Luthorne, are Sha'ir unable to take Panoplies or do you just think they are a bad choice for Sha'ir?
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So a Panoply isn't just a collection of Implement Schools, it is a collection of specific Implements from those Schools. I guess having Jin as your Implements would make that impossible. For non-Sha'ir Occultists that sounds really flavorful.
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So a Panoply isn't just a collection of Implement Schools, it is a collection of specific Implements from those Schools. I guess having Jin as your Implements would make that impossible. For non-Sha'ir Occultists that sounds really flavorful.Pretty much, yes, though you might be able to work something out with your GM. Honestly, for a sha'ir, I'd be tempted to work out something completely different...something more elemental-based.
Maybe have each Jinn bear one of the items associated with the panoply? Like having you Jinn associated with the illusion school wear the mask, etc.
I'll be impressed if it was coordinated, but the way the panoplies are set up means they can't be used with the new Blingomancer archetype (not actual name) from Heroes of the High Court, which gets more implements, magic, and focus, but no longer uses regular implements. A nice balancing factor.
Both panoplies and the new Heroes of the High Court archetype are making me want to play an Occultist!
If the obstacle is house-ruled away for Sha'ir, they'd still need to wait until 14th level, and would have to pick from just the quicker-access panoplies.
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It wasn't directly coordinated, but I was aware of their existence by virtue of my presence on both projects. I wrote the silksworn occultist before I saw the final designs for panoplies.
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It wasn't directly coordinated, but I was aware of their existence by virtue of my presence on both projects. I wrote the silksworn occultist before I saw the final designs for panoplies.
Cool! I really like how the two coming out at the same time give really good options for a magic-focused Occultist and a martial-focused Occultist. (Although it does leave me with a dilemma on which to play first.)
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Burst of force is kind of fun, though having it centered on you is a bit of a bummer. Debilitating pain is, uh, wow. Mind-affecting, but you're screwed even on a successful save for a round, so that's pretty damn potent. Reflexive barrier is pretty nice, I think, and I love the rend body line of spells...gruesome.
Glad you liked them!
Rend Body was a lot of fun to write. :)
And thanks to Owen and the Paizo team for allowing me to contribute to this book!
Contributor, RPG Superstar 2010 Top 8
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Burst of force is kind of fun, though having it centered on you is a bit of a bummer. Debilitating pain is, uh, wow. Mind-affecting, but you're screwed even on a successful save for a round, so that's pretty damn potent. Reflexive barrier is pretty nice, I think, and I love the rend body line of spells...gruesome.Glad you liked them!
Rend Body was a lot of fun to write. :)
And thanks to Owen and the Paizo team for allowing me to contribute to this book!
I love the flavor of Rend Body, it's a great concept :)
What's the deal with the save, though? It says Fort partial (see text), but nothing in the text mentions a save. Is it Fort for half damage, like Burst of Force?
It wasn't directly coordinated, but I was aware of their existence by virtue of my presence on both projects. I wrote the silksworn occultist before I saw the final designs for panoplies.Cool! I really like how the two coming out at the same time give really good options for a magic-focused Occultist and a martial-focused Occultist. (Although it does leave me with a dilemma on which to play first.)
Play both at once? The Blingomancer from Heroes of the High Streets synergizes well with the Panoplies. You just need to get ways to boost your AC and all is set.
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Play both at once? The Blingomancer from Heroes of the High Streets synergizes well with the Panoplies. You just need to get ways to boost your AC and all is set.It wasn't directly coordinated, but I was aware of their existence by virtue of my presence on both projects. I wrote the silksworn occultist before I saw the final designs for panoplies.Cool! I really like how the two coming out at the same time give really good options for a magic-focused Occultist and a martial-focused Occultist. (Although it does leave me with a dilemma on which to play first.)
Nope, they aren't compatible. (That would be way too good. 6/9 caster with extra casting and more spells known than a Sorcerer getting full BAB and access to all the metamagic feats?) Panoplies require specific implements, and so they don't work with any archetypes that change what you can use as implements.
