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What are the new animal options?
How does the dragon shifter look compared to other recent archetypes?
What's the thing that's a bigger buff for druids?


I'm assuming the line about weaving coins and bars to get special material bonuses allows you to 'specific overrides general' 'this material cannot be used for items not normally made of metal' restrictions... but how much would mithral-woven handwraps cost?


Question on the handwraps... Can you still use the hands for other things, or do you need to slip them on and off like gloves?

And if the hand is occupied, presumably they're just the move action to put on much like readying any other weapon?


Does the Gunslinger archetype stack with Pistolero (or any other archetype, for that matter)?


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Cheers Rysky, you rock.

Any chance of some more information on the shifter?


Rysky wrote:
Sir_Andrew wrote:
what does the swashbuckler archetype get?
They use Monk weapons, get some basic Monk Chi abilities, and count their levels as Fighter and Monk for the purposes of qualifying for Feats.

Waveblades?


Any chance of a list of all the archetypes, their class, and a single sentence summary of what they do? Or did we get all that info already?


zer0darkfire wrote:


Grappling has a couple new things. Savage Slam lets you, well, savagely slam someone into the ground. This ends the grapple, but makes the enemy prone. There are 3 upgrade feats to this ability, first one makes the enemy shaken after you do this to them, second one makes them staggered if they fail a save, and the last one makes you intimidate everyone within 30ft because that was freaking badass.

My brawler is going to enjoy those...


What's the tonfa support?

What fun things are there to do while grappling?


Yeah, there's a lot that's odd about it. Not even trying to pretend it's mechanically solid. Bastard sword wielding Kobold. This one's all about the flavour (which is why DD wasn't an option; follower of Apsu, not Saranwrap).


Thanks for taking the time to answer.
Unfortunately 'being able to take it with your regular first level feat' doesn't fit the bill as I'm working on a very particular build;

1: Virtuous Bravo | Exotic Weapon Proficiency
2: Battle Oracle | Weapon Focus
3: Virtuous Bravo | Slashing Grace
4: Virtuous Bravo |
5: Virtuous Bravo | Scaled Disciple
6: Dragon Disciple

So the requirement is Slashing Grace as early as possible, Dragon Disciple at 6, and at least 4 levels of Paladin, which means I'm really just looking to replace Oracle with something that'll give the same benefit but not require Scaled Disciple at 5.


Question is pretty much what it says.
Is there a spontaneous arcane caster which gets Weapon Focus as a bonus at first level?
Prepared arcane can get it (Kensai Magus)
Prepared Divine can get it (Warpriest)
Spontaneous Divine can get it (Battle Oracle - I guess if there's a way for a bard or Sorcerer to pick up a revelation at 1 that would work too)?

Any thoughts?


So... is the Warrior Poet archetype along a similar theme as the Devoted Muse (which is still 1 of only 2 PrCs I've built multiple characters towards). How well could they work together?


I know there are the poster maps available, and some very cool dudes have done some digital work, but are there any battle maps/flip-mats available for actual tabletop play?

If there aren't any AP specific ones available, has anyone found some easily repurposed generic flip-mats they would recomment?


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Feels like an arbitrary barrier to players actually using the stuff in the books they pay for.

Great for the guys who don't like their players building the characters they want to play, I guess?

And no, it's not 'just the same as dm fiat that's always been in the system'.


I'm not precious about thread drift.


Also, I've seen talk of Enhanced Resistance getting nerfed... is that in official errata/FAQ, or just forum talk for now?


Kvetchus wrote:
Like any skill, Blazing Orbit is situation. Clearly, there will be some critters that it's ineffective against, but Solarian's aren't one-trick ponies.

Well yeah, but it doesn't really seem like it's ever going to be effective at all. Pitiful damage that's easily avoided, takes a fair bit of set-up to get the most out of, and even then that's more likely to fail than succeed.

There's situational, and then there's pie-in-the-sky, and this pie looks a waste of my first 6+ revelation.


