Hey all this is for a backup character in pfs. Trying to figure out the best fit for a high int character that mainly focuses on combat instead of magic. I'm looking mainly for decent skills and decent combat abilities. I've looked at the bard and skald..bard just didn't click and I was soso on the skald. I've been seriously looking at the empiricist investigator but mainly worried about how long it will take to get moving. Just barely looked at the occultist (battle host) any advice or suggestions would be appreciated
Fighter with high INT.
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I play an empiricist and it works very well. I easily pull my weight in DPR terms, can tank quite well, and participate fully in skill stuff.
There is some startup involved, but it's not as bad as you fear. I started with Strength 16, a longspear and Combat Reflexes. Add to that extracts of Shield, Enlarge Person or Longarm, and I already had quite a combat presence.
Then at level 3 comes Mutagen and Power Attack. At level 4/5 Studied Combat/Quick Study, and Phalanx Formation. Also, 2nd level extracts like Barkskin and Bull's Strength.
At level 7 I got Combine Extracts, Potion Glutton and extracts like Heroism and Monstrous Physique.
Consider the Alchemist or the Magus... Both have a need for high intelligence. There are multiple effective builds for both in the class guide section. I would say that you should consider the Alchemist and look at some of the variant classes that make the PC more fighter like.
Good luck!
Lore warden fighter is also a reasonable choice.
I feel we just had this thread.
Currently there's not a martial class that makes good use of INT.
Investigator especially empiricist and alchemist. They are fake casters that can just use some buff extracts and go to town fighting. Investigators rock at skills and combat, Alchemists are good at skills and rock at combat.
Magus and Occultist are classes that have spellcasting, but do the whole fighting stuff well. It's more of using their magic to help them fight. Magus fights with his spells, occultist is more buff and fight. Both do the skills okay, and rock the combat.
Bards and skalds are actually a poor choice as they don't need or use INT for anything. They and all other fighty classes only get skills and knowledge bonuses from the high int.
Slayer is the closest you'll get tbh. Good skill points and other things allow for a smart warrior build.
Bloodrager is a magical barbarian, though they are charisma and con based.
Consider the Duelist Prestige Class.
Here's a Fighter build:
Fighter
Human
Archetypes: Lore Warden
20 pt buy: S16+2 D15 C12 I14 W10 CH7
Traits: Defender of the Society, Indomitable Faith
Feats
1. Medium Armor Proficiency, Iron Will, Power Attack
2. Toughness, (Combat Expertise)
3. Improved Disarm
+1 DEX
4. Improved Trip
Weapon Training: Thrown
5. Advanced Weapon Training -> Versatile Training -> Thrown -> Acrobatics, Perception
6. Combat Reflexes
7. Cut from the Air
+1 STR
8. Greater Trip
Weapon Training II: Advanced Weapon Training -> Fighter's Tactics
9. Outflank
10. Paired Opportunists
11. Advanced Weapon Training -> Defensive Weapon Training
12. Smash from the Air
Uses INT for Lore Warden features, fights with a Spear, uses Fighter's Tactics and teamwork feats to have a bit of fun and make most use of its AoOs.
+1 STR
I know I personally don't count an int of 12 as "a high int character"
Here's a Fighter build:
Fighter
Feats
1. Medium Armor Proficiency, Iron Will, Power Attack
2. Heavy Armor Proficiency, (Combat Expertise)
3. Improved Disarm
+1 CON
4. Improved Trip
Weapon Training: Thrown
5. Advanced Weapon Training -> Versatile Training -> Thrown -> Acrobatics, Perception
6. Combat Reflexes
7. Cut from the Air
8. Greater Trip
Weapon Training II: Advanced Weapon Training -> Fighter's Tactics
9. Outflank
10. Paired Opportunists
11. Advanced Weapon Training -> Defensive Weapon Training
12. Smash from the Air
I don't believe you can take Cut from the Air if your Weapon Training is in 'Thrown.'