Nope, they aren't compatible. (That would be way too good. 6/9 caster with extra casting and more spells known than a Sorcerer getting full BAB and access to all the metamagic feats?) Panoplies require specific implements, and so they don't work with any archetypes that change what you can use as implements.Play both at once? The Blingomancer from Heroes of the High Streets synergizes well with the Panoplies. You just need to get ways to boost your AC and all is set.It wasn't directly coordinated, but I was aware of their existence by virtue of my presence on both projects. I wrote the silksworn occultist before I saw the final designs for panoplies.Cool! I really like how the two coming out at the same time give really good options for a magic-focused Occultist and a martial-focused Occultist. (Although it does leave me with a dilemma on which to play first.)
They seem plenty compatible to me...The Blingomancer even has the overflow of implement schools to be able to take the panoplies easier.
The archetype replaces all your implements with fancy clothing and ostentatious jewelry in specific slots. You can't use a sword, shield, wand, crystal ball, etc. If you can't do that, no panoplies. (As I mentioned, though, that's probably good for balance.)
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I love the flavor of Rend Body, it's a great concept :)
What's the deal with the save, though? It says Fort partial (see text), but nothing in the text mentions a save. Is it Fort for half damage, like Burst of Force?
So, uh... I wrote that a while back and looking at my notes... I believe I intended that the Fort save would block the limb from being removed, but you'd still suffer full damage... but I might have also intended it to reduce the damage, but not the limb removal. I'm PRETTY sure it was to block the limb from being removed, but I'm not 100% sure.
That's a mixup on my part for not putting that explanation in there, but I don't want to claim official ruling on that.
I love the flavor of Rend Body, it's a great concept :)
What's the deal with the save, though? It says Fort partial (see text), but nothing in the text mentions a save. Is it Fort for half damage, like Burst of Force?
So, uh... I wrote that a while back and looking at my notes... I believe I intended that the Fort save would block the limb from being removed, but you'd still suffer full damage... but I might have also intended it to reduce the damage, but not the limb removal. I'm PRETTY sure it was to block the limb from being removed, but I'm not 100% sure.
That's a mixup on my part for not putting that explanation in there, but I don't want to claim official ruling on that.
Don't worry, Jeremy! That's what campaign clarifications and developer comments are for!
Save on both seems necessary. Maximized at the d8/level point, it needs both to avoid being either guaranteed death (for d6 HD and most d8s) or guaranteed loss of limb (since saving for half on an insta-kill means losing a limb). Unlike most evocation spells, there aren't any protective spells, items, or abilities other than SR. It's not mind-affecting, so there's a lot more it can work on than the usual Psychic damaging spells.
So the Phantom Blade gets Spell Combat as a Magus, which includes this ability:
If he casts this spell defensively, he can decide to take an additional penalty on his attack rolls, up to his Intelligence bonus, and add the same amount as a circumstance bonus on his concentration check.
Assuming the Phantom Blade is meant to get that part of spell combat, should they still base their maximum attack roll penalty on their Int? Or should they use Wis since it's their casting stat?
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HolyMolyILoveThisBook!
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Got my hands on it, and really loving it. The Occult classes are my favorite set of classes ^_^
The Bad... or nitpick (getting this out of the way)
- Basic Phytokinesis is nowhere to be found. I know it was omitted in Occult Origins, and I would have liked to see it here.
- Positive Blast seems to be a weaker blast... Void's Negative Blast (Occult Origins) deals negative energy damage without healing creatures that wouldn't be harmed by it. By comparison, Positive Blast doesn't heal creatures and only harms creatures that would be harmed by it. Yeah, the blast is kinda limited to a certain creature category here.
- One aspect of the Elemental Knight's Elemental Bastion only works with heavy armor; there is no scaling for light and medium armor. What if I find a good studded leather or a good breastplate? I feel like it would have been better if this ability would have scaled according to your armor type.
- The psychometabolic corruption seems to be missing some "entry requirements"... Could a completely Burned out Kineticist be corrupted and turned into a Combusted (Occult Bestiary)? How about an Occultist that empties his mental pool, or a Medium that breaks one too many taboos?
