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Let's not try to compare this to the wizard, which is more flexible than most classes. I think a few good classes to compare this with are the magus, the alchemist, and the inquisitor. All three are damage focused with a nova sort of feel, but right now they all have far more options both in combat and outside of it.
Also getting bonuses to CMD against specific combat maneuvers based on element would be cool.
Aether- grapple, pull, push
Air- steal, disarm, grapple
Earth- trip, bull rush, sunder
Fire- dirty trick, disarm, sunder
Water- grapple, trip, steal
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So, the Conductive enchantment, should work with the Kinetic Blast class feature?
The way I'm reading it, it depends on your blast.
If your blast targets AC, it is not a Ranged Touch Attack and therefore it does not work with Conductive. If it targets Touch AC it is a Ranged Touch Attack and can be used with Ranged Weapons with Conductive.
So a Sword with Conductive won't channel your Fire Blast, but a Bow with Conductive Would.
If there is a Form or Substance Wild Talent that changes the Blast to target Melee Touch you could use a Sword with Conductive with that, but all the ones I'm seeing don't.
Additionally, I just realized that you can have Conductive Ammunition. By having Conductive Arrows you could use your blast with every arrow you fire in a round. This means for just over 8000gp you can get 50 Conductive Arrows and at level 15 firing them with Rapid Shot and Manyshot firing a total of 5 Arrows each delivering one of your blasts.
You will be burning through gold VERY fast (it equals out to about 166 gold per arrow or about 830 gold per round)
You have to use Ammunition for this because otherwise it is only one per round.
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Some ideas for Wild Talents:
Kinetic Manipulation:
Element all; Type Su; Level 1; Burn 0
Prerequisites kineticist level 1.
The kineticist can manipulate his element as if it were a limb with a Strength score equal to his Constitution score. His element manipulation has reach 10 feet, and he can use it as a secondary natural attack that deals 1d3 points of damage. His element can manipulate objects (but not weapons) as dexterously as a human hand.
He can cause his element form to take rough shapes at will within range, although a skill check might be needed for complex forms.
Taken from the prehensile hair witch hex, this would keep the manipulation within bounds of existing rules
Kinetic Spirit:
Element all; Type Su; Level 1; Burn 0
Prerequisites kineticist level 1.
The kineticist may influence the minds of others by channeling the spiritual essence of his element. Each element can provide the following with a standard action.
Aether: Can send telepathically through the aether a message (as the spell) or read surface thoughts providing +4 bonus in one sense motive or bluff check.
Air: Can instill the calm o a light breeze, providing a +4 bonus in one diplomacy check or produce ghost sounds (like the spell).
Fire: Can infuse the target with energy providing a +4 bonus on acrobatic checks or dazzle an enemy with a sudden flare (as the spell)
Earth: Can provide the stout resolution of the earth, giving a +4 bonus against fear in a check, or increase the target's resistance (as the spell).
Water: Can provide fluid thought and speech giving a +4 bonus on a bluff check or can stabilize a dying creature (as the spell).
If I am looking at this class right, Carrie would have been around 15th level to pull off all stuff she did in that movie(remake). Though she still could do stuff that there is no rules for as well.
That is a good question, what feats apply to your blast; spell penetration, combat casting, weapon focus, precise shot, point blank shot, etc.?
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I would like to make a suggestion for an additional class feature.
Elemental Resistance
Each type of Kineticest would have a different type of resistance based on their element.
Fire = Fire, Water = Cold, Air = Electricity, Earth = Acid, Aether = Force?
The amount should be based off your current Burn.
I would suggest 5 per burn with level based maximums to prevent a level 1 with 20 con from having 8 burn for resist 40. (Although honestly, I don't think it is that over powered, especially since there is a drawback of not being able to spend anymore burn that day.)
Additionally, with Expanded Element, make it 1/2 your burn (rounded down) x5 if you select a different element for that element, or 1.5x your burn (rounded down) x5 for your primary for concentrating on it.
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He has already said you can do Weapon Focus(Kinetic Blast), so that tells us for the purpose of feats it can count as a weapon (Like Rays can), so Precise Shot, Point Blank Shot, Improved Critical, etc. should all work.
then i think that it should be written in the blast text something along the lines: "Counts as a weapon for the purpose of feats."
The problem with that statement Ivan, is that the vital strike feats would also apply, wich to me would be broken.
I would give them energy resistance but it would be based on level. Something like this:
lv2-5
lv6-10
lv10-20
lv14-30
maybe immunity at level 20.
