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There are some threads in this forum that focus on what you can’t do in Pathfinder 2. Let’s talk about some of the interesting stuff you CAN.
So, here’s one of my favorite interactions. One of the gnome’s level 1 ancestral feats let them get a small animal as a familiar. Familiars have the ability to deliver touch spells. And an interesting quirk of Pathfinders “powers-as-spells” system is that Lay on Hands now counts as a touch spell.
So from level 1, you can have a thrush or badger buddy running around and healing your allies while you hold the line.
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Anyone can be an "arcane archer" by 4th level. All it takes is spellstrike ammunition (which can be made by anyone with expert proficiency in Crating and the Magical Crafter feat) and spell use (which can be gained, up to 3rd-level spells, by non-casters with either Cleric Dedication/Basic Cleric Spellcasting or Wizard Dedication/Basic Wizard Spellcasting).
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There are many different types of Spell casters you can make with the sorcerer class. I made an Elf Shaman, Fey Bloodline, Primal Spell list, with Otherworldy Magic to get an arcane cantrip. My healing powers are pretty good. I mean it really feals like a shaman to me. Also since my spell list is fixed, it makes the character simpler to play. Sometimes I just want to relax and play a simple character with a high CHA.
And I have a question for the group, do any of you know a way to make a Gish/Magus style character? I have a player that wants to try that out. We don't care how 'weak' just trying to find a way to do one.
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I love that Cavalier is an archetype!
Anyone can be an "arcane archer" by 4th level. All it takes is spellstrike ammunition (which can be made by anyone with expert proficiency in Crating and the Magical Crafter feat) and spell use (which can be gained, up to 3rd-level spells, by non-casters with either Cleric Dedication/Basic Cleric Spellcasting or Wizard Dedication/Basic Wizard Spellcasting).
That's very cool. I'm not sure if I'm reading the item right though, does the spell you cast into the ammunition last indefinitely? Can you just preload them during downtime and shoot them off whenever?
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I love that mage armor is 24 hours now from first level onward.
I also love that spellcasters don’t need to tote around crossbows, they can use cantrips as a reliable attack regularly.
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When I saw that grappling grants the flat-footed condition I got right to work making a muscle rogue that "sneak attacks" her foes by putting them in a chokehold and beating them with a club. I'm not sure how well it'll work given that enemies get three chances to break the grapple and you can only attempt to grapple once per turn without a huge penalty on the roll but I still want to try it.
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Wisdom based Dwarven Paladins are possible via two feats: Cleric Dedication (taken at 2nd level, 16 Wis is not a problem for Dwarves) and Domain (taken at 4th level, switching your spell points to key off of Wisdom instead of Charisma.)
Enjoy being a Dwarven Paladin with good stats for what you want to do; I plan to. Dwarves and "as good as anyone with the heaviest armor around" together at last.
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Just generally multiclassing as feats rather than levels, without being nothing more than decorative like the D&D 4e equivalent. Mystic theurges and fighting mages (gishes) were never easier to make.
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Ditto for True Strike & Strike in same round . Even if different, <10> system keeps it strong. Now couple that to Power Attack or other option which boils down to one attack roll.
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I love that Cavalier is an archetype!
I know! I want to play a Wizard with a horse.
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And I have a question for the group, do any of you know a way to make a Gish/Magus style character? I have a player that wants to try that out. We don't care how 'weak' just trying to find a way to do one.I've been working hard on my magus character. Its sooo leet.
Wizard or Sorc as base class. Sorc is cool because you can go with the Occult spell list while the Wizard is arcane exclusive.
at level 2, take the fighter multiclass feat. This gives you proficiency with martial/simple weapons and all armor, but not shields. This is great for wizards since there aren't any negatives for casting in armor. (none I've found and I've looked!!) :)
You'll generally need a free hand, so you Want to weild a bastard sword (martial weapon), cause you can take an action to 2hand it, and take the damage from a D8 to a D12.
At 4th, I'd personally take the Magical Striker feat, this is a really big part of the plan and it's why sorceror and wizard are the best choices for magus.
so, once you have all these pieces, here's the sort of plan...
