Shooting Toward a New Horizon

Ashanderai wrote:

In every playtest so far, the Wayne Reynolds art in the playtest PDF has always been the new iconic art for the class being playtested. It has been that way ever since the 1st edition of the game, if I recall correctly; it certainly has been for entirety of the second edition. Furthermore, Paizo has been on record saying that they always get Wayne Reynolds to do the initial concept art every time they create a new iconic. So, I believe the art for the gunslinger and the inventor in the playtest PDF is the early draft of the final art that will be in the final print of Guns & Gears for those classes. The art in the blog post here is not the art for the new iconics.

Correct! The dwarven lady with the cannon on her shoulder and the half-orc man with the prosthetic arm and trusty gobbot are the new iconics.

Aww man, was hoping orc pregen xD Ah well good to have that half orc rep core book folks never had :D

Michael Sayre wrote:

Ashanderai wrote:

In every playtest so far, the Wayne Reynolds art in the playtest PDF has always been the new iconic art for the class being playtested. It has been that way ever since the 1st edition of the game, if I recall correctly; it certainly has been for entirety of the second edition. Furthermore, Paizo has been on record saying that they always get Wayne Reynolds to do the initial concept art every time they create a new iconic. So, I believe the art for the gunslinger and the inventor in the playtest PDF is the early draft of the final art that will be in the final print of Guns & Gears for those classes. The art in the blog post here is not the art for the new iconics.

Correct! The dwarven lady with the cannon on her shoulder and the half-orc man with the prosthetic arm and trusty gobbot are the new iconics.

Aww man, was hoping orc pregen xD Ah well good to have that half orc rep core book folks never had :D

You mean an orc iconic, yeah? We've got an orc pregen character for The Slithering. I forget her name, but I believe she's the investigator.

Yeah meant orc iconic

The chassis looks very similar to fighter with a few trades. Almost seems like it could have been a "class archetype" as mentioned early on (those seem to have been ditched or were misunderstood from the start)

But it will be an archetype: all new classes include a multiclass archetype. As a GM, if you don't want to include gunslingers as a class you can tell your players, "Nope, they're Uncommon." However, if the multiclass archetype provides less of the game options you have issues with, you can also say, "But I will allow you to use them as an archetype [but only as a fighter, or only with crossbows, or whatever]."

It opens up options for both players and GMs. I'm really looking forward to this book! Additionally, I'm hoping for more material related to both the Impossible Lands and the Broken Lands.

Apologize if I missed this, but what are the monsters in the image? The one coming up behind the two PCs looks very 40K Eldar to me.

Apologize if I missed this, but what are the monsters in the image? The one coming up behind the two PCs looks very 40K Eldar to me.

They are Clockwork Automaton. They were in PF1, and they are coming in Bestiary 3 for PF2!

Admaletz wrote:

Apologize if I missed this, but what are the monsters in the image? The one coming up behind the two PCs looks very 40K Eldar to me.

They are Clockwork Automaton. They were in PF1, and they are coming in Bestiary 3 for PF2!

(And they will become a playable ancestry in the Guns & Gears book)
Also, this picture comes from the Lost Omen World Guide book, one of the first second edition book!

Thank you! Much appreciated

Any word on whether Androids will make an appearance in this book? I certainly hope Clockwork Automatons are not taking their place entirely in Golarion. I think there's certainly room for both aesthetics to have their place, and there's plenty of room to differentiate, at least in my eyes.

Any word on whether Androids will make an appearance in this book? I certainly hope Clockwork Automatons are not taking their place entirely in Golarion. I think there's certainly room for both aesthetics to have their place, and there's plenty of room to differentiate, at least in my eyes.

This seems like it's intended to be more of a Mana Wastes book; I'm sure any book that approaches Numerian content would have an Android entry.

Any word on whether Androids will make an appearance in this book? I certainly hope Clockwork Automatons are not taking their place entirely in Golarion. I think there's certainly room for both aesthetics to have their place, and there's plenty of room to differentiate, at least in my eyes.

I mean, Androids are already appearing in the Lost Omens Ancestry Guide, which comes out next month. It might be a little too early to expand on them since they would've just come up within 6 months of G&G.

The book will be very "Clockwork-punk". Advanced technology like laser pistols and more info on Androids might come in a future "advanced technology" book.

And as said above, Androids are already planned for Lost Omen Ancestry guide that releases in a month.

It's probably a good idea to introduce the Gunslinger class in a different book than the one that will provide guns that really unbalance the gunslinger (e.g. "this blue star plasma pistol needs to be reloaded every 100 shots".)

It's probably a good idea to introduce the Gunslinger class in a different book than the one that will provide guns that really unbalance the gunslinger (e.g. "this blue star plasma pistol needs to be reloaded every 100 shots".)

I don't think they will be in the firearm group though, they are more "energy weapons" or something like that.

Don't forget that, if we do get high-tech weapons with high magazine capacities and so on, they can also be higher-level items, with matching higher-level price tags.

Just because we've only seen a mundane weapon go up to level 4 so far, doesn't mean that nonmagical weapons are stuck at those ranges.

