Kinetesist hype thread

[shroudb]

The only one I see as meme personally is the grindstone.

The rest imo fit the general pathfinder feel.

I don't see a ballista made out of wood and metal as something cartoonish as an example, nor generating sandstorms around you, or lava leap and etc.

[Xenocrat]

I don’t think Lava Leap is a meme! But maybe I need to imagine it being goofier.

Bladderwort and the grindstone you can actually use to sharpen weapons mid-fight, on the other hand…

[PossibleCabbage]

The language of Elemental Overlap sort of suggests that other composite impulses are possible. So other than the rotating piece of flint (a rock that is harder than steel, but brittle) what other interaction between earth and metal would work? Since one way in reality that stone and metal are combined constructively is that one can use the former for sharpening the latter.

Like I was sort of disappointed the armor/metal composite wasn't defensive in nature.

[aobst128]

I hadn't considered the steam knight and lava leap combo. That's pretty handy.

[Dubious Scholar]

Metal/Earth composites? Honestly, a fortress wall kind of makes of sense there. Either a more efficient wall impulse or some extra crazy one.

Maybe "Fortress Tower" - you raise a fortified wall from the ground in a square, it lifts allies up with it, everyone on it has cover from the ground level but it's one-way. Basically a fancy stone and steel construct to let your ranged characters blast away with impunity. At higher levels the sides become spiked and jagged to harm anyone climbing it, the cover improves, etc?

[Sanityfaerie]

Ravingdork wrote:

Sanityfaerie wrote:

Ravingdork wrote:

The whole conjure a ballista or combat grindstone are just the height of cartoony silliness in my mind.

Is that a good thing or a bad thing?

Depends on who you ask. I'm not a fan.

Where are all the amazing composite ideas from 1e? They were interesting and practical, and unlikely to turn into a game disrupting joke.

Earth/Wood is good enough to make me seriously consider trying to put together an Earth/Wood character jsut to get access to it.

Fire/Metal is pretty great for pure Fire types who are willign to wait until level 8. I guess Metal types might like it to, but I'm just not impressed by Metal in general.

Wind/Water is... well, it feels like it could fit very easily into either camp. I'm not convinced that it's any better or worse overall than any of the roughly equivalent standard water impulses, but it's certainly not *bad*.

Wind/Earth is apparently a solid enough stance that people are trying to make builds around it. Water/Fire is a likewise very tempting stance in some ways, especially if you happen to be mono-water (though then the overflow/stance thing may become an issue).

Wind/Wood is... it's okay? I mean, "stack another heal, and this one also does bad things to the enemy" certainly isn't a bad thing."

Water/Wood... I'll put it this way. There's a good chance that the first kineticist I bring to an actual table will be a Water/Wood kineticist, and I will try to make that thing a useful and effective part of my repertoire. I have some hopes of succeeding?

Earth/Metal is gonzo but seems viable? Wood/Metal is gonzo and kind of not. It's like the truenamer. We're sitting here in thread right now, trying to figure out if we can leverage enough cheese to polish it up to shining mediocrity.

Water/Metal is just as brutally niche as... basically the entire rest of Metal.

Water/Earth looks potentially useful, but currently has at least one critical parameter that is undefined. Fire/Earth looks pretty cool in some ways. The people who are inclined to consider playing Fire/Earth certainly seem happy with it.

I honestly don't recall what Wind/Metal even is, unless it's that stance with the shattering plates, in which case it seemed a bit underwhelming to me, but I might not be giving it credit for all of its benefits.

Wood/Fire is a bit underwhelming, in that "you have to use it to its fullest in order to get a decent value out of it at all" way. Maybe it would have some value if you're regularly in combat with enemies who like hiding behind cover? I suppose there's also the argument that it's a utility power as much as it is a combat power, and that it can be used to prep the battlefield if you know the enemy's coming. I suppose that with a bit of finagling you can cobble together enough utility to make it worthwhile. It's just a bit of work.

I simply do not recall Fire/Wind.

...and that's the lot of them. Some that are very solid, some that are workable, some that are... less so.

Oh - and another purpose to the ballista - if you're fighting something sufficiently dumb, you can open with the ballista while the entire party stays basically hidden, and have the enemy start by smashign the heck out of it. Similarly, it does get a bit better if you can run some battlefield prep before things really get going. Kineticist has a few of those, actually.

