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Going by magic items which store spells (rings, armor and weapons) yes you have to use up the spell to be stored.

The fencing grace feat is probably the easiest way to get some damage back, adding your dex to damage. Problem: it doesn't work with spell combat. Dervish dance (which also adds dex to damage) hasn't been specifically nerfed that way so you might find yourself using an effortless laced-scimitar.

Charmstrike and your limited spell combat seem to cut you out of the usual magus damage sources. I suppose you could still use shocking grasp or frostbite and just deliver them via unarmed strikes or as touch attacks. It's not going to be as good as the usual magus though, and it'd take a few levels to be good unless you threw two traits and at least one feat at one spell.

Taking a look, direct-fire siege weapons (ballistas, cannons etc.) do use attack rolls and could theoretically sneak attack, indirect-fire siege weapons (catapults, bombards etc.) use a special check to target a square and couldn't, and others with their own special mechanics couldn't as far as I can tell.

Good luck hiding a cannon within 30' of an enemy though.

Yqatuba wrote:
While we're on the subject, why is plane shift always off target from where you intend to go? Has there been even a fig leaf of justification for this?

You're teleporting somewhere (which has a chance of being off-target), but it's on another plane. Going to another plane adds wobbliness.

I think the original idea pre-PF was to avoid having two plane shifts making a single teleport. Role protection for magic-users (now called wizards.)

If you want forced roleplay then the barbarian wild rager archetype or a hag-haunted spiritualist could work besides those Derklord mentioned. If you just want an excuse then any number of sources of rage, bloodrage or other states of excitement could work.

Mesmerist is a class which seems to attract would-be evil masterminds. It's not perfect for real damage but it's OK for a bit of melee.

One casting will do for both. In fact you can't cast two frostbites at once - casting the second will drop the charge on the first.

Acts like <spell> is there to avoid having to write a new effect for every such ability, not as a way to add back in spell components etc. IMO.

Holding the Charge, CRB wrote:
If you don’t discharge the spell in the round when you cast the spell, you can hold the charge indefinitely. You can continue to make touch attacks round after round. If you touch anything or anyone while holding a charge, even unintentionally, the spell discharges. If you cast another spell, the touch spell dissipates. You can touch one friend as a standard action or up to six friends as a full-round action. Alternatively, you may make a normal unarmed attack (or an attack with a natural weapon) while holding a charge. In this case, you aren’t considered armed and you provoke attacks of opportunity as normal for the attack. If your unarmed attack or natural weapon attack normally doesn’t provoke attacks of opportunity, neither does this attack. If the attack hits, you deal normal damage for your unarmed attack or natural weapon and the spell discharges. If the attack misses, you are still holding the charge.

This is the main source. A normal unarmed attack can be part of a full attack. I'll have a look to see if I can find other mentions but I'm pretty sure I'm right on this.

Using the touch spell as a rider on another attack - whether an unarmed strike or a natural attack, or if you have spellstrike any weapon attack - lets you do a full attack.

The free attack you get when you cast a touch spell can only be a single attack though. And if you want to target touch AC after that you're making a standard action attack.

If it's using a profession (siege engineer) check rather than an attack roll SA won't trigger.

Not as I understand it, and chill touch doesn't work that way either as far as I know.

Sort of. You can make exactly one touch attack per round, or you can tack the damage/effect on to unarmed strikes or natural attacks but those are made as normal attacks not touch. If you're doing the latter TWF will work.

You're wrong. A cleric of a deity that isn't 'chaotic, evil, good or lawful' doesn't have a 'particularly powerful aura corresponding to the deity's alignment' as per the aura class feature. This is the only thing the aura class feature can give you, so without it you don't have the aura class feature.

Dunno that they'd get a selectable feat when they share the combat trick Derklord, I'd think they'd get the combat trick with the options as chosen by the skald sharing it.

Arcane deed has been nerfed so that your swashbuckler level is zero, always. Precise strike won't work for you.

SLAs use Cha for their save DC. Sense thoughts will suck for you.

Your magus bonus feats are combat feats, metamagic or item creation, not skill focus.

You're sure to want mobility. Bladed dash may help a lot.

Are you starting at level 11 or building up to it?

First, the tidepool dragon is effectively a 4th level sorcerer (with no bloodline & poorly chosen spells.) It can use scrolls and wands of sorc spells just fine, and with freedom of movement it can move thru a web, with flight it can fly over a pit or the debris from a stone call if necessary. Obviously this costs money but BFC is often effective without save DCs - webs and pits and debris slow or deter movement regardless - and your dragon isn't trapped by them itself. A cheap scroll of stabilize and it can save lives. Moment of greatness may make your own buffs better.

