Oops, I was unclear, sorry. I was proposing that the NPC's check the East side of the Shrike river in Hexes G19 and F20. From the map these are both inside the border. Or am I misunderstanding something?
I do not expect them to find Tig but I am hoping they will find someone who saw Tig during the time in qustion. This means we can focus on the East side of the Tuskwater/Candlemere. It is basically answering the same question that riding to the lunber folks answers: Which side of the nTuskwater is Tig likely on?
Speaking of questions:
.Is the Shrike river fordable/easily swimmable in hex G19?
.Is the Skunk river crossable at any point downstream of the bridge in hex F17? Because if the Skunk is not crossable after the bridge then Tig is very likely to be on the east side of the Tuskwater.
.Have any boats been reported missing?
.Does someone in the city have a boat that can take our troupe and horses?
With a boat we could move G19 to H19/20 to I19 and perhaps catch up to Tig. Because if Tig had to use the ford in F20 to cross the Shrike then I19/20/21 is their southern limit, assuming they were not exhausting/killing their horse and that they got lucky and were able to cross the Gudrin river in the first hex they tried.
Mind you they will be in the J's or points south by the time we reach them but given a start in town, use of the ford, and a 1 day per hex speed once they run out of roads row I is their present southern limit.
If you have not taken the time to visit the campaign map (always linked above), please do so.
I have moved the black portions to expose a lot more of the southern forest and Greenbelt. Everything that you have heard about occurs in the areas that were not focused on in the previous module. Doing this online can be more difficult because of time, group change over and just communication issues with the PBP system. So I have taken the time to mark out the area that will largely be the focus of this module. That does not mean events will not occur within the kingdom, but everything you are currently aware of is somewhere in that white area. So asking people to keep an eye out for any of these items in the current kingdom is unlikely to provide anything too beneficial. It's not bad as an RP thing, but I just want to make sure you understand where your attention needs to start being focused.
To the best of my understanding, every book largely focuses on a new area around your kingdom and open up places where you can potentially expand your nation if you want. So when I talk the waters of the southern Greenbelt it will be south of the capital, potential several days journey south.
So to try and help clear up any confusion, I have taken the time to mark off the unknown areas that you need to cover through this book. If this is not helpful or appreciated let me know and I can clear it out and refrain from doing so in future books. If marking off the area you need to consider is helpful, I can continue to do this. I will then remove the lines from the area once you have explored a section so we all know what has been cleared.
Now there are a few sections that might have been cleared in the previous book. If that is the case assume that its just an area that sees little attention from locals and you need to come back through after a year and make sure nothing has changed like wandering worgs.
Does that make sense to everyone?
Now to answer a few questions. No horses or boats have been taken. If you know of a way across the river, it is marked on the map. That doesn't mean Tig did not find something you have not yet discovered. With the way roads work, you have created a way to get over the river in G19 in preparation for someday expanding into G20.
If you ask around about Tig, no one has seen him in at least three days and no one has a good idea where he might be other then suggesting looking south of the city.
GM RE: Tig. Is there a possibility, however slight, of picking up a trail in Hex G18 or 19? Will tracking be useful here or is this a stumble into Tig or their body sort of deal?
Jackob is quite good at tracking with a maximum of +24 with the right spirit and assuming Guidance and Natural Divination work and a +10\13 if they don't. From the SRD tracking a three day old trail of a small or medium sized target over firm ground is DC 19 +1per every hour of rain over the past three days.
Is this an option or am I just wasting folk's time? I'm good either way. I just don't want to keep beating a dead horse.
If you have not taken the time to visit the campaign map (always linked above), please do so.
I have moved the black portions to expose a lot more of the southern forest and Greenbelt. Everything that you have heard about occurs in the areas that were not focused on in the previous module. Doing this online can be more difficult because of time, group change over and just communication issues with the PBP system. So I have taken the time to mark out the area that will largely be the focus of this module. That does not mean events will not occur within the kingdom, but everything you are currently aware of is somewhere in that white area. So asking people to keep an eye out for any of these items in the current kingdom is unlikely to provide anything too beneficial. It's not bad as an RP thing, but I just want to make sure you understand where your attention needs to start being focused.
To the best of my understanding, every book largely focuses on a new area around your kingdom and open up places where you can potentially expand your nation if you want. So when I talk the waters of the southern Greenbelt it will be south of the capital, potential several days journey south.
So to try and help clear up any confusion, I have taken the time to mark off the unknown areas that you need to cover through this book. If this is not helpful or appreciated let me know and I can clear it out and refrain from doing so in future books. If marking off the area you need to consider is helpful, I can continue to do this. I will then remove the lines from the area once you have explored a section so we all know what has been cleared.
