Most sadistic spell combo you can think of?


Advice

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named bullet has a rather short duration, the other two do not. ;)


My gm always ruled that if you cast blindness first then you wouldn't take the minus four for unnatural lust, so we would go with blindness + unnatural lust + the ugliest thing we could find with a pulse.


Staggering Fall and Hideous Laughter. If the enemy you are facing has a low will save, they are not getting back up for 1 rd/lvl thanks to staggering fall requiring a will save to break, and since it staggers an opponent, no breaking out of hideous laughter.


BjørnEarakson wrote:
My gm always ruled that if you cast blindness first then you wouldn't take the minus four for unnatural lust, so we would go with blindness + unnatural lust + the ugliest thing we could find with a pulse.

Uh...how do you know where to go for your lustfull object if you can't see it? It gives you strong feelings, not radar or a mystical sixth sense direction finder.


Maybe the critter goes stumbling around after what it last saw as the unspeakable desires blossomed within its breast? "I'm so randy right now I gotta have [ugly critter], my lusts make me blind!"


Possession + Blood Money

Ring of Invisibility + Mind blank + Secluded Grimoire. That wizard is going to have to prepare new spells at some point. When he does there is no save

If your not doing dazing: Fire Body + Maximized, Empowered, Intensified Fireball

Plane shift+ Create Demiplane Greater. Antimagic prison anyone?


If you're after sheer sadism then Passing Fancy can inflict severe social embarrassment. Add on another spell - Wizened/Youthful Appearance, Miserable Pity, whatever - and it could be crippling.

Though, "Never deal an enemy a little wound."


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Spectral Hand, Aboleth's Lung, in the desert.

This should function as Suffocate since the opponent can't breathe air anymore, and isn't benefiting from any air in their lungs. And you can cast this combo long before you gain access to the actual Suffocate spell.


Murderous Command + Deja Vu = 3-round-long Murderous Command (Deja Vu has no save).


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Cuup wrote:
Murderous Command + Deja Vu = 3-round-long Murderous Command (Deja Vu has no save).

Deja Vu doesn't work like that.

Quote:
Whatever full-round, standard, or move actions the creature takes on its first turn after you cast this spell, it must repeat on the turn after that.

After being hit by the spell you act freely for one round, then repeat that on the second round. With appropriate timing (surprise, ally coordination or quicken) you can get a two round Muderous Command, but that's a lot of trouble, Extend Spell is easier.

Grand Lodge

Lord Magus wrote:
3) For your aquatic types, against non-aquatic opponents: Nixie's Lure and Hydrophobia

Hydrophobia works better with slipstream as a repulsion effect.


In any kind of stony environment -- a cave, or any kind of structure with stone floors:

1) Create Pit (or any of the pit variant spells).

2) Stone Shape to form a seal over the top of the pit, leaving about an inch of space between the original level of the floor and the new seal. Make sure the stone shape is firmly attached to the surrounding floor surface.

Once the Create Pit spell wears off, the extra-dimensional space that it created suddenly vanishes, and any creatures inside are forced up against the seal. So basically, anyone in the pit is going to get reduced to paste.

If you're worried about air pressure building up under the seal and causing it to burst explosively, you could leave a few finger-sized holes in the seal to vent it. And then it would work rather like those play-dough toys that let you mash the play dough through little holes.

Still, considering the extra-dimensional space probably creates its own air and takes it away again when it leaves, I wouldn't worry about it too much. The stone seal has a hardness of 8 and 15 hp/inch, and a break DC of probably 30-ish, so it's pretty sturdy.

The Stone Shape cannot be dispelled once cast, because it has duration instantaneous. That thing is permanent. Which is handy at higher levels. At that point the pit may last a while, which may afford the opponent time to devise a way to get out. In this case, Dispel Magic can end the Create Pit spell while leaving the stone seal intact.

Splat.

I came up with this in the middle of a PvP session with some people I'd never met before (there were campaign reasons for the PvP -- it was complicated). The guy I killed with it was super-impressed. We're good friends now.

Sovereign Court RPG Superstar 2011 Top 32

Tinalles wrote:

In any kind of stony environment -- a cave, or any kind of structure with stone floors:

1) Create Pit (or any of the pit variant spells).

