Clamoring for a 2e Technology Guide

Today’s Secrets of Golarion stream had a call for fans to make some noise if we want Numerian tech in the current edition, so it only seemed fitting to make a thread for exactly that! I adore pretty much all things Numeria, and I’m especially keen for most of those weapon options to come back.

Doubly so if it heralds an Iron Gods 2 - or maybe comprised the backmatter of an Iron Gods 2!

LO Legends did quite a bit of teasing about the current state of Numeria, and I think it could be very interesting to adventure in. All these Technic League remnants and warlords looking for new opportunities. Meanwhile I wouldn't exactly trust Kevoth-Kul. Just because he's no longer a League pawn doesn't mean he was ever a nice person. But while he's mighty at close range, does he really have fine-grained control over the pretty vast and wild land? I doubt it - so plenty of room for heroes to get their start and level up.

I want a good and proper chainsaw sword.

I'll join the clamor. The advanced superscience tech was one of the things that I loved about Pathfinder's setting and Numeria is still one of my favorite nations.

Whether we see advanced tech as a new Numeria book, or see it as part of a time traveler-style book spanning pre-humanoid civilizations and Stone Age tech to far future stuff I'd love to see the advanced tech come back. With how items are handled now I think it'd be a lot easier to gage when and where advanced tech should be available in a campaign.

Also, advanced tech vehicles please. Maybe 2E's vehicle rules are cleaner, or maybe I just groc them better, but vehicles seem much more doable in this edition than the previous, and who wouldn't want a hoverboard or motorbike?

I hereby declare that I am clamoring for a Technology Guide. I'll put money down now.

I am more into the mana wastes and steam punk these days, but I will say that Iron Gods was an utterly awesome adventure path to run. Each and every module was splendid-- not a weak volume in the 6. Also, when you dig into Numeria, it is friggin *cool*, what with mutants, rat folk warrens, Kellid barbarians, the Technic League, all of the crashed alien starships and alien monsters.

Ill buy a tech guide in a heartbeat

give me advanced tech wepons nukes ect

A Technology Guide would likely herald a LO: Broken Lands book, which would be a real joy.

I'd certainly be willing to give it a look given my predilection to science-fantasy.

Skymetals were already in Grand Bazaar.

But what I need is Investigator's methodology dedicated for technology.

As an avid fan (and early adopter) of Starfinder, yes, all of the yes!

I frequently used technology elements in my PF1 games, I'd love the ability to do the same in PF2!

Yes yes, please Nethys, Irori and Casandalee yes!

2E has already shown that tech doesn't have to be mechanically stronger with G&G vs 1E where guns hit touch and with game knowledge and the right class could be super strong especially before gid wizards got levels.

Energy weapons could be just that and deal only an energy type of damage or hybrid damage like some of the guns do. Also tech weapons would be a great place to explore the 4 degrees with weapons instead of only spells. Like some guns may be so point and shoot that they deal min damage on a miss and if the timeworn condition comes back misfires on crit fail. I would love to see the technomancer me a dedicated class like in Starfinder instead of the 1e prestige class. Could be kind of a magus wave caster that can use focus spells to recharge or alter the function of tech.

Would also like to see some non-tech but numeria related options. Like Barbarians who are good fighting tech. Primal spells like anti-tech field. Kasatha and their bone weapons as well as their bow nomad ranger(two bows man!). More android options as their status in Numeria has to have changed after Iron Gods. There are also lots of other AP's and modules from 1e that would have impact on Numeria such as Kingmaker because of Armag and the Tiger Lords as well as Pitax changes along their border. Wrath of the righteous as the crusaders road up the sellen may be less guarded by passing Crusaders could lead to more river pirates and bandits hitting Numeria for tech to loot. Than there is the threat of undead and the Whispering Way to the east after the events of Tyrants Grasp. Numeria is really a region surrounded by strife on all sides after just having its own power crisis and dealing with literal Gods besides all the Gonzo tech and drugs and aliens.

Tldr: gimmie!

I am more into the mana wastes and steam punk these days, but I will say that Iron Gods was an utterly awesome adventure path to run. Each and every module was splendid-- not a weak volume in the 6. Also, when you dig into Numeria, it is friggin *cool*, what with mutants, rat folk warrens, Kellid barbarians, the Technic League, all of the crashed alien starships and alien monsters.

