Fuzzy Feet and Voles to Meet

Friday, April 13, 2018

Overlooked and disrespected, halflings and gnomes get by in their own way. Human society's misguided expectations don't mean much when you know who you are and what you're about. Let's take a look at the ancestry entries for these folks!

You might also want to take a gander at the Big Beards and Pointy Ears blog to see how dwarves and elves work if you're a fan of ancestries that are entirely too tall and entirely too stuffy.

Illustration by Wayne Reynolds

Halflings

Living among taller folk gives halflings a good bit of perspective and plenty of opportunities to make new friends—plenty of opportunities of all kinds, really. Keep your eyes open and your heart brave, and you can accomplish anything!

Both halflings and gnomes get 8 Hit Points from their respective ancestries, are Small, and have a speed of 20 feet. A halfling speaks Common and Halfling. Halflings have nimble fingers, giving them an ability boost to Dexterity, and are jovial, getting another ability boost in Charisma. They also get one free ability boost to put in any score. Now, there's nothing wrong with how you're made, but halflings do get an ability flaw to Strength. Seems like a better deal, though. Goblins are a bit stronger, but they're not so wise, and good sense is a good trade. (You can read more about goblins here!)

We've mentioned ability boosts and flaws a few times now, so let's go into more detail about how those work! At 1st level, your ability scores all start at 10. Your ancestry then gives you ability boosts, each of which increases the score by 2. Most ancestries get three ability boosts, two of which have to go into specific scores. The remaining free ability boost can go into any score except the two set ones. Most ancestries also get a flaw, which decreases a designated score by 2. You can put your free ability boost in the same score as your flaw if you want to get back to 10. In later parts of character creation, you'll get more ability boosts, which we'll cover in later blogs! (And if you want to roll your ability scores randomly, we have an option for that in the playtest so you can see how that might work, though we prefer for characters used in the playtest to be generated in the standard way.)

Now, where was I? Halflings, right!

At 1st level and as they level up, halflings can pick up halfling ancestry feats that take advantage of their size, their gumption, and their fabled luck. Distracting Shadows lets them sneak around by using larger creatures as cover. They might also pick up Plucky to overcome fear and other detriments to their emotions. They can take Titan Slinger to get a bonus to damage when using their slings against Large or larger creatures. This bonus increases on critical hits, even before being doubled! Additionally, the sling is now a more formidable weapon than in Pathfinder First Edition—we've both increased its damage and done away with the difference in damage die size between Small and Medium creatures. A halfling with a sling can be pretty dangerous!

One feat we know will be popular is Lucky Halfling, which lets you reroll one skill check or saving throw you fail or critically fail once each day. Rules in the Pathfinder Playtest Rulebook list traits that apply to feats, often indicating special rules. This one has the fortune trait, which appears on all sorts of things that involve rerolls and manipulating dice in your favor. You can benefit from fortune only once on a given roll, and misfortune can cancel it out.

As mentioned in the blog post about dwarves and elves, ancestry entries suggest some backgrounds you might choose that are common for those of your ancestry. Halflings are often entertainers, acrobats, or street urchins. Many come from hard lives as criminals or laborers.

Illustration by Wayne Reynolds

Gnomes

What's THAT?!

A gnome's life is a constant barrage of the curious, the compelling, the cacophonous, the colorful, and the chaotic. There's always something new to discover. There... kind of has to be. See, gnomes who don't take in enough novel experiences are stricken by the Bleaching—their colorful hair turns white as their minds fall into despair. So let's not do that. Let's explore!

Now, when you're exploring, it's good to be durable because who knows what you might encounter. It helps that gnomes are tough and charming, with ability boosts to Constitution and Charisma, plus their one free ability boost to any other score. Gnomes have a flaw in Strength. Who needs it? Magic's better. And alchemical bombs. Those look fun. Gnomes can speak Common, Gnome, and Sylvan, but might want to study up on some other languages too. They can also see in low light—all the better for exploring into the dusk.

Gnomes came from the First World, the realm of the fey, long ago. Their ancestry feats can reflect this, like Fey Fellowship, which makes a gnome more charismatic when dealing with fey, or First World Magic, which gives the gnome a cantrip spell chosen from a wide number of options (including dancing lights, prestidigitation, and tanglefoot, to name a few).

Discerning Smell lets a gnome truly appreciate peculiar food and drink, or sniff out that invisible orc who's caked in the clay from a particular mountain pass, hasn't bathed in roughly 8 years, and recently ate a live bird. (A swallow, fittingly.) And, of course, you can choose Animal Speaker so you can talk to all your favorite burrowing animals!

A gnome's younger years will no doubt be weird, so they could have any kind of background—even a path they abandoned early on. A gnome might be an entertainer, a merchant, a nomad, an animal whisperer, a barkeep, or a farmhand.