2) Stone Shape to form a seal over the top of the pit, leaving about an inch of space between the original level of the floor and the new seal. Make sure the stone shape is firmly attached to the surrounding floor surface.

Once the Create Pit spell wears off, the extra-dimensional space that it created suddenly vanishes, and any creatures inside are forced up against the seal. So basically, anyone in the pit is going to get reduced to paste.

If you're worried about air pressure building up under the seal and causing it to burst explosively, you could leave a few finger-sized holes in the seal to vent it. And then it would work rather like those play-dough toys that let you mash the play dough through little holes.

Still, considering the extra-dimensional space probably creates its own air and takes it away again when it leaves, I wouldn't worry about it too much. The stone seal has a hardness of 8 and 15 hp/inch, and a break DC of probably 30-ish, so it's pretty sturdy.

The Stone Shape cannot be dispelled once cast, because it has duration instantaneous. That thing is permanent. Which is handy at higher levels. At that point the pit may last a while, which may afford the opponent time to devise a way to get out. In this case, Dispel Magic can end the Create Pit spell while leaving the stone seal intact.

Splat.

I came up with this in the middle of a PvP session with some people I'd never met before (there were campaign reasons for the PvP -- it was complicated). The guy I killed with it was super-impressed. We're good friends now.

Even at CL20 stone shape only affects 30 cubic feet, which means your 10'x10' cap is only 3/10 of an inch thick. So it has 5 hp. I'd rule the trick does 13 points of damage to the creature, before the stone breaks (5 hp+8 hardness, both the creature and the surface take this damage).


ryric wrote:
Tinalles wrote:

In any kind of stony environment -- a cave, or any kind of structure with stone floors:

1) Create Pit (or any of the pit variant spells).

2) Stone Shape to form a seal over the top of the pit, leaving about an inch of space between the original level of the floor and the new seal. Make sure the stone shape is firmly attached to the surrounding floor surface.

Once the Create Pit spell wears off, the extra-dimensional space that it created suddenly vanishes, and any creatures inside are forced up against the seal. So basically, anyone in the pit is going to get reduced to paste.

If you're worried about air pressure building up under the seal and causing it to burst explosively, you could leave a few finger-sized holes in the seal to vent it. And then it would work rather like those play-dough toys that let you mash the play dough through little holes.

Still, considering the extra-dimensional space probably creates its own air and takes it away again when it leaves, I wouldn't worry about it too much. The stone seal has a hardness of 8 and 15 hp/inch, and a break DC of probably 30-ish, so it's pretty sturdy.

The Stone Shape cannot be dispelled once cast, because it has duration instantaneous. That thing is permanent. Which is handy at higher levels. At that point the pit may last a while, which may afford the opponent time to devise a way to get out. In this case, Dispel Magic can end the Create Pit spell while leaving the stone seal intact.

Splat.

I came up with this in the middle of a PvP session with some people I'd never met before (there were campaign reasons for the PvP -- it was complicated). The guy I killed with it was super-impressed. We're good friends now.

Even at CL20 stone shape only affects 30 cubic feet, which means your 10'x10' cap is only 3/10 of an inch thick. So it has 5 hp. I'd rule the trick does 13 points of damage to the creature, before the stone breaks (5 hp+8 hardness, both the creature and the...

Maybe a wall of force on your side of the stone shaped cap for structural integrity.


not really a combo but I've always loved Compassionate Ally (a 2nd level spell) especially against enemy clerics (but it is actually pretty effective against any enemy as a way to take them out of the combat for a few rounds of applying healing to their allies - doesn't work as well as an opening move - but once combat has started and they have any injured allies it is a great way to get them to largely waste their efforts.

(and It was especially amusing in one PFS game where I used it to great effect to disrupt a BBEG necromancer from being at all effective - instead she spent her turns healing her zombies while the party saved the innocents she had been threatening and then slaughtered her.

Sure the effected creature can still make attacks (but for most people doing heal checks or using magical healing will take standard actions - limiting the creature to just attacks of opportunity largely) - importantly this spell has the advantage that attacking the creature doesn't end the spell - so if the creature has a lot of allies that can be injured you can force them to run around healing allies (potentially triggering attacks of opportunity from you or your allies) and taking attacks without being able to effectively respond to those attacks.

