Paizo Leadership Team Update

I've got three questions.

1) Did UPW get a say in the hiring of MH&H for internal investigations?

2) Will the results of this investigation be made available to UPW?

3) I understand that you can't talk about internal corrective actions that have taken place. Can you, however, state what new policies have been implemented to prevent Jeff from doxxing other customers in future?

Lastly...Jeff. Man, your apology would look a lot better with just a little adjustment.

"As the person in charge of trade shows, I want to apologize to anyone that felt marginalized as a result of the convention decision-making process..."

"...we see now that our room-sharing policy was based on outdated interpretations of gender, was not friendly to transgender employees, and could contribute to a perception of transphobia at the company."

These two statements together give off a pretty unflattering attitude about this matter. Your company has been accused of implementing transphobic workplace policies, confirmed by members of UPW and tacitly confirmed by your executives. When those policies are implemented, regardless of intent, your company is responsible for making people feel attacked. You can make a person hurt without intending to make a person hurt. These things are not mutually exclusive. But you need to recognize that is what you did, directly and transparently.

"As the person in charge of trade shows, I want to apologize to anyone that felt for marginalizeding our employees as a result of the convention decision-making process..."

"...we see now that our room-sharing policy was based on outdated interpretations of gender, and was not friendly to transgender employees, and could contribute to a perception of transphobia at the company."

Do you see the difference?

Prior to this post, I don't think most people were asking for Jeff to step down. But showing that you can't own up to a mistake does not inspire confidence that you are capable of correcting that mistake.

You have every opportunity to right this ship. Please, show a little more humility here. You'll be a better leader, and a better person for it; and it's an important step towards trust. You CAN still be the leader most of us strangers thought you were a few months ago. But that will require you to be that leader. Right now.

To help me sort out my feelings about all of this, it's been helpful for me to go back to the list of demands offered by #PAIZOACCOUNTABILITY:

[1] * Paizo needs to hire a whistleblower/arbitration company.
[2] * Said company must investigate Sara Marie's wrongful termination.
[3] * Executives need to be held accountable and investigated
[4] * Executives need to enter good faith negotiations with their employees
[5] * Salaries need to be posted and raised; some employees live below the median living wage in Seattle

So here's how things currently seem to stand with respect to these demands:

[1]: This announcement seems to meet demand [1].

[2]: This doesn't seem to have been addressed in this announcement or any other.

[3]: This announcement seems to meet the first half of this demand - the "investigated" part. The other half - the "held accountable" - is pending investigation, and so falls in the "we'll have to wait and see" category.

[4]: The voluntary recognition of the union seems to meet demand [4].

[5]: This issue is going to depend on how things go with negotiations with the union. So this also falls in the "we'll have to wait and see" category.

So Paizo has met 2.5 of the 5 demands, and 1.5 of the demands are in the "we'll have to wait and see" category - demands which they would need more time to meet, and might meet, but haven't met yet. So with respect to [1] and [3]-[5], Paizo's actions make me cautiously optimistic.

The big outlier here seems to be [2]. [2] hasn't been addressed at all. I realize there are confidentiality issues here, but there hasn't even been a statement of the form "we can't talk about this publicly, but the circumstances of some recent employee departures are being investigated, and corrective action will be taken".

So for the most part I guess I'm feeling cautiously optimistic. (Which is not to say other people should feel the same - I'm speaking only for myself here.) But the glaring omission on *anything* about [2] is disappointing.

Jeff is nothing if but consistent...consistently obtuse.

I mean, I don't feel that "I shouldn't doxx my customers" is holding anything up to a higher standard. If a freelancer or customer service person had done it, you'd have probably fired them. So that an executive can do it and just promise to not do it again is not any kind of high standard.

"I shouldn't doxx my customers" is an absolute minimum standard for anyone working at any company.

It is pretty fascinating that they had months and came up with this.

Laborer: Can get fired for literally anything their employee desires. Potentially nothing at all, if some recent stories are to be believed.

Executives: Can commit multiple offenses that would be auto-firing situations for the laborer and become President of a well-established company (relative to the industry).

Remember, kids. Executives aren't your friends and don't care about you, especially in the context of their business. Jeff clearly just wants to collect money while letting other people catch heat for his screwups.

I do hope the union will be involved in the processes mentioned.

And I agree that the language used with regards to the transphobic policy is very weak and a non-apology.

The big outlier here seems to be [2]. [2] hasn't been addressed at all. I realize there are confidentiality issues here, but there hasn't even been a statement of the form "we can't talk about this publicly, but the circumstances of some recent employee departures are being investigated, and corrective action will be taken".

