Goblin Squad Member
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Poi is Hawaiian taro pudding. It's a silly thing to call an inn, dock, or manor house "a pudding". And we're not even going to consider the possibility of using a modern acronym for "point of interest" as part of our in-character language. We need a better word.
The most appropriate word is "outpost", but that's already in use for the next tier down. Even if we came up with a replacement word for what is currently called outposts, the current usage is probably too deeply ingrained in our culture already to be able to make a shift without massive potential for confusion and miscommunication.
So, what do we call the central feature of a hex, that isn't either PoI or Outpost? What term can equally aptly refer to a shrine, an inn, a dock, a manor house, or a watchtower?
Seat
Steading
Holding
Estate
Domain
Demesne
Dominion
Claim
Freehold
Fief or Fiefdom
I like the sound of Fief. It's short and simple, it has the medieval/feudal color appropriate to the setting, and historical fiefs could be either independent holdings or subordinate to a higher lord.
Anyone got a better idea?
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Is term landmark already used? All of the names already proposed are much more specific than Point of Interest and should rather refer to types of infrastructures build around the PoI.
I made, like, five different versions of an acronym joke. Then I realized I was just looking for ways to spell "poop" over and over again.
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Goblin Squad Member
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A point of interest, or POI, is a specific point location that someone may find useful or interesting.This seems to be pretty aptly named if you ask me.
An inn can be a PoI, but so can a scenic overlook, or a funny-shaped boulder, or a monument in a town square. Using PoI to refer specifically to the player-made structure at the hub of commerce and adventuring in a local region- and not to settlements, outposts, dungeons, or other natural features which would also be Points of Interest as the term is naturally used- is not an accurate or precise use of the word, and doesn't suit the fantasy tone of the game setting.
On which note, Hub might be a candidate.
Building Point, Point of Construction (could be nicknamed PoCky), Potential Origin of Property or Building Platform could work.
What? Maturity? That must be for people who don't have hats.
Not that I have a hat. But if I did, I sure wouldn't be getting those disapproving looks, would I?
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Goblin Squad Member
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It would seem as though PoI would not really factor into IC conversation as context relevent terms would be used there, would they not?
Agreed. We'll probably be calling them things like mine, farm, dock, watchtower, logging camp, stone quarry, hunting lodge, etc...
Capture Point, too. Or Control Point. Wheeeee teeeerms
But in seriousness, Hub is gonna confuse me like crazy due to the Hub TV channel.
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Goblin Squad Member
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...we're not even going to consider the possibility of using a modern acronym for "point of interest" as part of our in-character language...
Dundee's Law
Fighting the battle for nomenclature with your players is a futile act. Whatever they want to call things is what they will be called.
But Orcs and Trolls spoke as they would, without love of words or things; and their language was actually more degraded and filthy than I have shown it. I do not suppose that any will wish for a closer rendering, though models are easy to find. Much the same sort of talk can still be heard among the orc-minded; dreary and repetitive with hatred and contempt, too long removed from good to retain even verbal vigour, save in the ears of those to whom only the squalid sounds strong.
Internet culture is full of semiliterate orcs, so no matter how well the proper term fits, and no matter how stupid the abbreviation or acronym sounds, fewer keystrokes will probably win out as the majority.
Are you going to argue about in-character terms with an elf named 'Goatzilla'? He'll probably just say something like "lol wut r u talken abot??". Perhaps you should just put him on /ignore, if such a feature exists. If /ignore does exist, it will take a significant portion of the playerbase using it on the gibberish-grunters before they get the clue that they should stop using it.
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Goblin Squad Member
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I think we'll just be calling them shrines, inns, docks, taverns, ranches, watchtowers, etc. and they'll end up getting their own names to locals depending on who runs them or their geography.
PoI is just a generic thing we have to deal with until there is landed property in the game.
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Goblin Squad Member
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In context, POI works just fine.
Yes, but it isn't very elegant.
POI is perfectly fine for the surface. It gets the intention across adequately. But those of us that want to get heavy Role-play in would much rather have another term. Caldeathe has no interest in leading a prayer to his god to "protect our points of interest." In that context, calling it "Our Holdings" or "Our Steadings" or something of the sort is going to feel more natural, and help to maintain the suspension of disbelief.
I'm afraid "Point of Interest," while fine for the players, does nothing for the characters.
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Goblin Squad Member
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I think that's totally covered by Proxima's post right before yours ;)
Well, yes, except for the fact I'm referring to the collection of assorted locations, rather than individuals. I have no interest in saying "I want you to go out and do a sweep of the shrines, inns, docks, taverns, ranches, watchtowers and brothels to make sure the companies are all alert."
