What’s the most broken Gestalt build you can make?


Advice


I’ll give one as a base for the (potentially) most broken martial Gestalt build:

Monk of the Four Winds 14/Heritor Knight 6//Mobile Fighter 20

Long story short, every round, 3 full attacks done as standard actions (plus a leftover move action), every attack in those full attacks has the effects of Greater Vital Strike, can sacrifice 1 attack at highest bab in any full attack to simultaneously do an extra move action, and enemies cannot AoO you.

It does have the downside of a useless feat tax (Weapon Focus (Longsword)), as it is needed to take levels in Heritor Knight, but you get Vital Strike and Improved Vital Strike as bonus feats.

Now top this for martial Gestalt builds, or give what you think is the most broken spellcasting Gestalt build.

I’d love to see what you can do in Gestalt games.

P.S. I’ll let you decide whether or not to add Mythic, but please add a note saying it is Mythic at the top of the build if you do so.


Any damage above what is required to incapacitate your opponent is wasted. It is easy to build a character that can one-round most opponents without using gestalt rules.

Also: straight DPR is the easiest thing in the game to counter. A simple swarm will crawl all over this character; litterally.

Something like a kensai/wizard, on the other hand, brings the full power of a wizard and fully functional melee to combat simultaneously. He also brings the AC/touch AC/CMD needed to keep him alive.

If you go mythic, the most broken thing in the game is a rogue with always-on invisibility, Undetectable, and the ability to multiply precision damage. He can also redirect incoming attacks back onto his opponents.


Mesmerist with Sorcerer.


Well, I once built a gestalt of Hunter and Unchained Rogue for a gestalt guide. You can get a real powerhouse from that.


Most broken I can think of is School Savant Arcanist 20/ Serial Killer Vigilante 6/ Shadowdancer 1/ Arcane Trickster 10 and 3 spare levels for whatever is needed (ex: bonus feats).

This build gives divination school, no penalty armor and shield that lasts all day (Arcanist exploit), Hide in plain sight, enemies cannot auto detect you (though they might get a large bonus to perception), 3d8(or 4)+3d6 sneak attack dmg, and a bunch of other potentially usefull abilities.


Hmm....

Sorcerer (Empyreal) / Shaman / Stargazer / Mystic Theurge / Evangelist // Druid (Nature Fang)

Can pretty much do ... everything. With the Druid levels alone, you have all the combat roles open up for you. The other side? Pffft. You get access to Kintargo Opera House guild stuff, and you have all the spells. Hexes and spirit abilities you get from Shaman, combined with the Hexes, Arcanas, & Mysteries you get from Stargazer... And with options to pick up an Animal Companion (via druid levels, or feats) make you quite dangerous.


Go for the CHA to everything build:

Oath of the People's Council Paladin 13/Scaled Fist Monk 1 (unchained)/Magus 6
//
Sorcerer 20

Desnas DFT gets you CHA to hit/dmg, Paladin gets saves, Monk gets AC Noble Scion of War for Initiative. Magus gets the Broad Study arcana to use Sorcerer spells with spelll combat (it really doesn't even matter if you get CHA casting on the Magus) and some weapon enhancements if you want them. You get +18 BAB by level 20. Paladin also gets you bardic performance as a 13th level bard (swift action to begin performing), and as a 10th level divine caster lets you use Divine Interference.

The only problem I'm having with this build at the moment is the swift action economy ... I'm sure someone can improve on it.


If you don't have at least 6-level casting in gestalt then calling your character broken (on the upside) is asking to get laughed at. Also gestalt games which reach level 20 without starting there basically don't exist. Plan for something which peaks earlier, much earlier.

Daring champion cavalier (Order of the Eastern Star) // eldritch scion (arcane bloodline) magus is potentially broken, being able to apply 3 buffs in a round and adding twice her level to damage. Inspired blade noble fencer swashbuckler // bladebound magus is a slightly more well rounded version of the same idea.


For the the all Cha build I would instead go with:
* Water Dancer Monk: 2* cha to AC, kinetic blast, and maybe some utility talents.

