Prestige classes, spells known, and bloodline spells


Rules Questions

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1 person marked this as FAQ candidate. 3 people marked this as a favorite.

Someone cast "summon design team IX" and get this thing over with...


1 person marked this as a favorite.

I would but the material costs are too expensive; a case of 30-year-old bottles of scotch, yikes...

Liberty's Edge

Xaratherus wrote:
I would but the material costs are too expensive; a case of 30-year-old bottles of scotch, yikes...

*hicup* Is that what that was for? *hicup* Sorry. *snore*


At least it's not a 5000gp diamond....


Flapjack Johnson wrote:
At least it's not a 5000gp diamond....

We save the diamonds for the number of people casting "Raise Thread" around here. Either that or for resto's for the wis damage inflicted reading Pally fall and alignment threads.

Though given the cost of Taliskers 30y old... anyone remember the GP -> dollar conversion that someone ran up based on beer? Or what thread it lived in?

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Companion Subscriber

Gen Con is ending. Nothing will happen until have after that is all done.


How many more FAQ's do we need? Geez...


There's no guaranteed number. In a lot of instances it's less dependent on number of FAQs and more dependent on the complexity of the topic\answer or what the designers are currently focused on.

Keep in mind last week was Gencon, so they're probably playing catch-up on their regular work (as someone who's attended a [non-gaming] convention as an employee I can definitely attest to there being little to no time for your regular workload while it's going on).


I knew the delay was because of the con, I just wondered if there was a fixed number or not.


*sigh* Is it weird I wanna be proven wrong, just for the sheer viability for a decent EK.

Shadow Lodge

I believe that as far as a threshold number, we've already passed it. I forget who indicated that. That said, there isn't just catching up with regular work to do post-Gencon. There's also post-Gencon recovery to do.

Silver Crusade

Flapjack Johnson wrote:
How many more FAQ's do we need? Geez...
Xaratherus wrote:

There's no guaranteed number. In a lot of instances it's less dependent on number of FAQs and more dependent on the complexity of the topic\answer or what the designers are currently focused on.

Keep in mind last week was Gencon, so they're probably playing catch-up on their regular work (as someone who's attended a [non-gaming] convention as an employee I can definitely attest to there being little to no time for your regular workload while it's going on).

Flapjack Johnson wrote:
I knew the delay was because of the con, I just wondered if there was a fixed number or not.
jlighter wrote:
I believe that as far as a threshold number, we've already passed it. I forget who indicated that. That said, there isn't just catching up with regular work to do post-Gencon. There's also post-Gencon recovery to do.

This thread has 51 FAQ flags. That's more than enough. The Design Team will get around to it when they're able / when they feel like it. My reference for the number::

Sean K Reynolds wrote:
BTW, no need to bump this, 27 flags places it fairly high in the list of FAQ hotspots.


Hey design team, if you answer this I'll bake you all some muffins...

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Companion Subscriber

Last Pathfinder Design Team post was Fri, Aug 2, 2013, 05:22 PM.


the design team is not getting off that easily


nope still not


How do I flag a topic?
And yes, I think that this is an annoying rule, especially for prepared casters. Still working on a countering feat though....


Morgan Champion wrote:

How do I flag a topic?

And yes, I think that this is an annoying rule, especially for prepared casters. Still working on a countering feat though....

did you click faq above the initial post asking the question?

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Companion Subscriber

Since GenCon, it's been over a month since the Pathfinder Design Team has answered anything.

It seems they like to do things in short, big bursts.

So, until the next burst pops up, we must be patient.


blackbloodtroll wrote:

Since GenCon, it's been over a month since the Pathfinder Design Team has answered anything.

It seems they like to do things in short, big bursts.

So, until the next burst pops up, we must be patient.

I think 2 faqs have passed since this thing hit over 30

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Companion Subscriber

Not when I posted before.

Good to see them back.

Silver Crusade

blackbloodtroll wrote:

Since GenCon, it's been over a month since the Pathfinder Design Team has answered anything.

It seems they like to do things in short, big bursts.

So, until the next burst pops up, we must be patient.

Sean K Reynolds, last Friday:

Sean K Reynolds wrote:

Now that I am back from GenCon and my post-GC road trip, I mean to post some meta-FAQs about how to best use the FAQ system.

It terms of how the FAQ flagging works, it doesn't matter if people create a new thread and flag it or if they go back to the original thread, make a new comment, and flag that—it all goes to the same place.


So... Should we just give up then?

Shadow Lodge

Don't think we should. Let's just keep floating it to the top.


We should all float on, all right?

Paizo Employee Organized Play Developer

Xaratherus wrote:
We should all float on, all right?

I'm not sure whether or not my Bloodline gave me the spell to do that.....


Ssalarn wrote:
Xaratherus wrote:
We should all float on, all right?
I'm not sure whether or not my Bloodline gave me the spell to do that.....

I'll have to take a look at the Modest Mouse Bloodline and see what it gives you.

Paizo Employee Organized Play Developer

Xaratherus wrote:
Ssalarn wrote:
Xaratherus wrote:
We should all float on, all right?
I'm not sure whether or not my Bloodline gave me the spell to do that.....
I'll have to take a look at the Modest Mouse Bloodline and see what it gives you.

Isn't it a Wildblooded variant of the Maestro bloodline?


