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Organized Play Member. 1,223 posts (1,231 including aliases). No reviews. No lists. No wishlists. 1 alias.


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What "Florida Man" style headlines could you make off of your games?

I jokingly said there was a newspaper for a place called Flure E Da, and a player wants to buy a subscription to it.

I always saw the Immortality Wizard thing as not dying of old age. As has been brought up, the official wizards that are older than maximum lifespan all have the Immortality ability, so it is clear what the intent is.

But even if it isn't, the fact that you don't take Ability Score penalties from old age would in fact have the effect of not dying of old age in real life.

The thing is, creatures don't actually die of old age. They die from their body getting worse and worse with age, and straight up failing. Since that is clearly Ability Score penalties from old age, and you don't take those anymore, you won't die of old age.

So yeah. Take your pick of justification for not dying of old age.

You gain each level one by one, but technically speaking, I don't think anything in the rules of Pathfinder says you can't intentionally not take a feat at 3rd level, and wait until 4th level to fill it because you want Animal Ally (prereq of level 4 for some reason), for example.

Even if you do have to fill everything right away, retraining rules are a thing. Only problem is getting that much gold to actually retrain (we can actually calculate the real world price. I forget the numbers, but I think it was 50 gp is one pound of gold, so from there, you can calculate the gp price to retrain, and then the real world price to retrain).

He gets so good at being both a Samurai and Ninja, that I almost want to try him in a Gestalt game, but then again, he didn't start off as a Ninja, and was probably many levels of Samurai already due to how high ranked his legal guardian was growing up (more important people typically got trained better in the past).

So which should I try for him? I already have a basic idea of what I should build for him. I'm making him an Order of the Shield Samurai. For Ninja, I haven't looked it over in several years, but I have a basic idea of what I want. Jin technically wasn't a standard Ninja, rather more likely the first Ninja (Ninja didn't actually exist yet), so I just have to get stereotypical Ninja stuff, and nothing too over-the-top.

Anyways, let me know your opinions on the question "To Gestalt, or not to Gestalt?"

I just want to thank you all for continuing to discuss this and give me ideas. I know I don't always respond to my own threads as much as I should, but I am always reading the advice I get, so thank you all.

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Mine is the Anhana. In regards to the lore surrounding them, they remind me a lot of the Kokiri from The Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time, and I adore that race.

What about you?

The people here who disallow it seem to be giving very, very bad reasons for doing so.

The Vigilante does in fact work in a cooperative game. Just because you have a secret or two doesn't mean you aren't cooperating.

People are complicated. I don't tell people I like kids shows when I meet them. Doesn't mean I'm not trying to be friendly, nor does it mean I have some nefarious plot in store for them.

Like damn people, get a grip.

If you are banning the Vigilante class for such reasons, I guarantee it isn't the class not working, but rather you not having any creativity, because the class works perfectly fine in this game.

Java Man wrote:
I'd go with hematite.

And that is clearly a great answer, so that's going into my notes.

Thank you for the help!

Fortifying Stone

So if you are confused by my question, I mean the general social meaning of a semi-precious stone. Like some stones are thought to be calming, some thought to bring good luck, and so on.

What semi-precious stone would be best to represent a Fortifying Stone?

It has to be semi-precious, not precious, because the description of Fortifying Stones says that's what they are.

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So instead of trading feats at levels 3, 7, 11, 15, and 19, and getting your VMC abilities at those same levels, you would instead trade feats at levels 1, 5, 9, 13, and 17, and get the abilities at those levels.

Anything that is gained with an effective class level less than character level would have an added text of "(minimum level 1)", for obvious reasons.

Anything that was already gained at 1st level is obviously still gained at 1st level, but otherwise, this means you get your VMC 2 levels early.

I know some options are trash, even if only because they are gained so late, so with this change, it might mitigate some of that.

And yes, the good options would be better, but this could make it where you don't have to exclusively take the good options, if you take this at all that is.