1 action, true strike (lvl 1, verbal action only)
0 action(free), Magical Striker activates, granting an extra dice of dmg.
1 action, strike. (wizards craft well, so they might even have their own magic +1 bastard sword!!!)that's 2xD20's rolled on an attack which deals 2d12 or 3d12 + str. and you have an action to play with!! :)
Theres a bunch of cool stuff you can eventually do too! you have access to fighter feats, so you can add neat stuff.
Sorry for info overload!! :)
Thank you for sharing your research. That is cool.
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I love that Cavalier is an archetype!I know! I want to play a Wizard with a horse.
“Run, Shadowfax! Show us the meaning of haste!”
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“Run, Shadowfax! Show us the meaning of haste!”I love that Cavalier is an archetype!I know! I want to play a Wizard with a horse.
See, I like the idea of a Bard cavalier more. Allegro.
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I love that the new action economy essentially means everyone can fight with two weapons, rapid shot with a bow, or use a shield reliably from lvl 1 as long as you have proficiency.
I like how they brought more meaning to skills, which before many were largely ignored despite taking up almost half of the character sheet and a whole chapter of the book.
I like how they took away the power of ability/attack bonus/skill check magic items in favor of having more flavorful magic items that makes them more unique and fun.
So far I love the a LOT of the stuff. I haven't really found something I heavily dislike. I've been confused more than once but I just searched for the solution instead of getting upset. So far I haven't been disappointed. I've even started to come around to Resonance, the one thing I didn't like from the blog posts.
Elven "Demon Hunter" Paladin. There are a lot of Paladin Class feats and abilities that really work well for focusing on fighting Demons.
Dipping into Rogue with a few feats (or just being a Ranger) allows for Trap Finding by anyone.
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Something else I just realized yesterday when equipping my wizard:
My wizard is carrying a dagger, staff, a host of minor adventuring gear, and 7 days of rations - and is using just under 3 of his max 5 unencumbered bulk. Back in PF1, I could not have carried as much gear as I am currently carrying with the previous encumbrance rules. I distinctly remember back in PF1 building an archer with a 13 STR -- a pretty respectable STR for an archer, mind you, not brawny, but not an 8 STR weakling. By the time I had equipped her with a chain shirt, a longbow, about 40 arrows, and some supplies, even with a masterwork backpack she was 56 out of 58 pounds encumbered. She was on the bare cusp of burdened, before I ever saw one coin of loot.
My PF2 wizard feels fully equipped for adventuring, with enough encumbrance for 2000 coins worth of loot to spare! I did not go into the bulk system liking it at first, but I really think (at least at first blush) it looks like it gives you the room to be prepped but still have room to carry some loot back home without having to drag it in sacks, or needing a bag of holding...
I've been working hard on my magus character. Its sooo leet.
Wizard or Sorc as base class. Sorc is cool because you can go with the Occult spell list while the Wizard is arcane exclusive.
at level 2, take the fighter multiclass feat. This gives you proficiency with martial/simple weapons and all armor, but not shields. This is great for wizards since there aren't any negatives for casting in armor. (none I've found and I've looked!!) :)
You'll generally need a free hand, so you Want to weild a bastard sword (martial weapon), cause you can take an action to 2hand it, and take the damage from a D8 to a D12.
At 4th, I'd personally take the Magical Striker feat, this is a really big part of the plan and it's why sorceror and wizard are the best choices for magus.
so, once you have all these pieces, here's the sort of plan...
1 action, true strike (lvl 1, verbal action only)
0 action(free), Magical Striker activates, granting an extra dice of dmg.
1 action, strike. (wizards craft well, so they might even have their own magic +1 bastard sword!!!)that's 2xD20's rolled on an attack which deals 2d12 or 3d12 + str. and you have an action to play with!! :)
I am looking at something very similar for a character of mine.
I went Elf for the Weapon Familiarity.
Str 12 Dex 16 Con 12 Int 18 Wis 10 Cha 10
Hand of the Apprentice and Reach Spell on a universal wizard.
At 2nd level, pick up the Fighter Multiclass for the Armor proficiency.
At 4th level pick up Magical Striker.
