Announcing the Starfinder Roleplaying Game!

I am really excited by this. Not only do I love the idea I can dust of my Dragonstar books and run that campaign setting again. :)

This announcement gets my game designer brain grinding so well... I'veoften tried to explain how Paizo or any company almost NEEDS to choose a setting for sci-fi/sci-fantasy because there are fundemental differences between say Star Wars, Star Trek, Stargate, Battlestar Galactica, etc. that decide more than just the fluff but especially the hard mechanics. I look forward to Paizo's "solutions" to it all :)

Is this exactly the same game mechanics as the Pathfinder (3.5 ed) system, or will there be changes? I've really been hoping that Paizo/Pathfinder would eventually release a simplified and streamlined version of Pathfinder similar to 5e. While sometimes I do find 5e a little too simple, the game just runs so smoothly and quickly... even at high levels!

Is this exactly the same game mechanics as the Pathfinder (3.5 ed) system, or will there be changes? I've really been hoping that Paizo/Pathfinder would eventually release a simplified and streamlined version of Pathfinder similar to 5e. While sometimes I do find 5e a little too simple, the game just runs so smoothly and quickly... even at high levels!

It is intended to be the same system.

James Sutter covered the question of Starfinder being "the same system" as Pathfinder in the panel we had today, and that's not quite what we mean when we say it'll be backward compatible. We intend for you to be able to use Pathfinder material, especially monsters, with Starfinder. That should require very little work, though that doesn't mean the game are identical.
After that our #1 goal is produce a complete RPG that produces a fun and satisfying science-fantasy experience and is the best system for telling the kinds of stories we foresee people being most interested in for the Starfinder setting.
The systems will certainly be very similar, and knowing how to play Pathfinder will be a significant step up on knowing how to play Starfinder. But we will handle some things differently, so some amount of conversion effort may be needed to use Pathfinder material in Starfinder, or Starfinder material in Pathfinder. Since we're very early in the process of creating this game, we can't currently say the two games will be exactly 98% compatible, just that making the best game we can, and making it work with our existing game material, are both important considerations to us.
The Pathfinder core classes won't be the core Starfinder races, but we will give the rules you need to play them in Starfinder (and background material on what elves, dwarves, half-orcs and so on are doing in a campaign where their homeworld is gone). We won't represent all the pathfinder classes, because we're building classes designed to work best in the science-fantasy setting of Starfinder, which will best utilize the Starfinder game systems.
We can't say exactly how much work it'd take to play an elven paladin in Starfinder. We can say it'll be easy to create a character matching that iconic concept using Starfinder on its own.
I'm sure we'll discuss this more in the months ahead, but until we're further along in the process, details on how we're handling some of these questions aren't settle, so we really can't get into details. :)

You had me at anthropomorphic rats in space.

Yes, my overstuffed Skaven bits box will be getting some long-awaited release.

Mantic also do a race of sci-fi shipboard humanoid-rat scavengers, so there's no shortage of kitbashing options for your PCs and NPCs.

We intend for you to be able to use Pathfinder material, especially monsters, with Starfinder. That should require very little work, though that doesn't mean the game are identical.

That is certainly something to provide all GMs a sigh of relief.

After that our #1 goal is produce a complete RPG that produces a fun and satisfying science-fantasy experience and is the best system for telling the kinds of stories we foresee people being most interested in for the Starfinder setting.

This part is what I foresee being the main schism in the player base.

I seriously hope that Paizo take the latter path, since those who want to play 'wizards in space' already have all the tools they need.
(GM: "These are the roles for wizards, you all have necklaces of adaptation, you start the campaign in space. What do you do?"
Players: "We look for a tavern.")

Those of us most interested in this want to see genre-relevant adventures, not just a mysterious patron in the space-tavern, telling the PCs to go to a space-dungeon, where they'll find a space-room, with a space-orc, guarding a space-pie.

I seriously hope that Paizo take the latter path, since those who want to play 'wizards in space' already have all the tools they need.

What tools? I certainly know a lot more pure scifi than wizards in space games .-.

Also, wait, you don't think space bars and mysterious patrons who make you do shady stuff aren't part of any good space adventure? :D

Seriously though, I don't see why "space-fantasy" would mean "Same as regular pathfinder, but with word space added in front of everything". Like, that train of logic doesn't make sense to me.

Definitely something to look forward to.

So this sounds freaking amazing! The fact that it's backwards compatible with Pathfinder is just gravy. I do love a bit of SciFi with my fantasy!

James Sutter covered the question of Starfinder being "the same system" as Pathfinder in the panel we had today, and that's not quite what we mean when we say it'll be backward compatible. We intend for you to be able to use Pathfinder material, especially monsters, with Starfinder. That should require very little work, though that doesn't mean the game are identical.

