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I'm pretty sure Starfinder is already firmly in the realm of superheroes. There are easily shades of Guardians of the Galaxy in this game. And the Solarian is also very comic-book-y.
My plan if a player wants a shield:
Energy shield: Bracer on an arm. Has a button to activate a shield that covers part of you from energy attacks. Physical attacks go right through it. Depending on item level it has certain amount of charges and increase to EAC.
Level 2
+1 EAC
10 charges
2 charges to activate
1 charge per round active.
1 charge per Energy attack blocked (Missed atk roll)
Requires move action to activate. -4 against Combat maneuvers since arm is occupied. Recharges anywhere you can recharge a weapon battery.
Thoughts?
You've just described a slightly different Phase Shield at level 2 with an extremely bad energymanagement.
Well fair Enough. Should have done more research Hahaha
If one does not know where to look, is it bad research?
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Historically, shields stopped seeing usage when the progress in armor smithing made them obsolete. There's no point in hoarding a shield and wasting one of your arm for it when your armor is just as good at protecting you. Since we're in a sci-fi setting, it's safe to assume that armors are as protective as they can physically be, rendering any shield useless.
Really, if something is going to blast through your armor and shred you to pieces, adding a small wall that is at most as protective as your armor isn't going to do you no good.
On the other hand, deflective shields that could protect and entire area from damages, reflect projectiles or stop otherwise intangible attacks that would go through a physical, non-magical armor can still see uses. But that's less of a flat bonus to AC and more of a special property added to your defense.
I guess that is why every modern police force has riot shields. Like I said above...with the combination of advanced materials, energy projection, and magic, shields would be totally viable defense in Starfinder...
If a shield in Pathfinder can survive combat involving wizards, dragons, etc...imagine what a few thousand years of technological advancement would do to them.
With the way AC scales, there's only 3 scenarios that shields can lead to.
Shields give high AC + armor gives low AC to compensate = shields become mandatory to keep AC up.
Shields give high AC + armor gives the same AC it does now = shields become overpowered and end up giving players too much AC.
Shields give low AC + armor gives the same AC it does now = shields are a really minor bonus, so that having or not having a shield can't make or break a character.
Starfinder went with the third scenario, the only shield in the game gives a +1 EAC bonus.
Historically, shields stopped seeing usage when the progress in armor smithing made them obsolete. There's no point in hoarding a shield and wasting one of your arm for it when your armor is just as good at protecting you. Since we're in a sci-fi setting, it's safe to assume that armors are as protective as they can physically be, rendering any shield useless.
Really, if something is going to blast through your armor and shred you to pieces, adding a small wall that is at most as protective as your armor isn't going to do you no good.
{. . .}
Depends upon whether common attack types push hard (in which case a shield helps by giving some without making a dent in your body) or would blast through 1 layer of armor and any layers that are too close behind, but dissipate if given some space between layers (I think some tank armors are made this way to defeat the type of anti-tank weapons that produce super-fast jets of molten metal, but if you put that on personnel armor it would be too bulky to have all over).
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I just got done with my first combat in starfinder and i got to say near the end of battle i could have really used a riot shield or a gun attachment that provided some cover. Like this. Or this where its an attachment at the end of a gun. or a full on riot sheild this.
The ability to create your own cover is considered a high-level ability. Solarians only get to do so at level 14 with the Gravity Shield stellar revelation.
Plate armour and o-yoroi literally made shields obsolete for anyone wearing them in real life, as the shield provided no extra protection over what the armor itself provided. You were literally wearing a full body shield in those kinds of armor.
This is how I see the armor in Starfinder, it's even said to fully enclose the body, either physically or with force fields, in order to seal it against the environment. Shields aren't needed in Starfinder because your armor is as good as wearing a shield.
To use the riot shield analogy, imagine if SWAT armor was made out of riot shields. That's starfinder armor.
Hardlight and other force shields are a staple of the genre, tho. Halo has them, destiny 2 will too
Even Pathfinder have them: riot suppressor
Other (metal) shields are common too. Starcraft or wh40k have them, so does mass effect
I think it was just a matter of space and they will add them later
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It occurred to me that they probably didn't include shields, because the term is also needed for starships. And they didn't want there to be confusion when talking about "shields".