It shares your bards skills and may be able to use bluff to create a diversion for someone to hide. Intimidate isn't likely to work due to tiny size but it may be better than doing nothing or than entering melee. Avoid that last.

If anyone in the party can make an enemy drop something (disarm, stun, odder effects) a familiar can jump in and pick them up while others are engaged. Also if a party member hurriedly drops a bow to switch to a melee weapon, or a wand to put both hands on a weapon or anything like that it can be useful to not risk losing the dropped item.


The lyrakien isn't a spellcaster but it does have a 20 Cha, 19 Dex and all of an investigator's skills. And it's humanoid-shaped with full martial weapon prof. 80' flight, at least +16 skill. It's probably a great face and should be reliable-ish at UMD; get her a wand of ill omen for sure. Throwing alchemical weapons should work, shard gel or tanglefoot bags rather than direct damage. A bow with alchemical arrows maybe if greater range is possible. She could even use a reach weapon (which should let her threaten adjacent, only) for aid anothers and flanking, though routine melee will probably get her killed.

Mainly though she's a great scout. Senses, fast flight & freedom of movement to get away, dex & size to stealth, truespeech to understand what she's snooping on, hands to use thieves tools if a locked door bars her way (this can be a problem for non-humanoid familiars), every skill that the investigator has; what's not to like?

Could you have two different instances of resist energy targeting different types of energy up? I've seen it argued both ways but the recent one here comes up as 'yes, absolutely'. Which is the same question

The usual first - weapon (enhancement bonus first, holy, grayflame and/or vicious next priority), belt of giant's strength, headband of (adjective) charisma, armor (enhancement bonus), cloak of resistance/amulet of natural armor/ring of deflection.

In paladin-specific items you might want merciful vambraces or bracers of the avenging knight.

It's possible your character might want a means of emergency flight or something like that.

All told you're unlikely to be able to afford all of these to the level you want them at any time soon.

Weird words gives one word per 4 bard levels, not one plus one per 4 bard levels over 6, so your first guess is right there.

A good touch attack spell with multiple touches - frostbite maybe - is the best way of increasing unarmed strike damage. In Paizo material there's no arcane spell which gives a serious bonus to unarmed damage itself but I'm sure there's a decent 3rd party spell somewhere.

SR is usually CR+11. A bonus more than ~ your level+10 is therefore unnecessary and almost always overkill, though it's hard to get there unless you're getting something like the alternate FCB for some races as a cleric (+1 per level to penetrate SR vs. outsiders).

I think the stars subdomain spells include those you get from the subdomain via the void domain.

Are you actually going to be good at finding traps though? Trap spotter just lets you make the roll, being good at perception is up to you, and a lot of melee bard-types dump wisdom in order to have good physical stats and charisma. Also it's not likely to be useful in combat which is generally when you'll grant it to others via raging song.

Admittedly, lacking a rogue's class features there aren't that many great rogue talents. Combat trick has some interesting options though; get amateur swashbuckler (dodging panache) to avoid full attacks for example. Positioning attack for more offensive combat movement, eerie disappearance if anyone in the party is good at stealth, or got your back to effectively double the flanking bonus are worth thinking about too.

BTW: tongue not tounge.

If a spell requires an attack roll of any kind it'll mention it. If nothing is mentioned it doesn't require one; there isn't a rule saying this that I know of because there's no positive requirement (anywhere) for such an attack roll.

The Beautiful Lights: On this island there's a colony of miniature dragons which tales say will bond with the first person they see after hatching. The tales aren't wrong, and who doesn't want a minidragon of their own? They're incomplete however.

When the hatchlings grow up (after a couple of years assuming plenty of food) they transform into their adult shape, a will o' wisp, which has no attachment to their former bond/owner. If they die from violence and the body isn't entirely destroyed they rise as a will o' wisp with the young template 1d4 rounds later, same deal. Treat the hatchlings as pyraustas with the aberration type (but no stat changes from that), knowing whatever language was most spoken around their egg. Possibly a couple of languages in a household or adventuring party with mixed use of languages.

If the tales wouldn't be enough to attract your PCs they might follow an offer to buy the eggs, or be investigating the mysterious death of a girl and the disappearance of her minidragon.

Over three years dead CD. Solidly in necromancer territory.

A psychic is a bit weaker than a wizard or a sorcerer playing to their strengths but on a par with an arcanist, stronger than a witch IMO. A divine full caster is too different to easily compare but they are probably better spellcasters than a druid or even a cleric (maybe not a shaman) even if their class chassis is weaker. I suspect trying to make mind thrust work might have lowered your opinion of the class.