<snip>

Based on this, it seems that the changes from Pathfinder to Starfinder will be more extensive than those from D&D v3.5 to Pathfinder. I think that's a good thing. It really doesn't take much to allow reasonable 'backwards compatibility'... I'd argue it is still fairly easy to convert most 1st edition materials to Pathfinder. Thus, the more that can be done to improve systems and customize them for the new setting the better.

Seriously though, I don't see why "space-fantasy" would mean "Same as regular pathfinder, but with word space added in front of everything". Like, that train of logic doesn't make sense to me.

We'll wait and see, but if the change from AD&D 1 to AD&D 2, or from AD&D2 to D&D3.0, or from D&D3.5 to PF is any indication, there'll be a sizeable portion of the player base screaming, because they can't play a direct clone of exactly the same PC they always play, described in exactly the same mechanics, running through exactly the same situations, relying on exactly the same methods, with exactly the same outcomes.

"Same as regular pathfinder, but with word space added in front of everything" is exactly what those people will be demanding. But they need to be resisted, for the good of the new game, and its ability to tell the kinds of stories that need to be told.

The tools already exist, if their group wants to find out "What would happen if a wizard, a cleric, a barbarian and a ninja were transplanted to Arrakis?". Or Barsoom. Or Cardassia. Or Manhattan in 2016.
It's as easy as the GM saying "You wake up on Arrakis". Or Barsoom. Or Cardassia. Or Manhattan in 2016.

And the ruleset for that already exists. It's called 'Pathfinder'.

Starfinder is our chance to clean house, consolidate all the redundant feats, traits and abilities that do the same thing (but worded differently and confusingly), clean up the wording of rules that have been argued for years, show examples that explain the explicit intent of the designers, round up 40 years of sacred cows, that still interfere with running certain plot types, throw them in the airlock and send them into the void.

Agreeing with the cow.

Starfinder is a stellar opportunity to streamline things. Owen's post brings me hope that Starfinder will support Serenity docking alongside the Phoenix and the Spelljammer, and characters who use nanotech healing kits looking askance at being healed by a cleric of Erastil.

Would it have been so hard to just give us a Distant Worlds hardcover book about the other planets instead of creating a whole new gaming system/world.

Would it have been so hard to just give us a Distant Worlds hardcover book about the other planets instead of creating a whole new gaming system/world.

One does not eliminate the other. In fact, expanding the cosmoverse in Starfinder and then revisiting its state in the current Golarion timeline sounds like a plan.

round up 40 years of sacred cows, that still interfere with running certain plot types, throw them in the airlock and send them into the void.

No way, nuke them from orbit, it's the only way to be sure.

After that our #1 goal is produce a complete RPG that produces a fun and satisfying science-fantasy experience and is the best system for telling the kinds of stories we foresee people being most interested in for the Starfinder setting.

While that sounds really good somehow, what kind of stories are those exactly? A lot of people go crazy about spelljammer and dragonstar here and i´m sorry to say, i find that a bit backward. Old game repetition Nr. 23525435 gets boring, neither do i think those science-fantasy.

I don't really see what all that has to do with making a science fiction game over a science fantasy game...

@Spacefinder Development Team: For my 2 cp, I'm really hoping all of the basic classes will have a good degree of narrative agency. XD That is, no class is just combat or just technology or whatever, but has a reasonable balance for the three realms of combat, social interaction, and exploration. Not every class needs to be balanced in the same way, obviously, but everyone should have an opportunity to somehow contribute to most encounters, regardless of type. That's my preference, anyway. ^^

Snorter wrote:

round up 40 years of sacred cows, that still interfere with running certain plot types, throw them in the airlock and send them into the void.

No way, nuke them from orbit, it's the only way to be sure.

Nuke seems inappropriate. Let's hit 'em with rods from god instead. Just to be on the safe side.

If it has the same "rules-mentality" that Pathfinder has - I won't be interested.

Owen K. C. Stephens wrote:

James Sutter covered the question of Starfinder being "the same system" as Pathfinder in the panel we had today, and that's not quite what we mean when we say it'll be backward compatible. We intend for you to be able to use Pathfinder material, especially monsters, with Starfinder. That should require very little work, though that doesn't mean the game are identical.

<snip>

Based on this, it seems that the changes from Pathfinder to Starfinder will be more extensive than those from D&D v3.5 to Pathfinder. I think that's a good thing. It really doesn't take much to allow reasonable 'backwards compatibility'... I'd argue it is still fairly easy to convert most 1st edition materials to Pathfinder. Thus, the more that can be done to improve systems and customize them for the new setting the better.

I am thinking that the new system will incorporate stuff needed to get space fantasy/science fiction to work, but probably won't change much of the underlying system of the game.