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I would probably argue that even though shields are still a scifi staple, they're not enough of one to warrant space in the CRB and will probably come in a future book. It also wouldn't surprise me if the changes in how the math works for the game means that shields will work differently in Starfinder than they do in Pathfinder (Paizo are really strict on ways to get straight + bonuses in SF) and that maybe they wanted people to feel out how the game now works and understand how the underlying mechanics function in play before introducing something that will most likely change how combat feels. Of course it's also possible that it's just not something they feel fits in the setting and just won't include it, which is of course up to them, but Paizo tend to like to throw everything together into a big ol' mixing pot and then you just pick the bits you want to include so you'll almost certainly see shields in some form eventually.
I feel shields are most lacking, because of the solarian. We have a class that's proficient in light armor with a built in one-handed melee weapon. It practically screams, "Give me a Shield!".
The thing with shields is: they should exist, but not be mandatory.
Every single solarian usibg a shield because it adds up KAC, and why not use it if it is free will get old quickly.
Probably something that gives you cover with a move action is cool enough to be interesting, but not as much as every body carry one because there is no reason not to.
Every single solarian usibg a shield because it adds up KAC, and why not use it if it is free will get old quickly.
This is really no different than the brawler in Pathfinder though.
True, but fit less with the theme and mood of SF. Shield should exist, but not every single jedi should carry one.
Tbh, I dislike the way PF bucklers work too (in particular, Mithril Bucklers), for similar reasons, but that's another different topic.
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I just got done with my first combat in starfinder and i got to say near the end of battle i could have really used a riot shield or a gun attachment that provided some cover. Like this. Or this where its an attachment at the end of a gun. or a full on riot sheild this.The ability to create your own cover is considered a high-level ability. Solarians only get to do so at level 14 with the Gravity Shield stellar revelation.
And yet anyone can create their own cover at level 1, all you gotta do is put 1 rank into Engineering and take the Barricade feat. All it takes is a Move action.
If I had to guess, the phasing out of shields is for similar reasons to two-handed melee weapons no longer getting 1.5x strength to damage, changing the importance of handedness. The fact that armor numbers scale up a lot higher seems to compensate for the inability to use shields to boost your AC.
The energy shields from armor upgrades help, but they're basically just temporary hp.
If shields gave a passive cover bonus to AC that didn't stack with other AC bonuses from cover, I think it'd be fine without being overpowered. They could scale slowly too, maybe capping out at 6/5 AC around level 20, so for most levels they won't even help if you can manage to gain traditional cover.
They would also logically require their own proficiency.
And yet anyone can create their own cover at level 1, all you gotta do is put 1 rank into Engineering and take the Barricade feat. All it takes is a Move action.I just got done with my first combat in starfinder and i got to say near the end of battle i could have really used a riot shield or a gun attachment that provided some cover. Like this. Or this where its an attachment at the end of a gun. or a full on riot sheild this.The ability to create your own cover is considered a high-level ability. Solarians only get to do so at level 14 with the Gravity Shield stellar revelation.
Cover that lasts longer than a single attack.
I assume that some armour already has shields in-built into it's stats.
Anyone else disappointed that there are no shields in SF?
High tech polymer riot shields, energy based shields, archaic metal shields, etc. Not ship based shields.
I just so happen to be building a Vesk soldier, and noticed this and was disappointed as well. I was thinking it would be really cool to have a retractable energized riot shield that had a.. I don't know what to call it. A ridge in the top like |-|_|-| so that I can plant myself defensively behind the shield, rest the gun barrel in the slot, and fire at baddies.
I'm really hoping they add something like this in the future. If not, I'm plotting to try to design something that will work to either give small stat bonuses (like variations of +1 or +2 EAC and KAC based on design), or to avoid breaking the game they'll just be aesthetic and stats would be considered to be part of worn armor be in place of/equivalent to certain armors.