Obviously in the hands of a munchkiner, this could be bad, but just talk things out with your group ahead of time to have an understanding not to abuse this.

So would this be balanced?

I'm thinking some kind of combo of Monk and Barbarian, which I will explain how below.

So normally, you won't have a Rage as a Monk. Monk's need to be lawful, but Barbarians need to be nonlawful.

However, there are a few workarounds.

VMC Monk and VMC Barbarian do not have alignment restrictions. This means you can be both, one being the main class, the other being the VMC.

Bloodrager and Skald do not have alignment restrictions, thus can work with a regular multiclass with Monk.

Martial Artist archetype of Monk does not need to be lawful, thus can Multiclass with Barbarian.

There is also the issue of whether to choose Barbarian or Unchained Barbarian, if you are taking actual levels of Barbarian, rather than VMC Barbarian.

Now if it matters, I like flavoring Rage, Greater Rage, and Mighty Rage as Super Saiyan 1-3 (from Dragon Ball Z), and Tireless Rage combined with Moment of Clarity Rage Power, the feat Mad Magic, and Rage Cycling, makes the training Goku and Gohan did to be in full control with Super Saiyan, like they are when in base form.

HOWEVER, I am not specifically making a Dragon Ball character. Just pointing out that that is how I like to flavor Rage.

I just like the idea of a raging Ki user fighting with their fists.

I may be different from the normal person, based on some of these responses. My first character, named Torrex, was based off of Batman, but I changed some things up. She was, well, a she, a half-elf, and a Fighter//Rogue gestalt, that for her last 5 levels, was going to take levels in Druid. I just based the starting situation off of Batman.

She quickly became her own character though, as she adapted to the story.

My next character was actually an NPC, that I adopted, because I joined that game later (it was with family, so I wasn't prepared with a character of my own), and I played him as having some brain damage that caused memory loss. He was a kobold named Meepo, that eventually ended up worshipping the dwarf in the group, thus in proxy, worshipped Torag.

My point being, is that they were not based off of me.

Well this got real. I just wanted to see what people would like to be able to do if they were given this buff, and my answer to these types of questions is almost always "fix my mom", and I always try to answer the questions I give for stuff like this.

I was unaware of the Regenerative Sinew Hex, or I would have said that. However, I do believe that I wouldn't be able to protect myself if the big pharmacy companies and/or hospitals started getting angry enough to hire a hit man to deal with me taking all their customers, so I don't think I'd be willing to start a business with it.

And before you think I'm being paranoid, I live in the USA, where healthcare is about helping people SECOND, and being a business first. I am not being paranoid enough actually.

Mysterious Stranger wrote:
Not having to pay for food would allow you to move into a better place and give you more disposable income. Having hundreds of millions of dollars would allow to you own multiple mansions and have a staff of servants to wait on your every whim. It would also allow you to pursue any form of leisure or entertainment you desire. It would also allow you to get the best medical care in the world for your mother. Even if they cannot fix her disabilities having enough money may be able to mitigate some of the issues. Having a chauffeur and personal assistant to help them move around would really help someone with mobility issues.

I'll be honest, I somehow skipped the paragraph you talked about Bard and the wealth I could get with it. I read all the other paragraphs though, so I really don't know what happened.

That would be way better, so I think I'd go for Bard.

MrCharisma wrote:
Totally Not Gorbacz wrote:
This is entirely too close to ...
These kinds of questions pop up all the time. It's not like spending an hour fantasizing about this is going to stop someone from living a real life. Let people have their fantasy in a fantasy RPG forum.

I barely spent 5 minutes thinking about it, because I wanted to see other's answers, but don't like to be a hypocrite and thus gave an answer myself. But yeah, like you said, it is just about having fun with fantasy. Doesn't stop us from living our lives.