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I’ve built the below character using rules for Pathfinder Society Organized Play, but did not assume that the character is that the character is a Pathfinder. The character’s starting wealth of 62,000 gp is largely unspent as the character would be saving for a belt upgrade. The character would likely have several expensive potions and basic adventuring gear.
I enjoy playing balanced characters and made several decisions to reflect that. This character can contribute to melee and ranged combat equally. By accepting at least 3 burn throughout an adventure, the character’s blasts are more accurate, but 30+ nonlethal damage is nothing to scoff at. Much like a fighter, this character is a buff sponge. Anything that increases armor class, attack, or saving throws will be put to regular use, especially in melee. However, like most fighters this character is not very skilled and I have labored to make the best of what is available. Lastly, greater self telekinesis compensates for flight well enough, something most fighters struggles to do on their own.
Half-elf telekineticist 10 (Occult Adventures Playtest 3)
N Medium humanoid (elf, human)
Init +5; Senses low-light vision; Perception +16
DEFENSE
AC 23, touch 16, flat-footed 18 (+6 armor, +1 deflection, +5 dexterity, +1 natural)
hp 115 (10d8+60); Force Ward 10 temporary hp
Burn (7 max; +3 feel the burn max)
Fort +14, Ref +15, Will +11; +2 vs. enchantments
Immune sleep
OFFENSE
Speed 30 ft.
Melee kinetic whip +12/+7 (5d6+9), +1 dagger +13 (1d4+2/19-20)
Ranged telekinetic blast +12 (5d6+9), force blast +12 (5d6+2)
Space 5 ft.; Reach 5 ft. (10 ft. with kinetic whip)
Special Attacks aetheric boost, extended range, metakinesis
Spell-like Abilities (CL 10th; concentration +14)
at will—force ward, greater self telekinesis, kinetic whip, light touch, telekinetic blast
2 Burn—force blast
STATISTICS
Str 13, Dex 20, Con 18, Int 10, Wis 14, Cha 8
Base Atk +7; CMB +8; CMD 24
Traits Bastard (+1 Sense Motive, class skill), Indomitable Faith (+1 Will saves)
Feats Improved Iron Will, Iron Will, Point-Blank Shot, Precise Shot, Toughness, Weapon Finesse
Skills Heal +6, Intimidate +3, Knowledge (engineering) +4, Perception +16, Sense Motive +10, Sleight of Hand +12, Stealth +12, Use Magic Device +3; Racial Modifiers +2 Perception
Languages Common, Elven
SQ dual minded, keen senses, infusion specialization (–2 form infusion burn) multitalented, wild talents (expanded element [aether], extended range, greater self telekinesis, kinetic blade, kinetic whip, light touch, self telekinesis)
Other Gear +2 mithral chain shirt, +1 dagger, amulet of natural armor +1, belt of physical might +2 (Dex, Con), cloak of resistance +3, eyes of the eagle, handy haversack, ring of protection +1, 27,098 gp
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The problem with that statement Ivan, is that the vital strike feats would also apply, wich to me would be broken.
But blast is not an attack action but a standard action
From FAQ:
Vital Strike can only be used as part of an attack action, which is a specific kind of standard action.
at least that is the way i see it. It is the same reason you can't hit twice with it when your BAB is +6/+1
That's right, it's a spell like ability, my bad;)
I would think that the Kineticist blast would effect incorporeal targets like any magic based physical or energy attack.
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Suggestion for a new class feature:
Combat Style (Ex)
At 1st level, a Kineticist must select one combat style to pursue: Unarmed, Swordsman or blaster.
Unarmed: The kineticist receives Improved Unarmed Strike as a bonus feat, and may add his constitution bonus to AC as long as he is unarmored and not wielding a shield. The damage from his unarmed strikes increase as a monk of 1/2 his level (min. 1). At 6th, 12th and 18th level he may select a style or monk bonus feat.
Swordsman: The kineticist gains proficiency with a light or one handed melee martial weapon. He receives weapon focus with that weapon at 1st level, and can select bonus combat feats at 6h, 12th and 18th levels. His kineticist levels count as fighter levels for the purpose of selecting Weapon Specialization, Greater Weapon Focus and Greater Weapon Specialization for his chosen weapon.
Blaster: The kineticist gains the Precise Shot feat, and may select the following feats for his Wild Blast even without fulfilling the prerequisites: Focused Shot, from 6th level: Snap Shot, from 9th level: Improved Snap Shot. He receives bonus feats at 6th, 12th and 18th level from the following list:
Far Shot, Focused Shot, Point Blank Shot, Weapon Focus (blast) and Rapid Shot.
At 6th level, he adds Improved Precise Shot, Parting Shot and Point Blank Master to the list.
At 12th level, he adds Pinpoint Targeting and Shot on the Run to the list.