Yeah, there's already a party face, he's just not sitting in the captain's chair.

So I take it small arms with multiweapon fighting isn't really viable then and any ranged build that's not using at least longarms is just wasting everyone's time?

Is Blazing Orbit better than it looks at first? It seems like insignificant damage that's trivially avoided with the number of 3-dimensional movement options available.


Awesome, cheers peeps.


It was Light Blindness I meant, thanks for the catch.


Claxon wrote:

The biggest problem I had with a solarion in general, was starship combat (if you want to do something other than be a gunner).

So, it's just something to keep in mind when you build. Also, captain isn't really an essential role either so I wouldn't put your eggs heavily in that basket either.

Joining a game in progress and the other roles are locked down. I'm ok with that though.


Level 6, captain, not looking to multiclass but not zealously opposed to it either.
Looking for effective and fun rather than super-optimized.

Solar Armour, obviously.
Dex = Cha >>> everything else, or do I need to really heavily prioritise Dex?

Multiweapon fighting small arms viable, or do I need to drop a couple of feats into long arms?

How well can it work as mobile battlefield nuisance?

What are the traps I'm most likely to stumble into?


Or other ways to mitigate light sensitivity?


thaX wrote:
Also, one can spend burn to go from being 100 lbs a level to 1000 lbs a level for a round...

Minute per level, not one round.


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Yakman wrote:
Throne wrote:
Gut feeling is that people who like/can tolerate Starfinder will get on with this, but people who actually enjoy Pathfinder will find themselves needing to find another game.
there's enough of P1 material out there for many lifetimes of gaming.

Don't be so bloody disingenuous.

Yes, there's plenty of PF1 material. No, the books aren't going to crumble to dust. No, Paizo ninjas aren't coming to anyone's house to confiscate old books.

Completely irrelevant.

People drift away from games that are not getting new content.
The release cycle maintains buzz. New material keeps the game fresh. Stagnant games dwindle.

Sure, there'll still be some people playing. But before long the people who want to keep playing will have trouble finding people to play with, and they'll move on to something else.

And everyone on this forum knows it.

So let's stop treating people like idiots and pretending like no-one who who wants to keep playing PF1 is going to have any trouble doing so. Even for an rpg website, that's a make-believe step too far.


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Gut feeling is that people who like/can tolerate Starfinder will get on with this, but people who actually enjoy Pathfinder will find themselves needing to find another game.


The FAQ for shifter's edge is up.
No fixes to the class though, so pretty moot.


TWF is generally seen as not worth it because it's feat expensive and cuts off your Precise Strike and Slashing/Fencing Grace.

Only during full rounds, sure, but ideally you want as many of those as you can get.


So... gets vanilla swashbuckler deeds from the Devoted Muse's deeds ability, and advances archetype deeds from the stacking clause?

That would be unusually generous.


I think there's a vigilante Jekyll/Hyde archetype that can make you hulk-out under certain circumstances not necessarily under your control.

Or is that too literal?


I'm toying around with an idea for a swordlordy devoted muse.
Rostland Bravo swashbuckler.

Would the Devoted Muse archetype's deeds class feature advance the archetype's deeds, or just give vanilla deeds.

I'm thinking the former due to the note of 'levels stack with other classes with the deeds ability', but wanted to double check I'm not getting the wrong end of the stick there.


QuidEst wrote:
23. Only use android pilots. Remove life support to make room for comfier chairs.

Androids can be technomancers too...


Erk Ander wrote:
Bigguyinblack wrote:

A possible consideration in your choice. There is a chain of exploits related to vision. At 2nd level Nightvision grants both low-light vision and darkvision. Enhanced Senses gives you blindsense 60 feet if you have low-light vision and darkvision. And that can become blindsight 60ft at 14th level. So android would let you skip the first step in that chain effectively granting you an extra exploit.

Wide Spectrum Ocular Implants or Retinal Reflectors would give the Ysoki the needed low-light vision. The Halfling would need advanced Darkvision Capacitors to skip that first exploit.
I think you need both darkvision and lowlight to skip the exploit. Android grants only DV.