How do these two ancestries stack up? (About 6 feet high, I'd say.) What sort of halfling or gnome characters do you look forward to playing?

Logan Bonner
Designer

More Paizo Blog.
Tags: Pathfinder Playtest Wayne Reynolds
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Liberty's Edge

2 people marked this as a favorite.
Cthulhudrew wrote:
I can't say I'm a big fan of the new stat allotment system. Everyone starting at a base 10 and each stat boost is a +2 sounds like it is going to make for some very cookie cutter ability scores. Also, since everything is a +2 stat, why not just go with single increments (+1 stat = +1 modifier)?

I mean, things were pretty cookie-cutter with point buy as well, since people tend to create the same stats, and just put them in different places. At least in my experience, "16, 14, 14, 12, 10, 8" is near ubiquitous in all the 20 point games I've been in.

Grand Archive

Pathfinder Pathfinder Accessories Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber
Mbertorch wrote:

Also, another point. And I feel like I'm not going to convey what I'm trying to well enough, but here goes.

The inherent ability scores act as a guideline of sorts, if you will, as to how to roleplay the races, ESPECIALLY for new players and players whose strengths in the game are other than roleplaying. For example, if you play a Dwarf, you're a bit gruff, but sensible. Or, you're a reckless but pleasant Dwarf, and therefore an exceptional one.

So, having all small ancestries have a Charisma bonus guides these types of players to play these ancestries in somewhat of a similar vein. One is not obligated to do so, by any means, but many people look for assistance in their creativity, and ability scores have an impact here, and not just in mechanics.

This is just another reason why I think Halflings should get a Wisdom bonus instead of Charisma. It emphasizes them as a sensible people, which fits with the lore of Golarion, the post this thread is built upon, and, I think, how many people end up roleplaying them.

Another point. Many people are not fond of how reckless and curious and zany the Gnomes are. And since Halflings are currently also Charismatic and share some of those qualities, I think Gnomes are roleplayed as being incredibly so, since they have to me more so than Halflings, right? Well, make Halflings sensible and Wisdom-oriented, and then Gnomes just have to be Charismatic and zany, not MORE Charismatic and MORE zany. Which may help them be accepted at some tables. Maybe.

Anyway, I know this was long, but I wanted to give conveying it to everyone a shot. Thanks!

I understood you. And I agree. I don't think it's maybe as important as you make it, but yeah, it IS a factor. And I really think the WIS for Halfling could help.


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Vidmaster7 wrote:
So I think we would never see a 11, 13 or 15 again seems weird.

If that means I never see another feat with an odd stat requirement again, it'd be worth it. ;)


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graystone wrote:
Vidmaster7 wrote:
So I think we would never see a 11, 13 or 15 again seems weird.
If that means I never see another feat with an odd stat requirement again, it'd be worth it. ;)

So Sez we all!


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Vidmaster7 wrote:
Yeah I think the all +2 think is kind of odd... or rather not odd enough! (You know odd numbers) the only place I can think of it coming in is when you are bumping a stat over 16 and it only goes up 1 if they are keeping that fact from star finder. So I think we would never see a 11, 13 or 15 again seems weird. I kind of wonder if their is something else involved that we just haven't been privy to yet.

But is that a problem? I always hated that odd values are wasted. Getting a +1 in something (assuming you're starting with an even number) just means that later when you get a second +1 it can actually have an effect. The only direct effect of an odd score is for strength and carrying capacity. I'm hoping they don't keep the +1 for stats 16 or above thing.

But if we just have even numbers, it does raise the question why are we still using ability scores and not just using the bonuses? Although I'm fine with leaving them as a vestigial remnant for ease of transition for people. They would be unnecessary. But phasing out the dead odd numbers is a positive in my book.

Scarab Sages

Thread.


Doktor Weasel wrote:
Vidmaster7 wrote:
Yeah I think the all +2 think is kind of odd... or rather not odd enough! (You know odd numbers) the only place I can think of it coming in is when you are bumping a stat over 16 and it only goes up 1 if they are keeping that fact from star finder. So I think we would never see a 11, 13 or 15 again seems weird. I kind of wonder if their is something else involved that we just haven't been privy to yet.

But is that a problem? I always hated that odd values are wasted. Getting a +1 in something (assuming you're starting with an even number) just means that later when you get a second +1 it can actually have an effect. The only direct effect of an odd score is for strength and carrying capacity. I'm hoping they don't keep the +1 for stats 16 or above thing.

But if we just have even numbers, it does raise the question why are we still using ability scores and not just using the bonuses? Although I'm fine with leaving them as a vestigial remnant for ease of transition for people. They would be unnecessary. But phasing out the dead odd numbers is a positive in my book.

I don't know if it is a problem or not but IT is strange to think you just automatically skip numbers. It really does push for the peeps that want the stats M&M style. only thing then is you can't do the 1 point after 16 thing.


