@Morgan: Drawing an arrow doesn't require a move action, its considered "not an action" per CRB pg 182. Secondly, you needed to take a -4 penalty to your missile attack against the Orc you shot at in Round 2 because it is engaged in melee with / threatens a friendly character. I don't think you hit anyway...
Thanks for clarification on the arrow-draw.
My bad. You're right, I should have included the -4 for melee. It doesn't look like it makes a difference, though.
@Morgan: You are able to edit the spreadsheet we are using for a map yourself. The changes will automatically be saved. I went ahead and moved you this turn.
Btw, I think you subjected yourself to an attack of opportunity from the orc you shot at. If you use a missile weapon when someone is threatening your space (as the orc in EZ40 is doing) they get an AoO against you.
Drawing my sword would have provoked an Attack of Opportunity. Moving through a threatened square would as well.
By taking the 5' step, then shooting, I only provoke one attack, and have a chance of taking out my attacker.
It seemed my best option.
I am posting from my phone, which is letting me see the spreadsheet, but not edit it for some reason.
FYI … I will be on the road to Canada tonight, and in Canada for the next four days. Should still have daily access, but won't be as frequent (and no phone access.)
Bot me if necessary … position for AOOs (I get 3), Heal as necessary
FYI … I will be on the road to Canada tonight, and in Canada for the next four days. Should still have daily access, but won't be as frequent (and no phone access.)
Bot me if necessary … position for AOOs (I get 3), Heal as necessary
I shudder to think how cold it might be in Canada given what has been happening in the comparatively balmy climes of the U.S. (I live in Ohio and it has been insanely cold recently). Good luck and try to stay warm.
Where in Canada?? I live in Saskatchewan..nice and warm here...-23 with windchill of -32!!
Being from Cincinnati Ohio, I am glad to live in Melbourne Florida. We are complaining that is in the high forties at night.
When I converted this I gimped the orcs (no falchions but clubs and +3 attacks vs +5). A group of six and a nearby group of four arriving round 3 seemed appropriate. I admit the dice roller has been cold.
It's looking rough, but not unwinnable.
What is your opinion/policy about us discussing tactics in this thread?
Some GMs are cool with it, and others frown on it because they believe it is tantamount to having a telepathic link between the characters.
I am totally cool with it.
Being old school, at the table top it was common. If you notice, I play the monsters smart. They will gang up rather than distribute their hits. The players are encouraged to do so too and communicate.
What we need is a good olde fashioned sleep spell to knock their numbers down...
Yeah...too smart...lol...I did not realize poor Grimm got left out and surrounded...stupid dwarven hatred :-)
If we can get our wizard a clear shot, he has color spray, which should thin the orc herd.
While a channel would get me and Grimm on our feet, it would help the orcs, too.
A bless spell would help even the odds against the unhelpful dice roller.
Well I think just me and you Morgan were outside the 'shieldwall' and with us down they should be able to get off a shot...just cast it over Elwitta's head...lol
Let's rally on Grimm. Mott should try to stabilize and heal him - maybe get him back into the fight. I'll try to push the orcs back.
I hesitate to even bring this up as we are in serious trouble already but should I be taking a -4 penalty when using my Telekinetic Fist (sort of a missile attack) when firing at Orcs engaged with a friendly PC? If so, I may have missed on the last TF used.
@Tribute: the Orc marked -4, does that mean he is at -4 HP or that he has taken 4 HP of damage thus far? I'm guessing it is the later option but I want to check before taking my Round 4 action.
So … my current hail mary plan here is ... if more of us go down, and I am not yet dead, Mott could pop a channel to stabilize everyone and hope to his god that they accept a surrender. Maybe we could continue as captives!
I have a plan that just might work.
Elwita move to FC41 and atk orc @ FD41
Rowan atks orc @ FB41 or if already down move perform coup de grace.
Eldarian move to FC42 and use your color spray, cone geets orcs @ FB41, FA40 and FA41
Mott move to FC40 and heal Grimm
Once Grimm is up Grimm and Mott go after Morgan, Rowan and ELwita head into cavern to right and finish those two orcs where rowan will have room to flank, Eldarian stays in cave mouth firing bow where needed.
If all else fails I think Mott should use a channel and lets start the fight over again, I am not up for surrender as I don't think any of us can communicate with them.
Can Elwitta move into the orc's space in FC41? I'm unclear on whether the orc is incapacitated, which I think would allow him to move into that space, or not. If Elwitta can do that, then I agree that Eldarian should move up and use Color Spray. I've been trying to do it for a while but this area is so darned cramped that I haven't been able to move into a useful position yet.
Btw, Eldarian can speak Orcish. I'm not sure how much good it will do as Orcs hate both Dwarves and Elves.
Yes, I think the FC41 orc is dead after its round of ferocity. Elwitta had planned to move into that square.
Not dead, but incapacitated like Grimm. I see no problem with people moving into squares of those incapacitated.
I tend not to care about how stable enemies after dropping below zero unless they are significant.
I just looked up ferocity (I'm new to Pathfinder so there are quite a few of the more obscure rules I have not seen before...) and found this:
Ferocity (Ex) A creature with ferocity remains conscious and can continue fighting even if its hit point total is below 0. The creature is still staggered and loses 1 hit point each round. A creature with ferocity still dies when its hit point total reaches a negative amount equal to its Constitution score.
This appears to be different than the "Orc Ferocity" racial trait which half-orcs possess. They only get to fight for one more round. The version listed for Orcs in the Monster Bestiary says they get to keep on fighting until they reach negative CON hp.