Mysterious Stranger wrote:

Saving money form not eating is not going to be really helpful. While it may seem like a lot of money in reality it is not. The only people who spend a significant amount of money on food is those with no income. A wealthy person may spend a lot on food, but as a percentage of income it is actually much lower than someone who is poor. The amount of money you save on not eating is not going to be enough to change your lifestyle.

In the real world detect evil is not going to be that useful because the vast majority of people are not high enough to register and there are no monsters. Lay on hand would be fairly good but being limited to only 3rd level mercies makes paladin only good for something like an EMT.

Bard would be a great choice. Getting a +10 to all knowledge skills and the ability to take 20 once per day would be incredibly useful. Versatile performance would give you more skills. Inspire competence would also be a very useful ability. You would be able to answer all but the most difficult questions at will and be able to answer 1 incredibly difficult question per day without putting in a single skill point or using any feats. Knowledge is power and power translates into wealth. You would end up very wealthy

Sorcerer with the right bloodline looks fairly good. I would probably go with Rakshasa. Being able to use Alter Self at will and being able to stay in the form as long as you like is hard to beat. Then throw in being able to read people’s minds, Silver Tongue and the feat deceitful makes this hard to beat. You would become the world’s greatest spy.

While it isn't exactly no income, I live on disability (I'm on the Autism spectrum), and so does my mom that I live with (she's physically disabled due to a handful of conditions, although we suspect she is also on the spectrum). Not having to pay for food most days would literally get us out of the hole we are in.

Bonus: Which Alternate Capstone would you choose, since you can get one even if the class you took 20 levels in doesn't have one to trade?

For me, it'd have to be Oracle. I'd choose the Consumed Curse, so I can go at least 15 days without food and water, though probably less because that's just how long I can go before suffering physical damage from not eating/drinking. Still, the money I'll save from not having to buy as much food and water will be tremendous.

And being able to resist poisons and diseases by rolling twice and taking the better result, when we are living in a pandemic, would be amazing.

Life Mystery would be pretty good, and hopefully I can help my mom out with some of the Revelations, or maybe with them and feats enhancing them.

For the Alternate Capstone, I'd select "With This Sword", and have the item be the bracelet my mom made me. Since it is now an artifact, I can wear it at all times without fear of it breaking (it has broken before), and I can give it 100,000 gp worth of healing based spells to go with my healing theme from the Life Mystery.

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This thread has been necro'd 6 or 8 times, depending on whether or not you count a one month break a necro.

That's got to be a record or something.

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Hey VoodistMonk, if you're willing to advance the Wolverine to 4 HD like I previously said, and it turns out too weak for a CR 4, here is an idea:

Replace the two feats with Endurance and Diehard, and give it, as a bonus feat, Fast Healer. Make sure the +1 to an Ability Score from gaining its 4th HD goes to Con, so its mod goes up by one. This will lower its hp by 4 (from losing Toughness), but its hp also rose by 4 from the Con increase, so it pans out.

This will result in it adding half its Con mod (minimum 1) to any magical healing it gets, as well as healing from bed rest. However, I personally allow it to work with Fast Healing and Regeneration, because there is no logical reason it wouldn't if it also worked on bed rest healing.

This means, assuming you gave a +4 to Con from the Mutant template, it will heal 2 extra hp every turn, at the cost of its Skill Focus (Perception) and Toughness.

Mysterious Stranger wrote:
Are you sure you want to give up domain spells and not be able to use armor? That is a pretty steep price to pay Many of the Credence’s are combat focused and not being able to use armor is going to put you at a severe disadvantage in combat. Personally, I would use a vanilla cleric instead.

I was planning on getting a Beaming ranged weapon, probably a bow of some sort, because of the Searing Light working well with this build, and partially also because it reminds me of Light Arrows from Zelda, so I would almost never be in melee unless I needed to heal my allies with a touch spell, but I think there are ways around that too, besides just spamming Channel Energy.

Plus, there are some small ways I can boost my AC, if needed, like one of the Credences.