My thinking is that we will have largely the same system as current Pathfinder, but elements of the game will be tweaked to better support a more science fictional/space fantasy tone. Things like robust rules for space combat, the skill system, items, and of course classes and magic. I don't see much likelihood of major revisions to things like actions, or how characters are created, etc.

I think most gamers, when they hear compatible, are thinking 3.0/3.5 to Pathfinder. I certainly don't think most people would think 1E to Pathfinder.

I hope magic or spell casting classes don't get the shaft in this one. I can classes that choose to be spell casters be a more rare such as wizards and clerics. But classes that get magic through bloodlines, fate, or random weirdness such as sorcerers, oracles, and kineticist I can see being just as common as they were 1000+ years ago.

Awesome, now make Trailfinder and move the gunslinger to its own pocket universe.

I´m hoping for a healthy part of advanced high tech, perhaps along with magic.

So are we!

Magic is a force in Starfinder. Rituals and gods and magic swords didn't cease to exist. But they do now share stage time with plasma rifles, medpacks, and megacorporations, so they don't hold as prominent a place in the overall day-to-day life of folks.

I suspect most characters won't have a magic sword, because with powered armor and jetpacks and arc cannons, a magic sword just isn't as useful The design team is certainly mindful of what is needed, both logically and in the rules space, for advanced technology and magic to both be of note in this game.

And they are coming up with some cool as heck stuff!

How much of d20 Future and Star Wars d20 are OGL? There's a lot in them that I wouldn't mind seeing Paizofied.

Almost everything and exactly nothing, respectively.

Zaister wrote:

OMG. This can't come fast enough.

Some people will have to be extra careful of who they elect as President, or some of us won't be able to see/get this.

Huh?

I suspect most characters won't have a magic sword, because with powered armor and jetpacks and arc cannons, a magic sword just isn't as useful.

Now I am wondering if there will be a specific class focussed on magic swords and and making them more useful in a setting with common high-tech guns, kinda like and anti-Gunslinger.

_
glass.

Hayato Ken wrote:

I´m hoping for a healthy part of advanced high tech, perhaps along with magic.

So are we!

Magic is a force in Starfinder. Rituals and gods and magic swords didn't cease to exist. But they do now share stage time with plasma rifles, medpacks, and megacorporations, so they don't hold as prominent a place in the overall day-to-day life of folks.

I suspect most characters won't have a magic sword, because with powered armor and jetpacks and arc cannons, a magic sword just isn't as useful The design team is certainly mindful of what is needed, both logically and in the rules space, for advanced technology and magic to both be of note in this game.

And they are coming up with some cool as heck stuff!

Why is it always magic swords and tech-guns? Why can't we have it the other way around for a change?

"What's that you have there, my good man?" asks Slicer, the Ninja.
"Oh, that? That's a Fierach II plasma rifle! See this? First magazine chamber is for the tiny portal to the Elemental Plane of Fire - second one, slot it in right on top, make sure the luminifers touch, yeah, like that, second chamber's a tiny portal to the Elemental Plane of Water. C'mon, hold my beer, I'll show you what happens when you hold the trigger."

(egregious amounts of plasma fire later)

"An' what's that you have there, Slicer?"
"Oh, those are Vibro-chainsword-katana-chucks. Luna Titanium blade, nanopoison dispensers, smartmatter exothermic reactors, the whole works."

Is it time to quote Arthur C Clarke?

I think there should be advantages and disadvantages to having magic or tech based items. I can see magic items being rarer but the ones you do find should be good because there the ones that lasted this long.

I can see religion being less common and there by fewer clerics but the gods haven't gone any where so classes like oracles wouldn't be any more or less common.

I can see there being less wizards and alchemist since such practices would be very obscure. Though I can see there being just as many sorcerers or kineticist.

I don't see barbarians, paladins, inquisitors, cavaliers, samurai, warpriest, shamans, etc. being common. But I can see fighters, gunslingers, rogues, psychics, swashbucklers, rangers, etc. being common.

Also I hope to see a space pirate archetype for swashbucklers.

Honestly, I hope they don't go the route of magic = technology. It just feels like a cop out. I'd rather they be two separate forces that can be combined for interesting effects. What I don't want are lasers that are just wands of fireballs reskinned.

What about magic tech weapons?

Yeah magitech is cool by me.

James Sutter covered the question of Starfinder being "the same system" as Pathfinder in the panel we had today, and that's not quite what we mean when we say it'll be backward compatible. We intend for you to be able to use Pathfinder material, especially monsters, with Starfinder. That should require very little work, though that doesn't mean the game are identical.

I get it it's early days yet. The difficulty I see is that the moment I'm faced potentially playing another system, there's nothing keeping me from pulling out... say... Numenara.

It's sort of the same thing that I point out when people talk about a second edition for Pathfinder; if I wanted to play not-Pathfinder, there are already many, many systems to choose from.

