Today what are the top 3 best/most effective classes in Pathfinder? Also, does anyone know where I can find great builds for these classes?
Thanks in advance!
The answer to this obviously depends on what level range you are considering... if you are thinking PFS play where your ceiling is 12th level then I'd probably say Master Summoner and then a well-made Barbarian or Paladin. If you'e talking 12th level and higher only then the Wizard is a no-brainer.
It's a trick question - the best build is a mix of barbarian, synthesist summoner, and druid (I think - either that or cavalier).
My estimate is the TWF pistolero cheese monkey is the most powerful damage dealing class, he can do almost as much damage as a wizard and can do it all night long unlike a 30 Seconds of Combat per Day Wizard.
A summoner is also pretty good, but a well cheesed, erg built, TWF pistolero can outperform one. And can do it longer, although both can last much longer than a 30 Second Wizard.
Master Summoner would bury him. I've got a Barbarian I suspect would as well. And probably a Paladin for that matter... which is good, I suppose, as guns have never had a place in my fantasy games. More to the point, being able to deal the most damage is far from being 'the best class' - I'd say being the most survivable would be more likely to fit the bill.
Eh, I'm not a big fan of the plague of cheese monkey label use I've been seeing so much lately.
Also, I don't get where wizards are being compared to a dedicated damage dealing class. A wizard who builds for damage is a waste of a good class for abilities that other classes can do without jumping through so many hoops that wizards have to do to get the "cheese monkey" levels of damage.
What amount of DPR is the pistolero doing and at what levels? I mean the HP totals that monsters have go up quite a bit as you get higher, and ideally a damage dealing character needs to be able to 1-2 rounds an CR = APL monster. Most of the gunslingers do a bit more than that, but when you calculate the lost shots due to misfires and misses (range, cover, misc). its usually not any better than the more famous melee builds or even the bow paladin or fighter builds.
IMHO the best class shouldn't be as limited as a pure damage dealer. The evangelist cleric of erastil with boon companion and sacred summons might take that further than even I like though! I mean, druid quality animal companion, bard performance, standard action lantern archons and hound archons, if you take protection alt channel you can boost party AC... That and you could say that they qualify for the various moonlight/sunlight summons due to the domain summon natures ally. Oh, the longbow proficiency is a nice little bonus too. Since its a party friend/summoner rather than attack cleric that means you can skimp on the wisdom a bit, letting you buy a decent combat score too (only need good dex due to bow and body guard).
Eh, I'm not a big fan of the plague of cheese monkey label use I've been seeing so much lately.
Me too. That's why I've switched over to "min-maxed cheese weasel". There's even a great cheese weasel logo we can use here that suggests we set aside a day (April 3rd) for especially cheese weaselly builds.
Yeah, the best classes are still any full caster.
I'm not a fan of it, but in any game based on 3rd edition D&D, Magic > No magic, and More Magic > Less Magic.
Paragon Surge, Pages of Spell Knowledge, and similar items propped up the spontaneous casters, so I am pretty sure they're all equal now (and I'd unquestionably prefer to be spontaneous as I find it more fun).
The only class that trumps these general rules is the Summoner.
So, the "three best classes" are actually seven classes tied:
Cleric, Druid, Oracle, Sorcerer, Summoner, Witch, and Wizard
fighter.
The only class that trumps these general rules is the Summoner.Why does the summoner trump them...?
Without getting into too much detail: action economy and versatility.
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Eh, I'm not a big fan of the plague of cheese monkey label use I've been seeing so much lately.Me too. That's why I've switched over to "min-maxed cheese weasel". There's even a great cheese weasel logo we can use here that suggests we set aside a day (April 3rd) for especially cheese weaselly builds.
That... is glorious. It will surely bring me years of joy. Thank you so much!
Also, bards are the best. Lem told me so; he made a very pursuasive argument.
Master Summoner would bury him. I've got a Barbarian I suspect would as well. And probably a Paladin for that matter... which is good, I suppose, as guns have never had a place in my fantasy games. More to the point, being able to deal the most damage is far from being 'the best class' - I'd say being the most survivable would be more likely to fit the bill.