Mightypion wrote:
Do you start at level 1?

Yes and no.

I'm going play this as a player soon, assuming plans don't change, and it'll start at level 1.

I also really like the idea, and want to use it as an NPC when I GM, with a player being able to take them as a Cohort with Leadership, if they want. Otherwise, I want to have some NPCs that I'll roll percentage dice to see if they'll save the PCs when they would fail due to poor strategy or poor rolls, kinda like how King Mickey could show up if you died in boss fights in Kingdom Hearts 2, and I'll add this character as an NPC that can save the PCs.


As for everyone else, I have a lot to look through now, so thank you for the suggestions.

I want to make a healing/sun's warmth/high positivity character. Sarenrae was the obvious choice for deity, which is why I think the prestige class Dawnflower Anchorite would work. Blossoming Light is very thematic for the starting class before multiclassing into the prestige class, but I want to know if there are better options for this.

In addition, if there is a way for me to become sunlight, or something like that, I'd like to hear it.

Thanks in advance for any help with this.

Sorry for not responding sooner. Life happens. Anyways, thank you all for the information. This is very useful to me, so I'll be making use of it sooner or later.

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Wolverine (Marvel), recently (sort of) got a fire ability where he super heats his claws. I'd say increase the HD of the mutant wolverine by 1 (so it gets an extra mutation), select heat metal, and have its natural attacks count as both fire-forged steel and adamantine, and as a result, increase the CR by +1. Depending on where it lands powerwise, you might need to increase its HD by more to balance it, possibly increasing its CR by a further +1. Though since it'll be taking fire damage, maybe have its fur count as fire-forged steel (armor version), to give it fire resistance, and to increase the fire damage on the natural attacks.

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As far as I know, you can only offer your own soul, as that is all they care about, but it is about as much a common trope to sell your first born child to a devil. In addition, the devil should know what you care about most, or will care about the most, but don't know it. Imagine selling your future pet's soul, because right now you are an ahole, but in the future, you'll become a good person.

In fact, that same devil comes to claim the pet's soul, but when you object, they say something like "perhaps you have something of equal, or perhaps more value to offer in place of this soul", hinting that they want your soul instead. It is the long con, but they most likely get your soul in the end, even though that wasn't the original deal.

Basically, I'm wanting lore on what exactly you can realistically offer a devil for a contract of some sort.

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The Bloodline Arcana of the Orc Bloodline for Sorcerers makes you gain the Orc Subtype. If the base creature is a Kobold, then congrats, you have a half Kobold, half Orc.

Also, there are rules (1st party rules) for making new races, and I believe you can make hybrid races (has two different racial subtypes). See if you can work something out with your GM in regards to these rules.

EDIT: Race Builder. If the type is Humanoid, you can choose two different subtypes denoting race, like how Half-Elves are Human and Elf.

glass wrote:

Regarding redeeming liches: Are we assuming the (implied) unspeakable evil inherent in becoming a lich is a one-time deal? Because I always got the impression that such acts had to be repeated; the lich's form needs maintenance.


Can't they make new phylacteries, if the lich still has a body when their's is destroyed?

Maybe making a phylactery is what forces them to do the repeated evil, because they are rebinding their soul in an unholy manner.

So as long as their phylactery is safe, they would never have a reason to recommit those atrocities, if they decide to be good for whatever reason.

Andostre wrote:
Reksew_Trebla wrote:
I just want to point out that there is nothing wrong with treating something that is pretty much genetically evil, as less than human.
Eeeehhhhhh... not sure everyone would agree with this.

And they would be wrong for not doing so. Nobody bats an eye at murdering devils and demons for simply existing. Nobody bats an eye at destroying a lich's phylactery just for existing. So clearly it is canon that liches are not seen as human, because they are genetically evil.