There are some higher level spells that do similar effects - but many of them are disrupted if the creature is attacked.

One of my favorite spells for taking enemies out in an unusual manner - can be especially useful if your party needs some time to complete another task (like saving innocents) or needs time to get into position - and the enemy has some allies that you can easily injure (especially great if that injury is itself hard to heal... )


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One of my favorite combos is:
Resilient Sphere + ANY summons/conjuration. I have used it with Flaming Sphere, Conjure monster spells, and Summon swarm.

I guess you could use it with Cloud spells too?

I know it isn't a NEW combo, but I have used it successfully a few times. :)

Now I have to try that Black Tentacles+ cloudkill/stinking cloud combo! Thanks for that! :)


I mean if we are just going for sadism?

Cup of dust. Aqueous orb.


Tiny Coffee Golem wrote:
Maybe a wall of force on your side of the stone shaped cap for structural integrity.

A wall of force has to be vertical, doesn't work.


Whatever flavor of create pit + Create Deadfall

Make the deadfall 10' by 10' and watch it go splat from outside the pit


ryric wrote:
Even at CL20 stone shape only affects 30 cubic feet, which means your 10'x10' cap is only 3/10 of an inch thick.

I think perhaps you have made an error in your calculations.

For the sake of simplicity, let's assume we're doing a cubical solid, as opposed something oval or circular. Cubes work nicely with the grid based map system, and with the unit of measurement from the spell (cubic feet), which makes the math easier.

Given that, the formula for calculating the volume would be:

length x width x height

Suppose we wanted a one-foot thick seal. That would be:

10' length x 10' width x 1' height = 100 cubic feet

Clearly that is far more than even the most powerful caster could accomplish (in a single casting, anyway).

But suppose we only wanted a seal one INCH thick. There are 12 inches in one foot, and 1 / 12 = 0.0833333 (repeating). So now our formula is:

10' length x 10' width x 0.0833333' height = 8.33333 cubic feet per inch of seal

A level 5 wizard gets 15 cubic feet to play with (10 + 1 per level), so a one inch seal is easily possible.

Math isn't usually my favorite activity, but let's just work out exactly how thick a seal a wizard could make at each level up to 20. It should be simple: divide the available cubic feet (10 + CL) by the amount it takes for one inch. I'll round it to 8.33 per inch for simplicity's sake; two significant digits is plenty for this purpose.

CL    Cubic ft    Inches thick
 5    15          1.80
 6    16          1.92
 7    17          2.04
 8    18          2.16
 9    19          2.28
10    20          2.40
11    21          2.52
12    22          2.64
13    23          2.76
14    24          2.88
15    25          3.00
16    26          3.12
17    27          3.24
18    28          3.36
19    29          3.48
20    30          3.60

The Substance Hardness and Hit Points table in the Additional Rules chapter lists stone at 8 hardness, and 15 hp per inch. It does not make provision for thicknesses in increments of less than full inches, but you could easily multiply the suggested hit points by the thicknesses listed above to get a final value. Or you could just declare that the seal gains no mechanical benefit from the extra thickness, and go with 15 hp at levels 5 and 6, 30 hp at levels 7 to 14, and 45 hp at level 15 and up.

Regardless, it starts at almost 2 inches thick. I would contend that a creature smashed almost instantaneously into a one-inch gap against a barrier that thick by the sudden disappearance of the Create Pit spell is going to be raspberry jam, and that's that.


create pit does not instantaneously go away, it does so over the course of a single round. This gives its occupants a full round to smash that stone covering before they are forcibly compressed or otherwise effect an escape should brute force not be their forte.

The Burst DC is not going to be any higher than the low 20s, making it entirely possible that a strong enemy that has been stewing in the pit simply busts on out of there.

Best hope that the stone shaper's Craft (stonemasonry) is up to snuff, or their "squishing lid" may not prove to be as robust as originally hoped.


I suppose we could split hairs further, calculate the velocity of the rising pit floor, and so on.

But it wouldn't really change anything. Once the pit is gone the original floor is right back where it started, and the creature that was in the pit has only one inch of unimpeded vertical space in which to exist.

End result: raspberry jam.

It's just a matter of how fast the squishing happens.