Edit: Oh, that's right. Wind/Metal is Lightning Rod. Yeah... that one's pretty terrible. It looks especially bad when you put it next to Molten Wires (the Fire/Metal hybrid). Like, it's a real "Why can't you be more like your brother?" moment there.

[aobst128]

Metal/air is lightning rod. You stab a target at melee range for 3 actions and while its embedded they take a -1 penalty to electric effects. -2 if they're metal or wearing metal. Not great. Air/fire is ash strider I think it's called. You stride through an enemy, they take some fire damage and you become concealed until the start of your next turn.

[aobst128]

Yeah, metal really just wants you to fight armored dudes and metal constructs. Werewolves and fiends too I guess with plate in treasure. It has no other niche or play style unfortunately

[Sanityfaerie]

aobst128 wrote:

Yeah, metal really just wants you to fight armored dudes and metal constructs. Werewolves and fiends too I guess with plate in treasure. It has no other niche or play style unfortunately

Okay. Now you've inspired me. I'm going to find a way to make Metal viable/competitive that doesn't depend on your enemies conveniently all being the specific kinds of things that are vulnerable to you.

There's gotta be something.

edit: and for further challenge, I'm going to make it mono-Metal... and try not to depend entirely on Molten Wires and Whirling Grindstone.

[Ghaar Drona]

Sanityfaerie wrote:

aobst128 wrote:

Yeah, metal really just wants you to fight armored dudes and metal constructs. Werewolves and fiends too I guess with plate in treasure. It has no other niche or play style unfortunately

Okay. Now you've inspired me. I'm going to find a way to make Metal viable/competitive that doesn't depend on your enemies conveniently all being the specific kinds of things that are vulnerable to you.

There's gotta be something.

I think it is already viable. Metal doesn't have any specific strengths or weaknesses outside of enemies wearing/made of metal. But for other enemies, it's not bad, just mediocre.

[Xenocrat]

Metal does fine damage (second or tied for second to fire) against non-metal (or weak to metal) things and at level 12-14 has great personal/party defense. Even just tossing out the scrap wall to divide up enemies and eat up some actions and then inflict some damage is fine.

[aobst128]

Sanityfaerie wrote:

aobst128 wrote:

Yeah, metal really just wants you to fight armored dudes and metal constructs. Werewolves and fiends too I guess with plate in treasure. It has no other niche or play style unfortunately

Okay. Now you've inspired me. I'm going to find a way to make Metal viable/competitive that doesn't depend on your enemies conveniently all being the specific kinds of things that are vulnerable to you.

There's gotta be something.

edit: and for further challenge, I'm going to make it mono-Metal... and try not to depend entirely on Molten Wires and Whirling Grindstone.

I salute you and wish you luck on your journey.

It's probably not that bad if you just focus on pinions if you've got enough targets. Would get pretty boring though. alternatively, you could focus your attention to the regular class feats and see if you can find something cool with that.

Additionally, if you have versatile blasts and plate in treasure, I think your electric blasts can count as a precious metal. Silver electricity is pretty rad.

[shroudb]

Metal has good base damage though.

as an example, retch rust, even without the metal part of persistent damage, still starts at 4d10 at level 8 and increases at 1d10/2levels. For a 2 action impulse that's pretty strong base damage (strongest base damage of all 2 action impulses exluding capstones?).

similarily, Pinions is quite strong at simply doing damage.
same deal with the level 12 burst that leaves hazardous terrain behind without sustain, again, great damage.

the higher levels of the element are also strong, the level 14 sustain is very good defensive tool, the million needles capstone is amazing, the 12th level aura is not bad for defense/support with group wide resist physical.

and while metallic/armored opponents won't be that common, if you add all metallic/armored and all material resistance enemies, there are quite alot of them that you can exploit their weakness.

[Gaulin]

Yeah it's easy to look at all the metal impulses that specifically have to do with metal and think they're only good against metal, but the base damage is very strong. 10d10 at 20 with retch rust, a two action overflow, is great even without the extra damage to metal creatures, and fortitude is a little rarer for impulses too. Pinions is strong, rain of razors isn't initially anything to write home about but an enemy moving a square or two in the area makes it very competitive. Hell of 1000 needles is really strong. Grab metal resistance, consume power, sustain the impulse for free to deal electricity damage to everything in the area, consume power the electric damage, and then needles again. If you take kinetic pinnacle you could even blast or stance at the end.