They already announced the Impossible Lands book at the con so you are getting the Mana wastes and Steam punk. Now we need our magitech and space punk.

A high tech book would also be a good place to cover the rest of the solar system - what kind of tech do the Vercites have, what about the corpse fleet?

A high tech book would also be a good place to cover the rest of the solar system - what kind of tech do the Vercites have, what about the corpse fleet?

Whatever gets me playable 2e Lashunta, I'm here for it.

A high tech book would also be a good place to cover the rest of the solar system - what kind of tech do the Vercites have, what about the corpse fleet?

The Corpse Fleet won't have much tech since they don't exist as of yet. I'd love the Bone Sages to show up though in a solar system exploring book, and get to be more than LICHES, IN, SPACE.

Can this book please include the Solarian, Vanguard, and Biohacker classes?

Can this book please include the Solarian, Vanguard, and Biohacker classes?

It's doubtful. The first two classes aren't even tech based classes, so they don't really belong in a tech book.

And, even if they did port over something with the same name it's going to be mechanically very different to suit the PF2 design guidelines.

I would hazard a guess that in the same way no one foresaw fighter being the "best class" in PF2 before it was released, you probably wouldn't get a converted Solarion/Vanguard/Biohacker in the way you would hope to see it.

Ascalaphus wrote:

A high tech book would also be a good place to cover the rest of the solar system - what kind of tech do the Vercites have, what about the corpse fleet?

The Corpse Fleet won't have much tech since they don't exist as of yet. I'd love the Bone Sages to show up though in a solar system exploring book, and get to be more than LICHES, IN, SPACE.

I mean, it's not yet the really-honest-independent-from-Eox corpse fleet, but,

While the bone sages are abhorrent to civilized

beings from most worlds, the issue of their sociopathic
immortality would be strictly academic were it not for their
corpse ships. Vessels of steel spines and blistering f lame,
some as large as cities, Eoxian corpse ships are capable
of traversing the vast distances between planets, thanks
in large part to the bone sages’ unique undead nature.
Effectively immortal, the residents of Eox care little about
the long spans of time sacrificed in the voyage, nor do they
have any need to transport food or atmosphere. Instead,
their ships are often open to the void in places, adorned
with grim trophies and laden only with a few emotionless
bone sages or bound servants and the terrible weapons
that allow them to take what they want from other races.

2E technology guide?

Shut up and take my Skymetals. I am in.

I'd also super love to see how cybernetics get implemented in 2E. My assumption is that they wouldn't use investiture, not unless PF2E suddenly decided it wanted to be like Shadowrun, but I'm not totally sure what, if anything, they would use as a limiter instead.

It seems to be one of the few things we're missing. I would LOVE a technology book, but would also like a Lost Omens book on the current state of Numeria. I have all the LO books and I have barely touched them, but I just like to have them so if I ever go through an adventure in these lands, have some lore ready.

I think I would like "another Numeria AP" more than I would want a Tech book. I think you could make the incredible chainswords and lasers that you find work with the rules that you put in the toolbox of the APs.

The Technology Guide really wasn't especially useful in 1e except when you were playing Iron Gods (which was a great AP, but I don't think I ever opened it after we finished that one.)

The Technology Guide really wasn't especially useful in 1e except when you were playing Iron Gods (which was a great AP, but I don't think I ever opened it after we finished that one.)

That's a big reason why I pitch the advanced tech and other rules as part of a broader book, like something that looks at Golarion across time. Different time periods that each support different kinds of temporally-based genres would mean a hypothetical book would have more to offer wider groups of players and GMs.

I meaaaaaaaaan part of why it was less useful in 1e was that Technic League was lore ways explicitly preventing spread of technology and attacking anyone who is using it abroad.

So that kinda disincentived gms from using technological items in other campaigns because it would break the lore :p It wasn't just because of genre shenanigans (though that is also a reason). But it was why there was only single bad guy in APs besides iron gods that used technological items secretly, because lore really disincentived from writers making "Here is cyborg assassin from numeria" or "this character went to numeria and picked up laser guns!" type oneshot encounters.

