Battle Endless Waves of Undead in “Pathfinder: Gallowspire Survivors”

For a system touted as "the math is really solid and balanced", nobody seems to be eager to do a straight adaptation of Pathfinder 2e.

The funny thing about this is I feel like this was a missed opportunity for a Starfinder run-and-gun style game, where the gameplay might support the theme instead of....whatever this is.

For a system touted as "the math is really solid and balanced", nobody seems to be eager to do a straight adaptation of Pathfinder 2e.

The funny thing about this is I feel like this was a missed opportunity for a Starfinder run-and-gun style game, where the gameplay might support the theme instead of....whatever this is.

Yeeeeeeah. Not to rag on it but I am very interested in seeing if we get a PF2e CRPG at some point. Im gonna cross my fingers that it's being made.

Definitely gonna play the other game being made, survivor games aren't my thing but I hope others enjoy it!

Addendum: I don't want to suggest that branching out into the video game side of the pathfinder universe is unwelcome. I think there's more to do with the PF/SF settings than just CRPGs. There's fertile ground here for expansion.

Yeah as said, the AV arpg I can understand still, this one feels like "Why vampire survivor inspired game though?" Like yeah would be easier to buy in starfinder bullet hell game than pf :'D

Yeah as said, the AV arpg I can understand still, this one feels like "Why vampire survivor inspired game though?" Like yeah would be easier to buy in starfinder bullet hell game than pf :'D

My guess is that survivor games are a relatively low-cost genre to develop for. CRPGs and ARPGs seem, from my armchair software-engineer-but-not-a-video-game-developer position, a lot more complicated to develop than a survivor-like.

For a system touted as "the math is really solid and balanced", nobody seems to be eager to do a straight adaptation of Pathfinder 2e.

PF2e's system would make one of the worst video games ever

Well that sure is a spicy take.

Given how expensive and time-consuming an Owlcat-level CRPG is, and with all the massive updates we'll be getting with the Remastered books, I can definitely see how these two smaller games made by this smaller indie dev study were just never going to be that in this timeframe. That said, I get why others may have still hoped. Here's hoping sometime in the future we get a PF2e CRPG with the complete Remastered rules.

Either way, I really enjoyed Vampire Survivors, and hope this (presumably) cheap little game will be successful for the continued diversification of the Pathfinder brand to bring more people into Golarion.

Though for a true bullet hell, I do like Corvus' idea of a more Starfinder inspired one.

oh gods, they let create it. who said to Paizo, we need that kind of game? Abomination Vaults is interesting. but this? this is horrible. even farm-like game for Otari could be better.

Haven't played video games in a while, Can someone explain to me what this phrase means: "a roguelite bullet hell survivor game"?

Haven't played video games in a while, Can someone explain to me what this phrase means: "a roguelite bullet hell survivor game"?

There's a small indie game that was hugely successful called vampire survivors. That's what this new genre is based on.

Yeah, I'm not opposed to this kind of thing. Could be fun. (Although I'm extremely doubtful of Vampire Survivors' imitators. That was lightning in a bottle. A very affordable bottle everyone still has.) I can only see so many action games before I start pounding on the door for a proper PF2 cRPG.

Though for a true bullet hell, I do like Corvus' idea of a more Starfinder inspired one.

Well to be clear its Leon who mentioned the run & gun fitting starfinder better first

Haven't played video games in a while, Can someone explain to me what this phrase means: "a roguelite bullet hell survivor game"?

Have you maybe played Crimsonland back in the oughts? I think it's a similar genre.

I enjoy getting the occasional Survivors clone now 'n then. If this clocks in at-or-under ten bucks like most of them (and is comparably chill), I'll probably check it out. They're fun to play while listening to an audiobook or podcast.

Generally, the genre is a pretty straightforward game where your attacks fire on cooldown, your control is just movement for positioning, and you select from different attacks and power ups each level. If it involves a bunch of skillful dodging, it's a bullet hell instead. If you need to aim most things, it's a run-'n-gun instead. At least, that's my take on it.

Just to note that many Paizo employees were very excited for the announcement, and are big fans of these games.
NO video game ever is "needed".
They are made to entertain people, and no game is for everyone, and not everyone like all games. It's perfectly ok.
Also, usually companies will focus on making games they like playing, because yeah, they will make WAY better games.