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Pathfinder Adventure Path, Rulebook Subscriber

So very tired of small races being Charismatic. I follow that it comes from 3rd edition ripping apart the Gnomish race that we were presented with in 2nd Edition, but I wish that Paizo had done something better in the first edition of Pathfinder, or corrected it in the 2nd edition.
Gnomes used to be Int boost and Wisdom neg or Wisdom boost and Int neg depending on the type of Gnome that they were.
Goblins Charisma bonus is similarly horrible.

Silver Crusade

2 people marked this as a favorite.

Ancestry Feat spread confirmed in Jason's Game Informer interview:

Jason wrote:
You get one at first level, another at fifth level, and so on.

Also:

Jason wrote:

So, if you want to say, “I was an elf, but I was raised among dwarves,” what does that mean? We’re building ways in the game for you to make these distinctions and possibly pick up some dwarf feats. We’re still trying to figure out how this will work during the playtest, but I think we’ve got a solution, so bear with us. It might take us a bit to get right. But you can have a character that crosses those lines that makes sense, which is fun and exciting. It’s the story of your character. The rules are opened up in a way that lets us tell even bigger stories.

What we’re trying to figure out is how to make that work mechanically without the player just picking whatever they want. We’re still playing around with that and I think we might have something that will go into the playtest, but we’re still teasing that out right now. That’s ultimately the goal. What I’d love to be able to do is to have a system in which you can say "I was an elf raised by dwarves and there are certain elven feats that I can take because they’re genetic. This is a thing that elves have based on being elves." But then there are other things that are cultural. For example, dwarves have a training and fighting against giants. There’s nothing genetic about that really; it’s more of a cultural thing. There’s nothing physiological that allows them to fight giants. It’s about the training regimen that they have that allows them to fight them after centuries of perfecting that. It kind of makes sense that you might be able to pick that up if you’re not a dwarf, but there are other things that don’t make as much sense. For example, elves have magic running through their blood, but it wouldn’t make sense for a human to pick up that ability because they don’t have magic running through their blood.

We’re trying to tease apart which parts of the ancestries we can keep exclusive to that ancestry against the ones that background and choices can dictate. That’s kind of where we’re heading. You might make a choice to say how you were raised in order to access certain things.

Shadow Lodge

Barator wrote:

So very tired of small races being Charismatic. I follow that it comes from 3rd edition ripping apart the Gnomish race that we were presented with in 2nd Edition, but I wish that Paizo had done something better in the first edition of Pathfinder, or corrected it in the 2nd edition.

Gnomes used to be Int boost and Wisdom neg or Wisdom boost and Int neg depending on the type of Gnome that they were.
Goblins Charisma bonus is similarly horrible.

Pathfinder gnomes by definition are 3.5 gnomes, due to their desire for backwards compatibility. Golarion gnomes (fey heritage) are completely different from D&D 2nd edition gnomes (underground heritage).


I love that you don't have to give up other feats to gain Ancestry ones. Hands down one of my favorite parts of all we've heard thus far. This has long been a dream of mine for this kind of game, because I am all about embracing the fantasy of being this, well, fantasy hero who comes from (often) a nonhuman ancestry.


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Joe M. wrote:

Ancestry Feat spread confirmed in Jason's Game Informer interview:

Jason wrote:
You get one at first level, another at fifth level, and so on.

I'm not happy, Bob. :P

I get that the ancestry feats look like they're going to be better than things like +1 to saves vs. fear, or whatever, but a single ancestry feat's difference between, for instance, halflings and goblins at first level seems like the races ancestries don't have a lot of flavor on their own.


5 people marked this as a favorite.
Joana wrote:
Joe M. wrote:

Ancestry Feat spread confirmed in Jason's Game Informer interview:

Jason wrote:
You get one at first level, another at fifth level, and so on.

I'm not happy, Bob. :P

I get that the ancestry feats look like they're going to be better than things like +1 to saves vs. fear, or whatever, but a single ancestry feat's difference between, for instance, halflings and goblins at first level seems like the races ancestries don't have a lot of flavor on their own.

Agreed. 5 Ancestry Feats in 20 level (1/5/9/13/17). That means even if you go 1-20 you quite literally cannot play the same Dwarf (in mechanical benefits) that you could play in PF1 from level 1. And that's just if you try to emulate the old Racial Traits. God forbid if you want to do something else.

It's really bad, to be honest. And yeah, it makes all the Small races even sameier at level 1, which is not something you want.

Liberty's Edge

1 person marked this as a favorite.

On the bright side, this is a playtest, and 'Give everyone one or two more Ancestry Feats at 1st level' is both super easy to do mechanically for the folks at Paizo and something people seem to be in rough agreement on.