Sidenote its also why I made thread on lost omen setting that we should get distant worlds material and technology guide in same book ;D That way we could cover both planetary shenanigans and expand technology to be not just numerian thing considering amount of interplanetary portal shenanigans

I think I would like "another Numeria AP" more than I would want a Tech book. I think you could make the incredible chainswords and lasers that you find work with the rules that you put in the toolbox of the APs.

The Technology Guide really wasn't especially useful in 1e except when you were playing Iron Gods (which was a great AP, but I don't think I ever opened it after we finished that one.)

I think a Lost Omens: Broken Lands and a Numerian AP would give me 99% of everything I ever see myself needing.

I think a Lost Omens: Broken Lands and a Numerian AP would give me 99% of everything I ever see myself needing.

I would be pretty stoked for that too.

I would like to turn on a very noisy engine to signal my clamor over a technology guide.

I would like to turn on a very noisy engine to signal my clamor over a technology guide.

Noisy Engine: ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

Lighting my big purple Torch is support of a 2E tech guide or Numeria AP

On a slightly different note, I would really want to see some "advancement of magic" type things that result from further understanding of magic as well. I think it would really play into the idea of science improving all things as well as the themes of the game as a whole.

But more on topic, I agree that the book I would want to see would be a book describing "tech levels" in general than a book purely on tech (which in 1e was unfortunately synonymous with Numeria only). In fact, I would actually like an approach that emphasizes the similarities between magic and tech, instead of making up arbitrary divisions.

Ps: A big problem of the OG tech book was because it was biased since we were seeing only one very specific civilization's tech. It would have been better to see more, or at least get a working tech level table (perhaps with "alternate tech levels" listed as well) to get more insight on the topic as a whole.

Pps: Also, on this-- "writers making "Here is cyborg assassin from numeria" or "this character went to numeria and picked up laser guns!" type oneshot encounters."

ngl I'd actually want to see more, considering PFS already had tons of Numerian-inspired crossover modules. Also, because there have been weirder things published already-- remember Reign of Winter?

Putting my name down as another person who really wants this book.

I want a good and proper chainsaw sword.

Go for the multiverse crossover, with a modified version of Planescape as well!

Putting my name down as another person who really wants this book.

Seconded!

Currently running a game where I'm having to home-brew laser guns. Clamoring for a technology guide ASAP!

And by technology as folks in this thread have postulated: magitech that shows magic expanding and evolving or as magic is used by Outsiders and on outer planets/galaxies; biotech grafts and beastguns; psitech enhancers and equipment; mundane steam- and clocktech; super wyrd dimension tech nobody really understands…; (riffing from the playable drow thread and general darklands skimming of the wiki) darklands tech that uses modified blightburn radiation or defunct aeon orb tech etc etc etc…

So my vote would be something in the vein of Book of the Dead or Dark Archives - part exploratory tome of the subject, part mini bestiary or adventures, and part equipment guide. With a shiny new class or bunch of ancestries/heritages.

To be even more specific, (and this sort of reflects what I want to see more in design as a whole) I would want to see guidelines on how to make your own tech according to a "tech level table" or something, rather than just writing down a bunch of "generic" future/Numeria stuff and saying "this is the only stuff you can have."

That is, I would much prefer solid guidelines and examples, in order to provide both players and GMs resources.

Ps: Fwiw, I know the og tech book had that weird color system that roughly corresponded to "spell level" but that didn't really help at all, considering a lack of help on spell design and magic in general (but I digress).

A Dark Archive style Numeria/Tech Guide could be really neat. Big list of equipment, some select monsters, handful of archetypes, and some mini-adventures. A little mini-story where you explore a ruined facility or crashed ship... another one where the PCs get embroiled in politics between warlords and technic league remnants.

I feel like that kind of book design could be really neat with how many plot hooks Numeria has.

Now there is Tech trait.

Is there rechargeable mobile battery in 2e?

Battery recycling still exists?(1e did some sort of)

And Inventor X Numerian tech... Maybe modification that will stop mundane rune suppress from anti magic?