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Ssalarn wrote:
Xaratherus wrote:
Ssalarn wrote:
Xaratherus wrote:
We should all float on, all right?
I'm not sure whether or not my Bloodline gave me the spell to do that.....
I'll have to take a look at the Modest Mouse Bloodline and see what it gives you.
Isn't it a Wildblooded variant of the Maestro bloodline?

If it's not already, give me a couple of days and I'll write it up, lol.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Xaratherus wrote:
Ssalarn wrote:
Xaratherus wrote:
Ssalarn wrote:
Xaratherus wrote:
We should all float on, all right?
I'm not sure whether or not my Bloodline gave me the spell to do that.....
I'll have to take a look at the Modest Mouse Bloodline and see what it gives you.
Isn't it a Wildblooded variant of the Maestro bloodline?
If it's not already, give me a couple of days and I'll write it up, lol.

...please do


We're holding you to this Xaratherus.


I second the motion of holding him to it.

Dark Archive

I'm not sure I see the issue: "Bloodline" (and "Patron") are separate class abilities of the Sorcerer and Witch respectively. These class features happen to grant bonus spells as you take levels in the base classes, but not if you PrC out.

The overall design goal in PF is to reward you for staying single-classed and to punish multiclassing/PrCing - this is just another way of doing that.

And yes, it means that Sorcerers and Witches are weaker if they multiclass. They don't need any additional help anyway.


It's been faq'd 65 times so far. Keep on clickin'.


lets hope for resolution either way


Psyren wrote:

I'm not sure I see the issue: "Bloodline" (and "Patron") are separate class abilities of the Sorcerer and Witch respectively. These class features happen to grant bonus spells as you take levels in the base classes, but not if you PrC out.

Read the thread.

And the +1 spellcasting was to make you essentially the higher level as far as casting went, this conflicts with your other.. the question is which wins.

The wording is fairly clear. You gain certain things, none of which are the entirety of a class ability. The designation of class ability is a red herring.

Rather it is spells per day, increased effective caster level, and (if spontaneous) spells known.

People want to claim that there are spells known that aren't spells known, but even if they are spelled out as spells known, don't like it. It boils down to wanting a result rather than merely reading the wording.

-James

Liberty's Edge

james maissen wrote:
Psyren wrote:

I'm not sure I see the issue: "Bloodline" (and "Patron") are separate class abilities of the Sorcerer and Witch respectively. These class features happen to grant bonus spells as you take levels in the base classes, but not if you PrC out.

Read the thread.

And the +1 spellcasting was to make you essentially the higher level as far as casting went, this conflicts with your other.. the question is which wins.

The wording is fairly clear. You gain certain things, none of which are the entirety of a class ability. The designation of class ability is a red herring.

Rather it is spells per day, increased effective caster level, and (if spontaneous) spells known.

People want to claim that there are spells known that aren't spells known, but even if they are spelled out as spells known, don't like it. It boils down to wanting a result rather than merely reading the wording.

-James

And once again you attempt to be as dismissive as possible of the people who disagree with you. But we'll see who is wanting a result rather than merely reading the wording when it does get FAQ'd.

Shadow Lodge

james maissen wrote:
Psyren wrote:

I'm not sure I see the issue: "Bloodline" (and "Patron") are separate class abilities of the Sorcerer and Witch respectively. These class features happen to grant bonus spells as you take levels in the base classes, but not if you PrC out.

Read the thread.

And the +1 spellcasting was to make you essentially the higher level as far as casting went, this conflicts with your other.. the question is which wins.

The wording is fairly clear. You gain certain things, none of which are the entirety of a class ability. The designation of class ability is a red herring.

Rather it is spells per day, increased effective caster level, and (if spontaneous) spells known.

People want to claim that there are spells known that aren't spells known, but even if they are spelled out as spells known, don't like it. It boils down to wanting a result rather than merely reading the wording.

-James

And as some folks have pointed out, there are things that function as Spells Known without being explicitly stated as Spells Known. Bloodline Spells are on that list of things that aren't explicitly called out as Spells Known, with the exception of a few Bloodline Abilities that are separate from Spells Known. Hence the debate. The wording interpretation is open-ended, especially with some of the things that are included in some PrCs over others.

Dark Archive

james maissen wrote:


Read the thread.

Don't need to. I know both sides. I just disagree.

james maissen wrote:
And the +1 spellcasting was to make you essentially the higher level as far as casting went,

As far as CASTING. Not other class features. Nothing in the "Special" column gets advanced by a PrC unless specifically called out. Your argument is "the rules don't say I can't!" Which isn't how rules work.


Psyren wrote:
james maissen wrote:


Read the thread.

Don't need to.

Your argument is "the rules don't say I can't!" Which isn't how rules work.

Actually it seems that you do need to read the thread, as you have gotten my argument wrong.

-James


and around we go again


Well as I pointed out 6? Pages the spells come from the bloodline. The spells added from the. Bloodline spells are even their own entry on the chart. Pretty clear they are a function of class like everything else connected to bloodline.


So where's my Modest Mouse Bloodline?


ZanThrax wrote:
So where's my Modest Mouse Bloodline?

dont make me brake out the adamantine bagel.

Shadow Lodge

Any chance of Dev response? I will bake cookies and mail them. :)

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