[aobst128]

Here's another late game combo for earth/metal/wood kineticists. The heavy armor earth impulse combined with alloy flesh and assume earth's mantle with the wood impulse junction giving you temp HP every turn. The free sustain lets you raise a shield with alloy flesh and grants you 10 physical resistance on top of everything. Only thing is you can't be healed but good luck to anything that's trying to get you to the point that you need healing lol.

[Calliope5431]

Hell is extremely strong yes. 13d6 is a lot and immobilized hurts a ton. In general metal is better as a dip for hell, plate in treasure and consume power... but I don't think any mono element really is better than someone who branches out, at least not from 1-20 (from 1-10 mono means you get the impulse and aura junction faster which is huge, but most elements run out of good impulses eventually. Except maybe air).

[YuriP]

One thing that I noticed is that elements are primary divided into heavy and light elements.

Heavy Elements:

Earth

Wood

Metal

Light Elements:

Air

Fire

Water

Basically heavy elements don't requires a high dex investment giving some good defensive impulses and junctions but also is more close range focused making them interesting to those who want or don't care to stay in frontline or closer to frontline.
While light elements requires a good dex investment to keep your AC high also don't get too much or too strong defensive impulses but usually get more and better movement options making them more focused in long range.

This not means that an air kineticist cannot play closer nor an earth kineticist can't fight at range but reflects how their impulse will focus more.

Considering this when you make a multi-element kineticist usually if you merge a heavy+light element this usually means that you will probably get a mix of versatile impulse while try to keep your defenses high, when you focus in heavy-heavy elements you probably will get more defensive options to complete/increase your defensive abilities also if you get light-light elements you will get many good range AoE damage and control impulses while probably will be able to keeping out the distance.

[Dubious Scholar]

Hell of 1,000,000 needles is one of my favorites of the capstones for just being absolutely brutal in both mechanics and flavor. You read it and it just keeps adding more ways that it's a very bad day for whoever you're fighting.

In particular, I just feel bad for any minions you face.

[Sanityfaerie]

I note that the "heavy" elements are much more about extablishing structures and lasting effects... and I feel like Water is a bit "heavier" than wind and fire, in that way.

I also again note that it's very possible to manage your AC issues even at base dex 12 by grabbing Sentinel/Armor Proficiency ASAP, and then retraining back out again once you get a couple of stat bumps.

The lvl 1 armor impulses really wouldn't be worth it without their add-on benefits.

[Calliope5431]

Dubious Scholar wrote:

Hell of 1,000,000 needles is one of my favorites of the capstones for just being absolutely brutal in both mechanics and flavor. You read it and it just keeps adding more ways that it's a very bad day for whoever you're fighting.

In particular, I just feel bad for any minions you face.

Pretty much all of the level 18 capstone impulses do a good job of feeling epic. Obviously haven't playtested them yet, but they're so much better than anything else you get that barring weird situational stuff (if you really need to double move, say) I suspect they're always the best thing to be doing at high level.

Not that other impulses are bad or don't scale, but the capstones were clearly designed to be superior to those other impulses, and it shows.

The one complaint I had was making all of the healing impulses vitality. It makes sense for wood (less so for water), but speaking as someone playing Blood Lords right now...yikes. Would have preferred to have seen at least a few of these things that could be used on a negative healing party, like Soothe can.

[Squiggit]

Calliope5431 wrote:

Pretty much all of the level 18 capstone impulses do a good job of feeling epic.

Most of them. I feel a little underwhelmed by Turn the Wheel of Seasons.

Getting four effects for one impulse is neat, but since they rotate it's hard to get them to line up ideally and the individual effects aren't super strong. 5d6 damage for 3 actions at level 18 is real bad. AoE Slowed 1 is good, but the actual Slow spell does it better 7 levels earlier (spells are limited, but by level 18 those slots aren't super high cost).

There's also no such thing as dazed but I assume they mean dazzled.