At 5th level pick up Weapon Elegance (Elf). Bump all physical attributes and Int.
Early levels you use Magical Weapon for the bonus Damage dice, it lasts a minute. If you have someone dedicated to melee, use it on their weapon since it likely has a larger damage die. I also plan to take Grim Tendrils since it is AoE line.
Acid Splash as a cantrip for swarms. It only does 1 splash damage, but swarms tend to have a weakness to splash damage.
In addition to the True Strike you mentioned, there are tricks like Hand of the Apprentice so you can make a Strike without having to be next to the opponent. The Elf weapons help at first level, and at 5th you are getting the critical specials.
Since Wizards never get better than Trained in Unarmored, wearing armor will end up being better except for the Bulk requirements.
I’m still trying to determine exactly what other things can be done here, but with the new weapon proficiency rules it looks possible for a Wizard to hit things. They still will be far behind a real martial character (only having Trained in their weapon normally), but it will not be as wide a gap as in PF1.
Anyone can be an "arcane archer" by 4th level. All it takes is spellstrike ammunition (which can be made by anyone with expert proficiency in Crating and the Magical Crafter feat) and spell use (which can be gained, up to 3rd-level spells, by non-casters with either Cleric Dedication/Basic Cleric Spellcasting or Wizard Dedication/Basic Wizard Spellcasting).That's very cool. I'm not sure if I'm reading the item right though, does the spell you cast into the ammunition last indefinitely? Can you just preload them during downtime and shoot them off whenever?
Alas, no.
Many pieces of magic ammunition must be activated before
being fired. Once you activate this type of ammunition,
you must shoot the ammunition before the end of your
turn. Otherwise, it deactivates (though it isn’t consumed)
and you must activate it again before you can use it. If
you use this type of ammunition without activating it, it
functions as nonmagical ammunition of the same type and
is still consumed.
The action required to activate the ammunition doesn’t
alter how many actions it takes to reload. For example,
you could activate a beacon shot arrow with an Operate
Activation by touching it, then draw and shoot it as part
of a Strike as normal. For a beacon shot bolt, you could
activate it, load it into a crossbow, then shoot it, or load it
into the crossbow, then activate it, and then shoot it.
The activation for spellstrike ammunition is casting a spell and 1 RP. So you cast a spell with your normal actions, then shoot the arrow.
Depending on your various proficiencies (weapon vs. spell) and item bonuses (weapon rune vs. spell duelist's wand) and TAC vs. AC this may not actually be a great option. An archer Fighter (Wizard) can probably make it work, but won't have many slots for that purpose. A good range extender for touch and 30' spells, though. This also helps with multiattack penalties if you're trying to get off an arrow strike and an attack spell in the same round.
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I had two concepts for goblin characters that have worked to varying degrees.
The first was a goblin alchemist named Spike. Spike thinks he can play the lute and sing as well as any bard (he can't and doesn't train it). When he walks out on stage he places two flaming pots on corners of the stage and then whips out his lute and starts playing fast and loud while screaming incomprehensible lyrics. After the song, looking out at the crown he sees stunned expressions on their faces and thinks that they truly enjoyed his performance (they didn't, they were stunned he had the audacity to try it). As he leaves the stage he feels he has amassed a new group of fans.
Spike is an Alchemist, but the +2 CHA that goblins get out of the box has a mitigating effect on how far I can push the concept.
The second is a goblin barbarian named Digurt. Digurt is from a clan of goblins that a gold dragon chastized and told to be good after he subdued them. Our hero is now trying to live up to the expectations of his new god, but when he gets angry and starts hitting things they tend to get set on fire. (We don't want to discuss his belching in combat issue.) But he tries so very hard to be good.
Digurt is a Goblin Barbarian with the Gold Dragon Totem. This concept works well, and is super funny in my head.
I had two concepts for goblin characters that have worked to varying degrees.
The first was a goblin alchemist named Spike. Spike thinks he can play the lute and sing as well as any bard (he can't and doesn't train it). When he walks out on stage he places two flaming pots on corners of the stage and then whips out his lute and starts playing fast and loud while screaming incomprehensible lyrics. After the song, looking out at the crown he sees stunned expressions on their faces and thinks that they truly enjoyed his performance (they didn't, they were stunned he had the audacity to try it). As he leaves the stage he feels he has amassed a new group of fans.