Now there are a few sections that might have been cleared in the previous book. If that is the case assume that its just an area that sees little attention from locals and you need to come back through after a year and make sure nothing has changed like...
I like the change and appreciate it.
I find this much easier to understand.With the understanding that we have bridges going over the river towards G20. WE could take that route and go around to the lower part of candlemere. Going up one side of the rivers and back down the other side until we come back home????maybe?
@Jackob If you wish to track him you can try. There are places where this will be hard as he enters and exits the water in different areas.
Does the group want to do that then? How are you traveling? Horses? Carts? etc?
@Leopold & @Albert I need to know your Exploraiton Action. This link is to the Pathfinder 2E actions as they are more robust than the 1E actions. We are using this list and adapting as necessary to make it work in 1E.
@Leopold & @Albert If you do not have an action set up for when you may not be able to post, please put something into your stat sheet. If you are AFK and we need to move on I will just ask for anyone to post an action for you and it will be beneficial if you give them an idea of what you might want to do or how you want to do it.
Tracking is my plan if we can get a trail. I think just horses would be best esp if the trail takes us to the west side of the Tuskwater.
Thoughts o' boon companions?
Hallo all, I'm back from my vacation. Sorry it took longer than expected.
I agree that Tig is the most important one, as we might find him alive. I don't really see any other option than searching for tracks south of the city.
I say we bring the horses, but would probably be walking, as we need to search for tracks. Can we assist with the survival roll? not the best at it, but should have a decent chance of helping out.
Seeing as I'm coming back a little late here, should I post some questions for Mrs. Tannerson in gameplay? any roll I can do for more information and do we already have what we can get?
I like the changes to the map, please keep them!
a couple of follow up questions.
About Tig:
When we say south along the waters, I assume it is Tuskwater we are talking about?
Are we talking about the west (H19) or east (H20) side of the lake?
About Old Crackjaw:
What hex is he/the fishing spot in?
Is this the same Arven as with the Hodag?
The elven ruins:
Did she give any further directions to the ruins (aka a hex)?
Hodag:
Where was he attacked?
If you look back at the Handout, all of the available information for the four missions is now up there, but answers to your questions below.
a couple of follow up questions.
About Tig:
When we say south along the waters, I assume it is Tuskwater we are talking about?
Are we talking about the west (H19) or east (H20) side of the lake?
You have everything that you can get.
About Old Crackjaw:
What hex is he/the fishing spot in?
Is this the same Arven as with the Hodag?
Old Crackjaw is in H20 south of the Gudrin river. The Hodag is in the forest, so not that close. Arven was also away from the camp and ran into the Hodag randomly when he was off by himself. He has no idea where it is but would likely have occurred in either G16 or H17. But he has no idea where it might be sleeping.
The elven ruins:
Did she give any further directions to the ruins (aka a hex)?
Nope, she just heard they exist and wants an art piece.
Hodag:
Where was he attacked?
See the answer above.
Hallo all, I'm back from my vacation. Sorry it took longer than expected.
...
Welcome back!
I am slammed at work with a big project that is due next week. I am going to have to pause over the weekend to get as much of it done as possible. I want to get this train moving, but I need to take a moment. I should be able to get us moving on Monday.
Corryllon- focus on work! We will be here when it eases up!
Yes, take the time you need.
Hey all. I will be off whiffling through the tulgey wood from Aug 29th through Sept 3rd or 4th. Just a heads up. Feel free to bot.
Right, J should be all set up to bot with correct spirit details. I am away with faeries for a few. See you when I get back.
I feel like I am being too pedantic, because I am, and this is not the place to do that.
You can all track Tig down. Jackob is amazing at tracking. But it will take in an incredible amount of rolls that you are destined to eventually succeed at. So I am going to explain the mechanics here of what happens so everyone understands.
If Jackob tracks alone you cover about 2 miles an hour and it takes you about eight hours to pass through a region. If the humans in the group join in you cover about a mile and a half and 11 hours to pass through a region. If Rillka joins in you drop down to a mile and 14 hours to pass through a region. So it is probably easier for Rilka to not participate unless the tracking becomes very difficult.
Every day that passed from the point that Tig passed the DC does go up some. And there might be rain. So by the time you are close to him the DC will be quite high, but even if you just search for 3 hours a day your going to eventually figure out where he is.
With Jackob taking 10, which works for tracking, and an average of 1-2 of the party helping you will quickly make headway. That lets you move at the 15 ft pace. If you push it and travel about 12 hours a day, that means it will take about 3 days, maybe 4 if there is some bad rolling, to get to the final destination. Even with rain and other delays. To save us the odd 40+ rolls, we are just going to move on to what happens as you explore the areas and any wandering monsters or events you may find.