I'll just leave this here as looks like it only appeared a few days ago and not everyone might be aware of it:

I think every post in this thread and every unionize hashtag on twitter should cost a donation to Sara's Ko-Fi.

I have taken my time processing this statement. I have to say I am deeply disappointed by it. Many others have stated my concerns in a much more eloquent manner, so I will stand by their words. Transphobia in the workplace is unacceptable. Violating customers' privacy is also unacceptable. Offering feeble apologies and couching even that in terms of "allegations" and "perception" is frankly craven. The Paizo executives seem to want us to trust them that the right things will be done... but trust with the community has been broken.

I wish to continue to support the freelancers and writers who have created a world I love, so I will continue to do so for the time being. But all the goodwill recognizing the PWU created has now been expended. Paizo remains on thin ice with me. Better hope that negotiations with the Union don't break down, because that might be enough to push me over the edge and not come back.

Porridge wrote:

The big outlier here seems to be [2]. [2] hasn't been addressed at all. I realize there are confidentiality issues here, but there hasn't even been a statement of the form "we can't talk about this publicly, but the circumstances of some recent employee departures are being investigated, and corrective action will be taken".

I'll just leave this here as looks like it only appeared a few days ago and not everyone might be aware of it:

https://ko-fi.com/charmedneedle

I think every post in this thread and every unionize hashtag on twitter should cost a donation to Sara's Ko-Fi.

Thanks for sharing this!

Heather removed the ones I quoted here but missed this one. Self Removing.

The non-apology apology is fast becoming Paizo's MO, having been mastered already by Jeff.

CyberMephit wrote:

Porridge wrote:

The big outlier here seems to be [2]. [2] hasn't been addressed at all. I realize there are confidentiality issues here, but there hasn't even been a statement of the form "we can't talk about this publicly, but the circumstances of some recent employee departures are being investigated, and corrective action will be taken".

I'll just leave this here as looks like it only appeared a few days ago and not everyone might be aware of it:

https://ko-fi.com/charmedneedle

I think every post in this thread and every unionize hashtag on twitter should cost a donation to Sara's Ko-Fi.

Thanks for sharing this!

Want to support. Any one able to confirm it is real/verify it isn't someone else? Would definitely buy Sara Marie a cup of java for all of the headaches I've seen her manage in the CS forum :D

I think one of Paizo's ongoing problems here is that this is just some of the stuff that's happened. They've crystalized around these couple of big things, but there's more and some of them are lesser but longer term. I know there are tales from certain former employees that probably won't see the light of day unless they do. There are other things out there that have the potential to come up and that's where the continuing problems will lay. There is potential for them to keep coming up and Paizo just be a consistent holding pattern so that the good they do is constantly chopped off at the knees by old patterns of abuse.

It's a problem.

Yeah you have transphobia directed towards freelancers. You have incidents at Paizocon that were never resolved or at least if they were they never told the victim. Bill Webb wasn't really investigated particularly well enough which resulted in huge fights within the Organized Play community that caused people to leave or be kicked out. Multiple situations of active harassment that were brought up on the message boards that were never investigated nor told to relevant people. The lead time between getting a response in terms of harassment could take months if your email wasn't just ignored. No semblance of active guidelines on how to deal with harassment. No existing privacy policy on how said policy was handled. Paizo withdrawing convention support because of safety reasons and not telling anyone about said safety issues.

Now with that being said do I think progress is being made to alleviate these issues? Yes. I have seen a marked improvement. Do I think the executives are responsible? No.

Want to support. Any one able to confirm it is real/verify it isn't someone else? Would definitely buy Sara Marie a cup of java for all of the headaches I've seen her manage in the CS forum :D

That's what is listed on her Twitter profile, at least.

Realize that convention issues are more than just, "I didn't get to go." GenCon is a place where you can meet fans, talk with industry professionals that will help you develop your career, and team building among colleagues. Being effectively banned from professionally attending GenCon is detrimental to your career both in and out-of-house.

Loss of opportunity that others get is discriminatory and wrong and needs more than just an OOPSIE to rectify.

Lissa Guillet wrote:

I think one of Paizo's ongoing problems here is that this is just some of the stuff that's happened. They've crystalized around these couple of big things, but there's more and some of them are lesser but longer term. I know there are tales from certain former employees that probably won't see the light of day unless they do. There are other things out there that have the potential to come up and that's where the continuing problems will lay. There is potential for them to keep coming up and Paizo just be a consistent holding pattern so that the good they do is constantly chopped off at the knees by old patterns of abuse.