The basic idea is to help with the fact that...Dex is kinda overloaded stat-wise. It does just so much and melee guys have to invest in it for AC even if they use strength for melee.
So this version helps deal with AC issues without giving a higher potential. They are good for people who well...don't dodge. They endure assaults. Heavy armour shields also give some more bonus when you fight defensively or take the full defence action.
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Hardlight and other force shields are a staple of the genre, tho. Halo has them, destiny 2 will too
Even Pathfinder have them: riot suppressor
Other (metal) shields are common too. Starcraft or wh40k have them, so does mass effect
I think it was just a matter of space and they will add them later
Admittedly the metal shield in Warhammer 40,0000 is also an energy shied, there are more or less two primary shields in the game, Combat Shields, which are a weak buckler type shield that provides an invulnerable save, and the Storm Shield, which is a powered shield that provided more or less and energy field that protects the wearer. T'au also have a sort of shield projector for their battlesuits, You could base them off that for sure though.
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I am baffled by the fluff argument that shields don't make sense in a "sci fi" setting that already has "tactical starknives." Whether the rules can accommodate additional defensive bonuses is another matter, but let's not argue a hard sci fi aesthetic in a space fantasy game. If we can allow for meteoric hammers and monowhips, we can make room fluff-wise for an arm-mounted shield that provides some form of protection.
If a skittermander equips 5 shields and a pistol, how much does its AC goes up?
Shields are probably still out because of something like that. Too many arms and tentacles going around.
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I remember finding that Brown Energy Shield in the first AP. And nobody could even equip the thing, because they didn't have 2 upgrade slots in our armor.
I remember finding that Brown Energy Shield in the first AP. And nobody could even equip the thing, because they didn't have 2 upgrade slots in our armor.
Welp, that's a ruling we missed on our playthrough. I had no idea armor upgrades could take more than one slot. TIL!
I remember finding that Brown Energy Shield in the first AP. And nobody could even equip the thing, because they didn't have 2 upgrade slots in our armor.Welp, that's a ruling we missed on our playthrough. I had no idea armor upgrades could take more than one slot. TIL!
All of the personal force fields take 2 slots, annoyingly. I think that they increased it in playtesting because it was such a powerful effect. They're the only ones that take up 2 slots, to my knowledge.
Another fun fact, the level 5 Disruptive fusion seal you find in Dead Suns 1 can only be applied to one weapon in the entire game, the level 5 Tactical Swoop Hammer (3,360 credits), almost certainly unavailable to level 2 characters. Not that it would matter even if you did have one, because it would take 24 hours to take effect on the weapon, time that most parties don't have by that point.
I thought fusion seals could go on anything of the seal level and lower?
Normally, yes. It has to be at least the level of the fusion effect (in this case 3 for Disruptive), because a weapon only has fusion "slots" equal to the level and needs at least three to allocate. Then it has to be no greater than the level of the fusion seal (in this case 5, stated in the adventure).
THEN it can only be a blunt weapon, because of the text in the Disruptive fusion says it only works on a weapon that does Blunt damage (because it's trying to be a Mace of Disruption from D&D; ICONIC!!! ).
Therefore, a blunt weapon no lower than 3rd level and no higher than 5th level, for which the complete list reads:
Tactical Swoop Hammer (Level 5)
End of List.
Maybe we'll get more in the Armory. :D
Pathfinder 2 idea might work. Give shields a AC bonus, but it cost a swift action to raise. So if you do it, you can't full attack, or use trick shot.
Big shields (tower sized, like the ones used by SWAT go storm) could be move action to raise/hold. So you can hold it, and shoot, or hold it and move, but not do the 3 things.
I don't like the "raise shield" thing for one reason. Some may view it as a bit petty, but whatever.
Shields were often kept raised and between the holder and the enemy. When someone attacks while holding a shield, they don't tend to drop a shield lower or hold it off to the side like in movies. They attack *around* the shield. Historically, at least when it came to the Norse, most injuries that warriors have were head or leg injuries. Places where the shield they carried didn't cover.