Nonsense as far as the Barb is concerned, never be able to lay a paw on a gunslinger.
A gunslinger is so SAD that with a 10 point character buy she can still afford an 18 DEX before racial adjustment and not worry. Instead of just having the enchants of weapons a gunslinger can get the effects of enchants on both weapons AND bullets. Twice as many attacks as any other class (two bullets for each attack using double barreled pistols cheese), with bonus ammo enchant effects, attacking touch AC - it adds up to a pretty hefty chunk of damage. On the survival side the AC comes from DEX, but gunslingers get a class based AC bonus as well as uncanny dodge, evasion improved uncanny dodge and re-rolls on missed saving throws - all as part of the class. Oh and they also get an initiative bonus to their massive DEX, so opponents have to survive a hail of lead before the gunslinger can even be attacked.
See and here every time one of these discussions comes up I always think the debate is over what the character can do not what the character can buy...
The main point of the post is that being able to deal the most damage is far from 'being the best'... I've seen fair arguments that put Bards in the lead with their ability to make everyone else better as well as fill in for a variety of rolls both in and out of combat.
Having said that, we'll have to agree to disagree. Gunslingers are glass connons, and one-trick ponys tend to have a horrible survival rate, in our games anyway. Like I said, I've posted a Barbarian build I feelpretty comfortable putting up against anything in a variety of in-game comparisons - among other things he features both DR and saving throws in the 20's, and that's before ever picking up a single magic item.
Wizards of course.
Always have, always will.
I'd have to say that the Cleric is the best class.
Also, would someone care to help me with that Tiefling?
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Without frontliners the wizard is toast
*cough* summoning *cough* divination to see what's coming *cough cough*
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I would say the Inquisitor comes pretty close to being "the best class" if your definition of "best class" is "Able to deal with the largest number of scenarios while being effective in combat and not relying on others overly much to be effective over the widest range of levels of play". Inquisitor and Bard are probably the best balanced classes for skills, survivability, adaptability, and self-sufficiency, plus both classes are inherently good at working as part of a team without any special investment having to be spent to make them so.
After that, probably Cleric, then Druid, then Wizards and Sorcerers. Wizards and Sorcerers will ultimately have the largest breadth of versatility and power, but they'll have the hardest time actually reaching those levels over other classes, upon whom they are very reliant throughout the early tiers of play. Clerics and Druids both have healing capabilities, extending their own usefulness and that of whomever they're traveling with, and a cleric's proficiencies and domains give her a survivability somewhat better than most other casters during levels 1-5 while a druid's Animal Companion and Wildshape similarly grant him a degree of combat effectiveness and durability others lack.
The Summoner probably rates somewhere in the upper reaches of the scale as well, but I hesitate to put the class in since its effectiveness is so dependent on Archetype and system mastery.
Yesterday it was the Wizard. Today it's the Bard. I'll see what I feel like tomorrow.
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One level of everything, just to be on the safe side. Or, fractions thereof per level. With a moustache'd goblin FTW!
(Hmm...honest question: all joking aside is such a build possible, let alone survivable? I know its not optimum.)
Without frontliners the wizard is toast*cough* summoning *cough* divination to see what's coming *cough cough*
Breath mint?
Indoor voices, brah, indoor voices.PLEASE DON'T SOME OF US ARE ENJOYING OURSELVES.please stop going around naked yelling "EMPHASIZE IT. IT IS IMPRESSIVE""Oh, stop you you'll gonna make me blush".....The one you have the most fun with.Back the original point and the perfect answer to the original question.
The best class is the one that is the most fun to play. :)
mnmnmnmnmnnmnmnmnmn
mnmnmnmnmnnmnmnmnmnIndoor voices, brah, indoor voices.PLEASE DON'T SOME OF US ARE ENJOYING OURSELVES.please stop going around naked yelling "EMPHASIZE IT. IT IS IMPRESSIVE""Oh, stop you you'll gonna make me blush".....The one you have the most fun with.Back the original point and the perfect answer to the original question.