The benefits of the kineticist's chosen style feats apply only when he wears light, medium, or no armor. He loses all benefits of his combat style feats when wearing heavy armor. Once a kineticist selects a combat style, it cannot be changed.
I don't think several of those feats would work with blast, since it's an SLA that requires a standard action to use.
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Unarmed: The kineticist receives Improved Unarmed Strike as a bonus feat, and may add his constitution bonus to AC as long as he is unarmored and not wielding a shield. The damage from his unarmed strikes increase as a monk of 1/2 his level (min. 1). At 6th, 12th and 18th level he may select a style or monk bonus feat.
While I enjoyed your suggestions as ideas for archetypes, the CON to AC would have to be limited in a fashion similar to the way Canny Defense limits INT to AC.
Unarmed: The kineticist receives Improved Unarmed Strike as a bonus feat, and may add his constitution bonus to AC as long as he is unarmored and not wielding a shield. The damage from his unarmed strikes increase as a monk of 1/2 his level (min. 1). At 6th, 12th and 18th level he may select a style or monk bonus feat.While I enjoyed your suggestions as ideas for archetypes, the CON to AC would have to be limited in a fashion similar to the way Canny Defense limits INT to AC.
If Con bonus to AC becomes a thing, I'd like to see it be Natural Armor because it makes the most sense.
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Okay, so Vital Strike makes this a little silly, but here we go:
CN Medium humanoid (human, orc)
Init +9; Senses darkvision 60 ft; Perception +14
Current burn: 3
AC 29, touch 23, flat-footed 21 (+4 armour, +1 deflection, +9 Dex, +2 luck, +4 natural)
hp 108 (10d8+60); 30 nonlethal
Fort +17, Ref +22, Will +10
DR 6/adamantine
Speed 30 ft., climb 30 ft., fly 60 ft. (perfect)
Melee air/earth blast +21/+16 (5d6+12) or sandstorm blast +21/+16 (10d6+17)
or air/earth blast vital strike +21 (10d6+12)
or sandstorm blast vital strike +21 (20d6+17)
empowered air/earth blast vital strike x1.5 (1 burn)
empowered sandstorm blast vital strike x1.5 (3 burn)
or maximized sandstorm blast vital strike (137) (4 burn)
Ranged air/earth blast +21 (5d6+12) or sandstorm blast +21 (10d6+17)
empowered sandstorm blast x1.5
maximized sandstorm blast (77)
Special Attacks feel the burn +3, metakinesis (empower, maximize), kinetic cover)
Str 8, Dex 28, Con 18, Int 14, Wis 12, Cha 8
Base Atk +7; CMB +5; CMD 28 (immune to trip)
Feats Combat Reflexes, Toughness, Vital Strike, Weapon Finesse, Weapon Focus (Kinetic Blast)
Skills Acrobatics +20, Climb +21, Fly +17, Knowledge (dungeoneering) +14, Perception +14, Use Magic Device +11 (+21 with wand of mage armour)
Traits Fate's Favoured, Legacy of Sand
Languages Auran, Common, Orc, Terran
SQ rock climber, sacred tattoo, skilled, wild talents (expanded element (air), extended range, kinetic blade, kinetic cover, kinetic whip, kinetic form, move earth)
Gear +1 amulet of natural armour, +1 ring of protection, belt of incredible dexterity +4, cloak of resistance +4, cracked pale green prism (attack rolls), headband of vast intelligence +2 (Acrobatics, Auran), jingasa of the fortunate soldier, pink rhomboid, wand of mage armour with wand key ring (50 charges), 1250 gp
Melee DPR Air/Earth Blast (0 burn): 48 or 43.63 with Vital Strike
Melee DPR empowered Air/Earth Blast (1 burn or 0 with move action): 65.44 with Vital Strike
Melee DPR Sandstorm Blast (2 burn or 1 with move action): 80.64
Melee DPR empowered Sandstorm Blast (3 burn or 2 with move action): 120.96
Ranged DPR is similar but without the option to Vital Strike and with only one attack. As such, its best no-burn option is Empowered Air/Earth Blast for 41.8 DPR. The big ticket items are empowered Sandstorm Blast (3 burn or 2 with move action) for 73.71 DPR or maximized Sandstorm Blast (4 burn, so must use a move action) for 108.15.
Not bad, but I wish I had more skill points and a few more things to do when not throwing wind and rocks at people.