So it's an issue, but not a hugely difficult one to fix if people really do all want it (and I, for one, certainly do).

Silver Crusade

Yeah, I definitely see the concern, but this feels like exactly the sort of thing the playtest is for. So I'm trying to be less "not happy Bob" and more, "this might not look great from what we're seeing, flagging as area of concern for playtesting once we get our hands on the full playest rules." That's what the playtest is for!

Semi-related, Jason tweeted recently:

Jason wrote:
We have reached that point where there are still things we want to change and iterate, but there simply is not enough time.

Sovereign Court

Pathfinder Starfinder Society Subscriber

Dwarves were packed to the gills in PF1. I'm not sure one character could meaningfully use all the random things they got in a campaign.

I'm interested in a more moderate benchmark, such as elves. I think another Ancestry Feat at level 1 is just what is needed for them to hit the spot.

Liberty's Edge

KingOfAnything wrote:

Dwarves were packed to the gills in PF1. I'm not sure one character could meaningfully use all the random things they got in a campaign.

I'm interested in a more moderate benchmark, such as elves. I think another Ancestry Feat at level 1 is just what is needed for them to hit the spot.

Yeah, this seems like a solid option.


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KingOfAnything wrote:

Dwarves were packed to the gills in PF1. I'm not sure one character could meaningfully use all the random things they got in a campaign.

I'm interested in a more moderate benchmark, such as elves. I think another Ancestry Feat at level 1 is just what is needed for them to hit the spot.

I mean, it depends on how you define meaningful, but a dwarf going through say Rise of the Runelords will see all his default Racial Traits be used more than once.

Also, you'd need far more than 1 extra. Probably 3. Even with 2 Ancestry Feats at level 1 you're playing catch up with a PF1 race for a lot of your adventuring career.

I mean, if you told me Ancestry Feats were these incredible, game changing things, I might accept it. But they aren't. A lot of them are literally just rehashes of old Racial Traits, and the rest of the new ones are just as situational (or worse).

And even then it doesn't address that you're mechanically playing a proto-elf for a lot fo your levels, when compared to PF1.

Liberty's Edge

1 person marked this as a favorite.
TheFinish wrote:
I mean, it depends on how you define meaningful, but a dwarf going through say Rise of the Runelords will see all his default Racial Traits be used more than once.

True enough, but they mostly wouldn'ty make a huge difference being a +1 or +2 here and there.

TheFinish wrote:
Also, you'd need far more than 1 extra. Probably 3. Even with 2 Ancestry Feats at level 1 you're playing catch up with a PF1 race for a lot of your adventuring career.

Eh. With two at 1st you can have three at 5th, and that's as many as most characters of a specific Race actually makes use of (an Elven Warrior can have enhanced senses, weapon training, and elven immunities by then, for example...he's missing Elven Magic, but he'd never have used that anyway).

Still, two extra would also work. Three is almost certainly overkill.

TheFinish wrote:
I mean, if you told me Ancestry Feats were these incredible, game changing things, I might accept it. But they aren't. A lot of them are literally just rehashes of old Racial Traits, and the rest of the new ones are just as situational (or worse).

We actually don't know this at all. We know they cover the same thematic ground, but not how powerful they are within that area. For all we know the Dwarf bonus vs. orcs in this edition is +5 to hit and +5 AC and utterly overwhelming (this specifically seems unlikely, but you get the idea).

TheFinish wrote:
And even then it doesn't address that you're mechanically playing a proto-elf for a lot fo your levels, when compared to PF1.

This is definitely a potential issue and one reason I advocate starting with two or three Ancestry Feats.


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Just one Ancestry feat at 1st level (or two if you can take one with a regular feat) seems awfully skimpy, and four levels is an awfully long time to wait for the next one.


2 people marked this as a favorite.
TheFinish wrote:
Joana wrote:
Joe M. wrote:

Ancestry Feat spread confirmed in Jason's Game Informer interview:

Jason wrote:
You get one at first level, another at fifth level, and so on.

I'm not happy, Bob. :P

I get that the ancestry feats look like they're going to be better than things like +1 to saves vs. fear, or whatever, but a single ancestry feat's difference between, for instance, halflings and goblins at first level seems like the races ancestries don't have a lot of flavor on their own.

Agreed. 5 Ancestry Feats in 20 level (1/5/9/13/17). That means even if you go 1-20 you quite literally cannot play the same Dwarf (in mechanical benefits) that you could play in PF1 from level 1. And that's just if you try to emulate the old Racial Traits. God forbid if you want to do something else.

It's really bad, to be honest. And yeah, it makes all the Small races even sameier at level 1, which is not something you want.

And here's yet ANOTHER reason it's important for all the small ancestries to not start with Charisma bonuses.

Wisdom Halflings to the rescue?

(I will not stop supporting this concept.)

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