* Warrior Poet Samurai (if going Devoted Muse): Cha to AC and overall just awesome archetype.

* Devoted Muse: Cha to AC and other bonuses involving panache.

* 1 lv dip Warpriest (if going with starknife): Free Desna's shooting star, and free weapon focus.

* At least 2 lvs of Virtuous Bravo Paladin: Cha to saves and instead of Int for pre-reqs.

* Sorcerer & Dragon Disciple: 9th lv casting and massive stat boosts (+4 str and +2 con at DD lv 6 helps to ofset any str dump)


MrCharisma wrote:
The only problem I'm having with this build at the moment is the swift action economy ... I'm sure someone can improve on it.

The bigger problem is that you're a LG paladin using a DFT that requires you to be CG.


avr wrote:

If you don't have at least 6-level casting in gestalt then calling your character broken (on the upside) is asking to get laughed at. Also gestalt games which reach level 20 without starting there basically don't exist. Plan for something which peaks earlier, much earlier.

Daring champion cavalier (Order of the Eastern Star) // eldritch scion (arcane bloodline) magus is potentially broken, being able to apply 3 buffs in a round and adding twice her level to damage. Inspired blade noble fencer swashbuckler // bladebound magus is a slightly more well rounded version of the same idea.

Gestalt WotR without the mythic does happen occasionally.

Grand Lodge

Druid 20 / Cleric 20

2 tier 1 classes that share stat synergy, amazing healing, etc. etc.


Wonderstell, the Desna DFT only requires worshiping. The problem is wether a GM would let you worship a CG god as a LG paladin.

Slyme, a Druid 20/ Cleric 10/ Evangelist (Cleric) 10 might be better due to evangelist being a stupidly broken upgrade to nearly any class.

Grand Lodge

Possibly, I don't know anything about that PrC...doing a quick search on it though, it looks like it does not advance your spellcasting...losing out on 10 levels of cleric casting (which includes all level 6+ spells) probably isn't worth it unless those Evangelist boons are straight up godlike.


Obligatory Half-Elf Oracle 20 / Sorcerer 20.


Slyme wrote:
Possibly, I don't know anything about that PrC...doing a quick search on it though, it looks like it does not advance your spellcasting...losing out on 10 levels of cleric casting (which includes all level 6+ spells) probably isn't worth it unless those Evangelist boons are straight up godlike.

It actually advances all class features for every level except the first.

My most fun gestalt build was an unchained rogue (phantom thief) /aether kineticist. Stealing stuff from a distance and that kind of stuff. Not broken, tho.

The build that was most broken (in my mind) was my skald/ master summoner. I purposefully did not use the character to the fullest so I wouldn't overwhelm, but I felt that I could have taken over most battles if I let loose.


Skald/Master Summoner is just pressing the Win button even when not taking good options simply cause 1d4+x (forgot exact number master summoners can get) all with +6 Str and Con.

Grand Lodge

Ah, didn't read that far into it. In that case, losing 1 level of casting for all those boons and such would most likely be worth it.

Silver Crusade

I haven't looked at gestalt builds enough to say that it would be broken, but a Dawnflower Dervish Bard | Paladin would be strong — build a Dawnflower Dervish as normal, and then add full BAB, smite evil, lay on hands, and divine grace on top of that.


Reksew_Trebla wrote:

Monk of the Four Winds 14/Heritor Knight 6//Mobile Fighter 20

Long story short, every round, 3 full attacks done as standard actions (plus a leftover move action), every attack in those full attacks has the effects of Greater Vital Strike, can sacrifice 1 attack at highest bab in any full attack to simultaneously do an extra move action, and enemies cannot AoO you.

Heritor Knight's Mighty Strike merely lets you Vital Strike as a standard action. With MoFW's Slow Time, you could get in three Mighty Strikes, or three full-attacks from Mobile Fighter's Whirlwind Blitz (unless your GM rules that you can't full-attack at all with Slow Time due to its specific text, with him deciding not to allow Whirlwind Blitz to override Slow Time proscribing full-attacks), or a mixture of Mighty Strikes and full-attacks -- but none of the attacks in a full-attack will be a Vital Strike (at least not from class abilities anyway).