I just want to point out that there is nothing wrong with treating something that is pretty much genetically evil, as less than human. If it was a choice, that's one thing, but the template makes them evil, and the likelyhood of ever redeeming from that is so low that it isn't even worth considering, like how it is scientifically possible to slam your hand on a table, and for your hand to go through the table, because all the particles of your hand and table, by sheer unbelievable luck, missed each other.

Yeah, it is possible, but are you really going to waste your time slamming your hand on a table to make the improbable happen?

So it is not evil to do this to a lich. This means good aligned churches can do this without falling.

In fact, there is a canon lich, who after being stuck in a demiplane for like a thousand years, will genuinely accept being good in exchange for the PCs freeing him, so if you do the same with a lich in op's scenario, after a thousand or so years, the lich might be willing to be a good boy or girl in exchange for freedom.

So not only are you helping future generations stop one of the most evil type of spellcaster, but you are working the very long game to redeem one of those evil spellcasters.

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Don't know if you know this already VoodistMonk, but the Spellscar Fever is an interesting change for the Mutant and Mana Waste Mutant templates.

Anyone who survives the disease for a week becomes immune to it, gains one of those templates, and can gain one of the new deformities in the disease in place of a deformity of the MWM template, or in place of one deformity and one mutation on the Mutant template.

So it offers 4 new mutations (one of them is Echolocation, but both better and worse than the Mutant template version, as it gives Blindsight instead of Blindsense, but at a shorter range, and you can't cast spells with verbal components, and take a penalty on stealth checks).

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The Mutant template on an Unfettered Eidolon.

Very fitting thematically.

154: You have both the Advanced template and Degenerate template at the same time (net result is +2 to Natural Armor).

So I want the identities to be clearly different, so having a mechanical application beyond the Disguise skill. Also, I don't want any magic (items or spells) that could have a theoretically infinite number of distinct identities.

Also, they don't necessarily need protection from Divination effects, so they don't have to have the protection of Vigilante's Dual Identity.

So to give an idea of what I would consider unique identities, here are some examples:

Carl the "Human" and Billy Bob the "Werewolf". He in actuality is a Skinwalker, who tries to keep his "Human" and "Werewolf" identities separate.

If you give him levels in Vigilante, you now have:

Carl the "Human" (Social Identity), Billy Bob the "Werewolf" (same Social Identity as Carl for Divination), Nightman the "Human" (Vigilante Identity), and Vicious Wolf the "Werewolf" (same Vigilante Identity as Nightman for Divination).

What are my options for expanding this? I want to blindside a group of friends by having them meet all the identities separately, only to discover it was all Carl* all along.

*Carl is just a placeholder name. I kinda want to name the character Dio, because of the meme, but I haven't actually watched JoJo's Bizare Adventure yet, so I probably wouldn't do it justice.

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Haven't done this yet (just thought up of the idea), but the Haunted One template, but instead of a random spirit, it is yourself, because your soul split in two or something.

Add in something that would allow your other half to take control, like the Possessed Creature template.

Alternativly, if the creature will have class levels, you could add in levels of Splintersoul Vigilante. This, combined with the thematic change to the Haunted One template, would allow you to make Moon Knight from Marvel Comics, or something similar.

Keep in mind that the weakness of the Haunted One template doesn't have to be used, as it says the rider only "typically" punishes the Haunted One for acting out of line, not that they always do so.

There is a template, Recycled Construct, that let's you use destroyed Constructs to replace some of the cost of a new Construct, but it also gives some malfunctions in certain situations.

I'd say you could sell it for half (because that is the price you sell items) of the cost (not price) of the construct, because half of the cost is removed for a Recycled Construct, and you sell items at half of their true value.

EDIT: I think I did my math wrong. You'd sell it at a quarter of the cost, because it is worth half of the cost, and you sell items at half off their true value.

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Not exactly legal, but I like giving the Energized (Golem) template to non Constructs.

It's just a fun template, and I find it odd it is not only limited to constructs, but even further limited to just golems.