- No new Psychic archetype... I said "nitpick", so...
The Good:
- Everything else :D
* More support for Void and Wood
* Alternate spirits for the Medium
* Panoplies
* etc...
Very good booklet with very good materials ^_^
With all being said, I'd like some clarification here: How does the Phantom Blade's weapon... works??? Does it act as a dancing weapon when it's summoned? Does the phantom blade actually wield the weapon? Can the phantom blade wield a real weapon and attack in tandem with his phantom weapon? Does the phantom blade lose Improved Unarmed Strike if the weapon is summoned (I guess he does, but still)?
Yeah, kinda need enlightenment here :P
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Kinetic Invocation can be used to pick up Etheric Shards? SOLD
Edit: Now, if only I could use VMC Vigilante for the best dual identity
...I'm not sure why you would think otherwise, but the Phantom Blade wields their weapon normally unless they're 15th level and spend ectoplasmic points to grant it the dancing weapon special ability. It's pretty clear they only get Improved Unarmed Strike when the weapon is harbored in their consciousness.
That's why I'm asking :P
A regular Phantom is a separate entity... which makes me believe that the Phantom Weapon is just a weapon-shaped phantom that attacks on its own, like instead of being a human-like spirit, it's a sword-shaped spirit, for instance.
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...I'm not sure why you would think otherwise, but the Phantom Blade wields their weapon normally unless they're 15th level and spend ectoplasmic points to grant it the dancing weapon special ability. It's pretty clear they only get Improved Unarmed Strike when the weapon is harbored in their consciousness.That's why I'm asking :P
A regular Phantom is a separate entity... which makes me believe that the Phantom Weapon is just a weapon-shaped phantom that attacks on its own, like instead of being a human-like spirit, it's a sword-shaped spirit, for instance.
Except it's not, and nothing in the Phantom Blade entry suggests that.
Can Kinetic Knights not use Focused Blast? (It seems like Kinetic Blade and Focused Blast are both form infusions)
If it's a form infusion, then by RAW, no. That said... I'd probably allow you to use it as a substance infusion in a home game, as the point of the archetype is to lock out ranged attacks and AOEs, and kinetic knights can find themselves a bit short on infusions to choose from. ^_^
...I'm not sure why you would think otherwise, but the Phantom Blade wields their weapon normally unless they're 15th level and spend ectoplasmic points to grant it the dancing weapon special ability. It's pretty clear they only get Improved Unarmed Strike when the weapon is harbored in their consciousness.That's why I'm asking :P
A regular Phantom is a separate entity... which makes me believe that the Phantom Weapon is just a weapon-shaped phantom that attacks on its own, like instead of being a human-like spirit, it's a sword-shaped spirit, for instance.
That's...quite the leap in logic. As the entry says, it's an ectoplasmic sentient weapon, or, an intelligent magic item. We have rules for those, they can't attack on their own unless they have a particular ability that lets them. It completely replaces the phantom that a normal spiritualist would have.
Ah, I see, thanks for the info ^_^
I would like to congratulate the Mesmerist Autohypnotist archetype for winning the "worst Mesmerist archetype" title in a rout, and being an early favorite in the 2017 competition for Worst New Pathfinder Archetype. I do hope this new design space of marginal benefit against an enemy in return for a crippling penalty to your character continues, this is the time in our national zeitgeist where the self own is particularly appropriate. Honestly, I read that you were going to apply your stare penalty to yourself in return for a boost and assumed it would be doubled against enemies. +1? And the same against yourself? I can apply a -4 to the enemy and myself instead of just a -3 to the enemy? Burn swift actions to reduce my self penalty (on my second and subsequent rounds) but at a chance of also eliminating any effect on the enemy target? My poor dog jumped in fear at how loud I laughed. I guess it has its place for NPCs that you want to cripple and give your PCs an easy win without officially adjusting CR.
Mesmerist feats are excellent.
