Any Class / Archetype / Build that could do these?


Advice

Grand Lodge

I had an idea for a character concept that I don't know of any particular ones that would be able to pull it off, it's just two things, but they're quite divergent in terms of class features.

1. Effectively two-weapon fight with tonfas. I know rangers and slayers often make the best TWF's in the game, so it'd be a matter of finding an archetype that gets me close to doing the second thing...

2. Be able to read enemy thoughts reliably, preferably as some sort of spell-like ability.

Grand Lodge

"Reading Minds" is not going to happen. There is no reliable way to "read minds" in pathfinder, because it's mostly up to the GM's discretion how creatures/opponents react- and if/when you run into Mindless Enemies, good luck.

Outside of combat, it's not going to work well either. you could try divination/Augury to get as much information a good face character would get from diplomacy/bluff/sense motive.

controlling opponents during combat- via numerous Enchantment/Compulsion spells- is "closest" you'll come to be reading minds, by controlling them.

Any particular reason for two tonfa? They give a +1 Shield bonus when fighting defensively, but they don't stack.


1 is easy, you already know how to do it.

2 is entirely possible, but you're going to need to be much, much more specific about what you want. Read surface thoughts after three rounds? Find out who's thinking about a specific thing? Mechanical bonuses against specific creature by "mind reading"? Read a dreamer's surface thoughts? Detect anxieties instead of surface thoughts? Desires? Find out what they think about their family? Replace knowledge with sense motive to read someone psychically? You're going to need to specify exactly what you mean by "read enemy thoughts", because all of those cover that in some way or another.


If you don't want to be a Ranger/Slayer and TWF without high Dex, you could always be a Brawler instead. A 2-level dip would grant you TWF with a number of weapons (Tonfa included), with the benefit that you can TWF with ONE weapon. So you don't need to split your cash between two weapons or take Double Slice to get x1 damage on your off-hand.


VMC Sorcerer or Eldritch Heritage can get you the 3rd level power of the Rakshasa bloodline, which reads minds.

Alternately a Mindblade Magus can TWF and can cast psychic spells, which are like SLAs in that they lack physical components. The magus list isn't good at such but they also get to pick some spells off the psychic list.

Ultimate Intrigue might well have a relevant archetype somewhere too.


Is third party ok? You could always play a Soulknife with Psion dip from DSP Psionics unleashed

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If you're talking about reading enemy thoughts to help in battle, the anticipate thoughts spell sounds right up your alley. +2 to AC, and if they fail their save, +2 to attack and damage as well. The spell is even V only, so you can cast it while holding both your weapons

Of the classes that can cast it, Bard would probably make the best TWF'er, with Inspire Courage and Arcane Strike. Arcane Duelist will get you a bonus feat, and take the sting out of the cost of enchanting two weapons by making one an arcane bond.

Here's a basic build off this idea (using a 20 point buy):

Half-Elf Bard (Arcane Duelist)
12/17/14/8/8/16
Alternate racial trait: Ancestral Arms (tonfa)
1: Arcane Strike, Weapon Finesse
2: Combat Casting
3: TWF
4: +1 Dex
5: Weapon Focus (tonfa)
6: Disruptive
7: Spell Focus (divination)


Pathfinder Maps, Starfinder Maps, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Have you considered the Skill Unlocks for Sense Motive? Starting at level 10, they do including being able to attempt to read minds.


BretI wrote:

Have you considered the Skill Unlocks for Sense Motive? Starting at level 10, they do including being able to attempt to read minds.

The theory of this is good, but the problem is he needs 15 ranks (ranks not bonus) before it really starts to be anything close to "mind-reading". Which is unfortunate, because that leaves the character concept unfulfilled for 3/4 of its existence, if it ever makes it there in the first place.

However, I did just notice that the Sense Motive 20 rank unlock is incredibly powerful, even if you are unlikely to ever actually get it.

I think you may need to look for abilities that you can re-flavor as some sort of mind reading (being able to preemptively react to an enemy's attack and so forth).


So, I don't know if this is an option, but if you're able to use 3.5 material, I always loved the flavor of the Mindspy Prestige class. As long as you can use a method to get detect thoughts reliably (not certain of a great method on this point), it gives a lot of bonuses to Detect Thoughts (faster detection, multiple targets at one time, bonuses in combat, and sphere instead of a cone).

As for getting access to detect thoughts... helm of telepathy? Unfortunately not a class feature, but it does get you detect thoughts at will.

Scarab Sages

A psychic detective investigator should work nicely. You are a excellent skill class, can fight well with TWF thanks to studied combat, can go STR/INT over Dex with Artful Dodge, and can read minds with psychic spells and the mindtouch phrenic amplification.


Pathfinder Maps, Starfinder Maps, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Claxon wrote:
BretI wrote:

Have you considered the Skill Unlocks for Sense Motive? Starting at level 10, they do including being able to attempt to read minds.

The theory of this is good, but the problem is he needs 15 ranks (ranks not bonus) before it really starts to be anything close to "mind-reading". Which is unfortunate, because that leaves the character concept unfulfilled for 3/4 of its existence, if it ever makes it there in the first place.

If it has to be literal mind reading, you are correct.

If the concept is amenable to having someone so "tuned in" to what others think that it seems like they are reading their minds, it may still work.


Rakshasha blooded tiefling for detect thoughts sla? And a dex bonus for your twf fun.

Liberty's Edge

Just throwing this out there: The Phantom Thief rogue archetype from Ultimate Intrigue gets early access on skill unlocks, adding 1/2 level to their effective ranks. So a level 10 could have the 15 rank unlock.

Sovereign Court

Investigator. Studied combat works just as well on your off hand. Those are significant to hit/damage bonuses. You just need a weapon proficiency. Either as a feat or an 1-level dip; ranger is a decent choice. That gets you Favored Enemy, the class skills you didn't have yet, and wand access.

Detect Thoughts is on your spell list, and the Empathy talent would probably work for you as well.


Ms. Pleiades wrote:

I had an idea for a character concept that I don't know of any particular ones that would be able to pull it off, it's just two things, but they're quite divergent in terms of class features.

1. Effectively two-weapon fight with tonfas. I know rangers and slayers often make the best TWF's in the game, so it'd be a matter of finding an archetype that gets me close to doing the second thing...

2. Be able to read enemy thoughts reliably, preferably as some sort of spell-like ability.

Monk comes to mind. Take Aesetic Style Feats, and your Tonfa Damage will begin to graduate as you gain Monk Levels.

Take Crane Style Feats, and you gain benefits while Fighting Defensively, which Tonfa gives you bonuses for.

Take Snake Style Feats, and you gain bonuses in Sense Motive, can use your Sense Motive Check in lieu of AC, and get an Attack of Opportunity whenever someone attacks you and misses.

To use more than 1 Style Feat at once, though, and you need to be a Monk, Master of Many Styles, and you will lose Flurry of Blows. Tonfa is a Monk Weapon which would allow you to use Flurry with it.

Another idea would be to be a Warpriest and 2Weapon Fight with 2 Tonfas.

Grand Lodge

Looking through, I've found the Secret Broker Occultist. They have Martial Weapon Proficiency, and at 8th level they're able to use Share Memory on an enemy. They don't have much else in support of TWF-ing with Tonfas, but as far as the Share Memory ability goes, it's among the best of the options that have been brought up and that I've been able to find.

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