If a studio makes games you don't personally like, don't expect that they would have made a game you like if they made a different game instead. And EVEN if they would have chosen YOUR personal favorite based purely on what they saw online as "demand", if their own preferences don't align, there's big chances you wouldn't have liked it anyway.

BTW, the lack of CRPG based on PF2 is probably caused by Owlcat Games making two behemots of Pathfinder games with Kingmaker and Wrath of teh Righteous. MANY players are burned out by those, as they have very long play time, and high difficulty. Releasing another CRPG would create too much confusion... and would enter into a very weird competition with Owlcat Games'. So it's easy to see this as a bad business decision IMHO.

Disclaimer: both their games are genres I don't like personally, and I could NEVER make these games. But I'm still happy for those that do, and will still be waiting for my Pathfinder point & click murder mystery, and/or sim dating.

I mean owlcat is working on a turn based wh40k crpg. Pretty sure that one's going to be good as well, I just want more Pathfinder. These crpgs come out every 4 years so it's not like you can burn out on them

Leon Aquilla wrote:

For a system touted as "the math is really solid and balanced", nobody seems to be eager to do a straight adaptation of Pathfinder 2e.

PF2e's system would make one of the worst video games ever

I'm really curious why you think that. I fail to see anything that would make pf2e a bad video game.

Given that Pathfinder is a TTRPG I don't think it should be any surprise that a lot of folks want more Pathfinder CRPGs - I'm one of them. That said, I don't blame Paizo a bit for looking to branch their brand out into other video game genres if the pitch is compelling enough! I'll admit up front that I don't know anything about marketing but wouldn't it raise brand awareness with folks who might find the setting cool and want to look into it more?

This particular type of game isn't my style so I'll be giving it a pass but I hope it - and the AV game which I *am* going to try - do well so we keep getting Pathfinder (and hopefully Starfinder) video games in general.

Zero the Nothing wrote:

Leon Aquilla wrote:

For a system touted as "the math is really solid and balanced", nobody seems to be eager to do a straight adaptation of Pathfinder 2e.

PF2e's system would make one of the worst video games ever

I'm really curious why you think that. I fail to see anything that would make pf2e a bad video game.

Is the difference between PF2 and 3.0/3.5 so stark as to deny the possibility of my true heart’s desire, a Pathfinder version of the original Neverwinter Nights/Shadows of Undrentide/Hordes of the Underdark or the 3.5 follow up NWN II and Mask of the Betrayer?

Not only did they have awesome graphics (fully 3d/spin/zoom and NOT bland isometric) and what appeared to be simulationist mechanics, they had fantastic toolsets and modding communities. Played many third party modules and used so many mod/hak.paks back in the day. Daring to dream.

Well, it's not my favorite genre (I've never played similar games at all and have no particular desire to start playing). So I'm just going to hope that we end up seeing another massive RPG set in the Pathfinder universe.

I would be happy even if it will be JRPG, no CRPG. Hmm... I even would be interested how Pathfinder can be set in JRPG restrictions

Is this the second announced game for this year? Does this mean there won't be PF2 cRPG (in the next two years)?

PF2e's system would make one of the worst video games ever

What a complete and utter nonsense. PF1 and 5e PC RPG games exist and work. PF2 is better than both of them, including as a base system for cRPGs.

NO video game ever is "needed".

I'm going to disagree. Papers, Please was absolutely needed.

Interesting surprise. Maybe it was a test run of the system?

"A roguelite bullet hell survivor game" – I don't have the slightest clue what that means, and I've peen playing computer games sice the late 1970s.

"A roguelite bullet hell survivor game" – I don't have the slightest clue what that means, and I've peen playing computer games sice the late 1970s.

"Roguelite" is basically name used for roguelikes that aren't actually "like rogue the ascii rpg game" but basically include same format of "You are expected to die and restart multiple times from beginning" with added caveat of "and a progression system so you unlock new things each playthrough"

Bullet hell is "there are lot of things that kill you in screen and you are meant to dodge them to survive"

Survivor I think is just referring to "you are trying to stay as alive as possible"

(all in all combination of three is just indie game called Vampire Survivor)

For those who don't know what to expect, the most famous game of this kind is the already mentioned Vampire Survivors. It's dirt cheap to try out on steam and even completely free on Android with no forced payment or ads whatsoever. (Might also be free on iPhone, but I don't use that and I'm too lazy too check).