Negative, Androids get both.


Most options you're given just aren't that good.
On the one hand, it's to encourage you to use different options in different situations; things which are generally terrible, but in the very specific right circumstance manage to rise to mediocre.
On the other hand... that means all you've got, at best, are mediocre options. That's pretty unsatisfying.


They both get to attack 3 times with a higher penalty and higher damage than the operative.
It is actually pretty well balanced.


Xenocrat wrote:
pauljathome wrote:
Bigguyinblack wrote:

Expect the +4 to stealth from the ghost to be removed at some point.

Not sure why everybody expects this (yeah, I know the +4 wasn't there at some point in the rules development. That just means that they consciously chose to add it). All the specialties get pretty much a maxed out skill as their startle skill, I don't see why stealth is so much better. The skills match pretty well to the theme of the specialty so I'd expect pretty much everybody to have their skill maxed out, including a +2 racial bonus if they want it enough.

The ghost is very good at what he does, but so are the rest. That is the POINT of taking an operative.

The Ghost is the only one who gets +4 to a dex skill. It's the sole exception to the pattern that non-dex skills get the bonus, the others don't.

Also I believe the developer has chimed in on this; the ghost isn't supposed to get the +4. Expect it to be errata'd (and in this case it really is proper errata, rather than the more common bait-and-switch changes).

The wisdom of that is up in the air, though; you're just not going to be so pinpoint focused on one stat that your dex will end up 8 points clear of your next highest stat, especially if you build towards your specialty, so the dex-based specialisations are going to end up worse at their trick attack than the others. I'm not convinced that's a good design decision, but then, the same goes for a lot of the starfinder design decisions.


Yeah, meeting feat prereqs and eeking out a little extra carrying capacity (combined with the 'count your str as 1 higher' eq) really is the only point to them, and even then only if in a stat you're never going to raise to 18 (at which point it gets swallowed up in the change from +2 to +1 increases).

It doesn't even matter which score the theme bumps, unless it is the one your race drops and you don't intent to put any points into it, because then you just spend points to get the odd number where it'll be some value anyway.


As I said, I'll have the refund to my original payment method as soon as you people deign to return my money for the goods you and your agents failed to provide. Why would I want store credit when you treat your customers this poorly?

But don't try and weasel around the issue.
These aren't the only options you 'have available', they're the only options you're willing to offer.
You refuse to return my money for an arbitrary time period - not can't, won't -, waiting on someone who is nothing to do with me to deliver something to you which has never passed through my hands. Unreasonable, and unacceptable.
What would you do if UPS fail to return the book to you entirely? If it gets lost in the post? Refuse to ever refund the money? Or wait for them to compensate you?
Neither would be acceptable, as well you know, so why do you think this treatment is?

I know you can't control what they do, but they are your employees in this, not mine. The status of the book is now solely between you and them, my refund should not be dependent on that in any way, shape, or form.
If I'd received the book and chosen to return it, I could accept that. But I didn't, and I don't.
But I'm aware you're just going to keep trying to talk around in circles and string me along until you get the book back anyway, outright refusing to do the right thing every step of the way.

So I expect we'll be having further disagreements when you guys try and squirm your way out of refunding the delivery charge?


So is the plan now just to fail to deliver yet cling on to my money for an arbitrary amount of time and ignore me 'til I go away?

Absolutely disgusting 'customer service'.


How about the refund right now to my original payment method?

I could understand having to wait until you've got the package back if I'd received it and then returned it, but it's unreasonable to hold on to my money until it's returned when the book never made it to me. You've basically handed it off to your courier, they've taken it for a walk around the world, and now I have to wait until they get home?
That's not on, especially given that the refund is needed in the first place because your courier has problems getting things where they need to go in a timely fashion.

No.

You've got confirmation it was never delivered. You've got confirmation it's on its way back. Everything from here on out is between you and your courier, I'm out of this equation.
You can refund my money now.