Diego's right about the developer comment (tho' I can't remember where it was either) and the vestigial arm mechanics look to be that you can't use it to gain extra hands to attack with. You get another hand for utility or defence.

Anything can work with a crafty GM. Whether it will with any GM is another story. If your mind works differently to the GMs or if you start from a different set of assumptions about the world then it can be very difficult to find the sort of out-of-combat info you're talking about. It's not that knowledge checks are the best solution, it's just that eliminating them comes with more costs than I think you realise Mark.

In-combat knowledge checks could definitely do with refinement or simplification.

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Gorbacz wrote:
Ryan Freire wrote:
PossibleCabbage wrote:
I feel like "printing in China no longer saves money" is more of a concern for Paizo than "some forumites are still unhappy" by a considerable margin.
I guess we'll see in a year or two
*Adds Ryan Freire to his deliciously long 'will come back to you in 2 years' list*

Do you actually have a list of people to hassle in the next 2 years?

Gorbacz wrote:
MidsouthGuy wrote:
I'm really glad to see there are companies continuing to publish 1E material. As someone who loathes 5E with a passion, Pathfinder was really the only thing that kept me from completely throwing in with the OSR community. That might change now if things go the way I fear they will. I've kept up with all the updates, and Pathfinder 2E is something I want nothing to do with. I'll always love Golarion as a setting, but unless I decide to pick up a new Pathfinder Tale novel, Paizo won't be getting any more of my money. Pretending to solve problems that don't exist just so you can make your fantasy game compatible with your sci-fi game is not the way to keep my business.
Your post would probably make any sense if PF2 and Starfinder were in fact compatible. Which they aren't, by any indication we've had so far.

Yup. There are similarities but I suspect those come from being made by groups which at least communicate and which probably overlap. That the groups making PF2 and Starfinder agree on what some of the problems are shouldn't be a surprise, and that some people from outside disagree (MidSouthGuy & me at least - though we may not agree with each other!) on what the problems are shouldn't surprise either.

3 levels of brawler is usually 1-2 points of average damage on the unarmed strike, occasionally zero benefit. You're actually getting ahead of the game with that +3 damage. Delaying the 3 feats option on martial flexibility is the only direct cost and getting to teleport is worth that IMO.

Not exactly. I mean, you might take a human with racial heritage (dwarf), or say that your aasimar or tiefling comes from dwarves, but basically no.

Fuzzy-Wuzzy wrote:
avr wrote:
The ingredients cost more than the list price of the item but in theory you can save by only making the items you need rather than having to have one of everything.
Any idea how it works out in practice?

There's a lot of different ingredients so you have to keep quite a large reserve. Many things you don't want to spend 10 minutes creating if just having them is an option. It doesn't really work IMO, but someone more organised than me might be able to make it sing.

You can find the rules at the bottom of the alchemist class page on d20pfsrd.

Basically it's a noticeably expensive way of making alchemical items quickly. If the alchemical item has a recipe (e.g. bleeding arrow) then if you have all the ingredients and ~ an hour to spare, and any equipment that particular method requires (nothing for the 'exposure' needed to make bleeding arrows besides lots of air) then you can make the item. The ingredients cost more than the list price of the item but in theory you can save by only making the items you need rather than having to have one of everything.

It's been done with clerics mostly. Ideally with a domain which gets the heroism spell. Magic vestment and greater magic weapon are the standout buffs, but there's others including magic circle vs. evil (10 min/level), resist energy (10 min/level) and there are some recent spells like ashen path (10 min/level, communal) and bestow planar infusion n (hour/level, on other planes only).

BTW you almost certainly won't have any 3rd or 4th level spell slots free ever. Once it becomes obvious that you can do this the demand gets...high.

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Patience. I didn't think much of the playtest version, but I for one am going to wait to actually see what they've come up with before condemning it. Waiting months is frustrating but deciding on it sight unseen is just dumb.

Call lightning is not useful except in a siege or similar situation. Entangle and related spells (mostly '___ entanglement'), those are useful true. Note explosion of rot (4th) and control winds (5th) for other things the psychic list does poorly. The psychic spell list isn't bad on the whole though and needs little expansion.

But yeah, if you want more illusions then it's hard to do better than veiled illusionist.

I like your twist on the Graveyard IaN. It makes that idea more than just a game session or two.

A long history of vampires, eh? That conjures up another idea.