It's simple but fun with quite a few nuances that aren't apparent during your first few runs.

Honest opinion if you didn't tell someone this game was associated with Pathfinder they would have no idea. This looks like a generic reskin of an existing game in an effort to cash in on its popularity. The characters and visuals are bland and the effects look anemic. The characters are named things like 'The Rogue' or 'The Wizard' if they'd at least used the iconics or something idk. This is another swing and a miss from BKOM for me.

I wouldn't call it "a generic reskin". It looks like they're mixing up the formula a bit, as good Survivor games do. It also looks like they're putting more effort into the graphics than most games of the type. I'l echo, though, that I'm just not seeing a lot of Pathfinder here. Like, if you took off the branding, changed the names "Tar-Baphon" and "Gallowspire" to something else, and otherwise published as-is, would we have any way of knowing it was supposed to be Golarion? Is there anything at all in the gameplay that ties into PF2 at any level beyond "generic fantasyland where you can fight undead sometimes"?

I mean, maybe there is. I hope there is. I'm just not seeing it currently based on what's here... and the fact that they picked the maximally generic trio of fighter/mage/rogue as their starter three isn't particularly encouraging on that point.

Oh... and I'm also curious as to whether we're going to see other characters than the starter 3. We'll see, I suppose.

Knowing the genre, if executed well it could be really good. Survivor games are about replay value and discovering combinations of abilities. Some of the hardest part of designing a rogue like is coming up with interesting effects that make sense from the "world."

PF2 offers a lot of that idea content already. Oh the Sudden Charge perk adds damage to the end of my dodge move? That makes sense and is PF2! Whats a good name for the Perk that lets the wizard stand still and increase the AoE of their abilities? Widen Spell! Etc.

Man, starfinder would've been such a better fit for this. Those dudes have never gotten a game, while this is the 4th(?) pf game.

Truly an unlucky one, though if it's cheap enough and you actually have to aim I'll get it, I guess.

Another one I'll probably never play, unless they come out with a Mac version. :-(

One of my TT buddies (GM for this campaign, gets easily annoyed) told us about this at our last session.
Me: So how does the game do dice rolls? Does it show history & modifiers?
GM: I don't think it does dice.
P2: Isn't it similar to that other survivors game that just throws enemies at you constantly?
GM: Yes. looks like a straight copy. I Don't know why Paizo would agree to it.
Me: Does it roll for hit on each enemy or just the spell/ability as a group roll?
GM: (slightly annoyed) I just told you I don't think it uses dice. Maybe a percentage chance
Me: You mean a D100?
GM: (more annoyed) Sure, whatever works for you.
P2: Then why is it a Pathfinder game? Wouldn't Starfinder fit with a bullet-hell system?
GM: (slightly aggravated) I don't know, I didn't make the game.
P2: Well, pass for me. Probably a cash-grab with a paper-thin story.
Me: Does each enemy roll for initiative?
GM: (definitely aggravated) THERE'S NO ****ING DICE ROLLS!
Me: But you just said there was a D100
GM: (walks away from the table to cool off)
P2: (Whispers) nice, now tell him we're converting our campaign to a bullet hell. At my signal, roll all the dice in your bag with me.

We laughed maniacally as we emptied the bags. P2 started counting up the rolls. I couldn't since I was crying laughing. The GM just sat there, shook his head (& smiled), muttered "I'm going to murder your characters". That will probably be the only & last time we mention this game in our group.

Removed a harassing post.

Removed a harassing post.

Sounds like a mischaractisation of the removed post. There are plenty of harassing posts on this forum that subtract from this being a safe place.. yet you remove a Rysky post?

Sadly my wait for my next Paizo PC game is still ongoing, not into this type of game either.

Hope other have fun but no thank you here, waiting again for 2 years or more :(

SIGH...

Tom

Hope it has multiplayer! This looks like it's gonna be a good chill game, don't know why it's getting so much hate though, its a video game for goodness sake.

Genre update: The industry has taken to either calling this type of game one of three things, no one of which SEEMS to have really taken full control of the wheel yet: Reverse Bullet-Hell | Bullet Heaven | Garlic-like