I am going on vacation this weekend. The internet at the cabins is apparently pretty poor to non-existent. So after today I will probably not be able to post again until Monday.
Rillka has the Fleet of foot racial trait, her base move is 30’ so she can keep pace with humans/medium creatures.
Or were you saying she was slower because of her riding dog?
Many of us are mounted, so it would be your mount's speed that matters.
yes, but the ones of us tracking isn't riding. We need to be close to the ground.
I hope we find tig safe, but I doubt it. The age of the tracks makes me think the lizard folks had him for dinner.
I say we follow the tracks to the end. So we should have lookouts for enemies as Jackob tracks.
yes, but the ones of us tracking isn't riding. We need to be close to the ground.
Anyone helping would have to be on foot as well.
I hope we find tig safe, but I doubt it. The age of the tracks makes me think the lizard folks had him for dinner.
I say we follow the tracks to the end. So we should have lookouts for enemies as Jackob tracks.
Agree. Plus I don't like our odds in going up against even a medium sized band. The Heavens spirit gives me Hypnotic pattern. Even one casting Maximized if the stars are out. That might hold a few of them. maybe even enough for us to snatch Tig back and at least get a head start.
I do not think continuing is a good idea but faint heart and all that.
As I have just posted in the game thread, we need to deal with it at some point. Might as well be no.
And I doubt they would put something impossible in at this point. It is not a random event. At least I don't think so. And with the time constraint, it's not something we could have left for later when we had levelled up.
I say we continue! :-)
I missed Rillka was speed 30. So she did not slow anyone down.
Onward you go to find Tig!
From an RP perspective, we can't have anybody's kids being kidnapped if we want to attract settlers.
So I believe we have lost Leopold. I sent him a DM, but I have not gotten a reply. As far as I can tell Leopold has not posted to any of his campaigns in over a month. Assume for now Leopold is not traveling with you.
If Rhavi and Rillka have not put up a Perception check by Tuesday someone can feel free to roll for them.
On crossing the river.
If I change to a Waves spirit in the morning I could burn 2nd level spells to get people across.
A glance at folk's swim skill and armor worn shows that everyone but Von Ulm could take 10 and swim assuming the river counts as calm water. If it is rough water then only Jakob (Lodvoka for the win!) and Albert can manage on a 10.
So if we wait until tomorrow and I ditch the very nice Heavens Spirit (sob, goodbye Color Spray and Hypnotic Pattern) then it's 1 of my 4 2nd levels to get our mighty king across if it is calm or 3 of my 4 spells if it is rough.
This is a corundum.
The river is pretty calm here. Assuming it doesn't get stormy you should be fine.
hmmmm... GM Coreyllon
Is swimming an action? If not then Albert or Jackob could carry Ulm's shield and the other of us could use the Aid action to get Ulm across on a take 10.
Swim is part of a move.
With a 10 Str and no ranks, that gives Rillka a straight die roll... emphasis on "die"...
Sorry I have had PC issues and been really busy, but will resume annoying the Tall Folk now.
Swim is part of a move.
With a 10 Str and no ranks, that gives Rillka a straight die roll... emphasis on "die"...
Sorry I have had PC issues and been really busy, but will resume annoying the Tall Folk now.
Well calm water is DC 10 so you should be good taking a 10.
Swimming is a skill and you can Aid Other on the roll, but in this case I would also probably allow for a Survival Check to find flotsam that you could use to aid instead. Trying to Aid in swimming can lead to them drowning you. Go summer of almost being a life guard. :P
You could also try and build a makeshift raft if you wanted to take the time to do that.
You have also only looked at the island from 300 ft away.
I came down with covid and fell behind on things. Will try posting tomorrow.
Life happens. I hope you are feeling better now!
I was thinking Ser Andreas was doing some out-of-combat diplomacy. If everyone else is joining the fray, I will do so on my turn, as well.
That makes sense. The King seems very disinclined to be diplomatic.
I've been busy. Will post later today.
While I respect the ruling; I don’t like it.
I don’t like that invisible opponents will be able to move a visible foe from a threatened square without provoking an AoO from us. Andreas or an opponent, leaving a threatened square should provoke attacks from the individual threatening the square regardless of whether it was Andreas’/a foe’s movement or being dragged.
Jacob certainly should not provoke, that was the whole point of invisibility.
Here is my reasoning behind this. If I am missing something, which is bound to happen with the number of systems I play, please feel free to point me towards it.
First, provoking an AoO is really intended to be occur when you take an action (move, cast a spell, pick up an item, etc.) that opens you up to an attack or distracts you. Sir Andreas did nothing to open himself up to an attack. He did not move, instead he was moved. I think this is an important distinction.
