Not so minor anymore if that new magic ammo that slows even on a crit success with an indefinite duration until target Escapes is any indication.The ammo that changes damage to bludgeoning and knocks prone on hit and stunned 1 and prone on crit (well, measured against Ref DC) also seems pretty strong. Add to that a bow user can poach Fake Out and put a gauntlet bow on their free hand to use it at-will, and I'd say archer fighter is doing very well with this release.
Oh hey it's attack roll vs ref DC too. Unlethal is a bit of a minus but prone on hit and no incapacitate on that stun is pretty great. I look forward to landing hits that crit vs ref saves.
| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
Not so minor anymore if that new magic ammo that slows even on a crit success with an indefinite duration until target Escapes is any indication.
I am hoping future books stay somewhat in line with balance now that Mark isn't with the team. I hope Logan doesn't want for a more pf1e/5e style loose balance approach as I would had to have to go back to banning content.
Unlethal
I assume you mean nonlethal right?
Not so minor anymore if that new magic ammo that slows even on a crit success with an indefinite duration until target Escapes is any indication.I am hoping future books stay somewhat in line with balance now that Mark isn't with the team. I hope Logan doesn't want for a more pf1e/5e style loose balance approach as I would had to have to go back to banning content.
Same
| 3 people marked this as a favorite. |
I wouldn't be surprised to see the tendril shot get errata because that's usually not how crit successes work, but by and large most of the stuff published is pretty much fine. There might be a slightly higher percentage of items my players actually want to use than normal, but that doesn't seem like a bad thing.
Not so minor anymore if that new magic ammo that slows even on a crit success with an indefinite duration until target Escapes is any indication.I am hoping future books stay somewhat in line with balance now that Mark isn't with the team. I hope Logan doesn't want for a more pf1e/5e style loose balance approach as I would had to have to go back to banning content.
was mark an issue? this is the first book in quite some time Ive heard talk of being too strong.
| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
I really don't know if the book is too strong. The things that are improved are things that were quite weak: Alchemy and ranged attacks. I wonder if this book is not there to make things straight.
Design Manager
|
| 22 people marked this as a favorite. |
I wouldn't be surprised to see the tendril shot get errata because that's usually not how crit successes work, but by and large most of the stuff published is pretty much fine. [...]
Already marked for errata. Not sure what happened there but I suspect we'll at least be changing the crit success to "Target is unaffected", and then cascading the other DOS effects down accordingly so that the crit failure falls off and the current failure becomes the crit fail (and probably dropping deafened as well, I'm not sure how that speaks the the item's effect.)
With this much new content, sometimes a couple things slip through the cracks, but we're already working on getting them identified and patched.
I wouldn't be surprised to see the tendril shot get errata because that's usually not how crit successes work, but by and large most of the stuff published is pretty much fine. [...]Already marked for errata. Not sure what happened there but I suspect we'll at least be changing the crit success to "Target is unaffected", and then cascading the other DOS effects down accordingly so that the crit failure falls off and the current failure becomes the crit fail (and probably dropping deafened as well, I'm not sure how that speaks the the item's effect.)
With this much new content, sometimes a couple things slip through the cracks, but we're already working on getting them identified and patched.
Thank you for the update
| 6 people marked this as a favorite. |
Here's a couple other things that should probably be marked for errata:
- Cassisian Helmet is a 6th level common item that gives +1 status to AC and saves against evil creatures... which are 90% of what most parties fight.
- Greater Phantasmal Doorknob spellheart, when attached to a weapon, passively makes all your Strikes blind on a crit... with no save. At level 10.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
UnlethalI assume you mean nonlethal right?
I swear sometimes my brain tells my fingers to do weird stuff when I type.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
I swear sometimes my brain tells my fingers to do weird stuff when I type.UnlethalI assume you mean nonlethal right?
Yep, between that and autocorrect, I've had some interesting posts too. ;)
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
I wouldn't be surprised to see the tendril shot get errata because that's usually not how crit successes work, but by and large most of the stuff published is pretty much fine. [...]Already marked for errata. Not sure what happened there but I suspect we'll at least be changing the crit success to "Target is unaffected", and then cascading the other DOS effects down accordingly so that the crit failure falls off and the current failure becomes the crit fail (and probably dropping deafened as well, I'm not sure how that speaks the the item's effect.)
With this much new content, sometimes a couple things slip through the cracks, but we're already working on getting them identified and patched.
Thanks for that feedback!
I'm so excited about this book!
|
| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
If we go back to PF1E I will be heartbroken.
Agreed, I haven't gotten the book yet so can't say from experience, but I truly hope Logan and other developers keep balance from creeping. I used to have to ban a lot of content in 3.x and PF1e because I had a mix of power gamers and casuals and if I didn't ban things the power gamers overshadowed the casuals so much.
One thing I love about PF2e is that I've not had to ban any content as it is so beautifully balanced. If that starts changing, I don't know whether we'd stick to Pathfinder and just start banning things again, or go to another gaming system (certainly not one run by WotC though).
Okay, good. It's already marked.
Because, even if it weren't, I wouldn't give an effect on a crit success, no matter what the text said.