EDIT: I re-read your post. I suppose it would be reasonable to allow them an attempt to break the stone. They would need to ready an action to hit the stone once it came in reach -- meaning no full attacks, they get ONE shot at it.

I'd actually set the break DC at 30, especially at CL 7 and higher. But that's entirely up to GM fiat, since the rules don't offer a break DC for a generic substance the way they do for finished objects like doors.

Craft (stonemasonry)? How much craft does it take to make a solid sheet of stone? It has no significant features or moving parts, so no craft check should be needed.


Ravingdork wrote:

I've always found the violent thrust option of telekinesis used in conjunction with dozens of pre-prepared nodes of blasting to be decidedly effective at annihilating one's enemies.

Since it's untyped psychic damage, it bypass many resistances and immunities. What's more, as a psychic attack, there probably isn't any evidence left behind as to what it was that killed the victims!

I want to add to this that a Psychic can apply a phrenic amplification (more than one after level 11 if you take Dual Amplification) to their Nodes of Blasting to make them extra nasty.

Obvious ones are:

Relentless Casting: cheap to apply, makes it more likely to pierce SR.

Will of the Dead: Prepare some capable of damaging and staggering undead.

Synaptic Shock: If they're hit they're confused for 1 round even if they make their save. Yikes.

I wish Dispelling Pulse could apply to strip protective spells, but I think it technically doesn't. Your target is the object you place the Node of Blasting on, not the creature who later touches it, so no useful effect.


Couldn't you use fleeting spell to make the pit dismiss-able and Wall of stone to get around the thickness issue?


Chromantic Durgon <3 wrote:
Couldn't you use fleeting spell to make the pit dismiss-able and Wall of stone to get around the thickness issue?

That would work nicely too. ^_^


How about instead of using the pit to crush people as it goes up, how about using the holes in the stone shape or wall of stone cover to pour water into the pit. That way, they drown.

Also, is wall of metal harder/more durable than wall of stone/stone shape?


The environment section place the dc to bust through a 3 in. metal wall at 30, and a 4 in. stone door at 28. So, I'd peg the dc to bust through a 3 in. wall of stone around 25-26.


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One spell combo:

Cure light wounds.

I mean, think about it. First level, PC gets hit by some goblin waving a dogslicer. Puts the guy down, but some cleric or oracle or whoever comes along, casts cure light wounds. They feel better.

Couple fights later, some orc smashes the PC with a greataxe, PC goes down. There's that spell again. And they're saved!

A level or two down the road, it's not just the spell, it's a wand[/i *shudder*.

Why is it sadistic? Because it teaches the PCs that it's okay to take damage, it can be fixed. Then there will be bigger spells. [i]Cure moderate wounds. Cure serious. Critical. Then the big daddy: heal. How cruel is it to teach these fighters and investigators and warpriests and rogues and monks and barbarians and everyone that the pain goes away? It does...and then it's back, and it's worse, and there's that spell again. Nothing is as bad as that!

Grand Lodge

Chains of light+force cage[windowed]+Hungry Darkness+Cloud kill


Tinalles wrote:

I suppose we could split hairs further, calculate the velocity of the rising pit floor, and so on.

But it wouldn't really change anything. Once the pit is gone the original floor is right back where it started, and the creature that was in the pit has only one inch of unimpeded vertical space in which to exist.

End result: raspberry jam.

It's just a matter of how fast the squishing happens.

EDIT: I re-read your post. I suppose it would be reasonable to allow them an attempt to break the stone. They would need to ready an action to hit the stone once it came in reach -- meaning no full attacks, they get ONE shot at it.

I'd actually set the break DC at 30, especially at CL 7 and higher. But that's entirely up to GM fiat, since the rules don't offer a break DC for a generic substance the way they do for finished objects like doors.

Craft (stonemasonry)? How much craft does it take to make a solid sheet of stone? It has no significant features or moving parts, so no craft check should be needed.

A 2-inch thick iron door has a break DC of 28. Stone is brittler and softer than iron. The stone shaped "lid" is going to be easier to break/burst than a comparably thick slab of iron.