So while I get it that obviously 100% equivalence doesn't make sense, the more not-Pathfinder Starfinder ends up, the less interest in it I'd have.

Also also, re-remembering or un-remembering things is relatively hard. It's easier to learn new feats, classes, or abilities than it is to learn changes to existing things. Heck, there are 3.5-isms that some of us still have to work hard at remembering changed.

So hey, feedback, hopefully useful.

Maybe because of certain events in the past that creating "magitech" weapons and other items is illegal or downright forbidden.

Just realized that StarFinder = SF = SciFi (or Sci-Fan) :-)

So, will we get a SFRD ?

I think the guy who does d20pfsrd.com is already on that, so... XD

I would rather see a new version of Pathfinder d20 Modern than a space Pathfinder. Or a whole new setting, not one with the same setting, even if it is set many years in the future. I like a science-fantasy game, and that's what I'm running now, but basing it in the same star system as the default Pathfinder system just doesn't interest me.

Snorter wrote:

round up 40 years of sacred cows, that still interfere with running certain plot types, throw them in the airlock and send them into the void.

No way, nuke them from orbit, it's the only way to be sure.

Airlock, then the nearest star... no need to waste nukes.

Hayato Ken wrote:

I´m hoping for a healthy part of advanced high tech, perhaps along with magic.

So are we!

Magic is a force in Starfinder. Rituals and gods and magic swords didn't cease to exist. But they do now share stage time with plasma rifles, medpacks, and megacorporations, so they don't hold as prominent a place in the overall day-to-day life of folks.

I suspect most characters won't have a magic sword, because with powered armor and jetpacks and arc cannons, a magic sword just isn't as useful The design team is certainly mindful of what is needed, both logically and in the rules space, for advanced technology and magic to both be of note in this game.

And they are coming up with some cool as heck stuff!

You mean I can't be the barbaric guy who tear the doors appart when the power is out? That plain old metal survival knives are things of the past? etc?

Looking forward to this, I actually like sci-fi mixed in with fantasy, Iron Gods was a great AP and I really enjoyed Expedition to the Barrier Peaks back in the day. This won't be Star Trek or Star Wars and I like that, I want to play their setting with their rules. I think they have a solid concept, everything I have seen seems to indicate it's going to be well done, and I can't wait for this to be released. I'm okay with letting the storytellers tell the story. And just a side note, not everyone cares about art, I for one could care less. Just give me the product already!

1) Holy merciful goodness.
2) My god, it's full of stars.
3) Will there be support for post-apocalypse settings? Clearly this won't be part of the main-stream Starfinder world, but I'd love to see some muties in there.

Maybe because of certain events in the past that creating "magitech" weapons and other items is illegal or downright forbidden.

That'd be pretty stupid. I'd definitely remove that setting detail (though there is a 90% chance I'll ignore the setting anyway I guess). I mean hell, you can already mix tech and magic in the golarion days.

Personally I'd prefer it all be magitech if I didn't think that golarion would just do the Eberron style of "Take tech from genre, cover in magic paint".

1) Holy merciful goodness.

2) My god, it's full of stars.
3) Will there be support for post-apocalypse settings? Clearly this won't be part of the main-stream Starfinder world, but I'd love to see some muties in there.

Want Mutants? Their called Orcs.

Is there s gold dragon from Hermea as CEO of a megacorporation.

Joe Wells wrote:

1) Holy merciful goodness.

2) My god, it's full of stars.
3) Will there be support for post-apocalypse settings? Clearly this won't be part of the main-stream Starfinder world, but I'd love to see some muties in there.

Want Mutants? Their called Orcs.

There are also Mana Waste Mutants, Ogrekin, just plain Mutants...

Honestly, I hope they don't go the route of magic = technology. It just feels like a cop out. I'd rather they be two separate forces that can be combined for interesting effects. What I don't want are lasers that are just wands of fireballs reskinned.

See, NOW that we have an actual sci-fi setting, they can officially use psionics and have it be the magic system du jour. ;)

Does it use a version of D20 modern or the basic Pathfinder rules?

Does it use a version of D20 modern or the basic Pathfinder rules?

they are modifying PF rules into an RPG system all its own as I understand it.

"What's that you have there, my good man?" asks Slicer, the Ninja.

"Oh, that? That's a Fierach II plasma rifle! See this? First magazine chamber is for the tiny portal to the Elemental Plane of Fire - second one, slot it in right on top, make sure the luminifers touch, yeah, like that, second chamber's a tiny portal to the Elemental Plane of Water. C'mon, hold my beer, I'll show you what happens when you hold the trigger."

{squints at possible suspect, pops holster's retention strap} That sounds suspiciously like a modified or cloned Lawgiver, citizen, and highly illegal. Care to explain yourself and produce the proper permits?