[Sanityfaerie]

Calliope5431 wrote:

The one complaint I had was making all of the healing impulses vitality. It makes sense for wood (less so for water), but speaking as someone playing Blood Lords right now...yikes. Would have preferred to have seen at least a few of these things that could be used on a negative healing party, like Soothe can.

If you really want to play a Kineticist healer in a Negative Healing party, I think that's a "talk with your GM" moment. I'll say that it does make sense that natural power channeled directly from the elemental planes might not be inclined to restore the undead.

[aobst128]

Maybe the void kineticist will get a negative healing option. Assuming we get more gates later down the line anyways. I'm interested in the potential of a psychokinetisist with power directly from the astral plane. Could have force and mental damage blasts.

[Temperans]

Sanityfaerie wrote:

Calliope5431 wrote:

The one complaint I had was making all of the healing impulses vitality. It makes sense for wood (less so for water), but speaking as someone playing Blood Lords right now...yikes. Would have preferred to have seen at least a few of these things that could be used on a negative healing party, like Soothe can.

If you really want to play a Kineticist healer in a Negative Healing party, I think that's a "talk with your GM" moment. I'll say that it does make sense that natural power channeled directly from the elemental planes might not be inclined to restore the undead.

They are going to have to wait until PF2 releases Void Kineticists.

[Xenocrat]

Calliope5431 wrote:

Pretty much all of the level 18 capstone impulses do a good job of feeling epic.

Poor air.

[shroudb]

from the capstones i don't like either from wood and the mounts from metal:

1)
the trees have a bit lower attack bonus than what i would like them to (your attack bonus at 20 is +37 and theirs is at +32, a normal martial's attack bonus would be +36 by that point)

plus, the fact that they share a MAP basically gives you 1 weak and 2 neglible attacks on the first round, and you only get 1 attack per sustain afterwards. Basically you get 3 attacks, for 3 actions each at -5/-10/-15 of your attack bonus. sure, they grab, but so low attack rolls...

the damage is also not really anything important at that level (see earth doing aoe 4d10 with no save at that point while they are at 5d10+9 single target with requiring attack to do said damamge)

2)turn the wheels is ok if nothing spectacular, you pretty much always want to open up with the slow i feel and then count down from there. Slow for 1 round followed by a bit of damage when it matters the most, then stabilize a bit with the temp hp on round 3 and ignore dazzled because level 18+ have other senses to begin with. But damage numbers would have needed to be a bit higher (like 9d6 or so) and slow a bit stronger imo. Temp hp numbers are fine, 20 temp hp group wide is very good.

3)the mounts... they really had to give the mounts some of the AC benefits like them having a free action stride per turn or something like that, because as written people ridding them need to be using Command an Animal mechanics and those are terrible for in-combat at those levels (1 action for 1 action, and that actions happens at NEXT turn). It also doesn't really make sense that people have to command artificially made mounts but whatever.

Xenocrat wrote:

Calliope5431 wrote:

Pretty much all of the level 18 capstone impulses do a good job of feeling epic.

Poor air.

what do you mean? Infinite expanse is amazing both in thematics and effect.

the stance is also very strong for a passive effect.

[Squiggit]

Xenocrat wrote:

Calliope5431 wrote:

Pretty much all of the level 18 capstone impulses do a good job of feeling epic.

Poor air.

Are you not hype for spending three actions and overflow to make someone flat footed?

Tempest's Fury is some pretty nice extra damage for something that's just passive benefits, at least.

[shroudb]

Squiggit wrote:

Xenocrat wrote:

Calliope5431 wrote:

Pretty much all of the level 18 capstone impulses do a good job of feeling epic.

Poor air.

Are you not hype for spending three actions and overflow to make someone flat footed?

Tempest's Fury is some pretty nice extra damage for something that's just passive benefits, at least.

and if they fail their save they are Fleeing, wasting actions, and they continue to flee until they also make their flat check.

the off-guard is only if they make their save.

[Calliope5431]

Xenocrat wrote:

Calliope5431 wrote:

Pretty much all of the level 18 capstone impulses do a good job of feeling epic.

Poor air.

Air forces fleeing on a failure. And it isn't incapacitation. Do you know how rare that is?