For me, it'd have to be:

Human-Bane Merciful Sapping Furyborn AoMF

+4 Staunching Invulnerability BoA.

Taking 5 less damage and removing the biggest source of damage (up to 4 points) in real life, which is bleed damage (most slashing and piercing wounds in real life inflict bleed damage automatically, and significant bludgeoning wounds in real life can also inflict internal bleed damage).

In addition, Human-Bane is because I could never bring myself to hurt an animal, so something more universal would be inferior to Human-Bane, Merciful is so I never accidentally inflict lethal damage once I become good enough at fighting, Sapping is so I can inflict extra nonlethal damage, and Furyborn is so I can still get up to a +5 (+7 vs humans) enhancement bonus on my attacks.

What about you? What would you put on these items if you had them in real life?

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Speaking of Goblins, this is my favorite abomination:

Oversized Goblin (Alternate Racial Trait/Subrace from Monster Codex, that makes them Medium) with the following templates:

Ogrekin (can be applied to any Medium Humanoid; makes them part Ogre)

Giantkin Ogre (since they are an Ogre now)

Mongrel Giant (since they are a non Ogre Giant now)

You already know Mutant Goblin template

You already know about the Mutant template

Mana Wastes Mutant

Id Mutant


and then any CR +1 template. With PC Wealth at level 20, this is a CR 30 Goblin abomination.

If it is a Mythic game, remove the standing CR +1 template, Two-Headed, Id Mutant, and Mana Wastes Mutant. This makes them only CR 25, thus allowing a full Mythic Tier 10 to be added to them.

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VoodistMonk wrote:

This is neat. I hadn't ever looked at that particular template before. That would be a lot of fun to have available as a player.

I have never seen Goblins as weak, though, so this just makes them that much stronger. Goblins weren't screwed nearly as bad as Kobolds, and they [Goblins] rather excel at most of the available dex-to-damage options... of which, there are several.

Anyways, I will have to take a look at my Goblin characters to see if any are a good fit for the Mutant Goblin template. Thank you for showing that to me.

Oh, sorry, I forgot to say that some of that "CR decrease" was because almost all NPCs are going to have a starting attitude of Unfriendly, if not straight up Hostile, making things much harder on a Goblin PC. I don't always do that, but if I want Goblins to have the same general role in the game as canon, then the PC needs something to make up for this massive disadvantage.

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Goblin PCs all gain the Mutant Goblin template, with the following exceptions:

They can only gain the Extra Arm mutation once.

They cannot gain any mutation that isn't already detailed how it works, so the theoretical alternative options are not allowed.

Instead of Str +4 and Int -2, the goblin chooses a physical ability score to give a +4, and a mental ability score to give a -2.

The following are extra mutations (since at 20th level, they will be missing 2 mutations, due to only having so many options, with all of them being selectable only once):

Rugged (Ex): The goblin gains DR 1/-. If it has 5 Hit Dice or more, this increases to DR 2/-. If the creature has 10 HD or more, this increases to DR 5/-.

True Extra Arm (Ex): The extra arm from the extra arm mutation no longer functions as a vestigial arm, but as a natural arm. If the goblin has the two-weapon fighting feat, they can replace it with the multiweapon fighting feat, and if they have the two-weapon defense feat, they can replace it with the multiweapon defense feat. This mutation can only be selected if the extra arm mutation has been selected.

All of this is because they are about a -1 to CR compared to normal PCs, so it balances out.

Sorry for not responding sooner.

I think I will go with the Amulet of Mighty Fists route, so thanks for that suggestion.

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Derklord wrote:
Reksew_Trebla wrote:
So according to you, you can't make most weapons armor, shields, and tools with Fabricate. According to the spell, you can. Which means you are wrong on this point as well.
Where does it say that? I don't see the words "weapon", armor", shield" or "tool" in the spell description. Or any description of what you can create beyond "a product that is of the same material." (note the singular "material").
Fabricate wrote:
You must make an appropriate Craft check to fabricate articles requiring a high degree of craftsmanship.

