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Your personal gripes about your cheating DM aren't relevant to this thread.
As for my favorite Combat Reflexes use: Snake Style. Especially with some delicious Panther action thrown in.
But casting the spell and attacking with is the same action.... I don't think it works that way.It's not a terrible Feat for any character with a decent to high Dex, particularly if they're using a reach weapon.
Being able to smack a caster both for casting AND firing a ranged attack is solid, for example.
Yep. If someone provokes for two separate reasons you can get two separate AoOs on them. Casting a Spell, and making a ranged attack would be legit.Combat Ref lexes and Additional Attacks of Opportunity:
If you have the Combat Ref lexes feat, you can add your Dexterity modifier to the number of attacks of opportunity you can make in a round. This feat does not let you make more than one attack for a given opportunity, but if the same opponent provokes two attacks of opportunity
from you, you could make two separate attacks of opportunity (since each one represents a different opportunity).Moving out of more than one square threatened by the same opponent in the same round doesn’t count as more than one opportunity for that opponent. All these attacks are at your full normal attack bonus.
It's one action and you can only get one AOO, but combat casting only protects the spellasting action itself, not the aiming for the ranged attack.
Combat Reflexes also allows you to take advantage of AOO opportunities while flatfooted and more than once per round.
But casting the spell and attacking with is the same action.... I don't think it works that way.It's not a terrible Feat for any character with a decent to high Dex, particularly if they're using a reach weapon.
Being able to smack a caster both for casting AND firing a ranged attack is solid, for example.
Yep. If someone provokes for two separate reasons you can get two separate AoOs on them. Casting a Spell, and making a ranged attack would be legit.Combat Ref lexes and Additional Attacks of Opportunity:
If you have the Combat Ref lexes feat, you can add your Dexterity modifier to the number of attacks of opportunity you can make in a round. This feat does not let you make more than one attack for a given opportunity, but if the same opponent provokes two attacks of opportunity
from you, you could make two separate attacks of opportunity (since each one represents a different opportunity).Moving out of more than one square threatened by the same opponent in the same round doesn’t count as more than one opportunity for that opponent. All these attacks are at your full normal attack bonus.
It's one action and you can only get one AOO, but combat casting only protects the spellasting action itself, not the aiming for the ranged attack.
Combat Reflexes also allows you to take advantage of AOO opportunities while flatfooted and more than once per round.
One action can provoke multiple ways; as has been posted earlier, the FAQ says that you get the AOO for both casting and ranged attack.
Casting a ranged touch spell is two actions. You cast the spell which provokes, and you then take a free action ranged attack, which also provokes.
The attack is PART of the spellcasting action. So while there may be two reasons to provoke, only one can actually be taken advantage of per threathening character.
It's kind of a moot point. Only a true idiot wouldn't be casting defensively, but even in that case, the aimed ranged attack would still provoke.
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Casting a ranged touch spell is two actions. You cast the spell which provokes, and you then take a free action ranged attack, which also provokes.The attack is PART of the spellcasting action. So while there may be two reasons to provoke, only one can actually be taken advantage of per threathening character.
It's kind of a moot point. Only a true idiot wouldn't be casting defensively, but even in that case, the aimed ranged attack would still provoke.
Drahliana, if you go to the previous page, you'll see the FAQ cite where casting a ranged touch attack actually provokes twice.
i don't see much of a point if your dm does not give you a chance to use AoOs with combat reflexes.
There is a point- enemies ahve to waste time tip toeing around you to avoid AoOs.
One of the greatest powers of a reach build is creating a CIRCLE OF PAIN (tm) that is 25' wide. Stand between them and the casters, and they might have to walk all the way around to get to your squishies (which might take turns, rather than the nice charge they wanted). You are a living obstacle on the battlefield, with just as much bite as a spell that fills that space with thorns.
Denying your GM options alone has advantages.
Also, you obviously move so they have to pick the lesser of two evils- you have a wizard agains the wall (so he can't 5' step away) and the wizard that wants to cast a ray that would have to eat 2 AoOs (1 for casting, one for ranged attack), and as such, he would much rather eat the single AoO for moving out of your space.
Without combat reflexes, there would be the same cost for casting the ray and walking away.
But casting the spell and attacking with is the same action.... I don't think it works that way.It's not a terrible Feat for any character with a decent to high Dex, particularly if they're using a reach weapon.