BTW, you probably should have put Martial in the title of the thread if you're only interested in the most powerful gestalt martial.


Slim Jim wrote:
Reksew_Trebla wrote:

Monk of the Four Winds 14/Heritor Knight 6//Mobile Fighter 20

Long story short, every round, 3 full attacks done as standard actions (plus a leftover move action), every attack in those full attacks has the effects of Greater Vital Strike, can sacrifice 1 attack at highest bab in any full attack to simultaneously do an extra move action, and enemies cannot AoO you.

Heritor Knight's Mighty Strike merely lets you Vital Strike as a standard action. With MoFW's Slow Time, you could get in three Mighty Strikes, or three full-attacks from Mobile Fighter's Whirlwind Blitz (unless your GM rules that you can't full-attack at all with Slow Time due to its specific text, with him deciding not to allow Whirlwind Blitz to override Slow Time proscribing full-attacks), or a mixture of Mighty Strikes and full-attacks -- but none of the attacks in a full-attack will be a Vital Strike (at least not from class abilities anyway).

BTW, you probably should have put Martial in the title of the thread if you're only interested in the most powerful gestalt martial.

Heritor knights mighty strike applies the effects of vital strike whenever you make an attack as a standard action. Vital strike is ALREADY a standard action. So, with mighty strike, whenever you make an attack as a standard action (as opposed to an attack action) you get the vital strike. Cleave, Deadly strike, all the class abilities of heritor knight, dual strike from the two weapon trick all apply the vital strike damage.

There are only two things to consider with mighty strike RAW.

1. Are you making an attack?
2. Is the attack part of a standard action?

If yes to both, then apply vital strike.


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Slyme wrote:

Druid 20 / Cleric 20

2 tier 1 classes that share stat synergy, amazing healing, etc. etc.

on any given round you are either one or the other.

There is no synergy in action economy or action effectiveness.


Being able to cast 9th level spells from 2 different lists makes you a much broader class of caster. But from that perspective I much prefer a 20 cleric/20 wizard for the superior spell lists. Not to mention that using Time Stop to cast cleric buffs and heals has more impact that what a wizard can do alone.

If we're going to ignore the gestalt limitations of not using prestige classes (especially Mystic Theurge) and hybrid classes...well. Make something really disgusting. Like an Ultimate Necromancer.

Undead Lord (cleric) 20/Wizard (Universalist) 5/Mystic Theurge 10/Agent of the Grave 5.

Use Prefered Prestige Class to pick up the 1 level of spellcaster you drop. Put 2 levels from Agent of the Grave into Wizard so you end up with CL 17 Wizard abilities at 17th level, then the other 3 levels from Agent of the Grave into Cleric so you end up as a level 33 caster.

While you shouldn't get any spell casting ability from anything over level 20, it should count for anything that is dependent on caster level. As in the amount of undead you can raise. Also your cleric spells won't have to worry about SR. As a side benefit you'll be casting 9th level spells at 14th level since Mystic Theurge and Cleric are both advancing your spell casting at the same time.

There is a very good reason Mystic Theurge is disallowed for Gestalt builds.


Synthesist summoner/magus focusing on a big hit would have a lot of damage and survivability.


Temperans wrote:
Wonderstell, the Desna DFT only requires worshiping. The problem is wether a GM would let you worship a CG god as a LG paladin.

Actually, DFT doesn't require worshiping. But you'd need a CG alignment to use Desna's teachings.

Divine Fighting Technique wrote:

Although each deity’s divine fighting technique is primarily preserved and passed on by her faithful, worship is not required to learn one. Instead, these fighting styles simply require a certain manner of looking at the world and specific combat training.

/.../

Prerequisite: Same alignment as chosen deity.


Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

Depending on which part of the game you want to "break:"

- skald (spell warrior) 1/arcanist (blade adept) 8/eldritch knight 10/arcanist +1//barbarian 2/sorcerer 3/dragon disciple 4/sorcerer +11 with the Spell Strike and Eldritch Blade exploits (one taken via the Extra Arcanist Exploit feat); BAB +16, spells as an arcanist 18/sorcerer 17 (plus skald 1; can use wands of cure light wounds without UMD), Enhance Weapons spellsong to add a +1 or +1-equivalent ability to all weapon attacks, rage to boost Str, Spell Strike to add a spell effect to a melee attack, black blade magic weapon; add Eldritch Heritage (Abyssal)/Improved Eldritch Heritage (Strength of the Abyss) to boost Str even higher

- half-elf hunter (courtly hunter) 3/cavalier (any archetype that keeps the Expert Trainer class feature) 4/hunter +13//summoner 20 with Eldritch Heritage (Arcane), Boon Companion (on the courtly companion), Horse Master, and Recruits; full strength courtly companion, full strength eidolon, full strength mount, familiar at level -2, and a cohort (that can be "swapped out" whenever the character is in major town or city)


Ryan Freire wrote:
Slim Jim wrote:
Reksew_Trebla wrote:

Monk of the Four Winds 14/Heritor Knight 6//Mobile Fighter 20

Long story short, every round, 3 full attacks done as standard actions (plus a leftover move action), every attack in those full attacks has the effects of Greater Vital Strike, can sacrifice 1 attack at highest bab in any full attack to simultaneously do an extra move action, and enemies cannot AoO you.

Heritor Knight's Mighty Strike merely lets you Vital Strike as a standard action. With MoFW's Slow Time, you could get in three Mighty Strikes, or three full-attacks from Mobile Fighter's Whirlwind Blitz (unless your GM rules that you can't full-attack at all with Slow Time due to its specific text, with him deciding not to allow Whirlwind Blitz to override Slow Time proscribing full-attacks), or a mixture of Mighty Strikes and full-attacks -- but none of the attacks in a full-attack will be a Vital Strike (at least not from class abilities anyway).

BTW, you probably should have put Martial in the title of the thread if you're only interested in the most powerful gestalt martial.

Heritor knights mighty strike applies the effects of vital strike whenever you make an attack as a standard action. Vital strike is ALREADY a standard action. So, with mighty strike, whenever you make an attack as a standard action (as opposed to an attack action) you get the vital strike. Cleave, Deadly strike, all the class abilities of heritor knight, dual strike from the two weapon trick all apply the vital strike damage.

There are only two things to consider with mighty strike RAW.

1. Are you making an attack?
2. Is the attack part of a standard action?

If yes to both, then apply vital strike.

Whirlwind Blitz lets you make a full-attack as a standard action; it says nothing about converting regular attack-actions (i.e., those individual components of a full-attack) into standard-actions themselves (which, if permitted, would actually to a recursive loop in which the player could argue he's entitled to an infinite number of attacks!). So, you'd receive either three Mighty Strikes (because you chose standard-actions) or three full-attacks (as standard actions), or mixture thereof, but not (full-attack count)x3 Mighty Strikes.

A standard action cannot be two things simultaneously unless the rules explicitly permit it (or your GM says you can) -- otherwise we'd have all been stacking standard-actions from day one, e.g., every caster could pop a spell and make one attack with a weapon at the same time since they're both standard-actions, or cast two (three? all of them?) spells, etc.

Grand Lodge

Volkard Abendroth wrote:
Slyme wrote:

Druid 20 / Cleric 20

2 tier 1 classes that share stat synergy, amazing healing, etc. etc.

on any given round you are either one or the other.

There is no synergy in action economy or action effectiveness.

Until you Wildshape into a huge elemental that can cast 9th level cleric spells, while your ongoing nature control spells create havoc all around you.

Grand Lodge

Synthesis Summoner and, you know, something else.


W E Ray wrote:
Synthesis Summoner and, you know, something else.

Yeah, almost anything at least half-way martial would do well as a combo. Paladin, Ranger, Slayer and Brawler would all be great. An Eldritch Guardian Fighter could be great when you share your natural attack feats with your familiar.