The Material Manipulator archetype is cool, but
At 14th level, he can adjust the target’s type or subtype, as per polymorph. At 20th level, he can instead adjust the target’s type as per greater polymorph
Neither of these spells (or any other polymorph) changes a creature's type or subtype. I assume the actual effect is to give the abilities granted by the spell. Otherwise this would give you lots of immunities that you can't otherwise get.
Vexing Trickster and the Projectionist archetypes look solid.
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It's not a new design space! For all your national zeitgeist needs, Ragechemist slightly boosts their mutagen's strength bonus in exchange for long-lasting cascading will save penalties and falling unconscious for an hour plus during combat! This one is tame by comparison, but yeah, really bad. (Preferable to a good archetype with a boosted save penalty, I admit.) Everything I wanted from an archetype of that name is available as a feat, though, so I'm happy.
Huh. Missed that about Material Manipulator.
EDIT: Just realized you can multiclass Ragechemist, Autohypnotist, and Psychkineticist for some really terrible will saves.
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I would like to congratulate the Mesmerist Autohypnotist archetype for winning the "worst Mesmerist archetype" title in a rout, and being an early favorite in the 2017 competition for Worst New Pathfinder Archetype. I do hope this new design space of marginal benefit against an enemy in return for a crippling penalty to your character continues, this is the time in our national zeitgeist where the self own is particularly appropriate. Honestly, I read that you were going to apply your stare penalty to yourself in return for a boost and assumed it would be doubled against enemies. +1? And the same against yourself? I can apply a -4 to the enemy and myself instead of just a -3 to the enemy? Burn swift actions to reduce my self penalty (on my second and subsequent rounds) but at a chance of also eliminating any effect on the enemy target? My poor dog jumped in fear at how loud I laughed. I guess it has its place for NPCs that you want to cripple and give your PCs an easy win without officially adjusting CR.
It's worth noting that the autohypnosis loses NOTHING for its better Will save penalty and the ability to try and reduce the penalty for yourself. It only alters hypnotic stare, and mesmerist constantly have the best Will saves in the game, between having a good Will and towering ego. The penalty really only drops them to slightly-better-than-a-bard territory, and they also have a powerful AoE state option that you get for the low, low cost of the mental potency ability.
The Material Manipulator archetype is cool, butAt 14th level, he can adjust the target’s type or subtype, as per polymorph. At 20th level, he can instead adjust the target’s type as per greater polymorphNeither of these spells (or any other polymorph) changes a creature's type or subtype. I assume the actual effect is to give the abilities granted by the spell. Otherwise this would give you lots of immunities that you can't otherwise get.
It's not trying to tell you that your type actually changed. It's trying to tell you how the ability works if you use it to assume a form with a different type than yours. Prior to that point, revision changes your current form's physical features, but can't let you assume forms of a different type.
I know this isn't the best place to ask, but the foxfire utility talent lists void healer or kinetic healer as a prerequisite. Being that the talent is fire based, is this a typo or is it meant to only be available to kineticists who have multiple elements? I'll also ask on Mark's thread in case no one can comment here. Thanks in advance.
I would like to congratulate the Mesmerist Autohypnotist archetype for winning the "worst Mesmerist archetype" title in a rout, and being an early favorite in the 2017 competition for Worst New Pathfinder Archetype. I do hope this new design space of marginal benefit against an enemy in return for a crippling penalty to your character continues, this is the time in our national zeitgeist where the self own is particularly appropriate. Honestly, I read that you were going to apply your stare penalty to yourself in return for a boost and assumed it would be doubled against enemies. +1? And the same against yourself? I can apply a -4 to the enemy and myself instead of just a -3 to the enemy? Burn swift actions to reduce my self penalty (on my second and subsequent rounds) but at a chance of also eliminating any effect on the enemy target? My poor dog jumped in fear at how loud I laughed. I guess it has its place for NPCs that you want to cripple and give your PCs an easy win without officially adjusting CR.It's worth noting that the autohypnosis loses NOTHING for its better Will save penalty and the ability to try and reduce the penalty for yourself. It only alters hypnotic stare, and mesmerist constantly have the best Will saves in the game, between having a good Will and towering ego. The penalty really only drops them to slightly-better-than-a-bard territory, and they also have a powerful AoE state option that you get for the low, low cost of the mental potency ability.