(yes, yes, something higher level than you isn't always going to fail its saving throw. But WOW)

[Dubious Scholar]

It's a 20' burst. If you've got multiple enemies it's likely to devour their actions.

I think the flat check might be too easy for them to escape on? But even then, Infinite Expanse is a very powerful control effect.

[shroudb]

Dubious Scholar wrote:

It's a 20' burst. If you've got multiple enemies it's likely to devour their actions.

I think the flat check might be too easy for them to escape on? But even then, Infinite Expanse is a very powerful control effect.

they always spend at least 1 action, and the flat check basically matters only for losing a second or third action, and it may not even matter depending on their speed and if they can escape.

keeping in mind that this triggers when someone enters as well, it means someone approaching you already spends an action to get towards you, then is forced to save, his action gets interrupted since now he is Fleeing, so he has to spend another action fleeing, and if he fails the 50-50 he has to spend his last action as well.

that's not an unreasonable example given the radius of the power and how big plots of land you can basically block.

[Xenocrat]

shroudb wrote:

Xenocrat wrote:

Calliope5431 wrote:

Pretty much all of the level 18 capstone impulses do a good job of feeling epic.

Poor air.

what do you mean? Infinite expanse is amazing both in thematics and effect.

the stance is also very strong for a passive effect.

With some luck Infinite Expanse can waste more than single action (which might just place them somwhere they want to be anyway). I'd rather have Hell of 1M Needles or the fire sun one. But I'd definitely rather than Infinite Expanse than the stance.

The stance gives flight/speed benefits you should already have, weak aura damage that doesn't compare to what a competent fire kineticist has been doing since level 5, and less of a damage boost to blasts than if you took Desert Winds way back at level 6. It's 2/3s of two better stances you could have had much earlier in your career and some redundant stuff you don't need.

[shroudb]

Xenocrat wrote:

shroudb wrote:

Xenocrat wrote:

Calliope5431 wrote:

Pretty much all of the level 18 capstone impulses do a good job of feeling epic.

Poor air.

what do you mean? Infinite expanse is amazing both in thematics and effect.

the stance is also very strong for a passive effect.

With some luck Infinite Expanse can waste more than single action (which might just place them somwhere they want to be anyway). I'd rather have Hell of 1M Needles or the fire sun one. I'd definitely rather than Infinite Expanse than the stance.

The stance gives flight/speed benefits you should already have, weak aura damage that doesn't compare to what a competent fire kineticist has been doing since level 5, and less of a damage boost to blasts than if you took Desert Winds way back at level 6. It's 2/3s of two better stances you could have had much earlier in your career and some redundant stuff you don't need. But it's a consolation prize for solo air who couldn't find room for the

you'd need to be level 12 firekineticist to get the equivallent to 2d12 aura damage, not level 5.

Also, a creature entering your aura and ending its turn there (as is, a creature trying to approach you and attack you) takes the damage twice, so 4d12, which is more than what a firekineticist will be doing with his aura even at level 20.

the 1d12 blast damage is nice without needing both a range limit, and another specific element

and you gain fly 40 instead of fly 30 that you would have with just Cyclonic.

all those simultaneously, for a passive effect, is nice.

Also, you can 100% direct where they will be fleeing (IF they win the 50-50, if they lose it, they keep losing actions) since they have to flee as fast as they can from their source of their fear, which you place, wherever you want. So, you direct their direction of their escape (they have to go towards the nearest edge of it).

So, wasting at minimum 1 action on a fail, and 50% 2 actions, and 25% 3 actions, in a huge AoE, and still giving them off-guard even if they make the save, is pretty good.

It's not as strong as million needles, no, but it still is a very good power.

[Xenocrat]

The pyrokineticist is doing it for 13 levels before you can, which was my main point.

The double damage potential is a valid point. Of course, the fire aura is guranteed (start of enemy turn) whereas the air is avoidable (but at least eats up an action if they move away).

You don't need another element for Desert Winds if you're solo air. The range will sometimes be useful, sure.

Only a very incompetent player is getting a +10 status speed bonus from this at 18th level. The new longstrider is an air spell and you can use it with kinetic activation as a baby kineticist.

The failure text of Infinite Expanse specifically says the GM chooses where they go. You can't dictate it. But I do think it's better than I gave it credit for.