So, I much rather just a straight-up AC bonus. Though I would also be fine with a Cover bonus as well, especially when it comes to being shot at. In fact, the more I think about it, the Cover bonus may actually be better than just an AC bonus. Could just add the Cover for the direction that the character is facing, with a normal shield giving partial cover and a larger tower/SWAT-style shield giving full cover.
Add in a rule that a character can only benefit from one shield at a time, and the issue of a Skittermander carrying five of them goes away.
I'd suggest that a Small character would get full cover from a normal shield, while a Large character only receives partial from a tower shield. Unless the shield is specifically made for their size, then it functions as normal.
I don't like the "raise shield" thing for one reason. Some may view it as a bit petty, but whatever.
Shields were often kept raised and between the holder and the enemy. When someone attacks while holding a shield, they don't tend to drop a shield lower or hold it off to the side like in movies. They attack *around* the shield. Historically, at least when it came to the Norse, most injuries that warriors have were head or leg injuries. Places where the shield they carried didn't cover.
But we are talking Starfinder. When I talk about shields here, I imagine things like this. I think it makes a lot of sense that whoever is carrying that, when using it, has less actions to do other things.
Giving full adventage from a shield as a passive bonus without any oportunity cost is a bad game design imho. It would end with everybody carrying shields everywhere.
Remember, we are talking a game where some classes have no incentive to use 2 handed weapons ever (operative), and some races can carry a shield (or two...) while still have full damage from their plasma cannon. Even other races can pay for an extra cybernetic arm to carry around a shield. This is not Pathfinder, where picking a shield means you lose other things (like 1.5 str bonus to damage, a bigger damage dice from a 2h weapon, or free hand to cast spells.)
I don't like the "raise shield" thing for one reason. Some may view it as a bit petty, but whatever.
Shields were often kept raised and between the holder and the enemy. When someone attacks while holding a shield, they don't tend to drop a shield lower or hold it off to the side like in movies. They attack *around* the shield. Historically, at least when it came to the Norse, most injuries that warriors have were head or leg injuries. Places where the shield they carried didn't cover.
But we are talking Starfinder. When I talk about shields here, I imagine things like this. I think it makes a lot of sense that whoever is carrying that, when using it, has less actions to do other things.
Giving full adventage from a shield as a passive bonus without any oportunity cost is a bad game design imho. It would end with everybody carrying shields everywhere.
Remember, we are talking a game where some classes have no incentive to use 2 handed weapons ever (operative), and some races can carry a shield (or two...) while still have full damage from their plasma cannon. Even other races can pay for an extra cybernetic arm to carry around a shield. This is not Pathfinder, where picking a shield means you lose other things (like 1.5 str bonus to damage, a bigger damage dice from a 2h weapon, or free hand to cast spells.)
I did address a character using multiple shields. I said it shouldn't be allowed.
Also, a shield would only provide cover on a character's front ark. Go to the side or behind of someone with a shield, and it's useless.
Shields are big. They are clumsy. They'd bang into a lot of things. If an operative is carrying a big shield that covers his entire body, then he should get negatives to things like stealth, movement speed, climbing, etc. Things that a standard soldier wouldn't much care about.
You could also go the extra mile and say Operatives just aren't trained in using the full shields as well. Along with Envoys, Mystics, and Technomancers. Probably Mechanics as well.
So no, I'm not saying everyone should just get the full benefits of mobile cover at absolutely no hindrance.
Cover bonuses don't stack. If players can use a shield to gain cover then there's less incentive to actively engage with the battlefield. I wouldn't mind having rule options for shields, including ballistic shields like what some of the Rainbow 6 Siege operators can use, but I'd much rather have shields give a generic AC bonus than specifically a cover bonus.
So I can’t remember which page of the core rule book, out there is artwork of a Vesk fighting a space dwarf who is clearly defending himself with an energy shield and axe. If you are going to show that shields exist in the fluff and artwork why not put them in the books.
The Dwarf you're talking about is on p. 9 of the CRB, and the shield he's wielding very closely resembles the description for the Phase Shield armor upgrade, which is also in the CRB. The shield that exists in the fluff and artwork is in the book.