More importantly, wall of stone gives us the necessary particulars: DC 20 +2 per inch of thickness, so DC in the low-20s as expected. No GM fiat required. ;)

Shaping stone is a lot like shaping concrete, only you do it in a matter of seconds. Calling for a Craft check is GM fiat. :)

Two other points of consideration:

First, stone shape has a range of touch. If you're not using it via Reach Spell or the equivalent, you're at risk of falling into the same pit with whatever is still in there.

Second, stone shape has a range of touch - while you're at the edge of that pit, whatever's in there might have a means of doing something about it.

Grand Lodge

Actually I thought of something else, Limited Wish>Geas.


Balancer wrote:
Actually I thought of something else, Limited Wish>Geas.

You're the 3rd person to mention that in this thread so far.


Not a combo, but the most evil spell is Stone Call. It has a very large 40' radius, but it only does 2d6 damage, so it's not very useful in combat. But cast it in the town center and you kill every commoner in the area. The difficult terrain assures no first aid arrives so they bleed out. Kind of seems like the only purpose.

If I was a necromancer, I'd announce my arrival in a new town by casting Stone Call followed by Desecrate and Animate Dead.


2d6 is an average damage of 7. Commoners are 3.5 HP average. A fair chunk will stablize on their own from that. The size isn't all that big either.

As for combos, how about Shamefully Overdressed+Reckless Infatuation/Unadulterated Loathing? The action loss from Shamefully Overdressed turns Reckless Infatuation/Unadulterated Loathing into a damned if they do (no actions left after moving) damned if they don't (They're nauseated/staggered and lose their standard action anyways)

Ravingdork wrote:
ryric wrote:
Val'bryn2 wrote:
I'm partial to Flesh to Stone, Rock to Mud, and Stone to Flesh. It has a way of making a lasting statement,
Transmute rock to mud only works on unworked stone, so you need to add in something like polymorph any object to turn the statue back into a rock. After that I'm partial to casting transmute rock to mud, purify food and drink on the mud to make water, then drinking the water. Good luck restoring that individual - they're not dead, just technically petrified, but good luck getting enough of them together to restore.
The statue IS unworked stone if no tool has ever touched it.

Failing that, just have your big stupid fighter demolish it the old fashioned way and throw it in some water so you don't even need the third spell.


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Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Yeah, if you're looking to kill a whole lot of commoners, cast firefall in the middle of a crowded city during a festival or other highly populated event.

The coruscating rain of fire fills a hemispherical burst with a radius of 60 feet. All creatures and objects in the area take 5d6 points of fire damage and catch on fire (Core Rulebook 444). Creatures who make successful Reflex saves take half damage and don't catch on fire. Creatures within 120 feet of the original fire source are blinded.

Not only will this kill most every low-level NPC within the massive 120-foot diameter, it sets them all on fire, so even mid-level people risk burning to death. What's more, objects are set on fire as well. All those nearby buildings? They're now burning down, with God knows how many people trapped inside.

Finally, everyone in a 240-foot diameter of the point of origin GOES BLIND. Nobody is helping anybody else now. Panic and death will be absolutely everywhere. Ever try to escape an sudden, unexpected, out-of-control fire while blind? You're probably just going to die.


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Ravingdork's avatar makes it look like they were a victim of firefall. ;)

RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

I'm looking for something to combine with spike stones. Something forces a lot of horizontal movement.

(In 5th Edition, I played a druid that cast spike growth (it does 2d4 per 5 feet traversed) and set it up so the warlock could cast a repelling blast eldritch blast.)


SmiloDan wrote:

I'm looking for something to combine with spike stones. Something forces a lot of horizontal movement.

(In 5th Edition, I played a druid that cast spike growth (it does 2d4 per 5 feet traversed) and set it up so the warlock could cast a repelling blast eldritch blast.)

Command, any number of fear spells, synaptic scramble, shifting sand, mind maze, ... are you casting this as a druid or what?

Edit: assuming druid spells, shifting sand, hydraulic push/torrent or aspect of the bear (for bull rush) stand out.

RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

avr wrote:
SmiloDan wrote:

I'm looking for something to combine with spike stones. Something forces a lot of horizontal movement.

(In 5th Edition, I played a druid that cast spike growth (it does 2d4 per 5 feet traversed) and set it up so the warlock could cast a repelling blast eldritch blast.)

Command, any number of fear spells, synaptic scramble, shifting sand, mind maze, ... are you casting this as a druid or what?