[shroudb]

Xenocrat wrote:

The pyrokineticist is doing it for 13 levels before you can, which was my main point.

you mean for 4 levels.

you gain the 2d12 (13 average) at level 18.
pyro does 14 at level 14.

(and if you just means, "pyro deals aoe damage around him earlier than you" then sure, but nothing forbids you to use another stance UNTIL level 18 and have a different benefit from it. That's why you can swap impulses at daily prep as soon as you hit 18 (if you pick this stance))

Xenocrat wrote:

You don't need another element for Desert Winds if you're solo air. The range will sometimes be useful, sure.

and if you are not solo air? but something like air/wood and etc? You don't, that's why compounded effects on a limited resource (stances) are nice.

Xenocrat wrote:

Only a very incompetent player is getting a +10 status speed bonus from this at 18th level. The new longstrider is an air spell and you can use it with kinetic activation as a baby kineticist.

yes, because kinteticst has so many free class feats /s.

i'm struggling to get what i need from low level feats, let alone luxuries like kinetic activation.

getting kinetic activation is a real cost in a kineticist build.

Xenocrat wrote:

The failure text of Infinite Expanse specifically says the GM chooses where they go. You can't dictate it. But I do think it's better than I gave it credit for.

no, gm chooses when they get the failure on the 50-50 (and have to lose another action, so now they are already at -2 actions). If they win the 50-50, they follow normal fleeing rules.

[Xenocrat]

shroudb wrote:

Xenocrat wrote:

The pyrokineticist is doing it for 13 levels before you can, which was my main point.

you mean for 4 levels.

you gain the 2d12 (13 average) at level 18.
pyro does 14 at level 14.

The air kineticst does zero aura damage from level 4/5 to 18.

shroudb wrote:

i'm struggling

Clearly. I don't think I can help you further.

[gesalt]

There's basically no reason to waste time with the class feat when trick magic item exists. If you somehow can't fit trained in a magic skill, then something has gone wrong in your build.

[Ravingdork]

gesalt wrote:

There's basically no reason to waste time with the class feat when trick magic item exists. If you somehow can't fit trained in a magic skill, then something has gone wrong in your build.

Except TMI doesn't let you use most items in combat without wasting a bunch of actions.

1 action. Draw scroll, staff, or wand.
1 action. Activate Trick Magic Item. Pass/Fail check.
2 actions. Cast two-action spell.

Shame you only have three actions. God forbid you were hoping to cast a three action spell in the same round.

Even if you have the item already in hand, you're a sitting duck.

Kinetic Activation has none of those drawbacks. Just cast and go.

[Dubious Scholar]

gesalt wrote:

There's basically no reason to waste time with the class feat when trick magic item exists. If you somehow can't fit trained in a magic skill, then something has gone wrong in your build.

You get a significantly better DC via Kinetic Activation since it lets you use your class DC. In the same vein as Scroll Thaumaturgy, the feat allows you to activate magic items on par with spellcaster classes.

[aobst128]

Also, it lets you prepare staves. Which is pretty cool for a non caster.

[shroudb]

Xenocrat wrote:

i have no clue

clearly, ignoring all the 100% valid counterpoints to your actual mistakes (like, you've even misread when the GM moves the person) is struggling.

whatever, if you want to be hostile, you can be hostile on your own.

[graystone]

gesalt wrote:

There's basically no reason to waste time with the class feat when trick magic item exists. If you somehow can't fit trained in a magic skill, then something has gone wrong in your build.

Luckily, every kineticst gets training in Nature. If you don't want to raise your skill any higher, you can always get Assurance too: I'd much rather use some skill feats instead of a class feat.

Dubious Scholar wrote:

gesalt wrote:

There's basically no reason to waste time with the class feat when trick magic item exists. If you somehow can't fit trained in a magic skill, then something has gone wrong in your build.

You get a significantly better DC via Kinetic Activation since it lets you use your class DC.

Does that matter in relation to casting Longstrider? I think that the quote is refering to that: ie, 'There's basically no reason to waste time with the class feat when trick magic item exists [to cast longstrider].'

[Calliope5431]

Dubious Scholar wrote:

gesalt wrote:

There's basically no reason to waste time with the class feat when trick magic item exists. If you somehow can't fit trained in a magic skill, then something has gone wrong in your build.