The Humble Association of Fishers of the Blue Cliffs: If there's one thing vampires will want in an archipelago it's reliable transport across the water. The Fishers were suborned and controlled long ago to this end. Any of their boats or ships carrying six or more crew will include a vampire spawn among their number, and any leaders in the association must be supported by one of the Revered - full vampires.

Besides simple fishing the Fishers transport goods and people between islands and some of them have engaged in piracy, with the help of their Revered.

IEH (Arcane) has had nerf tape wrapped around it so you can't see the original shape. By FAQ, if it doesn't say it adds spells to your class spell list (as opposed to your list of spells known), then you can only cast those spells if they're already on your class spell list. Forget about it, basically.

Druid spells for an illusionist...OK. You might like a polymorph spell, druids get a few like fey form or form of the dragon. There are a few druid spells used as traps which illusions might help in covering up. Some druid spells enhance senses; ashen path or echolocation or whatever. I'm struggling to see much else which is in-theme or helps with illusions.

Illusions can disguise areas, disguise people, act as single-target or area debuffs, includes invisibility, and includes some excellent defences like mirror image and displacement. You can go for any of these but not for all of them at once until you have a few levels - at least 8, say. What appeals most?

There's a possibility that the masterpiece was changed during editing and a mistake made. If the cost was originally a level 2 spell or a feat that'd be consistent with the 4 ranks in a skill required.

In any case it's a fairly minor weirdness.

Temperans wrote:
As for what feat tax: Racial Heritage let's you count as an Undine.

Close, but that feat's for humanoids. Undines are native outsiders and there's an otherwise identical feat named Planar Heritage to be related to one of them.

Getting the fleeting spell metamagic can make battlefield control easier to use. Being able to remove it if your friends need to cross the area, or if it's stopping them flanking the enemy is just handy to have.

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Funny thing, as of the Plane-Hopper's Handbook there's an elemental familiar archetype which works from 1st level.

The Elephant's Graveyard: Not actual elephants of course, but some type of creature comes here to die. Probably some sort of flying creature on an island. There are great piles and forests of its bones. Taking trophies or otherwise looting them will result in skeletons animating to attack. Respectful treatment may result in useful info or blessings.

Heart of Fire: A volcanic island may seem nothing special, but this one has a gate within driving its volcanism. Not to the plane of elemental fire, no; this one leads to somewhere far worse deep in the Hells. Thankfully only the smallest creatures can come through but seeds of infernal vegetation have sprouted in places, and the wasps may gather into hellwasp swarms if humanoids dally too long on the island.

The Smallest Continent: Everything living here is smaller than usual, use the young template. Deeper within they're even smaller, you can look down on forests of ancient trees no taller than your knees. At the very center there's a stone which will shrink anyone touching it to match the nearby ankle-height forests. A quick identify or similar will suggest that this will be permanent if the characters don't leave within 24 hours.

The current mild winds will seem like gales to any shrunken characters attempting flight, and there are a few full-size enemies on the PCs trail who will have greatly inflated stats. On the other hand there will be some odd treasures to be found and taken away.


Obviously all these would need fleshing out, the last especially.

A magic item which does a constant alter self might work as well or better than elixirs. A ring which has been on her hand for a decade could be very difficult to remove.

Sounds like a gelatinous cube. Though if people hang around too close to it your cubey can wander over and engulf them. DC 12 Reflex negates on that of course.

& yes this is in D&D of every edition too.

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Mauler replaces speak with animals of its kind, improved familiars don't have that ability to be replaced. That is indeed the problem.

Ambassador, emissary, occult messenger, prankster and sage are the familiar archetypes which an improved familiar can take.

New Valeros' facial expression seems like someone you might want to play. Old Valeros' face...wasn't that. I don't actually like either picture, but the newer one's better for that.

On the wizard side the divination/foresight school is excellent even with just the 3 level investment. I've seen that work wonders for an arcane trickster with the same number of wizard levels. I don't think there are archetypes which can really help without at least 5 levels.

If you go with cleric then domain spells and domain spell slots do advance, unlike spont casting equivalents. It's a difference in the wording. For Nethys the magic/arcane and protection/defense domains could work, you can directly benefit from the arcane caster level boost of the first, and the 1/day defense aura isn't level dependent except for duration.

Alchemist 8 does come with another discovery and may be a better break point if you're not using fractional BAB/saves.

Edit: I'm not sure which discoveries you're taking. Obviously feral mutagen and I expect spontaneous healing. Elemental mutagen and preserve organs have their points, so do extend potion and enhance potion. Wings isn't especially appropriate but is useful. You're probably not getting into bombs with this character?

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