Being able to smack a caster both for casting AND firing a ranged attack is solid, for example.
Yep. If someone provokes for two separate reasons you can get two separate AoOs on them. Casting a Spell, and making a ranged attack would be legit.Combat Ref lexes and Additional Attacks of Opportunity:
If you have the Combat Ref lexes feat, you can add your Dexterity modifier to the number of attacks of opportunity you can make in a round. This feat does not let you make more than one attack for a given opportunity, but if the same opponent provokes two attacks of opportunity
from you, you could make two separate attacks of opportunity (since each one represents a different opportunity).Moving out of more than one square threatened by the same opponent in the same round doesn’t count as more than one opportunity for that opponent. All these attacks are at your full normal attack bonus.
This FaQ apparently disagrees with me.
Wow, that's kinda effed up.
Oh, no, the martial-caster disparity is slightly smaller!
Drahliana, if you go to the previous page, you'll see the FAQ cite where casting a ranged touch attack actually provokes twice.
Of course, hitting with the first attack virtually guarantees that the second opportunity will never come up. :)
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Casters generally never provoke from casting spells outside of the low levels anyway.
I take it you've never seen a 7th level 14 Wis crusader cleric try to get off a 4th level spell.
"Eh, it's more likely that he'll miss than that I'll actually succeed in casting defensively. Go ahead and take your AoO."
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Its a really good addition to the Shielded Fighter / Shield Master path especially with Shield Slam in there. Getting to send people trying to get past you to the squishes behind you flying in various directions is just plain fun. And that is even before this: Reach is easily overcome with a supply of potions of enlarge person. (oh.. and pairing with an alchemist giving you fluid form as well...)
AoOs are part of the reason magi can get an arcana for converting rays into melee touch attacks.
AoOs are part of the reason magi can get an arcana for converting rays into melee touch attacks.
Nah, I save the few rays I memorize for when I actually need a ranged attack.
Casters generally never provoke from casting spells outside of the low levels anyway.That's why I love the barbarians Unexpected Strike.
Caster successfully casts a spell defensively (because beyond low level it's easy) and expects to not draw an AoO. Barbarian thinks that is just silly and smacks the caster anyway for the trouble. Caster has to now to make a DC 50-something concentration check or loose the spell anyway.
*headscratch*
Prerequisite: Barbarian 8
Benefit: The barbarian can make an attack of opportunity against a foe that moves into any square threatened by the barbarian, regardless of whether or not that movement would normally provoke an attack of opportunity.
Special: This power can only be used once per rage.
Casting doesn't usually move the caster into the square next to the barbarian (dimension dooring wizards are usually going the other way) so i don't see how you'd get an AOO off that ability.
Casters generally never provoke from casting spells outside of the low levels anyway.That's why I love the barbarians Unexpected Strike.
Caster successfully casts a spell defensively (because beyond low level it's easy) and expects to not draw an AoO. Barbarian thinks that is just silly and smacks the caster anyway for the trouble. Caster has to now to make a DC 50-something concentration check or loose the spell anyway.*headscratch*
** spoiler omitted **
Casting doesn't usually move the caster into the square next to the barbarian (dimension dooring wizards are usually going the other way) so i don't see how you'd get an AOO off that ability.
yeah. Dumb post. It's early and I miss read it.
Combat Reflexes in and of itself is usually worth it.
I really like it paired with Weapon Trick: One-handed--When your AC exceeds the result of a foe's melee attack against you by 5 or more, that foe provokes an attack of opportunity from you. Once you make such an attack of opportunity against a foe, you can't again use this trick against the foe that day.
Bloodragers running around with 45 reach have a good reason to have combat reflexes.
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Casters generally never provoke from casting spells outside of the low levels anyway.That's why I love the barbarians Unexpected Strike.
Caster successfully casts a spell defensively (because beyond low level it's easy) and expects to not draw an AoO. Barbarian thinks that is just silly and smacks the caster anyway for the trouble. Caster has to now to make a DC 50-something concentration check or loose the spell anyway.*headscratch*
** spoiler omitted **
Casting doesn't usually move the caster into the square next to the barbarian (dimension dooring wizards are usually going the other way) so i don't see how you'd get an AOO off that ability.
Because they provoke for moving into a square, where normally it's about leaving a square. Approaching the barbarian with the same reach as the barbarian will result in an AoO you didn't expect.