Energy weapons and higher levels of tech feel like more the realm of a Technologist/Technomancer route. I imagine a future book covering the the Broken Lands and Mueria would include one or both as Archetypes, which would be a lot of fun.

So... um...

What happened on Golarion to make Repeating Crossbows cease to exist in PF2? They were in PF1, albeit as an Exotic Weapon -- which firearms tended to be treated as.

Asking for a friend...

So... um...

What happened on Golarion to make Repeating Crossbows cease to exist in PF2? They were in PF1, albeit as an Exotic Weapon -- which firearms tended to be treated as.

Asking for a friend...

The same thing that made Witches cease to exist before the APG and guns cease to exist before G&G and Kitsune cease to exist prior to the LOAG.

That is to say "just no rules for them yet."

Wei Ji the Learner wrote:

So... um...

What happened on Golarion to make Repeating Crossbows cease to exist in PF2? They were in PF1, albeit as an Exotic Weapon -- which firearms tended to be treated as.

Asking for a friend...

The same thing that made Witches cease to exist before the APG and guns cease to exist before G&G and Kitsune cease to exist prior to the LOAG.

That is to say "just no rules for them yet."

Maybe it's just silly thinking but something like that when crossbows are an alternative for Gunslinger might be something to consider? Especially with an Inventor Class that can create alternate weapons?

*shrugs*

PossibleCabbage wrote:

Wei Ji the Learner wrote:

So... um...

What happened on Golarion to make Repeating Crossbows cease to exist in PF2? They were in PF1, albeit as an Exotic Weapon -- which firearms tended to be treated as.

Asking for a friend...

The same thing that made Witches cease to exist before the APG and guns cease to exist before G&G and Kitsune cease to exist prior to the LOAG.

That is to say "just no rules for them yet."

Maybe it's just silly thinking but something like that when crossbows are an alternative for Gunslinger might be something to consider? Especially with an Inventor Class that can create alternate weapons?

*shrugs*

Well, there is that entire book that we don't know the contents of. But I'm sure you knew that.

Its a question worth holding onto and bringing up during their panels for Paizocon and gencon.

Yeah. Repeating crossbows could already be slated for the book, but we don't know because their mechanic is predictable enough that it doesn't require playtesting.

My spitball prediction is that there will be a Magazine trait added to some weapons that have multiple barrels/shots before needing to reload, and repeating crossbows will fill that mechanical, her-her, niche.

So... um...

What happened on Golarion to make Repeating Crossbows cease to exist in PF2? They were in PF1, albeit as an Exotic Weapon -- which firearms tended to be treated as.

Asking for a friend...

+1 action loading time (◆◆ or ◆◆◆) plus Advanced Weapon?

The playtest is really about testing guns' issues, which of course do include Reload. I am pretty sure that what the devs will learn through the playtest surveys will be used to improve the Reload rules with the proper (Rarity / simplicity / stats / traits) mix for all the weapons concerned.

Generally (after the original PF2 playtest) they have asked us only to playtest classes. Classes have complex interactions in a way that "a piece of gear" does not.

Like the Investigator playtest had "proficiency with the sword cane" but the sword cane was not forthcoming until the actual book was printed.

Presumably since the gunslinger is the "reload weapons class" Guns & Gears will have some new crossbows in it, but the only reason we got the gun rules here is "they are probably necessary to playtesting the class" (and also things kind of went off the rails in PF1 with the gun rules, so it doesn't hurt to be thorough).

Also they need to understand thoroughly how people expect firearms to be different from crossbows.

Crossbows shoot pointy things. Firearms don't. :-)

Crossbows shoot pointy things. Firearms don't. :-)

No one's stopping you from filling your blunderbuss with caltrops or forks or w/e.

Lol.

Ed Reppert wrote:

Crossbows shoot pointy things. Firearms don't. :-)

No one's stopping you from filling your blunderbuss with caltrops or forks or w/e.

As presented, a blunderbuss can't do that. Now a hand cannon you can do that though. ;)

I hope that gets fixed just on the off chance that I get to use a blunderbus in a mansion while fighting werewolves. Pack all the fancy silverware in and let fly!

Interview: Pathfinder Guns & Gears Breakdown with Paizo's Mark Seifter and Micheal Sayre - Know Direction 241

"Mark "The Inventor" Seifter and "Gunslinger" Micheal Sayre, the designers of the Pathfinder Guns & Gears classes currently in playtest, join Ryan and Perram to talk about the inspirations and intent for Pathfinder 2e's first uncommon classes."

https://youtu.be/ibog3h6r5w8

Interview: Pathfinder Guns & Gears Breakdown with Paizo's Mark Seifter and Micheal Sayre - Know Direction 241

"Mark "The Inventor" Seifter and "Gunslinger" Micheal Sayre, the designers of the Pathfinder Guns & Gears classes currently in playtest, join Ryan and Perram to talk about the inspirations and intent for Pathfinder 2e's first uncommon classes."

https://youtu.be/ibog3h6r5w8

I watched this video, lots of good stuff, its always nice to hear from the design team how they think about the designs they put out there. Mark is always great, but I really love Michael Sayre's explanations in this one, in terms of design direction and such.