Edit: assuming druid spells, shifting sand, hydraulic push/torrent or aspect of the bear (for bull rush) stand out.

I looked at the bull rushing spells, but they don't seem to do a lot of pushing. Maybe if combined with a Quickened truestrike? I'll look at shifting sands. I was hoping to do something cool with just druid spells, but teamwork might be the better option. :-)


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Teamwork is best simply because it lets the entire group get in on the "shred their legs off" action via spike stones. grin

F'r'instance, if your group includes either or both an Intimimancer (Intimidation specialist) and a caster with something nasty like fear, your spike stones can go *behind* the enemy whilst your buddies force them to flee through the entire field of spike stones, getting mangled as they suffer the nastiness that is the panicked condition.

repel metal or stone will work beautifully when you have an enemy clad in lots of heavy metal armor attempting to hack you into chunky salsa. Combine with anti-life shell for maximum melee denial.

entangle combined with spike stones is just plain mean. "Here, slow down a bunch while my attack rocks gnaw your feet off."

If your group is reasonably capable with projectile weapons, you have the potential to mow the bad guys down with near-impunity. Have the arcane caster make things worse for 'em via stinking cloud and/or cloudkill. Add insult to excruciating injury via solid fog. Listen to the sounds of barfing and pain, have a readied projectile weapon or two, it'll be messy.


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Roaming Pit+Cloudkill. Gets things dead, moves to more things, carries the cloud to get more things dead. For extra fun, put a silent image or illusory wall over the floor that looks just like the floor. That way they don't evemn know when they get thrown in the pit.

Blade Barrier (ring)+Pits (any of them). Fun because each time they take damage they have to make the climb check or fall again.

Moonstruck+Wall of Force circling the enemy. Presumably followed up by either summoning popcorn or a megaphone for announcing the werewolf cage match.

Obsidian Flow+Toppling Etheric Shards. Every time they mobvre they take damage, fall, and take more damage. And they escape at half speed through difficult terrain.

Obsidian Flow+Aspect of the Wolf. Knock em down, grind their face into broken glass, kick em while they stand, and repeat next round.

Sadomasochism+Compel Hostility. After a while they get weirded out and leave.


From a Psionics perspective...

Telekinetic Maneuver + Solicit Psicrystal to have your Psicrystal Grapple/Pin a target for you, Foxhole underneath your grappled/pinned target, Ectoplasmic Sheen the walls of the Foxhole so he can't climb up, Concussive Onslaught, profit.

If you're a true sadist, manifest Clairvoyant Sense in the pit, so you have a front row seat as the target is pummeled by Force round after round and can't get out. And if you really want to get mean with it, keep using your Telekinetic Maneuver to Bull Rush every round while he's getting pummeled.

Or, Personality Parasite + Mindwipe his original mind for a bunch of negative levels, then Fuse Flesh so he's nothing more than a blind/deaf bag of meat in the fetal position, meanwhile his Personality Parasite can manifest powers normally, and will always attack himself using his own powers/abilities and costing his own PP to manifest.

Personality Parasite + Death Urge on the original mind is equally as fun.

Death Urge + Attraction (to my weapon)

Microcosm/Decerebrate is also nasty.

Foxhole / Ectoplasmic Sheen / Control Flames is also kinda evil. Basically they can't get out of the foxhole and become burned alive.


Ravingdork wrote:

Yeah, if you're looking to kill a whole lot of commoners, cast firefall in the middle of a crowded city during a festival or other highly populated event.

The coruscating rain of fire fills a hemispherical burst with a radius of 60 feet. All creatures and objects in the area take 5d6 points of fire damage and catch on fire (Core Rulebook 444). Creatures who make successful Reflex saves take half damage and don't catch on fire. Creatures within 120 feet of the original fire source are blinded.

Not only will this kill most every low-level NPC within the massive 120-foot diameter, it sets them all on fire, so even mid-level people risk burning to death. What's more, objects are set on fire as well. All those nearby buildings? They're now burning down, with God knows how many people trapped inside.

Finally, everyone in a 240-foot diameter of the point of origin GOES BLIND. Nobody is helping anybody else now. Panic and death will be absolutely everywhere. Ever try to escape an sudden, unexpected, out-of-control fire while blind? You're probably just going to die.