Bloodragers running around with 45 reach have a good reason to have combat reflexes.
Wait, 45? How the heck are they getting 45? Is there stuff I don't know about because the most I can see a bloodrager getting is 30 (reach weapon 10, bloodline 5, enlarge person 5, long arm 5, lunge 5)
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Like most things, that would fall under DM call. I know most I've played with would say that casting a spell whether it's attack or not is an AoO... and concentration or you lose the spell.. If the spell succeeds THEN you make the ranged attack and provoke another one.But casting the spell and attacking with is the same action.... I don't think it works that way.It's not a terrible Feat for any character with a decent to high Dex, particularly if they're using a reach weapon.
Being able to smack a caster both for casting AND firing a ranged attack is solid, for example.
Yep. If someone provokes for two separate reasons you can get two separate AoOs on them. Casting a Spell, and making a ranged attack would be legit.Combat Ref lexes and Additional Attacks of Opportunity:
If you have the Combat Ref lexes feat, you can add your Dexterity modifier to the number of attacks of opportunity you can make in a round. This feat does not let you make more than one attack for a given opportunity, but if the same opponent provokes two attacks of opportunity
from you, you could make two separate attacks of opportunity (since each one represents a different opportunity).Moving out of more than one square threatened by the same opponent in the same round doesn’t count as more than one opportunity for that opponent. All these attacks are at your full normal attack bonus.
That's why casting defensively is your friend. As well as backing away from the raging barbarian about to cleave you in twain if you dare cast a spell next to him. You know, THEN unload your spell.
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Anyone with a low initiative modifier and a reach weapon will get substantial usage from Combat Reflexes.What is considered a low initiative modifier??
Not many of my characters. My dex builds (which is nearly all of them) tend to have a +9 to init at level 1. Or a +5, and it jumps to +9 when I get my next feat.
Bloodragers running around with 45 reach have a good reason to have combat reflexes.Wait, 45? How the heck are they getting 45? Is there stuff I don't know about because the most I can see a bloodrager getting is 30 (reach weapon 10, bloodline 5, enlarge person 5, long arm 5, lunge 5)
enlarge goes to 10ft.
Reach takes that to 20ft.long arm and lunge take that to 30ft.
bloodline to 35ft
45 was probably a number from before the FAQ were we found out that you do reach and then everything. Otherwise some were saying that longarm or the bloodline ability would get doubled as it was increasing your natural reach.
Oh, didn't know that enlarged reach weapons had that much more reach to them.
Because they provoke for moving into a square, where normally it's about leaving a square. Approaching the barbarian with the same reach as the barbarian will result in an AoO you didn't expect.
1) why would a caster move towards a barbarian
2) aoo's occured in the round before or after spell casting don't interrupt a spell. you have to hit them in response to casting, so i don't see how you're interrupting a spell from that rage power.
Because they provoke for moving into a square, where normally it's about leaving a square. Approaching the barbarian with the same reach as the barbarian will result in an AoO you didn't expect.1) why would a caster move towards a barbarian
2) aoo's occured in the round before or after spell casting don't interrupt a spell. you have to hit them in response to casting, so i don't see how you're interrupting a spell from that rage power.
They are a reach weapon using blood rager with their big silly doughnut that means they can only do minimal damage against enemies close up, and can't full attack with their big shiny reach weapon without taking a move action backwards (which removes their full attack)?
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Because they provoke for moving into a square, where normally it's about leaving a square. Approaching the barbarian with the same reach as the barbarian will result in an AoO you didn't expect.1) why would a caster move towards a barbarian
2) aoo's occured in the round before or after spell casting don't interrupt a spell. you have to hit them in response to casting, so i don't see how you're interrupting a spell from that rage power.
Ah, you're right. It'd only really break a concentration spell, which they would not likely approach a combatant during.
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Because they provoke for moving into a square, where normally it's about leaving a square. Approaching the barbarian with the same reach as the barbarian will result in an AoO you didn't expect.1) why would a caster move towards a barbarian
2) aoo's occured in the round before or after spell casting don't interrupt a spell. you have to hit them in response to casting, so i don't see how you're interrupting a spell from that rage power.
Removed post. Sorry. I misread what this was saying.
