock tinkerer joined that party after level 2, and I had him pegged as an Inventor.
- You're already familiar with Dorianna Menhemes. She's a latent Psychic, but a Summoner would be cool too.
- The party found a loophole and managed to keep Carman Rajani alive. He's been rebuilding the Danwflower Library after he set part of it on fire, and he has a bit of a redemption arc. He's a Rogue type, but I could see any martial working for him. In the adventure he fights with a longsword and can throw light hammers.
- You seemed to have an interest in the wolf guy. The party failed their knowledge checks, so they don't know this, but he's a werewolf (beastkin would also work as a PC) and a murderer who fled into Gauntlight a long time ago. He has a pet wolf (but if you don't want a wolf, you can leave him at home) and fights with katars. He's officially a Druid, but I can see Ranger working for him as well. He's escaped Gauntlight and is now harassing a Druid group nearby, eating their sheep. They've requested that Cherry Berry deal with him, but we never got to that part. Could maybe also give Cherry Berry a reason to interact more and be less passive, if they're okay with that.
- The level the party is currently on is full of drow, caligni, and an urdefhan. There's no playable ancestry for them, so we'll have to homebrew something, but they could definitely tag along.
- The party just picked up a Feebleminded medusa. They could break the curse and have her join. Typically medusas fight with a bow, but any weapon would work, really.
- Mister Beak, from all the way back at level 1 is a goblin named Borbo that's been put in a soul gem. Lough has kept it around and used it as a power source for his mechanical arm. Lough could maybe construct a full body for him if you're interested.
- There's a bar a few levels back that has plenty of people you could pick up. There's a drider, several morlocks, a few of those augmented morlocks, and the band Shadow Malice, consisting of a xulgath, duergar, caligni, and a ratfolk. They could be great Warrior Bards. Most of them have some band-related custom moves I'd be happy to share with you.

Any of these pique your interest? Again, you can also make your own character, but these could be introduced a little more naturally. You could also be a prisoner on the next level, but that would mean waiting for a bit until the party reaches you, which might not be ideal.

For what it's worth, I think Farol would make a great replacement player. He's always been great to play with and is also an excellent GM.

Is that your way of saying you want to leave, or just chiming in they're a good addition?

I agree, I've played with Farol for a few games, both a great GM and player.

Is that your way of saying you want to leave, or just chiming in they're a good addition?

I believe I've been quite clear about my wishes to wrap up the adventure and call it a day, and that if the rest of the players wish to see this through in some manner, then I am happy for Kka to be killed off, replaced, or botted by someone else. Nothing in the discussion so far has changed my mind on this point, nor is it likely to do so given the degree of burnout I'm feeling about the AP.

I frankly can't think of a better person to take my place than Farol and I sincerely hope you finish this adventure up on a high note with him in my stead. If he wants to take over Kka, then fine by me, but it sounds like he'd rather bring in a new PC of his own. If so, then I'd suggest going with a PC capable of at least acting as a front-liner that can do reasonable levels of damage, otherwise there may be problems.

Nothing in the discussion so far has changed my mind on this point, nor is it likely to do so given the degree of burnout I'm feeling about the AP.

For a moment I was hoping to be that factor that would change your mind ;) But personally I understand the feeling of burnout with AP...

And anyway, thank you all for kind words.

GM Kwinten wrote:

Is that your way of saying you want to leave, or just chiming in they're a good addition?

I believe I've been quite clear about my wishes to wrap up the adventure and call it a day, and that if the rest of the players wish to see this through in some manner, then I am happy for Kka to be killed off, replaced, or botted by someone else. Nothing in the discussion so far has changed my mind on this point, nor is it likely to do so given the degree of burnout I'm feeling about the AP.

Ah, my apologies. I hadn't realised how burnt out you were. I had thought (or maybe hoped) a new party member would revive your enthusiasm, but I completely understand being burnt out. Regardless, I would like to thank you so incredibly much for being such an enthusiastic player and keeping the loot sheet up to date and stuff. I will miss you, and I hope we'll see each other in PbP again.

----

I understand the wolf guy not being a great fit. Dorianna as a playable character would be cool, with either Aesephna or Kka as an eidolon (just for reference, Kka is female. :)).

You could also take over Kka's character, if you feel like it (and her owner allows). Might feel a bit weird to play a "second-hand" character, but I'd like to offer it as an option anyway.