You get a significantly better DC via Kinetic Activation since it lets you use your class DC. In the same vein as Scroll Thaumaturgy, the feat allows you to activate magic items on par with spellcaster classes.

This. A thousand times this. Also trick magic item is rolling against level-based DC for an Int/Wis based skill, which is not guaranteed to work without burning substantial resources pumping the relevant skill. Especially if you want to supplement your blasting with other tricks, you do want activation.

I wouldn't say kineticist is hurting too much for feats at low level - you get enough free impulses natively and there's always human + natural ambition if you need more. Depends very much on the build, though.

[shroudb]

keep in mind that there is a technical difference between longstrider and the Air passive aura/stance benefit:

longstrider gives a bonus to Speed, which default to your land speed.

Air powers give the bonus to speed to both land and flying/all speeds.

which in some cases does matter, as an example, in a dwarf heavy armor build (like earth/air), you will have to spend a general feat for fleet and a skill feat for trick magic item, and still cap out at 35 fly speed, while with air powers you don't need fleet and still have 40 flying speed. (same for stuff like ancestries with starting 20ft speed)

[YuriP]

shroudb wrote:

from the capstones i don't like either from wood and the mounts from metal:

1)
the trees have a bit lower attack bonus than what i would like them to (your attack bonus at 20 is +37 and theirs is at +32, a normal martial's attack bonus would be +36 by that point)

plus, the fact that they share a MAP basically gives you 1 weak and 2 neglible attacks on the first round, and you only get 1 attack per sustain afterwards. Basically you get 3 attacks, for 3 actions each at -5/-10/-15 of your attack bonus. sure, they grab, but so low attack rolls...

the damage is also not really anything important at that level (see earth doing aoe 4d10 with no save at that point while they are at 5d10+9 single target with requiring attack to do said damamge)

I like Rouse the Forest's Fury. It's basically a decent "summon spell" (just remember that all summon spells are meh! Once they call a creature 5 levels bellow that unless your are summoning due support reasons they are too bad and too expensive for spell-casters.

This Impulse stats is pretty closer to a lvl 18 plant monster just its attack modifies is that a bit low. But is an unlimited summon, share MAP between these plants prevents them to become too OP and due its be "recastable" kill it becomes basically useless.

If we consider that you can sustain it effortlessly this probably makes it the best summon ability in the game.

[aobst128]

Kinetic activation has some potential with attack spells since you get your attenuator bonus on them I believe. Pyrokinetisists with scrolls or staves of scorching ray at +2 sounds fun. (Or whatever the spell is called in the remaster. Can't remember.)

[The Raven Black]

PossibleCabbage wrote:

The actual text is:

Quote:

The ballista can be shot again, but it must be first reloaded with two Interact actions. The ballista lasts until the end of your next turn and you can Sustain the impulse. Each time you Sustain it, you can roll the ballista up to 20 feat, shoot it if it's loaded, or contribute one interact action towards loading it.

It's pretty clearly the intent that the reload actions can be spread across turns or characters.

As opposed to Siege engines, nothing here states that the Reload can be split between characters. It sounds just like a usual Reload 2 weapon.

Thankfully, the Reload rule states that "If an item takes 2 or more actions to reload, the GM determines whether they must be performed together as an activity, or you can spend some of those actions during one turn and the rest during your next turn."

So, at least, and GM permitting, the reload actions can be spread across turns.

[aobst128]

You know, the avatar build with lava leap, steam knight, and the air/earth stance seems actually pretty strong and versatile by 9th level even without any junctions. This combination happens to have the best composite impulses seems like.

Anytime you need to close distance, go for steam knight then lava leap. Once in the thick of things, hit em with your boosted air blasts from the earth/air stance.

[shroudb]

Air/earth stance only applies the damage boost to Air impulses though

While the passive fire aura would apply to the fire stance as well as fire blasts would benefit from it as well.

Not to mention that Steam Knight is a stance in itself, so you cannot combine any of those.

[aobst128]

shroudb wrote:

Air/earth stance only applies the damage boost to Air impulses though

While the passive fire aura would apply to the fire stance as well as fire blasts would benefit from it as well.

Yeah the idea is to capitalize on single target air blasts.