If you add widen to that, then it blinds everyone in 240 feet. What other metamagic feats can we apply to this?


Not much since it's a 7th level spell slot to cast a Widened firefall. Persistent Spell would probably be the most devastating against the largest number of victims, putting it up to a 9th level spell slot...


Reduxist wrote:
Ravingdork wrote:

Yeah, if you're looking to kill a whole lot of commoners, cast firefall in the middle of a crowded city during a festival or other highly populated event.

The coruscating rain of fire fills a hemispherical burst with a radius of 60 feet. All creatures and objects in the area take 5d6 points of fire damage and catch on fire (Core Rulebook 444). Creatures who make successful Reflex saves take half damage and don't catch on fire. Creatures within 120 feet of the original fire source are blinded.

Not only will this kill most every low-level NPC within the massive 120-foot diameter, it sets them all on fire, so even mid-level people risk burning to death. What's more, objects are set on fire as well. All those nearby buildings? They're now burning down, with God knows how many people trapped inside.

Finally, everyone in a 240-foot diameter of the point of origin GOES BLIND. Nobody is helping anybody else now. Panic and death will be absolutely everywhere. Ever try to escape an sudden, unexpected, out-of-control fire while blind? You're probably just going to die.

If you add widen to that, then it blinds everyone in 240 feet. What other metamagic feats can we apply to this?

A wizard with the admixture focused school could turn it into cold damage and add rime spell and/or chilling amplification. You'd lose the catching on fire bit though.

A rod of the thriceborn would mostly ensure that all those with poorer reflex saves than the save DC will fail their saves. Two 20's on 3d20 is something like 3/400, or under 1% chance. A metamagic rod of persistent spell would be even better, but pricier.


The above ideas paired with Sunburst. Non elemental 6d6 damage + blindness-permanent in a 160ft diameter (or more with metamagic) but leaves the structures alone, kind of the 'neutron bomb' version of Firefall. Probably won't kill as many humans, elves, orcs etc., but against fire resistant foes or other such scenarios ... Zombie/undead horde anyone.


So probably the meanest I've done in a game would be mythic wall of thorns plus wall of force via a mean rogue with a good supply of boundary chalk. They kept *thinking* they were going to make it out of all those automatic grapples....

Dark Archive

Rules Police wrote:
Tiny Coffee Golem wrote:
Maybe a wall of force on your side of the stone shaped cap for structural integrity.
A wall of force has to be vertical, doesn't work.

Although if you were terribly unlucky, you could get flung up into the vertical edge of a wall of force over the square your pit is in, neatly cutting you in half.

(I don't think you could create the wall of force *after* creating pit, because it wouldn't count as a vertical surface anymore, but I don't see any reason why you couldn't cast create pit on a space that already contains a wall of force...)

Still, a lot of work, and no guarantee that the person won't just pop up on one side of the wall or the other.


Kayerloth wrote:

The above ideas paired with Sunburst. Non elemental 6d6 damage + blindness-permanent in a 160ft diameter (or more with metamagic) but leaves the structures alone, kind of the 'neutron bomb' version of Firefall. Probably won't kill as many humans, elves, orcs etc., but against fire resistant foes or other such scenarios ... Zombie/undead horde anyone.

21 hp to a bunch of 1st level folk will probably kill 'em all outright. The survivors are almost certainly blinded.

Anyone that survives and is not blinded should be dealt with promptly. ;)


The Mad Comrade wrote:
Kayerloth wrote:

The above ideas paired with Sunburst. Non elemental 6d6 damage + blindness-permanent in a 160ft diameter (or more with metamagic) but leaves the structures alone, kind of the 'neutron bomb' version of Firefall. Probably won't kill as many humans, elves, orcs etc., but against fire resistant foes or other such scenarios ... Zombie/undead horde anyone.

21 hp to a bunch of 1st level folk will probably kill 'em all outright. The survivors are almost certainly blinded.

Anyone that survives and is not blinded should be dealt with promptly. ;)

Agree, I was referring more to Ravingdork's post apocalyptic firestorm and the body count that might rack up from everything in the 80ft diameter getting set on fire rather than the initial 5d6 vs 6d6 damage the Firefall spell inflicts.

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