So, if Tribute is playing this RAW, then that Orc won't even truly die until his HP reach his negative CON score. That is a ridiculously powerful ability for 1 HD monster to possess. I think that will prevent Elwitta from moving into his square unless Elwitta actually hits him again and brings him to his negative CON score, at which point he will (finally) really be dead. Really.
I am giving them a single attack then falling unconscious just as at 0 hps.
An incapacitated character cannot deter someone from moving into a square anymore than a dead body. Here is where I apply rule zero, and rule you can move into squares of those at negative hit points that are not staggered (as these orcs when reaching negative hit points).
Well, thank goodness you are not using RAW because those guys would take forever to kill with that ferocity ability as presented in the Bestiary. That looks like a seriously broken mechanic.
Okay, people, things are seriously fubar'd now, so should I just go ahead and cast Color Spray at the remaining Orcs in front of me despite the fact that the effect will also require Elwitta to make a save vs. Will (he has a +0 Will save, btw)? All four of the Orcs would be in the area of effect, so I think it is worth it but I'll wait for input especially from Elwitta as it could leave him very vulnerable to attack if he fails his save.
I was about to say hitting us would be ok too ... unless they save and we don't ...
Go ahead and do it Eldarian. The four of them will probably drop Elwitta otherwise.
Given the incredible disparity in die rolls, things are looking grim. Rumors say the merchant is still alive. One option is to do a ransom situation.
I am also not averse to starting the trip again. Given it is pointless to make new characters unless you want to. Calling a mulligan and starting again is no problem. The roleplaying banter at the tavern can be handled with a quick intro post.
Or we end up captive ... Mot gives Eldarian time to run and maybe get help, Mot could also channel to stabilize everyone. We then try to escape. I'm open to either course of events.
Regardless of what is decided, one thing is clear: The armor comes off!
I honestly was only wearing it to simulate the feel of old Basic D&D elves as I had no intention of getting mixed up in melee.
Here are the options as I see them.
Mot and Eldarian escape, we roll new characters to avenge or rescue the fallen. I have always liked it when encounters were potentially lethal. And I have been in many groups where deaths lead to good campaign moments and makes surviving actually seem like an accomplishment.
We surrender and try to escape. Good role play potential.
We take a mulligan.
My old school bones make me think we should go for the first option. If we can rescue those that are currently down, each player could then decide whether to keep the new character or their old one. I know this will slow things down, but feels to me like the closest to what I would do at the table if running the game.
I like the idea of escaping myself. Plenty of chance to "revenge" ourselves on the creatures that took us captive! Remaking characters is ok too, but I am not too sure I want to restart...I really like Grimm!
Let's go with the Escape Plan.
I just remembered that my PC has a bonded object rather than a familiar. This will allow me to cast Color Spray again. If I don't fail my Arcane Spell failure check (again), we might still be able to resolve this without having to reboot/escape/surrender.
Should I go ahead and do this or does everyone just want to proceed with one of Rowan's proposed options anyway?
I say fire off another color spray, I like the idea of snatching victory from the jaws of defeat. Worst case, it delays our surrender for another couple rounds.
Mott, I think it would be best to let you do the Coup de Grace's on the three orcs. My damage potential is low enough that I might not actually kill them on one hit even with critical damage.
Well done Eldarian - that was close. Now drag us out to safety. We'll heal up and return to rescue Morgan.
How about this ... move to FC40 and channel ... try to get everyone into positives, hopefully including Morgan (then we'd have someone in their midst.) Just have to be careful not to heal any orcs. Could Channel twice, and then start the Coup De Graces ... how long will the orcs be down?
You do know many stabilized orcs litter the ground too. The orcs should be sleeping a while 12-48 seconds.
Thank god for the color spray!!!
I may be wrong, but a coup de grace does not require a damage roll. It assumes you are taking the 6 seconds in the round to make sure you are doing the job right.
I would say to make sure to dispatch the orcs and then we can worry about the healing.
Thank god for the color spray!!!
I may be wrong, but a coup de grace does not require a damage roll. It assumes you are taking the 6 seconds in the round to make sure you are doing the job right.
I would say to make sure to dispatch the orcs and then we can worry about the healing.
Yeah, too bad the first one fizzled because of my armor. You and Elwitta would still be up and about...sigh.
I agree that we should definitely finish off the orcs before healing.
Coup de Grace is no longer an auto-kill like it used to be, it merely is an auto hit and auto critical. If the person you attack survives the actual damage roll, he/she must make a Fortitude save vs a DC of (10+damage sustained) or die.
I suggested Mott do the honors because I only have a short bow which does (1d6)*3 while he has a long spear which does (1d8+2)*3. These orcs can sustain massive amounts of damage with the Ferocity trait and I'd like to see them eat dirt on the actual CDG and not have them revive for one last attack which might happen if I get some low rolls, which is pretty much guaranteed to happen given how our luck has gone thus far.
Mott, if you are using a long spear (and I think you are because you have been treating your spear as a reach weapon, correct?) then your critical damage is x3 not just x2.
I took the keep on the borderlands a while ago and made some organic sense about the setup. I have somewhat believed in making the placement of things make sense and what the Dragon magazine used to call the dungeon ecology.
Anyway, we are still in rounds as the orc that left dragging Morgan has a story to tell.
Well...poop.
If we have to face more Orcs we are pretty screwed as it's just the cleric and myself now.
If the cleric uses a channel now, before any of the orc females have been wounded, and the other orcs are nicely dead, most of the rest of the party could be on their feet again and fighting.
Poor Grimm...whatever did he do to deserve such treatment...lol
We have two not dead orcs ... if the wizard kills one more then we just have one I'll be helping ...
You could try to prestidigitate them into awe ...
I had completely forgotten about the Fortitude check to save vs. death if someone survives the damage delivered in a Coup de Grace. Thank goodness for that additional rule.