Must is non-magic item that heals curse(For tech reliant)

The main thing that I want is trains. Chugga-chugga-choo-choo!

Thinking about Eberron has again made me crave more magitech.

Thinking about Eberron has again made me crave more magitech.

Eberron is one of my favorite super focused settings. Magic blends into industrialization in that setting, though; in Golarion, industrialization seems to be a response to certain areas lacking access to magic. Magitech seems a lot less prolific

Saedar wrote:

Thinking about Eberron has again made me crave more magitech.

Eberron is one of my favorite super focused settings. Magic blends into industrialization in that setting, though; in Golarion, industrialization seems to be a response to certain areas lacking access to magic. Magitech seems a lot less prolific

Don’t mistake Alkenstar for everywhere! Arcadia especially has no problem with tech (air-powered firearms, giant outdoor elevators, huge factories) coexist with abundant magic, or even meet as one for things like Beast and skymetal guns.

WWHsmackdown wrote:

Saedar wrote:

Thinking about Eberron has again made me crave more magitech.

Eberron is one of my favorite super focused settings. Magic blends into industrialization in that setting, though; in Golarion, industrialization seems to be a response to certain areas lacking access to magic. Magitech seems a lot less prolific

Don’t mistake Alkenstar for everywhere! Arcadia especially has no problem with tech (air-powered firearms, giant outdoor elevators, huge factories) coexist with abundant magic, or even meet as one for things like Beast and skymetal guns.

Definitely, it's just not ubiquitous like it is in eberron. Eberron's whole thesis statement as a setting was that widespread access to magic would lead to it becoming a cog in industrialization and exploitative capitalism spurred by wartime innovation

keftiu wrote:

WWHsmackdown wrote:

Saedar wrote:

Thinking about Eberron has again made me crave more magitech.

Eberron is one of my favorite super focused settings. Magic blends into industrialization in that setting, though; in Golarion, industrialization seems to be a response to certain areas lacking access to magic. Magitech seems a lot less prolific

Don’t mistake Alkenstar for everywhere! Arcadia especially has no problem with tech (air-powered firearms, giant outdoor elevators, huge factories) coexist with abundant magic, or even meet as one for things like Beast and skymetal guns.

Definitely, it's just not ubiquitous like it is in eberron. Eberron's whole thesis statement as a setting was that widespread access to magic would lead to it becoming a cog in industrialization and exploitative capitalism spurred by wartime innovation

Totally! I do think it’s a very rational take, and My Golarion absolutely has Magewrights and Adepts all over the place, selling their services as cantrip and ritual casters.

One imagines that the hypothetical era between Pathfinder and Starfinder sees both science and magical theory advancing world-wide, likely melding as they go along. I’m not a SF gal, but I love that in that setting, the four traditions are gone; like Jatembe always said, magic is magic.

I’d love to explore what some of those early steps looked like!

I will say the jiksta empire, the floating cities, and the cyclops empire hint at the setting having been edging toward that sort of magitech level before cataclysms pushed everything back technologically

I will say the jiksta empire, the floating cities, and the cyclops empire hint at the setting having been edging toward that sort of magitech level before cataclysms pushed everything back technologically

Guns & Gears makes this pretty explicit, and advances their legacy in the setting today:

MAGITECHNOLOGY

In the continent of Garund, near the border between the pyramid-studded deserts of Osirion and the lush jungles of the Mwangi Expanse, the Uomoto people scavenge rare wonders from the ruins of the Shory Empire, famed for its flying cities that combined air magic with technology. The nation of Eihlona in southern Garund has taken its studies of the Shory and other magitechnology further, placing its members among the finest experts of the craft. Such hybrid magitechnology isn’t the domain of the Shory alone. The ancient fallen empire known as the Jistka Imperium (page 212) in northern Garund, near modern-day Rahadoum, developed myriad magitechnological constructs. The most notable were the famed automatons, which were designed to house the souls and life forces of Jistka’s finest residents, before Osirion’s distant ancestors shattered the Jistkan empire.

This section goes on to likewise describe magitech as being widespread in Arcadia, and elsewhere in the book the advances of the Eihlonans are elaborated on, suggesting they might even be making new Automatons.