For my second point, the closest action for what occurred here is a Bull Rush. Bull Rush provokes from the person who is charging through, Jackob in this case, but it takes feats to make it have the target provoke. I do grant that it says the enemy does not provoke, but I read that as whoever you bull rush does not provoke unless you have a special feat that makes them provoke. If your allies do not get to benefit from your actions here, I do not think your enemies should somehow get that advantage. I just did not make Jackob attempt a roll in which Sir Andreas would not have opposed. An invisible foe could move a target out against you without letting you attack them with a Bull Rush.
Might this ruling have been overly generous. Yeah. Because if its an attack you can argue that Jackob would be visible. But I still think it all fits into the narrative of mechanics and what your group was aiming to do.
In conclusion, I have never seen anywhere that granted AoO's on forced movement (Bull Rush, Falling, etc.). I may be missing something, but all forced movements I have seen have not granted AoO's.
If people would prefer, we can have him make his CMB check and then move the distance with Sir Andreas before becoming visible at the end of his attack with the idea that this is how we would treat any ally doing this to their ally regardless of what side they are in. .
I don't believe the reason for my objection was clearly stated...
I never meant to imply Jackob warranted an AoO, his action certainly isn't an attack action; Jacob is aiding a companion.
My objection is simpler - Andreas, regardless of the fact of how it occurred did "move" out of a threatened square while helpless and visible to opponents. That should in my opinion provoke, I don't believe that his movement being generated by another player rather than his actions should matter. Had he been crawling, he would provoke. And by the same logic an invisible party member could then "bull rush" another past a dozen foes without any of them getting an AoO? If an enemy escaped the party in either of those ways; I would call shenanigans.
Irrelevant, but for the sake of conversation; I would argue that Drag is the closet combat maneuver. By their own language, they are meant to be actions against foes in combat and the game mechanics are seemingly designed not to have AoO not be an issue with combat maneuvers, so the interpretation of any of those is a DM decision /house rule. Paizo has nothing in the rules about moving fallen companions (that I could find).
At the end of the day...
I don't have to like it. I don't.
I don't have to agree with it. I don't.
What I do have to do is accept you made a decision I don't like or agree with and move ahead with the game. And since it is probably the only thing keeping Andreas alive...move on...
I forgot to add an additional +4 for my Combat Casting feat, which would give me enough for Corrosive touch to succeed. I don't think I hit, so I will use it the next time I do. Will note it when I post the next attack.
I come down on the forced movement does not draw AoO side, but I also realize this rule makes no logical sense. It is definitely a "game" rather than a "simulation" rule.
So I did learn something new, which is always a good thing. I did not even look for drag because I have not ran into that before. But Drag also clearly says the creature being dragged will not provoke attacks of opportunity for being dragged.
Is it likely to ever come up with an enemy doing it. Not really. But both drag and bull rush specifically state in the text that the creature being dragged/bull rushed does receive AoO's. I actually think its way worse if it did because then you could get some abusive scenarios where the wizard TKs to knock a foe back and everyone gets a free attack on him. I truly believe that scenario could easily grow much more abusive.
I understand you do not like the maneuver. I have no intention of making it a plan of villain's unless the module states that they do X action for some reason. So for now, we will just move on.
@Albert - With Spellstrike you gain a free extra attack at your highest bonus if you use Spell Combat to cast a touch spell. So from level 2 on you can always get two attacks as part of a Full Attack action as long as you take the -2 to all attack rolls and have a Touch spell of any level.
All attacks as part of your Full Attack action are taking the -2 penalty from casting a Spell with Spell Combat but you gain the bonus attack with your weapon. This will work with any touch spell, including cantrips.
If you opt to cast a non-touch spell in a round you are attacking, like Mirror Image or Shield, you still take the -2 but you only gain your normal number of attacks based on BAB instead of the extra bonus touch spell attack. But this does let you fight in a round in which you are buffing yourself or casting other non-touch spells.
If you have any questions on this ask away.
how are we all doing? are we good?
Rhavi has two bombs left, she is probably going to use them as long as the other caiman is still alive. When it is only the king, she would probably move in to melee, after drinking an extract (shield).
Unless of course we the next frontline fighter also goes down, then she might have to get in there sooner than she would have liked.
I'm pretty sure the king can hit me more easily than I can hit him, and I'm nearly out of images. I don't have many other tools left, except some potions of Shield of Faith.
I think we are committed. Running would just mean fighting them in the water where I think they will have a bit of a home turf advantage.
Albert, I can manage a Barkskin if you need more AC.
I think we're doing well enough to just focus on attacking.