If Con bonus to AC becomes a thing, I'd like to see it be Natural Armor because it makes the most sense.Unarmed: The kineticist receives Improved Unarmed Strike as a bonus feat, and may add his constitution bonus to AC as long as he is unarmored and not wielding a shield. The damage from his unarmed strikes increase as a monk of 1/2 his level (min. 1). At 6th, 12th and 18th level he may select a style or monk bonus feat.While I enjoyed your suggestions as ideas for archetypes, the CON to AC would have to be limited in a fashion similar to the way Canny Defense limits INT to AC.
Or, maybe, deflection. I can imagine plates of ice or earth covering some skin, and flowing air or intangible force deflecting attacks.
I wouldn't mind saving more money;) though to be honest both options fit different elements better, example: natural armor makes sense for earth, while deflection makes sense for aether.
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@Mark Since I haven't seen this come up yet after many (but not all pages) of this thread. I have a question about Aether
Can I ready an Action to grab and redirect missile weapons in flight using telekinetic blast? Obviously they would reach their new destination using blast damage and properties rather than their original properties. My take on this is that once the object leaves the attackers control, essentially once its off the bowstring, it is no longer attended so this should be possible.
Should Flame Shield have the Fire element instead of Air like it does now? Or is it supposed to be for people who went air and picked up the fire defense power?
Also just theorycrafting for now till I get to try him on Saturday in PFS but the touch blasts just seem a lot better than the non touch ones. the 1/2 con is going to mean less as you level and the +1 per die just isn't worth targeting AC. I guess the talents for the different blasts might make up for it but that's hard to tell at the moment.
Finally would the powers I've been considering all have 0 burn, but not being able to use that to get to feel the burn seems really bad. I was wondering if adding a basic talent at first level would work, say for 1 burn you can add 1/2 your level (min 1) to the attack roll. If you use your move and no other effects it's a free boost to hit, otherwise its more risk/reward when you really need to hit your target.
You can always put burn in your defense to feel the burn!
I'm very much a fan of the suggestion of a sidebarthat would finangle a Con bonus for the various elemental races. Maybe just change their phsical bonus to Con?
I have a question. I see two means of bypassing burn, one free, one costing action economy. Will there be other ways to bypass burn when the book comes out? I assume if that's so it would have some sort of other cost like gaining a condition or lose some sort of action.
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Have to say, Splash Building these guys with martial classes is going to result in some pretty sick builds. 1 level of fighter yields heavy armor proficiency, 1 level of brawler will give you improved unarmed strike and brawlers flurry. for a 2 level dip you can make a heavy armored Kinetic warrior that dishes out punishment with Kinetic fist or kinetic blades.
Instead of that, the kineticist could have some melee support built into the class. This could fill the martial niche that is somewhat missing from OA.
Question: Once the prereqs for a Wild Talent are met (appropriate level and element known) do I have to use that element in its use. For instance I am Fire and I expand to Water and then learn the Spray Form Infusion. Does that mean i have to use my Water blast as basis for the cone or could I make a cone out of any other blasts I know ?
Suggestion for a new class feature:
Combat Style (Ex)
At 1st level, a Kineticist must select one combat style to pursue: Unarmed, Swordsman or blaster.
Unarmed: The kineticist receives Improved Unarmed Strike as a bonus feat, and may add his constitution bonus to AC as long as he is unarmored and not wielding a shield. The damage from his unarmed strikes increase as a monk of 1/2 his level (min. 1). At 6th, 12th and 18th level he may select a style or monk bonus feat.
Swordsman: The kineticist gains proficiency with a light or one handed melee martial weapon. He receives weapon focus with that weapon at 1st level, and can select bonus combat feats at 6h, 12th and 18th levels. His kineticist levels count as fighter levels for the purpose of selecting Weapon Specialization, Greater Weapon Focus and Greater Weapon Specialization for his chosen weapon.
Blaster: The kineticist gains the Precise Shot feat, and may select the following feats for his Wild Blast even without fulfilling the prerequisites: Focused Shot, from 6th level: Snap Shot, from 9th level: Improved Snap Shot. He receives bonus feats at 6th, 12th and 18th level from the following list:
Far Shot, Focused Shot, Point Blank Shot, Weapon Focus (blast) and Rapid Shot.
At 6th level, he adds Improved Precise Shot, Parting Shot and Point Blank Master to the list.
At 12th level, he adds Pinpoint Targeting and Shot on the Run to the list.The benefits of the kineticist's chosen style feats apply only when he wears light, medium, or no armor. He loses all benefits of his combat style feats when wearing heavy armor. Once a kineticist selects a combat style, it cannot be changed.
I think that this is what the Kineticist really needs in order to feel complete. Right now the class suffers a bit from a case of "I need to spend my first three feats to even have the character that I want to run". Honestly, those sort of feats should be given out by the class itself (or at least an archetype).