Do you feel treasure vault introduced minor power creep?
The level 6 item that effectively gives you at-will unlimited 3d8 fast healing certainly gave me pause.
(Only limitation being that you need to spend your reaction every round when damaged in melee while at half hit points or less to benefit for that round.)
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
It was pointed out to me that the Communion Mat is a little odd, in that it costs an action to make your familiar do a thing for you, which also costs an action.
3d8 are not worth a reaction after level 12
It is if you don't use your reactions for anything else.
bolas that trip 5 feet burst once per day have the potential to be overpowered since weapon doesn't have invested trait
Ooh. I hadn't noticed that. Yeah. Once per day limitations on cheap items don't mean much without investment.
On the more minor end, alchemical reservoir on a double slice build neatly dodges the MAP drawback, doesn't exhaust the reservoire quickly and is super cheap since you never progress past using level 1 bombs with it. Also stacks with energy mutagen.
Fighter with alchemist archetype at 6 can prepare 12 items which is enough to get four encounters at full offense if so inclined. Saves money and you keep getting more reagents for utility or more encounters as you level.
Probably not worth it for single weapons since you still eat the extra MAP penalty after the bomb is used up and you use it up rather quickly.
What item is this? I can't find an Alchemical Reservoir in Treasure Vault.
What item is this? I can't find an Alchemical Reservoir in Treasure Vault.
I blame my brain mixing up item names and descriptions. Weapon siphon is what I was thinking of.
How do we feel about Elemental Ammunition and niche protection for alchemist (and maybe gunslinger) as far as pinging weaknesses with persistent damage? Seems like a normal archer can do it pretty cheaply now, although the amount of damage and the action economy are both debatable, I think.
Alchemists have value because of triggering it in a large AoE on a miss. Nothing has changed there.
Does elemental ammution have activation requirements like magical ammunition? If so I don't expect anything to change.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Wind ocarina completely shuts down gunslingers, archers, and other ranged threats. Wand of choking mists completely shuts down pretty much every caster ever.
This is not just a little power creep. This is the return of the "I win" buttons of yore.
| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
Wind ocarina completely shuts down gunslingers, archers, and other ranged threats.
No moreso than the CRB's Wall of Wind, a scroll of which is cheaper than the ocarina.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Wind ocarina completely shuts down gunslingers, archers, and other ranged threats. Wand of choking mists completely shuts down pretty much every caster ever.
This is not just a little power creep. This is the return of the "I win" buttons of yore.
Let's not pretend that enemy casters were ever a threat past turn 1 after level 7. Putting silence 4 on the fighter and inflicting prone one of a million ways ends any threat a caster represents.
And the ocarina is just a personal wall of wind. You could already buy those for 30gp a pop. It does have some pros and cons, but it isn't out of line.
| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
Wind ocarina completely shuts down gunslingers, archers, and other ranged threats. Wand of choking mists completely shuts down pretty much every caster ever.
This is not just a little power creep. This is the return of the "I win" buttons of yore.
The Wind Ocarina can get that effect once and only once, while the Wand of Choking Mist is a once per day cast that only affects a 20 ft burst, and while the higher level version is difficult terrain they still only need to move a bit to get out of it perhaps wasting a round, depending on some layout factors. assuming the caster even cares about breathing, which obviously some creatures don't, like a lot of the undead casters.
Neither is remotely an "I win" button.
Wind ocarina completely shuts down gunslingers, archers, and other ranged threats.No moreso than the CRB's Wall of Wind, a scroll of which is cheaper than the ocarina.
Actually, the wall of wind is better as it actually covers an area vs a personal effect. And it's cheaper.
wind ocarina is overpowered
but ability to ignore arrow and bolt is not new just extremely high level
5th level is high?
Wand of choking mists completely shuts down pretty much every caster ever.
I don't have any idea what this is/what it does so I can't say anything about it... *looks at pdf release date*
there is no sphere of wind yet
only level 9 prismatic sphere
WALL OF WIND, 3RD LEVEL... Covers the whole party. NO NEED for a sphere, as the sphere is more of a limitation than a benefit. So, yeah... 5th level for what you said: "but ability to ignore arrow and bolt is not new just extremely high level".
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
there is no sphere of wind yet
only level 9 prismatic sphere
Let's compare.
Prismatic wall -> sphereSmaller area
-1 actions needed
+1 spell level / +2 item level as scroll
Wall of wind -> ocarina
Smaller area
-2 actions needed
+1 hands needed
Loss of anti-flier functionality
Gain of move with user
+1 item level scroll vs consumable
Usable by non arcane/primal casters since trick magic item doesn't work with 3 action spells like wall of wind. Ruins own ally ranged attacks since you can't just drop it behind the enemy like with a regular wall. Best used on a monk to jump behind the frontline or by casters for personal protection. No doubt, it's a good item, but +1 item level over wind wall seems about right for what it does.
wall of wind is not a emanation or follow character around
I don't have the rules yet, so I can't check.
But does the effect from the Ocarina have the Aura trait? If not, then it doesn't follow the caster around either.
Prismatic Sphere definitely doesn't move around with the caster. Its area is a burst that is set to a particular point on the ground.