A Synthesist/Brawler could be amazingly good at grappling, with the grab evolution's free +4 to grappling and the size increases available..


Dunno about going all the way to 20, but I do have a Paladin//Ninja(scout) sap adept build I wanna do. Charge/spring attack, get in lots of sneak attack + smite, take em in alive because paladin.


Magus 20/Wizard 20, pick up broad study
Old Scarred Witch Doctor 20/any Martial 20

Not OP, but really cool
Huntmaster Cavalier 20/Primal Hunter 20 - not that strong ovberall, but two animal companions(if Huntmaster allows that) with Eidolon Evolutions
Kinetic Knight Kineticist 20/Slayer 20 - Sneak Attack with your Kinetic Whip


Synthesist with max con form/evolutions/kinetic knight with a large portion of feats being unconquerable resolve = the true hp tank.

Using 5 unconquerable resolve gives 100 temp hp per resolve point, and you get at least 9 with Kinetic knight 20. Thats a total of 900 temp hp through out the day as needed; +5 burn used on force ward elemental defense gives an extra 50 temp hp with 5 regen/min. For a total of 950 temp hp with 5 regen/min, before calculating the summoner side.


Wonderstell wrote:
MrCharisma wrote:
The only problem I'm having with this build at the moment is the swift action economy ... I'm sure someone can improve on it.
The bigger problem is that you're a LG paladin using a DFT that requires you to be CG.

I didn't even think of that, I was just going off the top of my head =P

How about Magus (Eldritch Archer)/Alchemist (Probably Grenadier), Spell-combat with bombs*, and because Eldritch archer doesn't need a free hand for spell-combat you can use all the TWF feats, Rapid shot and Haste to get 8 attacks** plus a spell in a round.

5 X 10d6+INT vs touch AC, plus a spell, and every attack can also de-buff your enemies. The two "spell" lists also cover a lot of each others' weaknesses.

*You'll have to roll to concentrate since you're not holding your arcane bond, but at high levels that shouldn't matter.

**I can see an argument that the spell is still the first off-hand attack, so this might be 7 attacks. Even if the TWF feats don't work at all with this (which I can also see), you still get 5 bombs plus a spell, so it's still pretty good.


MrCharisma wrote:
Wonderstell wrote:
MrCharisma wrote:
The only problem I'm having with this build at the moment is the swift action economy ... I'm sure someone can improve on it.
The bigger problem is that you're a LG paladin using a DFT that requires you to be CG.

I didn't even think of that, I was just going off the top of my head =P

How about Magus (Eldritch Archer)/Alchemist (Probably Grenadier), Spell-combat with bombs*, and because Eldritch archer doesn't need a free hand for spell-combat you can use all the TWF feats, Rapid shot and Haste to get 8 attacks** plus a spell in a round.

5 X 10d6+INT vs touch AC, plus a spell, and every attack can also de-buff your enemies. The two "spell" lists also cover a lot of each others' weaknesses.

*You'll have to roll to concentrate since you're not holding your arcane bond, but at high levels that shouldn't matter.

**I can see an argument that the spell is still the first off-hand attack, so this might be 7 attacks. Even if the TWF feats don't work at all with this (which I can also see), you still get 5 bombs plus a spell, so it's still pretty good.

You might not get spell combat with twf but you might still deliver 8 Chill Touch (for example) using 7 bombs and a thrown bonded object if the GM allows.

Ranged Spellstrike wrote:
...if the spell allows multiple attacks and the eldritch archer can make additional ranged attacks as part of a full-round action with spell combat, one additional ray, missile, or effect from the spell accompanies each subsequent ranged attack the eldritch archer makes in the same round until all attacks allowed by the spell are made....


MrCharisma wrote:
Wonderstell wrote:
MrCharisma wrote:
The only problem I'm having with this build at the moment is the swift action economy ... I'm sure someone can improve on it.
The bigger problem is that you're a LG paladin using a DFT that requires you to be CG.