I don't believe you can take Cut from the Air if your Weapon Training is in 'Thrown.'Here's a Fighter build:
Fighter
Feats
1. Medium Armor Proficiency, Iron Will, Power Attack
2. Heavy Armor Proficiency, (Combat Expertise)
3. Improved Disarm
+1 CON
4. Improved Trip
Weapon Training: Thrown
5. Advanced Weapon Training -> Versatile Training -> Thrown -> Acrobatics, Perception
6. Combat Reflexes
7. Cut from the Air
8. Greater Trip
Weapon Training II: Advanced Weapon Training -> Fighter's Tactics
9. Outflank
10. Paired Opportunists
11. Advanced Weapon Training -> Defensive Weapon Training
12. Smash from the Air
Thrown Weapons are melee weapons.
Thrown Weapons, Longspear.
Longspear doesn't qualify, though spear does. Interesting.
Huh that elf chain is pretty nice I'll have to look at it a bit (maybe pick up the trait for int to umd and maybe maybe umd a class skill might round out the martial for me)
@Chesspwn...yeah a posted a couple weeks ago (?) about trying to do a int divine caster without much luck...so I decided to try a different route. I like the idea of a guy that can handle a sword but still pull out a magic item in a pinch
I like the slayer but I'm playing a inquisitor with the slayer type archetype so would be too similar
I'm kinda wondering if i should try a investigator/lore warden but maybe that would be too much
It isn't available for PFS yet, but the Child of Acavna and Amaznen Fighter archetype from Arcane Anthologies might fit the bill down the road.
investigators do best with investigator levels, not really good to dip out of except for like a 1 lv dip in inspired swashbuckler.
Gisher is there a descriptions of those somewhere?
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Gisher is there a descriptions of those somewhere?
No, but the quick summary is you are a fighter with 4 skills per level, you get cantrips at 2nd level, arcane armor training at 3rd, and get bloodrager spells at 5th level based on intelligence. You lose the first and second bonus feat, and all weapon training.
Losing weapon training would be a hassle and the bonus feats right off hurts but it might be worth it...sounds pretty good. Wonder when pfs will make it legal. Mix that with elven battle style and that might be just what im looking for. Pretty solid imo..not sure when I'll get to play it but since I only get to play every few weeks I have some time before I'd really get to play it. Since my main is a inq archer and I've only played the off character one time...i can play it two more times before it is locked down
And Fighter has a ton of feats to improve combat utility and does not need to juggle resources, concentration checks, dying due to rage ending when unconscious, etc.
It's a class. It has its things. You either prefer them or not.
Overall, Fighters post-WHM are low spectrum, sure, but they now have distinct advantages.
Yep, I basically don't bother with non-WT archetypes any more XD
Playing a Steel Hound Investigator/Inspired Blade Swashbuckler atm.
He is a smart fighter :P
It's been my constant fantasy.
That being said, I have a niggling feeling about AMH...
I think Fighters are a bit overstressed on feats right now too so it might not mesh perfectly.
Unfortunately, Child of Acavna and Amaznen doesn't qualify for the best toys from WMH because it loses weapon training. Also, it isn't proficient with two handed martial weapons.
Losing Weapon Training is a much bigger loss than it used to be. On the other hand, spells are a really good feature and you would qualify for Arcane Strike. I'd probably consider Lore Warden and CoAaA to be roughly equivalent.
Bloodrager is superior mechanically, but I just like playing high Int characters.
And what is this about them not being proficient with two-handed martial weapons?
I'm surprised no one has posted the student of war prestige class.
And what is this about them not being proficient with two-handed martial weapons?Weapon and Armor Proficiency: A child of Acavna
and Amaznen is not proficient with two-handed martial
weapons or tower shields. This alters the fighter’s weapon
and armor proficiency.
That's interesting. Thanks. I'm eagerly waiting o get that book and read the backstory for this archetype.
For the Elven build you proposed this might not be an issue since the strict wording of the Elven Branch Spear makes all Elves proficient with them. I know that wasn't the suthor's intent, but it says what it says. I'm not sure how PFS handles that.
Did they ever fix Eldritch Scion?
I know that was off topic a bit, but the talk about multi-classing magus brought that to mind, and thought I'd ask.
Thanks!