You take a 15 or 20% penalty in return for a 5% hit to your enemy. That's a bad trade unless your Will save is so high that you remain in auto save territory. Where this gets really punishing is that you also suffer your Bold Stare penalties. Goodbye, Sapped Magic. Better not take the ones that penalize Reflex saves or poison saves, either. Initiative? Yikes.
The AoE stare is reduced effectiveness and will hurt allies who engage in melee to take advantage of Painful Stare and relevant bold stare debuffs like to hit and damage reducers.
Hard pass.
So... kinetic knight. Like it.
Not in love with having to be wearing heavy armour and carrying a shield to use elemental defenses, but it's not a deal-breaker.
Is there any way to make it work with a telekineticist without really breaking flavour/some cheesy shenanigans?
Seems that telekinetic blade will still wreck whatever you're using as the base for the blast. You'll need quick-draw + a hefty supply of stuff to swing, and still might run out in a decent fight.
Or am I missing something basic with regards tk blast, kinetic blade, and object damage?
I would like to congratulate the Mesmerist Autohypnotist archetype for winning the "worst Mesmerist archetype" title in a rout, and being an early favorite in the 2017 competition for Worst New Pathfinder Archetype. I do hope this new design space of marginal benefit against an enemy in return for a crippling penalty to your character continues, this is the time in our national zeitgeist where the self own is particularly appropriate. Honestly, I read that you were going to apply your stare penalty to yourself in return for a boost and assumed it would be doubled against enemies. +1? And the same against yourself? I can apply a -4 to the enemy and myself instead of just a -3 to the enemy? Burn swift actions to reduce my self penalty (on my second and subsequent rounds) but at a chance of also eliminating any effect on the enemy target? My poor dog jumped in fear at how loud I laughed. I guess it has its place for NPCs that you want to cripple and give your PCs an easy win without officially adjusting CR.It's worth noting that the autohypnosis loses NOTHING for its better Will save penalty and the ability to try and reduce the penalty for yourself. It only alters hypnotic stare, and mesmerist constantly have the best Will saves in the game, between having a good Will and towering ego. The penalty really only drops them to slightly-better-than-a-bard territory, and they also have a powerful AoE state option that you get for the low, low cost of the mental potency ability.
You take a 15 or 20% penalty in return for a 5% hit to your enemy. That's a bad trade unless your Will save is so high that you remain in auto save territory. Where this gets really punishing is that you also suffer your Bold Stare penalties. Goodbye, Sapped Magic. Better not take the ones that penalize Reflex saves or poison saves, either. Initiative? Yikes.
The AoE stare is reduced effectiveness and will hurt allies who engage in melee to take advantage...
I think the danger is that - depending on what enemy you face - the saving throw penalty on yourself may be meaningless.
When you are applying a debuff, you are also supplying the attacks that might make use of it. With proper planning, you will make use of it.
When applying a debuff to yourself, your opponent has no control over what type of debuff that is. A lot of more basic opponents lack the ability to interact with Will Saves. They can't select a penalty that assists them in fighting you. If the situation is right, you should be able to select a Bold Stare debuff that helps your team without putting yourself at any disadvantage.
Plenty of tough fights will put you in a situation where you will have to either not boost and not apply the penalty to yourself or risk the boost with a self-penalty.
I don't want to dive too deep into how balanced the archetype is, but I can see some limiting factors that would prevent them from allowing you to double the debuff effectiveness.
I'm slightly disappointed by the psychic items in the Infinity Scroll section.
The Ring of Mysticism and Robe of the Overmind duplicate weak/overpriced arcane items that no one should be using anyway. The Shard of Psychic Power is just a reflavoring of Pages of Spell Knowledge and Spell Lattices which already work with psychic spell casting as written.
The Centering Jewel is good, although you'll want to combine with your stat boosting headband early in your career.