I didn't even think of that, I was just going off the top of my head =P

How about Magus (Eldritch Archer)/Alchemist (Probably Grenadier), Spell-combat with bombs*, and because Eldritch archer doesn't need a free hand for spell-combat you can use all the TWF feats, Rapid shot and Haste to get 8 attacks** plus a spell in a round.

5 X 10d6+INT vs touch AC, plus a spell, and every attack can also de-buff your enemies. The two "spell" lists also cover a lot of each others' weaknesses.

*You'll have to roll to concentrate since you're not holding your arcane bond, but at high levels that shouldn't matter.

**I can see an argument that the spell is still the first off-hand attack, so this might be 7 attacks. Even if the TWF feats don't work at all with this (which I can also see), you still get 5 bombs plus a spell, so it's still pretty good.

You aren't planning to make your ranged weapon bonded object a bomb are you? That means destroying your bonded object on the first ranged attack, which is a bit inconvenient.

"If a bonded object is damaged, it is restored to full hit points the next time the wizard prepares his spells. If the object of an arcane bond is lost or destroyed, it can be replaced after 1 week in a special ritual that costs 200 gp per wizard level plus the cost of the masterwork item. This ritual takes 8 hours to complete."


Meirril wrote:
MrCharisma wrote:
Wonderstell wrote:
MrCharisma wrote:
The only problem I'm having with this build at the moment is the swift action economy ... I'm sure someone can improve on it.
The bigger problem is that you're a LG paladin using a DFT that requires you to be CG.

I didn't even think of that, I was just going off the top of my head =P

How about Magus (Eldritch Archer)/Alchemist (Probably Grenadier), Spell-combat with bombs*, and because Eldritch archer doesn't need a free hand for spell-combat you can use all the TWF feats, Rapid shot and Haste to get 8 attacks** plus a spell in a round.

5 X 10d6+INT vs touch AC, plus a spell, and every attack can also de-buff your enemies. The two "spell" lists also cover a lot of each others' weaknesses.

*You'll have to roll to concentrate since you're not holding your arcane bond, but at high levels that shouldn't matter.

**I can see an argument that the spell is still the first off-hand attack, so this might be 7 attacks. Even if the TWF feats don't work at all with this (which I can also see), you still get 5 bombs plus a spell, so it's still pretty good.

You aren't planning to make your ranged weapon bonded object a bomb are you? That means destroying your bonded object on the first ranged attack, which is a bit inconvenient.

"If a bonded object is damaged, it is restored to full hit points the next time the wizard prepares his spells. If the object of an arcane bond is lost or destroyed, it can be replaced after 1 week in a special ritual that costs 200 gp per wizard level plus the cost of the masterwork item. This ritual takes 8 hours to complete."

No that wasn't the plan, although conductive would let you channel a free bomb along with any spell with a thrown weapon.


I just kind of realized how broken Mystic Theurg would be with Gestalt. If you entered MT at 4th level, that makes you a 5th level on the class you continue to persue at the same time. In other words a Wizard 3/Cleric 4/MT 1 casts like a 4th level wizard, and a 5th level cleric. By 10th level you are casting like a 10th level Wizard, and a 17th level Cleric. A 10th level character throwing around 9th level spells.

And this is why MT and prestige classes aren't allowed in Gestalt.


Temperans wrote:
Meirril wrote:
MrCharisma wrote:
Wonderstell wrote:
MrCharisma wrote:
The only problem I'm having with this build at the moment is the swift action economy ... I'm sure someone can improve on it.
The bigger problem is that you're a LG paladin using a DFT that requires you to be CG.

I didn't even think of that, I was just going off the top of my head =P

How about Magus (Eldritch Archer)/Alchemist (Probably Grenadier), Spell-combat with bombs*, and because Eldritch archer doesn't need a free hand for spell-combat you can use all the TWF feats, Rapid shot and Haste to get 8 attacks** plus a spell in a round.

5 X 10d6+INT vs touch AC, plus a spell, and every attack can also de-buff your enemies. The two "spell" lists also cover a lot of each others' weaknesses.

*You'll have to roll to concentrate since you're not holding your arcane bond, but at high levels that shouldn't matter.