Here is another build I've been working on:
Race: Half Orc
Alternate racial traits: Fey Thoughts (Perception, Sense motive), Shaman's Apprentice, Sacred Tattoo
Character traits: Defender of the society, Fate's favored
Abilities (20 point buy)
18 14 15 12 10 7 - 1st Level (+2 Str)
22 16 18 12 12 7 - 12th Level (+2 Str, +1 Con [Lv Incrs], +2 Str, Dex, Con [Belt], +2 Wis [Headband])
Class: Fighter (Mutation warrior) 12
1 - Dodge, Endurance, Shield focus
2 - Bravery +1, Power attack
3 - Stand still
4 - Combat reflexes, +1 Con
5 - Weapon training (Heavy blades), Cut from air
6 - Bravery +2, Bodyguard
7 - In Harm’s Way, Mutagen Discovery (Wings)
8 - Greater shield focus, +1 Str
9 - Advanced Weapon training (Fighter's tactics), Intercept Charge
10 - Bravery +3, Smash from the air
11 - Mutagen Discovery (Spontaneous Healing), Pin down
12 - Swap places, +1 Str
This one is a Tank type. You can easily cover your pals with bodyguard/In harm's way, cancel ranged attacks againts you or them, Intercept enemy charges gainining movement out of your turn and breaking their momentum, and can effectively lock a foe with stand still and pin down. Plus, it has a ton of AC even witout buff (37 with 12lv equipment) and can also fly on his own.
@@oldrolero... I really want to like the mutation fighter but as you pointed out..only 12 int and 2+ int kinda stinks.
@Gisher I'm curious if it would work or if I might need to pick up a prof feat... wait and see I guess. I really like that spear idea need to see what i can do with it.
@Aerodin... I need to look into the unbarbarian...if the temp hp stacks with other levels that might be really something to look at.
@Fruian I really like the swashbuckler + investigator and that was my first thought when i read the book...then I saw everyone else had the same idea... I wish they hadn't nerfed the arcane deed with precise strike... I really wanted to do a kensai magus with that =/
@LoneKnave...for your analogy..think of it this way guns or bat...in a zombie apocalpse...those 5 bullets really did a number to that horde...now here comes 20 more.... I'm sure it is a preference but I agree with it I wont play a magus out of fear of burning through resources. I like a decent balance.
I really like the idea of a 2 handed weapon/spear type user I cant wait to see the new class. I'll probably tinker with the investigator to see if i can get the elven spear chain in there (not sure if i have enough feats) I was looking at a falchion wielding investigator but I heard you should morph and claw things at later level...which I don't really care for with this concept. What is the view on the occultist?
And what is this about them not being proficient with two-handed martial weapons?Weapon and Armor Proficiency: A child of Acavna
and Amaznen is not proficient with two-handed martial
weapons or tower shields. This alters the fighter’s weapon
and armor proficiency.
That's... really bizarre and specific. I mean, there's nothing stopping you from just 2-handing a scimitar. It's not like you have any class features that make you want to leave a hand free like Spell Combat.
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That's... really bizarre and specific. I mean, there's nothing stopping you from just 2-handing a scimitar. It's not like you have any class features that make you want to leave a hand free like Spell Combat.
And what is this about them not being proficient with two-handed martial weapons?Weapon and Armor Proficiency: A child of Acavna
and Amaznen is not proficient with two-handed martial
weapons or tower shields. This alters the fighter’s weapon
and armor proficiency.
The two biggest issues are you can't use any reach weapon except the longspear, and you can't use bows. You could get proficency outside the class, but it's really annoying.
The two biggest issues are you can't use any reach weapon except the longspear, and you can't use bows. You could get proficency outside the class, but it's really annoying.That's... really bizarre and specific. I mean, there's nothing stopping you from just 2-handing a scimitar. It's not like you have any class features that make you want to leave a hand free like Spell Combat.
And what is this about them not being proficient with two-handed martial weapons?Weapon and Armor Proficiency: A child of Acavna
and Amaznen is not proficient with two-handed martial
weapons or tower shields. This alters the fighter’s weapon
and armor proficiency.
I'm a little confused. When did bows get moved from the "ranged weapons" category to the "two-handed weapons" category?
I guess hero labs hasn't added weapon master yet. Was tinkering with a elven occultist (battle host) with the elven branch spear...aim to go with the reach build with transmutation and abjuration. Not sure if that would work with a investigator (all the feats)but seems nice with the ability to get int to damage and dex to hit... I wonder if you could take a dex feat for damage or is the elven battle feats worth it... sigh too much going on in my head :)