The Recondite Rod is fine if you use lots of undercastable spells.
The Ring of Phrenic Prowess is nice, I've wanted a phrenic pool battery. The no save stun touch attack is also a good ability, but I could do without the Spell Turning if I could trim the cost even slightly.
Some of the language for the Martyr's Benediction focus power on page 28 got garbled. What exactly is it supposed to do?
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I'm slightly disappointed by the psychic items in the Infinity Scroll section.
The Ring of Mysticism and Robe of the Overmind duplicate weak/overpriced arcane items that no one should be using anyway. The Shard of Psychic Power is just a reflavoring of Pages of Spell Knowledge and Spell Lattices which already work with psychic spell casting as written.
The Centering Jewel is good, although you'll want to combine with your stat boosting headband early in your career.
The Recondite Rod is fine if you use lots of undercastable spells.
The Ring of Phrenic Prowess is nice, I've wanted a phrenic pool battery. The no save stun touch attack is also a good ability, but I could do without the Spell Turning if I could trim the cost even slightly.
Counterpoint — Ring of Mysticism is strong for the psychic because of the phrenic amplification that allows you to spend phrenic points to "overcast" an undercast spell. I.e. you could take a Ring of Mysticism I and use all of those extra spell slots, in conjunction with a buttload of phrenic points, to cast higher-than-1st-level spells.
Counterpoint — Ring of Mysticism is strong for the psychic because of the phrenic amplification that allows you to spend phrenic points to "overcast" an undercast spell. I.e. you could take a Ring of Mysticism I and use all of those extra spell slots, in conjunction with a buttload of phrenic points, to cast higher-than-1st-level spells.I'm slightly disappointed by the psychic items in the Infinity Scroll section.
The Ring of Mysticism and Robe of the Overmind duplicate weak/overpriced arcane items that no one should be using anyway. The Shard of Psychic Power is just a reflavoring of Pages of Spell Knowledge and Spell Lattices which already work with psychic spell casting as written.
The Centering Jewel is good, although you'll want to combine with your stat boosting headband early in your career.
The Recondite Rod is fine if you use lots of undercastable spells.
The Ring of Phrenic Prowess is nice, I've wanted a phrenic pool battery. The no save stun touch attack is also a good ability, but I could do without the Spell Turning if I could trim the cost even slightly.
Or you could buy 10 1st level Runestones of Power for the same cost. Until you have 10 first level spell slots that's going to be more efficient, you'll need 11 native slots to pull ahead with the Ring. Well before then you don't have the phrenic pool to afford boosting and have better spells to cast.
Rings of Mysticism/Wizardry are always beaten by Pearls and Runestones of power.
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Counterpoint — Ring of Mysticism is strong for the psychic because of the phrenic amplification that allows you to spend phrenic points to "overcast" an undercast spell. I.e. you could take a Ring of Mysticism I and use all of those extra spell slots, in conjunction with a buttload of phrenic points, to cast higher-than-1st-level spells.
Let me just say that I really appreciate it when contributors like yourself share their thoughts on these matters.
I know it's a risky thing to do, given the potential backlash you're exposed to. But I find it really helpful to hear a bit about the thought process that went into some of these things. And it helps me see the why various options that I might gloss over at first glance are actually worthy of consideration, and helps me to improve the balance of things I come up with in my own games.
So to Isabelle Lee, Alexander Augunas, and other contributors who have chipped in on these topics: Thank you!
Am I missing something in the reading, or did the example for the Martial Skill panoply ability get a bit botched? (bolded the part that seemed funky to me)
Martial Skill (Ex): When wielding the weapon used as the panoply’s associated implement, you treat your base attack bonus as though it were 1 point higher for every 4 points of total mental focus invested in all of the associated implements, to a maximum base attack bonus equal to your occultist level. This increase can grant you additional attacks when using the full attack action (for example, a 12th-level occultist with 12 points of mental focus invested among the associated implements would be treated as having a base attack bonus of +11, with iterative attacks at a base attack bonus of +6 and +1)."