@Sebecloki
Well, I am not familiar with the combo, but as long as it is not abusive I'm OK. By abusive I mean like the Summoner synthesist.Do you still need me to review the sheet or are you thinking of going in a different direction than what you have?
I'll have the opening post up in a minute. No crunch will be needed for that, just role-play. So it would be a good idea to settle on something even if you do not have the crunch and exact details worked out on your character sheet.
@Lady Vulpina of Katapesh
spoilering parries and ripostes is a good idea.
I'm still looking over options. I should have something together by tomorrow
That's good. I put the opening post up to have you each intro your characters.
I've decided to go with a sap master build with unchained rogue/snake bite brawler/assassin. I'm still putting the sheet together
does anyone have a blank form of that template with all the [b][/b] etc. tags already in it? I think I've basically finished my build but I need to finish uploading it here.
miteke has one as one of his alias but he will DM you the text if you want to use it.
If you download PC gen you can export the character formatted for the forum. You will need to update if for miteke's requirements.
If those don't work show me the basics of your build and I will DM you a formatted sheet from my copy of PCGEN.
I found the one in the alias, but I'm going to have to re cut-and-paste all the tags for that, which I'd like to avoid doing if possible.
I'm making a Brute (strength-based Rogue/Sap Master) build
Human Unchained Rogue 1 (Thug/Scout)
Str 19
Dex 13
Con 14
Int 10
Wis 13
Cha 7
TRAITS:
Reactionary
You were bullied often as a child, but never quite developed an offensive response. Instead, you became adept at anticipating sudden attacks and reacting to danger quickly.
Benefit: You gain a +2 trait bonus on initiative checks.
Bruising Intellect
Your sharp intellect and rapier-like wit bruise egos.
Benefits: Intimidate is always a class skill for you, and you may use your Intelligence modifier when making Intimidate checks instead of your Charisma modifier.
FEATS:
Sap Adept (Combat)
You know just where to hit to knock the sense out of your foe.
Prerequisite: Sneak attack +1d6.
Benefit: Whenever you use a bludgeoning weapon to deal nonlethal sneak attack damage, you gain a bonus on your damage roll equal to the number of sneak attack damage dice you rolled.
Weapon Finesse (Combat)
You are trained in using your agility in melee combat, as opposed to brute strength.
Benefit: With a light weapon, elven curve blade, rapier, whip, or spiked chain made for a creature of your size category, you may use your Dexterity modifier instead of your Strength modifier on attack rolls. If you carry a shield, its armor check penalty applies to your attack rolls.
Special: Natural weapons are considered light weapons.
Stealth, Perception, and Intimidate
Sap Adept (Combat)
You know just where to hit to knock the sense out of your foe.
Prerequisite: Sneak attack +1d6.
Benefit: Whenever you use a bludgeoning weapon to deal nonlethal sneak attack damage, you gain a bonus on your damage roll equal to the number of sneak attack damage dice you rolled.
If I have another, then also:
Improved Unarmed Strike
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So, at its most basic we have
Casper, Rogue
Katsumi Ishikawa, Fighter
Lady Vulpina of Katapesh, Swashbuckler
Lupe Fiasco, Cleric
Rahella, Arcanist
Sarona, Witch
Looks like a very well rounded party. I will be doing my best to adjust the encounters once I get a feel for the power level of the party so that the encounters are challenging but not overwhelming and not a boring cakewalk. I dislike encounters where the PCs finish of the enemy in one round about as much as I dislike it when they run into something they are outclassed by. Feel free to chime in if you feel like the encounters need to be budged in one direction or the other.
Sap Adept (Combat)
You know just where to hit to knock the sense out of your foe.Prerequisite: Sneak attack +1d6.
Benefit: Whenever you use a bludgeoning weapon to deal nonlethal sneak attack damage, you gain a bonus on your damage roll equal to the number of sneak attack damage dice you rolled.
If I have another, then also:
Improved Unarmed Strike
It should be in your DMs
Forgot my FCB and just realized there may be a couple of racials I might want to pick up; I’ll update in the morning with deets!
I'd like to grab Duplicitous, which normally replaces Kitsune Magic, so +2 RP, which should become +4 RP, which is... exactly as many BP as I have left over!
Okay, I think I'm almost done --
@DM can I check something.
I'm not interested in non-Paizo classes, but I'm interested in a 3pp. archetype.
Can I have this 3pp. archetype? I'm making a strength-based rogue, so I don't need dex to damage, and this works better for my build:
Contender Training (Ex)
At 1st level, a contender gains Improved Unarmed Strike as a bonus feat. Beginning at 3rd level, a contender deals unarmed strike damage as a monk of her rogue level – 4 (minimum 1st). If the contender has levels in monk, this ability stacks with monk levels to determine how much damage she can do with her unarmed strikes. Monk levels gained from this ability don’t stack with those gained from the Monastic Legacy feat. A contender cannot select the unarmed combat mastery ninja master trick.