It's a problem.

Yeah you have transphobia directed towards freelancers. You have incidents at Paizocon that were never resolved or at least if they were they never told the victim. Bill Webb wasn't really investigated particularly well enough which resulted

Now with that being said do I think progress is being made to alleviate these issues? Yes. I have seen a marked improvement. Do I think the executives are responsible? No.

Sadly, that is the case in most areas.:(

I've just removed a few posts for language, and some for being off topic/bickering. Please try to express your thoughts without cursing or attacking others.

I can save Wolfram and Hart some time and billable hours, the main causes of everything that's blown up in your faces the last 3 months are exactly the people it obviously is.

What you do with that information is what matters and... well maybe you'll surprise me.

It's been confirmed that the union was given no opportunity to interact with or contribute to this statement whatsoever.

That's not a very good sign, is it, Jeff?

Also, while I understand why Jeff used such careful language, that understanding makes this worse. This language is clearly couched to avoid litigation. While the law firm investigates, he would’ve been advised to not make absolute statements like “this was transphobic” or “I doxxed people.”

Except…those actions happened. Heck this post admits as much on the former and the latter doesn’t need admission cause the post where that happened is archived. You cannot apologize without exposing yourself to some form of repercussion. A sincere apology requires vulnerability. Without it, you demonstrate no desire to improve…just a desire to make people calling you out for it go away. That does not exactly inspire faith.

It's in general frustrating about public apology statements how more often than not they have air where the one doing apologizing is being defensive or grudging about it. Like the best possible interpretation is "oh my gosh, I didn't intend to be bad when I was bad, I'm so sorry for you feeling attacked at my bad behavior" which is at best acceptable only in private context when you know how and trust other person despite them fumbling with their words :P

I'm still overall cautiously optimistic, but bit heavier on caution side since I have no context of how "unbiased" these firms are. Most of my optimistic side comes from trust in paizo employees besides the key questionable figures in management and the new union. Internal investigation is always a good thing and Paizo isn't really big company like Ubisoft where abusers just got moved to cushy jobs out of the company. But yeah I'm opposite of confident about Jeff right now, perhaps to unfair degree in that sure they could be privately genuinely apologetic. But people in power have to prove it they use their power for good ESPECIALLY when they have abused power previously :/

My top priority right now is seeing that Paizo is cooperating fully with the union. There's no room for error in that. I no longer feel I trust Jeff, Vic, Lisa, or anyone in leadership, so I want to know that the union is going to have a seat at the table so I can trust someone in charge.

Also I just saw the twitter post KC is referring to confirming that none of the actions taken were done in consultation with the union or employees at large. So the law firm is transparently a self-defense mechanism and not a means of “sussing out accountability.”

The Twitter post did take care to specify that they were saying what they said neutrally, simply clarifying some confusion. But yes, it makes me trust the law firm a lot less.

Uhhhh, did anyone else actually click over and look at that law firm? Their last three cases they won were 1. Helping the bank that owns a Jewish history museum get more money from the museum when they filled for bankruptcy 2. Keep someone from being elected a deacon at a church? And 3. "MHH was retained by EverCare Choice Inc. (“EverCare”), a managed long term care plan, to challenge the decision by the New York State Department of Health (“DOH”) to freeze the risk score it uses to determine the partial capitation and nursing home transition rates (“Rates”) charged to its members." I'm not a lawyer but isn't that helping a nursing home scam old people against the wishes of the DEPARTMENT OF FREAKING HEALTH?

I'd reeeally like to know who the DEIB person was that recommended this law firm.

Uhhhh, did anyone else actually click over and look at that law firm? Their last three cases they won were 1. Helping the bank that owns a Jewish history museum get more money from the museum when they filled for bankruptcy 2. Keep someone from being elected a deacon at a church? And 3. "MHH was retained by EverCare Choice Inc. (“EverCare”), a managed long term care plan, to challenge the decision by the New York State Department of Health (“DOH”) to freeze the risk score it uses to determine the partial capitation and nursing home transition rates (“Rates”) charged to its members." I'm not a lawyer but isn't that helping a nursing home scam old people against the wishes of the DEPARTMENT OF FREAKING HEALTH?

I'd reeeally like to know who the DEIB person was that recommended this law firm.

Good lord. Any one of these things alone (referring to KC’s clarification also) would be cause for concern but not damning. But combined they don’t precisely paint a pretty picture.

Also, I do wish to sincerely thank Cleaver for the correction. Yeah they did specify that it was not a condemnation, just a confirmation that the union was only given an hour’s worth of time to read over the statement was issued.