**I can see an argument that the spell is still the first off-hand attack, so this might be 7 attacks. Even if the TWF feats don't work at all with this (which I can also see), you still get 5 bombs plus a spell, so it's still pretty good.

You aren't planning to make your ranged weapon bonded object a bomb are you? That means destroying your bonded object on the first ranged attack, which is a bit inconvenient.

"If a bonded object is damaged, it is restored to full hit points the next time the wizard prepares his spells. If the object of an arcane bond is lost or destroyed, it can be replaced after 1 week in a special ritual that costs 200 gp per wizard level plus the cost of the masterwork item. This ritual takes 8 hours to complete."

No that wasn't the plan, although conductive would let you channel a free bomb along with any spell with a thrown weapon.

No I was just planning to leave the bonded weapon in my backpack and forget about it. You don't really need it at higher levels. And I didn't even think of conductive weapons, I'm sure there's a way to make that amazing!


Meirril wrote:
I just kind of realized how broken Mystic Theurg would be with Gestalt.

I haven't really played gestalt, but I think the way it works is that the prestige class only affects one "side" of your character (aside from BAB, saves & skill points). This means if you went full cleric and full wizard you wouldn't qualify. It also means if you went full druid on one side, and went wizard/cleric/mystic-theurge on the other side you couldn't chose druid as the divine class you increase with mystic-theurge (you'd have to choose cleric).

This stops most of the cheese (I mean ... as much cheese ae you can stop when you're playing gestalt).


Actual 'rules' for Gestalt. Please note that these are 3.5 rules and Pathfinder never printed its own version of this. In a lot of ways the Hybrid classes are already gestalt, and some prestige classes attempt to do what you get offered by gestalt.


avr wrote:
Also gestalt games which reach level 20 without starting there basically don't exist. Plan for something which peaks earlier, much earlier.

Mine did. Age of Worms all the way to the end.

None of the characters in my game were particularly broken...the one who ended up being the most effective was a vanilla Fighter//Rogue, but that was due to the player rather than anything inherent in the combo.

There were quite a few other characters, as two players left early on, then came back, and then left again. Later, another player went off to university and then another had to drop out for work reasons, but they both came back towards the end. We went with Gestalt and a generous point buy so we could keep going with three or even two players, but as it turned out IIRC we never dropped below four and at certain points had five and for the finale has six.

Apart from the aforementioned we had, at various times, a Rogue//Artificer*, Cleric//Sorcerer, Ranger//Wizard, Swordsage**//Wizard, Paladin//Monk, and Paladin//Fighter.

We converted to Pathfinder from 3.5 early on, hence the lack of archetypes or PF specific classes.

Unfortunately, my main answer to the OP's question is "none of the above".

_
glass.

* D&D 3.5 class from Eberron Campaign Setting.
** D&D 3.5 class from Tome of Battle: The Book of 9 Swords.


I'm especially fond of combining Investigator with just about anything else. My last one was combined with Slayer. Action economy wasn't great, but I had tons of options at my disposal both in and out of combat. Great fun.


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Lynxden wrote:
I'm especially fond of combining Investigator with just about anything else. My last one was combined with Slayer. Action economy wasn't great, but I had tons of options at my disposal both in and out of combat. Great fun.

Investigator + Occultist together have a TON of offensive buffs to their name. If built properly, they can be an INCREDIBLY powerful gestalt. Especially considering the fact that Occultist has access to Trappings of the Warrior for full BAB; that + Haunt Collector + Studied Combat makes it very, VERY easy for you to hit things. And with the Lamplighter archetype you can also have Diviner-level initiative.

Nobody ever seems to mention Inquisitor + Ranger, either. Dunno why, it's simple, straightforward, and basically covers all important bases. Full BAB, all good saves, Stalwart + Improved Evasion (this is huge), tons of bonus feats, synergistic spellcasting, buffs for days, the works. They even get great stealth abilities, and stealth (when optimized) is basically the strongest defense in Pathfinder.

Course, everyone looses to a Sorcerer 20 / Oracle 20, so...yeah.

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