Order 4387031

Your courier is returning it to sender after one attempt at delivery then sitting on it for 10 days and refusing to attempt to redeliver.

When can I expect my money back?


No they won't.
The refund will do fine.


bugleyman wrote:
Redelia wrote:
I don't agree with Throne; so far, Starfinder looks quite interesting, as long as it's seen as its own game, not a replacement for Pathfinder. Just like reading Tolkien and Jane Austin are very different, meeting different needs, Starfinder and Pathfinder are very different games, meeting very different needs for the same players. It's just when you start talking about wanting to replace the gorgeous complexity of Pathfinder with the austere simplicity of Starfinder that I start to get worried.
Not really arguing with you here, just more than a little boggled by someone characterizing a 500+ page RPG as "austerely simple."

It's a much lower number if you just count the good pages......


Jane Austin is also terrible ;)


Hopefully never, or not 'til after Eclipse Phase games are easier to find.
Starfinder is terrible.


Pretty much what it says on the tin.
UPS tried delivering my book during the day, while I was at work, so left it at a UPS pick-up point over an hour away which closes before I get home from work.
I requested redelivery to my office via their online tracking portal.
10 days later, still no book, and I was due to be away for the next week, so I phoned them to request that they actually, you know, deliver my book, as crazy a suggestion as that is, and that I'd need it delivered to my address the next day because I'm going to be away for a couple of weeks as of the following monday (and don't forget, by this point they've left it sitting for over a week anyway, so I don't think I'm being unreasonable).

They refuse. Apparently it's too late in the day for them to be able to leave a message with someone to sort out their screw-up. Because I've had to go around in circles for over half an hour through their automated phone system which is intentionally designed to drive people off the call before they get to speak to someone. And since I tell them that if they can't deliver it the next day, they won't be able to deliver it, they tell me they're just going to return it to sender then.

So yeah, after that pretty poor experience, I'm done with it. I'd like my money back since you can't seem to actually get a preordered book to me until at least a couple of weeks after the release date.

Cheers.


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Steven "Troll" O'Neal wrote:
Colette Brunel wrote:
An operative weapon melee solarian with Strength 10 deals an absolutely pathetic amount of damage: 1d4+1 with each hit at 1st- and 2nd-level. That is terrible.
So? The class is a controller, not a dps machine.

Except they're not that either. Their control abilities are short range, vanishingly situational gimmicks that are going to let you down at least half the chances you get to use them anyway.


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JRutterbush wrote:
Throne wrote:
JRutterbush wrote:
Colette Brunel wrote:
Robbgobb wrote:
If not going to use either then why play a solarian?
I wanted to see how a solarian would fare at 1st level, which means no soldier (blitz) dip.
But that's not what you did. You ignored all of the Solarian's features. If you wanted to test how the Solarian fared, you would have actually built a character designed to use its class features. Even if you say you didn't use those features because they're bad, you still didn't actually test the Solarian, you tested a classless melee character. Of course that ended poorly. And it's true that going with more Charisma instead of Strength or Dexterity would also have ended poorly... but you can't claim that it would have, only that it might have... because you didn't actually test it.
...except 'not using the bad stuff on a class' is still seeing how that class fares.
No, it's not. You didn't use your class features and have them fail to be effective, you just assumed they would be ineffective and chose not to use them at all.

You don't need to use solar weapon to know it does less damage at less range than the alternative. Simple reading comprehension will do.

You don't need to use solar armour to know it gives less AC than the alternative. Simple reading comprehension will do.

And you don't need to use Blackhole or Supernova to know that you're going to go whole game sessions without the opportunity to use them coming up, when you've just gone a whole game session without the opportunity to use them coming up.

Your claim is mistaken at best, but more likely just outright disingenuous.


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GeneticDrift wrote:
Making me want to look into a Dex/chr based solarian. Guns and class abilities...

I'd considered it, but most of your abilities are either extremely short range, or explicitly melee only.

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