At 11th level and 19th level, a contender gains a bonus feat. This bonus feat must be Improved Feint or a feat that lists Improved Feint as a prerequisite. The contender must meet all of her chosen feat’s prerequisites, if any. This ability replaces finesse training.
If so, can the contender references to monk also apply to a snakebite brawler? I assume this was written before hybrid classes existed.
I'd like to grab Duplicitous, which normally replaces Kitsune Magic, so +2 RP, which should become +4 RP, which is... exactly as many BP as I have left over!
Sounds good.
It should be in your DMsSap Adept (Combat)
You know just where to hit to knock the sense out of your foe.Prerequisite: Sneak attack +1d6.
Benefit: Whenever you use a bludgeoning weapon to deal nonlethal sneak attack damage, you gain a bonus on your damage roll equal to the number of sneak attack damage dice you rolled.
If I have another, then also:
Improved Unarmed Strike
What does that mean? 'in your DMs?'
Okay, I think I'm almost done --
@DM can I check something.
I'm not interested in non-Paizo classes, but I'm interested in a 3pp. archetype.
Can I have this 3pp. archetype? I'm making a strength-based rogue, so I don't need dex to damage, and this works better for my build:
Contender Training (Ex)
At 1st level, a contender gains Improved Unarmed Strike as a bonus feat. Beginning at 3rd level, a contender deals unarmed strike damage as a monk of her rogue level – 4 (minimum 1st). If the contender has levels in monk, this ability stacks with monk levels to determine how much damage she can do with her unarmed strikes. Monk levels gained from this ability don’t stack with those gained from the Monastic Legacy feat. A contender cannot select the unarmed combat mastery ninja master trick.At 11th level and 19th level, a contender gains a bonus feat. This bonus feat must be Improved Feint or a feat that lists Improved Feint as a prerequisite. The contender must meet all of her chosen feat’s prerequisites, if any. This ability replaces finesse training.
If so, can the contender references to monk also apply to a snakebite brawler? I assume this was written before hybrid classes existed.
That sounds like a bit much. Trade out finesss training for UC, monk damage, and two bonus feats? In doing the math in my head you will be losing dex to hit and damage but that is pretty easily replaced by strength to hit and damage. Then you are adding more damage from monkliness plus you get the two bonus feats. What are the other player's thoughts on this?
What does that mean? 'in your DMs?'It should be in your DMsSap Adept (Combat)
You know just where to hit to knock the sense out of your foe.Prerequisite: Sneak attack +1d6.
Benefit: Whenever you use a bludgeoning weapon to deal nonlethal sneak attack damage, you gain a bonus on your damage roll equal to the number of sneak attack damage dice you rolled.
If I have another, then also:
Improved Unarmed Strike
If you read above. I was sending him a formatted charter sheet. DM mean direct message.
That sounds like a bit much. Trade out finesss training for UC, monk damage, and two bonus feats? In doing the math in my head you will be losing dex to hit and damage but that is pretty easily replaced by strength to hit and damage. Then you are adding more damage from monkliness plus you get the two bonus feats. What are the other player's thoughts on this?Okay, I think I'm almost done --
@DM can I check something.
I'm not interested in non-Paizo classes, but I'm interested in a 3pp. archetype.
Can I have this 3pp. archetype? I'm making a strength-based rogue, so I don't need dex to damage, and this works better for my build:
Contender Training (Ex)
At 1st level, a contender gains Improved Unarmed Strike as a bonus feat. Beginning at 3rd level, a contender deals unarmed strike damage as a monk of her rogue level – 4 (minimum 1st). If the contender has levels in monk, this ability stacks with monk levels to determine how much damage she can do with her unarmed strikes. Monk levels gained from this ability don’t stack with those gained from the Monastic Legacy feat. A contender cannot select the unarmed combat mastery ninja master trick.At 11th level and 19th level, a contender gains a bonus feat. This bonus feat must be Improved Feint or a feat that lists Improved Feint as a prerequisite. The contender must meet all of her chosen feat’s prerequisites, if any. This ability replaces finesse training.
If so, can the contender references to monk also apply to a snakebite brawler? I assume this was written before hybrid classes existed.
If the answer ends up being negative -- can anyone suggest another archetype or feat selection that works better for this build?
I'm trying to synthesize the brute rogue and sap master builds. Weapon finesse is only useful for dex to damage for a certain category of weapons which don't overlap with those used by a strength based rogue.
The sap master is a very corner case build, so I'd like to also be able to have a good brute rogue melee ability in case that one tactic doesn't work in some case for some reason as a back up.
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Sebecloki
https://drive.google.com/open?id=18gdOnaBOVw_2D4SemDrN6oLP-0K4MYBt
That link should give you a version of the sheet with the formatting intact. Sorry, the last one did not work correctly.
If you want a strength rogue for your concept I would:
1) Just ignore the dex stuff as you are getting it for free.