The best class is the one that is the most fun to play. :)
lololollllllllllllllllllllllllllllll
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One of the best multiclass builts I found, and am having a lot of fun with, is a Gunslinger / Inquisitor build. I created it as I wanted a character in the style of Solomon Kane.
The Character is approaching the point where he can swift action bane on his double barrel pistol. So base damage fully buffed will be 1d8+2d6+2. In another level of gunslinger he can added his dex bonus to damage for a total of +5. With rapid shot that is two shots a round - about to be three with a BAB increase, rapid reload, and alchemical paper charges.
If a creature has DR then I just drop a judgement next round to bypass DR. On another creature I use the Judgement for extra damage. If something gets in close I pull out a Bastard Sword (he is a servant of Ragathiel) and use the judgement for fast healing.
Then the skills that an Inquisitor gets which can be augmented by spells makes him very usefull in role play and skill checks.
It was just a character created on a whim, but now it is turning out to be one of my favorite PFS characters to game with.
Just to continue the tread without copying all the others, whatever you enjoy the most!
I absolutely hate these kinds of posts where people ask "what is the best class." It's really silly, it depends on what you want to play and the role you want to fill. The best class is the one you have the most fun with, just go have fun and stop trying to break the game. The end.
Obviously the most sensible thing is to take one level in every class. Even if this requires an alignment shift that eliminates some abilities of a previous class that you have had.
:P
I absolutely hate these kinds of posts where people ask "what is the best class." It's really silly, it depends on what you want to play and the role you want to fill. The best class is the one you have the most fun with, just go have fun and stop trying to break the game. The end.
It is silly. WIzards are clearly superior to all other classes. Clearly.
Commoner. Because when you have a brutish warrior, an amazing wizard, an annoying cleric, and a thuggish rogue, you don't have time to go stick something in that guy back there...
That and when you have a thousand or more of them, you can make a railgun. *runs for cover at the suggestion of such stupidity.*
lololollllllllllllllllllllllllllllllmnmnmnmnmnnmnmnmnmnIndoor voices, brah, indoor voices.PLEASE DON'T SOME OF US ARE ENJOYING OURSELVES.please stop going around naked yelling "EMPHASIZE IT. IT IS IMPRESSIVE""Oh, stop you you'll gonna make me blush".....The one you have the most fun with.Back the original point and the perfect answer to the original question.
The best class is the one that is the most fun to play. :)
I'm curious how many layers of nested quotes you need before the first is just black on black... The middle layers have all just stopped darkening now, haven't they?.... Pitty.
Best class depends on level, type of encounters, style of play, and a multitude of other factors, though I am tempted to go with commoner. We made the world. We were here before the murder-hobos, and when the murder-hobos are gone, we will remain
Also, all magic dependent classes can be nullified by antimagic field, or by dropping the ceiling on them. As a DM, or player, there are few moments that equal seeing a arrogant wizard stripped of his magic and confronted with a plain fighter. Or squished. Or immolated. Or liquefied. Or drowned. Or really anything that makes the character, if NPC or PC, or player, if PC, shout in dismay and sputter nonsense about there always being a saving throw. Grimtooth enjoys third edition characters. Grimtina has never had so many playthings.
'Tis a shame indeed, but for all its flaws this forum has the prettiest quote pyramids I've ever seen.I'm curious how many layers of nested quotes you need before the first is just black on black... The middle layers have all just stopped darkening now, haven't they?.... Pitty.lololollllllllllllllllllllllllllllllmnmnmnmnmnnmnmnmnmnIndoor voices, brah, indoor voices.PLEASE DON'T SOME OF US ARE ENJOYING OURSELVES.please stop going around naked yelling "EMPHASIZE IT. IT IS IMPRESSIVE""Oh, stop you you'll gonna make me blush".....The one you have the most fun with.Back the original point and the perfect answer to the original question.