Making noise

WWHsmackdown wrote:

I will say the jiksta empire, the floating cities, and the cyclops empire hint at the setting having been edging toward that sort of magitech level before cataclysms pushed everything back technologically

Guns & Gears makes this pretty explicit, and advances their legacy in the setting today:

Quote:

MAGITECHNOLOGY

In the continent of Garund, near the border between the pyramid-studded deserts of Osirion and the lush jungles of the Mwangi Expanse, the Uomoto people scavenge rare wonders from the ruins of the Shory Empire, famed for its flying cities that combined air magic with technology. The nation of Eihlona in southern Garund has taken its studies of the Shory and other magitechnology further, placing its members among the finest experts of the craft. Such hybrid magitechnology isn’t the domain of the Shory alone. The ancient fallen empire known as the Jistka Imperium (page 212) in northern Garund, near modern-day Rahadoum, developed myriad magitechnological constructs. The most notable were the famed automatons, which were designed to house the souls and life forces of Jistka’s finest residents, before Osirion’s distant ancestors shattered the Jistkan empire.

This section goes on to likewise describe magitech as being widespread in Arcadia, and elsewhere in the book the advances of the Eihlonans are elaborated on, suggesting they might even be making new Automatons.

Yeah the big thing to remember is that Golarion has a way longer history than Earth (which exists in the same setting, and iirc people matching up the timelines revealed that the aforementioned nations were extant when we were Neolithic and early Bronze age), and that the current Golarion we see is massively post-apocalyptic, just centuries after the apocalypse(s).

WWHsmackdown wrote:

keftiu wrote:

WWHsmackdown wrote:

Saedar wrote:

Thinking about Eberron has again made me crave more magitech.

Eberron is one of my favorite super focused settings. Magic blends into industrialization in that setting, though; in Golarion, industrialization seems to be a response to certain areas lacking access to magic. Magitech seems a lot less prolific

Don’t mistake Alkenstar for everywhere! Arcadia especially has no problem with tech (air-powered firearms, giant outdoor elevators, huge factories) coexist with abundant magic, or even meet as one for things like Beast and skymetal guns.

Definitely, it's just not ubiquitous like it is in eberron. Eberron's whole thesis statement as a setting was that widespread access to magic would lead to it becoming a cog in industrialization and exploitative capitalism spurred by wartime innovation

Totally! I do think it’s a very rational take, and My Golarion absolutely has Magewrights and Adepts all over the place, selling their services as cantrip and ritual casters.

One imagines that the hypothetical era between Pathfinder and Starfinder sees both science and magical theory advancing world-wide, likely melding as they go along. I’m not a SF gal, but I love that in that setting, the four traditions are gone; like Jatembe always said, magic is magic.

I’d love to explore what some of those early steps looked like!

I agree with this, and I would love to compare setting notes sometime! (I also dislike SF, mostly since it is just so bland and toneless meaning the system is by extension bland, toneless, and restricting)

I hope the tech guide we get focuses on "tech levels" and gives GMs and players resources to make their own instead of just being a list of random stuff like in 1e.

In any case, I have hope that we will actually get a new "tech guide", considering what has already been published.

Ps: I really hope we get more info on Arcadia (which is clearly coded as the Americas). This is because with the current lore, Arcadia is shaping up to actually potentially be the most progressed place on Golarion (quite different from irl), beyond the Inner Sea regions (which are a hodgepodge frankly), so not getting more info on that would just be criminal.

Today’s Secrets of Golarion stream had a call for fans to make some noise if we want Numerian tech in the current edition, so it only seemed fitting to make a thread for exactly that! I adore pretty much all things Numeria, and I’m especially keen for most of those weapon options to come back.

Doubly so if it heralds an Iron Gods 2 - or maybe comprised the backmatter of an Iron Gods 2!

+1

I for one love high-tech/scifi elements in my fantasy games.

Would love a new tech guide and 2e Numeria AP.

+9000 from me. Would love to see 2 supplements, one general and one specific to Lost Omens. I don't use APs myself but I think one of those would be fine too. This is a situation where more would be better.

I'd volunteer to work on these if Paizo needs extra hands from the community. (But I imagine you have plenty of free lancers as is.)