Spike is an Alchemist, but the +2 CHA that goblins get out of the box has a mitigating effect on how far I can push the concept.
You can just choose to have a lower Cha at chargen if you want (though you won't get any mechanical compensation for it). See "Voluntary Flaws" sidebar on page 19. It's for pretty much exactly this situation AFAICT.
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I really love how weapon choice matters and interacts with your fighting feats, creating several distinct fighting styles from level 1. Weapon and crit abilities are really nice.
I created about 6-7 characters between lvl 1 and 4 and I still have plenty of ideas just from the get go it is fast and smooth.
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You can just choose to have a lower Cha at chargen if you want (though you won't get any mechanical compensation for it). See "Voluntary Flaws" sidebar on page 19. It's for pretty much exactly this situation AFAICT.I had two concepts for goblin characters that have worked to varying degrees.
The first was a goblin alchemist named Spike. Spike thinks he can play the lute and sing as well as any bard (he can't and doesn't train it). When he walks out on stage he places two flaming pots on corners of the stage and then whips out his lute and starts playing fast and loud while screaming incomprehensible lyrics. After the song, looking out at the crown he sees stunned expressions on their faces and thinks that they truly enjoyed his performance (they didn't, they were stunned he had the audacity to try it). As he leaves the stage he feels he has amassed a new group of fans.
Spike is an Alchemist, but the +2 CHA that goblins get out of the box has a mitigating effect on how far I can push the concept.
Believe it or not, I missed that sidebar...
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So, this concept can only be realized towards the end of your character's career, but I think it's still kind of funny.
You've gotta be a Bard, so that you have Bardic Lore and advance your Occultism skill to legendary so that you become an expert in Bardic Lore.
First, you take the Assurance skill feat, which lets you "take 10" (or 15 in this case) with Bardic Lore. Then you get Automatic Knowledge, which lets you make a free Recall Information each round using any skill you have Assurance with (and which can only be used with the "take 10" aspect of Assurance on). Finally, you get Dubious Knowledge, which kicks in if you fail a recall knowledge roll. You learn one piece of true knowledge and one piece of false knowledge, and have no idea how distinguish which is true and which is false.
Which means now you have a Bard who knows everything about everything and can tell you right off the top of his head. It's just... not all of it is entirely accurate, that's all.
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I've done some paper math and determined that being able to roll a d20 twice and use the better result gives you an average increase of 3.325 on the roll. Combine this, Magical Striker (+1 attack and +1 weapon die of damage), and either Incredible Aim (Fighter, Level 8) or Favored Aim (Ranger, Level 2). Cast True Strike with your first action, use Magical Striker to increase your weapons Potency, and make an Incredible/Favored Aim attack with the last two actions to attack with an effective +6 bonus over your usual. This also gives you a huge boost to crit chance, activating Deadly and multiplying your boosted damage dice. Throw in a Spellstrike Ammunition for good measure and you can do some very high damage with a single shot!
Reach weapons now allow an attack into an adjacent square in addition to any squares within the weapon's reach
Wow, I had not noticed that. Thank you for sharing. It's hard un-learning things.
I appreciate this thread. Thank you for starting it.
The most important thing I can do in PF2: play a Goblin core! Woooot! Dogslicers are my new favorite weapon.
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I love that mage armor is 24 hours now from first level onward.
I also love that spellcasters don’t need to tote around crossbows, they can use cantrips as a reliable attack regularly.
I think that because of this, wizards shouldn't be proficient in ANY weapons... because why would they be? Or at least less weapons... certainly not a crossbow. Why would they ever whip out a crossbow in wizard school?
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We were playing Affair at Somberfell Hall and all of us were in heavy armor, big weapons. And then we realized: the enemy is afraid to close in on us because we have AoOs, reach and are all standing together. Anyone coming close gets hacked to bits.
But this is P2, we can move before and after attacks. We can go to them and get back into our unassailable formation.
The moment when two clerics and a dwarven paladin realize they have Spring Attack...