The best class is the one that is the most fun to play. :)
I wonder what the limit is on the darkness of the center of said pyramid.
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My picks would be:
1: Inquisitor - Wisdom = Can use a ton of good spells, Can identify every monster, including weaknesses, resistances, and equipment, can track anything, and increased initiative. Teamwork feats can allow you to reposition allies to set up flanking, never get attacks of opportunity against you, and majorly take advantage of any feint or crit used by an ally. Stacked judgements can leave you with damage and energy resistance plus regen or attack and damage buffs plus smiting and you can switch up on the fly. You then get Bane and Exploit Weakness just to top it off.
2: Magus - While unhasted and without any extras, can attack 3 times AND cast twice, wear heavy armor without spell failure, use the Arcane Pool AND Arcana, and counterattack all on the same round, then can recall spells if needed, or can go the soul forger route and get a bonded weapon and make magical equipment cheaply and quickly for everyone, and have your counterstrike able to sunder magic items.
3: Rogue - Tons of useful skills and skill points, sneak attack, and rogue talents. There are also tons of alternate classes. Once had a Rogue who was at least five times as rich as he should have been for his level and was always hasted with equipment he had purchased. He specialized in combat maneuvers, throwing sand in monsters eyes, kicking to the junk, tripping, etc. This left every creature pretty much defenseless against the rest of the group. The best thing about rogues is that they can fill any empty spot in a group (can use magic items and scrolls, can tank with right talents, can outdamage and outskill most, can be the "face") and are better at adventuring (finding treasure, unlocking chests, disabling traps, finding hidden areas, and disabling monsters) than most other classes.
The one you have the most fun with.
You gave the quintessential to a question he did not ask.
..
...what are the top 3 best/most effective...
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"GM's Girlfriend" and "GM's Pet GMPC" are hands down the best classes.
If by "best class" you mean most versatile: Inquisitor. Especially if you consider versatile to mean best class to be a one character party. In fact I posted a build as such about two years ago.
Granted the Conversion Inquisition isn't PFS Legal.
Sadly I never found out if I won. lol
Another interesting question that was touched on would be what the best class to comprise a single class party. Four Inquisitors, four Druids, four Wizards, etc...
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When did this obsession with stats, "best classes", and winning at Role Playing games come into fashion? Is this World of Warcraft's doing?
I just never saw this kind of cheese when I played 1st and 2nd edition.
-MD
PS: The only person who ever won at Role Playing was Pierce from Community.
Is this World of Warcraft's doing?The term "munchkin" is older than 3rd Edition. Just saying.
Considerably older :)
I wonder what the limit is on the darkness of the center of said pyramid.'Tis a shame indeed, but for all its flaws this forum has the prettiest quote pyramids I've ever seen.I'm curious how many layers of nested quotes you need before the first is just black on black... The middle layers have all just stopped darkening now, haven't they?.... Pitty.lololollllllllllllllllllllllllllllllmnmnmnmnmnnmnmnmnmnIndoor voices, brah, indoor voices.PLEASE DON'T SOME OF US ARE ENJOYING OURSELVES.please stop going around naked yelling "EMPHASIZE IT. IT IS IMPRESSIVE""Oh, stop you you'll gonna make me blush".....The one you have the most fun with.Back the original point and the perfect answer to the original question.
The best class is the one that is the most fun to play. :)
*peers into the abyss with his bullseye lantern* No good. We need someone with darkvision.
Also, we have got some data back, and have discovered that this has been emphasized almost enough. With just a little more emphasis, it will have been emphasized enough to collapse into the next thread.
Serious Answer: a good GM will have a variety of encounters, from social to violence-only!, and every skill-set will have its moments to shine.
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What would you say the best class for both surviving combat as well as posing an offensive threat would be? I'm trying to find a good balance of offense and defense for a 5th character in a party with no other full BAB classes.
Paladin. Defintiely paladin. Good hp, saves, and AC. can heal with a swift action and smite teh crap out of evil things.