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Goblin Squad Member
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I'd say something like, "Do a sweep of the surrounding area". After all, POI's are meta-game and mechanics first, my 'character' doesn't know about specific spots where specific things can be built. That's just the landscape, from a character's POV. Up until it becomes noticeable for some reason, and whatever that reason is (resources, building, whatever) is what that spot would be referred to from then on.
tl;dr - PoI is a good meta term, and from an 'in-game' perspective these mechanical points don't exist until you do something with them, at which point they have a name.
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Goblin Squad Member
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But those of us that want to get heavy Role-play in would much rather have another term. Caldeathe has no interest in leading a prayer to his god to "protect our points of interest." In that context, calling it "Our Holdings" or "Our Steadings" or something of the sort is going to feel more natural, and help to maintain the suspension of disbelief.
I'm afraid "Point of Interest," while fine for the players, does nothing for the characters.
That's a fair enough point when it comes to RP concerns. For OOC purposes though terms need to be clear and have specificity.
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Goblin Squad Member
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I agree with the OP, my association with a PoI is Disneyland on my TomTom. Holding sounds good and seems to cover it all.
I hope deisum is right and PoI's in-game will gain enough identity of their own so that we will uniquely name them. Maybe GW will actually let us name them in some way (can they be targeted?).
I hope the minimap displays any occupied PoIs as big bullseyes.
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Goblin Squad Member
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In context, POI works just fine.Yes, but it isn't very elegant.
POI is perfectly fine for the surface. It gets the intention across adequately. But those of us that want to get heavy Role-play in would much rather have another term. Caldeathe has no interest in leading a prayer to his god to "protect our points of interest." In that context, calling it "Our Holdings" or "Our Steadings" or something of the sort is going to feel more natural, and help to maintain the suspension of disbelief.
I'm afraid "Point of Interest," while fine for the players, does nothing for the characters.
And allowing the semiliterate orcsplayers to use a term that would equally work for OOC/IC conversations would even be better. Please GW take in account this very good suggestion by the OP and replace PoI with an appropriate IG name.
My vote for Hold or Holding or Fief.
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Goblin Squad Member
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'Fief' implies feudalism, which is maybe not so far a stretch for settlement-owned land, but just strikes me as the wrong term for land held by an independent company.
'Holding' implies You have what you Hold. Though Urman is right the term might be too wide (ie a settlement is also holding).
Kobold Cleaver: maybe you could run a UI script that changes every other company/settlement insignia to a bullseye (which would have an added bonus if we are allowed to make guild-tabards...). I'd prefer shrines, mines, farms and forts to have slightly different representations on my own map, but ownership insignia would also work.
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Goblin Squad Member
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I think POI is pretty spot-on both in game and OOC. Acronyms were prevalent in ancient history.
If the issue is in the pudding, I'm afraid there are a lot of things that will come across differently in other languages. It'll become second nature with frequent usage though and hopefully the pudding thoughts will fade into obscurity. I, for instance, no longer think my junk mail as canned ham.
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Goblin Squad Member
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My vote is to keep Point of Interest. It's a far more useful term than anything else discussed. It even works for hard core role players "Come fellow countrymen! Our nation is under attack, and we must ride forth to defend our nation's Interests."
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How about "Property"?
It denotes that it is claimed by a Settlement and is VERY general to cover all the bases for whatever kind of structure/landmark you have in mind.
Plus it gives me a IC justification to shout "Get off my lawn you punk kids! Don't you respect property rights anymore?"
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Goblin Squad Member
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In one old AD&D setting these things were called "assets". And major chunks of resources of your kingdom were called "holdings".
But if we can make our PoIs of one kind looking or working differently I'll side with Proxima Sin on that matter.
I agree with "assets".
But then, that might be abbreviated as "ass" so there's that... -_-
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Goblin Squad Member
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I think POI is pretty spot-on both in game and OOC. Acronyms were prevalent in ancient history.
Athansor, I think you've hit on the core issue here. Acronyms are indeed present in ancient languages and cultures, particularly Greek, Latin and Hebrew. But Anglo-American fantasy lexical items and tropes are primarily Anglo-Saxon, Germanic, Norse, and Icelandic in derivation.
As English speakers, we have two primary linguistic heritages: Latinate and Hellenic polysyllabic words primarily associated with abstractions, and primarily monosyllabic Anglo-Saxon words associated with the material world and bodies--a language where my body is a bon haus or a lichama. Whichof course is why we have Liches is D&D lore :)
So an acronym like POI is quite functional and accurate, but it isn't fantastic at all--it points at the wrong part of our linguistic heritage. But Anglo-Saxon words like Holding or Stead fit the register of Anglo-American fantasy.