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They are a reach weapon using blood rager with their big silly doughnut that means they can only do minimal damage against enemies close up, and can't full attack with their big shiny reach weapon without taking a move action backwards (which removes their full attack)?Because they provoke for moving into a square, where normally it's about leaving a square. Approaching the barbarian with the same reach as the barbarian will result in an AoO you didn't expect.1) why would a caster move towards a barbarian
2) aoo's occured in the round before or after spell casting don't interrupt a spell. you have to hit them in response to casting, so i don't see how you're interrupting a spell from that rage power.
Five foot step, full attack?
Five foot step, full attack?They are a reach weapon using blood rager with their big silly doughnut that means they can only do minimal damage against enemies close up, and can't full attack with their big shiny reach weapon without taking a move action backwards (which removes their full attack)?Because they provoke for moving into a square, where normally it's about leaving a square. Approaching the barbarian with the same reach as the barbarian will result in an AoO you didn't expect.1) why would a caster move towards a barbarian
2) aoo's occured in the round before or after spell casting don't interrupt a spell. you have to hit them in response to casting, so i don't see how you're interrupting a spell from that rage power.
That is the problem with the doughnut- you need to move 10' (or more) in order to get them back into range.
Reach weapons at medium work without problems, since the distance is within 5' range. It is when you add things line enlarge into the mix that things might get tricky.
So when a large character uses a reach weapon, the safest place is right at their ankles.
This is why aberreach bloodragers should use flachions, it eliminates the doughnut problem while still giving you 15 feet of reach without too much investment. (also lets you use staggering critical more often without spending the feat on a fauchard)
This is why aberreach bloodragers should use flachions, it eliminates the doughnut problem while still giving you 15 feet of reach without too much investment. (also lets you use staggering critical more often without spending the feat on a fauchard)
My thoughts exactly. They already have more than enough methods to outclass regular reach while using normal 2 handed weapons. It isn't hard to get double a regular reach user's area without using their own resources.
Why complicate your strategy just to do some extra area control (which they already do very well). Very un-barbarian-y, having to step backwards just to hit the target.
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Oh no, no, no, there is plenty of stepping back involved. After all, how are you gonna get two full bab attacks per turn by level 5 if you don't step back after using pushing assault? On top of that you limit most opponents to 1 attack since they are denied their full attack while you still get to enjoy yours due to your reach.
And oh dear gods, employing this on rough terrain just makes you hell for the opponent to deal with.
Oh no, no, no, there is plenty of stepping back involved. After all, how are you gonna get two full bab attacks per turn by level 5 if you don't step back after using pushing assault? On top of that you limit most opponents to 1 attack since they are denied their full attack while you still get to enjoy yours due to your reach.
And oh dear gods, employing this on rough terrain just makes you hell for the opponent to deal with.
Well...I more meant 'stepping back without stabbing them in the kidneys a half dozen times'
The move action step back, complete with drawing an AoO. Which you might have to do if you want to use the polearm while your are dealing with the enlarged doughnut. Master of AoOs that has to eat AoOs just to get at the right attack range when the guy is right at his ankles. THAT is unbarbarian.
but just a step and then hacking them into bits with a full attack? Perfectly barbarian.
This is why aberreach bloodragers should use flachions, it eliminates the doughnut problem while still giving you 15 feet of reach without too much investment. (also lets you use staggering critical more often without spending the feat on a fauchard)My thoughts exactly. They already have more than enough methods to outclass regular reach while using normal 2 handed weapons. It isn't hard to get double a regular reach user's area without using their own resources.
Why complicate your strategy just to do some extra area control (which they already do very well). Very un-barbarian-y, having to step backwards just to hit the target.
Double reach?!?!? I am talking triple reach Sarissa!
Back to the original question, it can help you survive surprise rounds if you have access to Parry and Riposte. I decided to get it and Flamboyant Arcana on a Magus I'm playing to help with exactly that.
It seems a lot of swashbucklers will try to provoke so they can parry and riposte. Allows them to attack several opponents in the same round.
Horrible reason: Bad dm. As the FTR, I take feats to keep him from screwing the party. Combat Reflexes, Blind Fight, cross class ranks in tumble, etc. Now that we're nearing 10, he's run out of the easy tricks. But I missed one 2-3 games ago and 3/5 characters DIED! Without me to protect them, very dangerous.
I really need to get this spear up to +3.