Now, personally, I don’t think an hour-long preview constitutes a good faith effort at collaboration and I, personally, view that as dubious and probably a bad idea. But that is specifically my take, and not the view of UPW or any of its members (of which I am not), as far as I know at time of writing

Unfortunately, this announcement doesn't give me a lot of confidence that Paizo is planning to improve - just move on and hope people forget.

This should have been written by Mr. Alvarez, on behalf of Paizo, to us, Paizo's fans and customers. Instead, we got a lawyer's letter with a short quote from the President. For all the deficiencies in the first response, at least it was from Paizo. This approach appears to signal the digging in of heels and the building of walls by a legal team, not a promise to do better by a leadership team.

I love Paizo, and its products, and many of the people that work there and with them. Paizo has changed my life in so many positive ways. So to see this behavior, and to see Paizo leadership double down time and again in such a short time... it's disappointing. I feel I'm losing a friend who's decided to engage in destructive behavior and all I can do is watch and suffer for it, or shut them out.

Unfortunately, this announcement doesn't give me a lot of confidence that Paizo is planning to improve - just move on and hope people forget.

This should have been written by Mr. Alvarez, on behalf of Paizo, to us, Paizo's fans and customers. Instead, we got a lawyer's letter with a short quote from the President. For all the deficiencies in the first response, at least it was from Paizo. This approach appears to signal the digging in of heels and the building of walls by a legal team, not a promise to do better by a leadership team.

I love Paizo, and its products, and many of the people that work there and with them. Paizo has changed my life in so many positive ways. So to see this behavior, and to see Paizo leadership double down time and again in such a short time... it's disappointing. I feel I'm losing a friend who's decided to engage in destructive behavior and all I can do is watch and suffer for it, or shut them out.

Same, and eloquently put.

While I'm still not boycotting, I also... up until all this broke, I hadn't bought any Paizo stuff in over a year. I barely knew anything about Pathfinder 2E. I'm interested now, and I want to come back, but I feel like we need a better reason to celebrate than this.

Lets get the facts straight and if I were you I would edit your post.

He isn't a VP. At the time he was barely middle management and according to the only public accusations the interactions were with co workers of about the same level. No reports that it was done to people who reported to him.

Levelling accusations is serious, get the actual accusations correct or we lose credibility and lose the shock if posts get removed with bad information.

Patterns of bad behavior demonstrate the culture of a -place, especially when those in authority are not held accountable.

Wait, the dick pics are off-topic?

I think making claims about incidents without some sort of verification or proof of discussion, whether on or off site, is off-topic and does muddy the water somewhat, and increases moderator stress (there are like... what, three at the moment? Let's try not to increase their work).

Dude already admitted to it, didn't he?

Lets get the facts straight and if I were you I would edit your post.

He isn't a VP. At the time he was barely middle management and according to the only public accusations the interactions were with co workers of about the same level. No reports that it was done to people who reported to him.

Levelling accusations is serious, get the actual accusations correct or we lose credibility and lose the shock if posts get removed with bad information.

Sorry, is this directed at me?

Yoshua wrote:

Lets get the facts straight and if I were you I would edit your post.

He isn't a VP. At the time he was barely middle management and according to the only public accusations the interactions were with co workers of about the same level. No reports that it was done to people who reported to him.

Levelling accusations is serious, get the actual accusations correct or we lose credibility and lose the shock if posts get removed with bad information.

Sorry, is this directed at me?

I think Yoshua is responding to a post that got deleted, since your post doesn't mention that stuff much at all I don't think.

I just wanted to be sure, since my edit window's about to close! XD

Funky Badger, I think the pictures went from "pics" to "dick pics" in the retelling, and not necessarily in the initial allegations.

Yoshua wrote:

Lets get the facts straight and if I were you I would edit your post.

He isn't a VP. At the time he was barely middle management and according to the only public accusations the interactions were with co workers of about the same level. No reports that it was done to people who reported to him.

Levelling accusations is serious, get the actual accusations correct or we lose credibility and lose the shock if posts get removed with bad information.

Sorry, is this directed at me?

Nah the person deleted their quote and what I referenced were the corrected facts, so unless you were stating misinformation, which I find unlikely, no not at you.

Why let a man responsible for discriminatory police keep his job and station? What happens the next time he decided to hurt people?

Why let a man responsible for discriminatory police keep his job and station? What happens the next time he decided to hurt people?

Another non-apology, apology.

Yeah I'm pretty sure those were pics of Dick, not dick pics. Internet has a great way of distorting things along the way.