Which reminds me, there are also several other older party members you could pick up, if you wanted. There's Sam, a human monk fighting with bow and arrow (dropped relatively early on because the player didn't really have a connection to the character, and thus the adventure), Gyozara, a gnome sorcerer (dropped because they started GMing this adventure and didn't feel like playing it again), and Fuìn, a kayal reach fighter (life got too busy, had to drop the game). If you like the sound of any of them, take a look through the old party members in the Characters tab.

If Farol were to join with a brand new character, I don't expect them to fill the exact niche Kka occupied. I will allow players to freely retrain some skills and skill feats if necessary. For Farol's sake: Kka was the medic of the party: she had Battle Medicine and the important Medicine skill feats for out of combat healing. She also was the default trap disabler (I handwaved out of combat healing away to speed things up, but having Ward Medic and Continual Recovery would be nice to have for the fiction of the game). She also demoralised a lot, but that was her personal playstyle, I don't expect you to fall exactly into those footsteps. Not sure you have room for that on a Summoner chassis.

I saw free archetype , any other rules for creating PC? Uncommon rare options ? How about the gold , standard rules?

Free archetype rule, and I made a small addition to it: You can have different "tracks" for your archetypes, allowing you two archetypes at the same time. I hope this makes sense:
- Free archetype feats have to be archetype feats. No double-dipping on class feats.
- Your regular class feats can become archetype feats, including free archetype ones, or start a new archetype.

For instance, if your Free Archetype is Acrobat, you can choose Celebrity Dedication as your normal class feat. Free Archetype feats can be spent on Celebrity or Acrobat feats, but not on main class feats. You still must choose three archetype feats before grabbing a new archetype.

Needlessly complicated? Yes. But it allows for a little more variation, if people need it.

I'm fine with most uncommon options, just let me know beforehand. I doubt I'll veto them, I just want a heads up. Definitely let me know if you're looking ar Rare options.

Normal gold for level 8.

Preferably choose a background from the AP, if it makes sense. Ties you a little bit more to the story.

Wealth by level

So it looks like either:

Permanent items of levels 7th: 1, 6th: 2, 5th: 1, 4th: 2 and 180gp

Or

lump sum of 1100gp

Ok, I should be ready for monday, I am going with Bibliophile background, I think she was a human sio that is my choice (first human PC in PF2 ;))
I have the general idea, I still decide on the archetype (mixed between Medic/Rogue/bard or Bless one for lay on hands).

For Skills I should be able to cover Thievery/Medicine + Intimidate but without any other face skills as I saw that we have them covered by others.

I still haven't done the equipment or spell selection. So a bit of work for me

Sorry for not commenting earlier. I took a major injury on Tuesday and am still going 'ouch' whenever I move too much. (I'll recover, no surgery needed, just really strong meds.)

I'll miss you Kka, you are the only reason we got as far as we did.

Just FYI, having site access issues today and yesterday. Took multiple tries to get here.

Ouch Cherry! Hope you recover well.

If you don't want to cover thievery, Kvit does have it and/or could pick up some Knock spells.

I know we aren't considering switching platforms, but if anyone wants to contact me on discord, as a backup contact option:

And I'm also assuming we're going to continue pausing the story until Farol is ready.

We were about to take care of a huge ceiling spider.

Farol could come in a number of ways, especially if we think of a way for Kka's exit.

We could say Kka is in the battle with us with the spider but gets poisoned or grievously injured and we have to take her back to the surface to recover. Then meet Farol somewhere along the way. Farol could bot Kka during that fight. (Or use their own character's stats and act as Kka for the fight until the switch).

One easy way to introduce Farol would be to have Farol be one of the spidersilk-wrapped victims. Then we rescue them (before or after the spider fight).

...

Side note on thievery, Kvit could have +15 to thievery without retraining, and up to +17 with retraining. And +4 to either if I learn and prepare the Knock spell. I'm sure there's probably a spell for disabling traps maybe.

Ouch Cherry Berry! I hope you recover soon.

Cherry Berry: do you agree with adding Farol to the group? You're the only one I haven't seen a definitive "yes" from.

---

As for the pause, I was ready to skip the last bit, but we could do a quick trip back up to pick up Farol. How do the others feel about that? Also depends on what Farol wants to do with their character. Farol, could you PM me with what you intend to do? So I can inject you into the narrative a little easier.