2) Build an enforcer sap master Slayer.
3) Or play a ninja and call it a strong rogue.
4) Play Skulking Slayer (rouge) it is a two-handed strength archetype. You will want Bludgeoner as one of your level 1 feats.
the answer ends up being negative -- can anyone suggest another archetype or feat selection that works better for this build?
I'm trying to synthesize the brute rogue and sap master builds. Weapon finesse is only useful for dex to damage for a certain category of weapons which don't overlap with those used by a strength based rogue.
The sap master is a very corner case build, so I'd like...
It's not a bad idea, you just get too much for the trade in. I think that if you eliminated the two extra feats you would be OK, which don't apply until level 11 anyway. I would allow you to trade out finesse training for the monk damage and UC (but not the two feats).
Combat Expertise for a rogue talent is fine, so your second level swap is fine too.
If we're going to edit it -- can the places where it mentions 'monk' also apply to 'brawler'? I was planning on multiclassing into snakebite brawler next level.
If we're going to edit it -- can the places where it mentions 'monk' also apply to 'brawler'? I was planning on multiclassing into snakebite brawler next level.
Absolutely. It makes total sense and would probably have been included if the Brawler was available when the archetype was invented.
Okay, I think I'll just go with that solution then. I'll finish editing everything later and submit it for a point count.
I hope it's okay if I raise a suggestion -- I was hoping we could slow down a bit -- I feel like I was still talking to Rahella and then Garavel and we already moved the scene to the next day before I really finished my conversation. I hadn't even had an opportunity to introduce myself to the other characters properly yet.
I was hoping to do a lot of role-playing, and really fleshing out the caravan journey. I'd be interested to hear feelings about pacing from everyone else.
I'm ok either way. On the one hand, it's nice to play out the scene, on the other hand, role-play conversations always fast track normalcy. I'm sure there will be lots of time.
Happy to indulge in more roleplay!
I am also fine either way. I like role play, but I also think we will have other opportunities for our characters to get to know each other. There's also the possibility of just carrying on parallel scenes at once. Unless you think something dramatic is going to happen that would affect your scenes the next day, you can just continue that conversation at the same time that you're working on the first day of travel stuff. At least, that's what we do in the Masks game I'm in, which is a very role play heavy game.
I always find Parallel scenes difficult on Paizo's sight since everything lumps into one thread. It's much more manageable over on RPOL where you can split each section of the story into separate threads where it is easier to keep track of what is going on in each scene. That being said it can always be spoilered or something.
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*chuckle*
Here I was worried that I needed to move the plot along faster! We haven't even gotten to the first official encounter. This stuff is all made up :)
You guys make the job easy, particularly if you want me to go slower :) :)
I want to be careful I'm not telling you how to run the game, since I've only DM'd in the past and I'm used to being in charge. It's just a suggestion given the pace we seem to have here.
Sebecloki if you are aiming halfway between American Psycho and nice guy I doth my cap to you m'lady you are killing it.
I hope it's clear by now the evil character will work out and I wasn't being misleading when I indicated that I thought it would be compatible with a group.
He's not a nice person but he has motives that align with the party and an active interest in getting along.
I think so. So I'm getting selfish jerk but will go along with things that are good for him. But also is kind of a tool.
Also, Lupe will chill out once he is less green under the ears. Well, to an extent he is an optimistic idiot.
Do we all have to roll for handle animal?
Little confused, thought someone already saddled everything or was I mistaken?
Garavel had said that he would have things ready, but he decided to have you all learn how to saddle up. You can make a riding roll or a handle animal roll if you want, or just RP how you think your characters would fare. Sometimes a nice roll can give you inspiration, but it's not really necessary if you would rather not.
Yeah, I was kind of under the impression that I had already put people's stuff on their camels with my good Survival roll (and since no one else seemed to have elected to get up early to help with it). But I guess maybe I just sorted out who gets which bags of stuff?
(Also, will update IC after my IRL game tonight)
It's OK. I don't expect a perfect script out of this. Somethings things can get confusing; heck, lots of times things will be confusing, but don't be afraid to ask questions and we can sort it out. I'll probably be on the leader board for mistakes made to tell you the truth. And I have no problem adjusting history if we need to because of a misconception or mistake if that becomes necessary.
You all ready to move on to the trip?
Ya.
I am prepared.
Yep!
All set!
Actually, the mention of a tent reminds me: does everyone have travel essentials? Rations, waterskins? Maybe a hot weather outfit (and if not, remember that Prestidigitation can be used to cool off!)?
Garavel has that all covered and that gear is on the pack camels.
I figured while Garavel probably had most of our travel needs covered, he might just have bedrolls or something rather than tents. Given Katsumi's desire not to be seen, making sure he had a tent would allow him some privacy in which to relax.
I like the idea that you would have bought your own tent in order to have privacy. I hadn't really thought about it, but chances are Garavel has his own tent but has one or two tents for the rest of you to sleep in.