Whether you like it or not, such items are going to be made of multiple materials, otherwise they wouldn't require a "high degree of craftsmanship".

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Diego Rossi wrote:

1) Making technological items require a laboratory, Fabricate isn't a laboratory.

2) Fabricate: "You convert material of one sort into a product that is of the same material."
Technological items generally aren't made from a single material.

1: Op already disproved this.

2: Most weapons, armor, shields, hell even ordinary tools, are made out of multiple materials (leather or wood for handles, steel for the main part, padding for armor, etc). So according to you, you can't make most weapons armor, shields, and tools with Fabricate. According to the spell, you can. Which means you are wrong on this point as well.

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Alright, I guess discontinue the Inquisitor rule, and instead just use your best judgment for it if you wish to treat it like a Hybrid class.

But Magus is still Fighter+Wizard.

Full disclosure, this is for Glinda the Good Witch of the South, from Oz The Great and Powerful, BUT BEFORE YOU MOVE THIS, it was never explained what her protection did, just that it would protect Oz, so I'm simply looking to see my possible options.

Prefer to be usable by Witches, particularly a Bonded Witch if it matters (Bonded Item is a Wand), but I can add extra stuff to her if needed, since she is a spellcaster somewhat by blood (father was the previous Wizard/King of Emerald City), so Sorcerer would not be out of the question (plus she is also called a Sorceress, more than Witch, in the books).

However, if it is a spell that simply is not on the Witch spell list, then there are rules for researching spells to add them to different spell lists. I don't want to do the option for straight up creating completely new spells, as I have a problem balancing homebrew, but spell research to add a spell to a different class's spell list is perfectly fine with me.

In addition, I'd prefer if the method of touch is either a kiss, or not stated (so I can fluff it as a kiss).

I appreciate any help with this.

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VoodistMonk wrote:
Reksew_Trebla wrote:
Is nobody gonna mention the Psychic Lich? Not only do they come back if destroyed, but their "Phylactery" (Memoir) gets restored if destroyed, unless you also destroy their Astral Legend.

Psychic Liches are still just Liches... destroying an Astral Legend is really no more involved than finding and destroying a phylactery/soul cage.

If you really want to throw a spanner in the works for the local Paladins, make it a Familial Lich... now they have to kill your bloodline. Lol. Some completely innocent soul whose only "sin" is being related to a Lich they don't even know about. Sorry little Sally, I know you be but seven, and you're loving and kind... but your great great great great great grandpa was very evil and you're the very last of their kin, so you have to die today.

Horrifying thought. What if Genghis Khan, of which 0.5% of all humans are believed to be descended from, became a Familial Lich?

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TxSam88 wrote:

What's the point? this is basically just gestalting the two parent classes with no drawbacks but a lot of extra paperwork.

Dude, it's just a fun thought exercise.

VoodistMonk wrote:
Best at what, exactly? ​

In general. If you need something more specific, basically, on average, which one would contribute the most to the group of PCs?

zza ni wrote:
an inquisitor (that i think should be paladin+cleric. same as you did magus for fighter+wizard) is not far behind and probably better at saves and attacks via bane, smite and judgment.

New rule, Inquisitor counts as a Hybrid of Paladin and Cleric.

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You are allowed Variant Multiclassing. Magus is treated as a Hybrid class of Wizard and Fighter, because let's be real, it's basically the precursor of the Hybrid classes.

Which class shines the most at level 20 with these rules?

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Is nobody gonna mention the Psychic Lich? Not only do they come back if destroyed, but their "Phylactery" (Memoir) gets restored if destroyed, unless you also destroy their Astral Legend.

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Phoebus Alexandros wrote:

I’ve never watched the show, but from what I gather Franko’s Oz is a con artist and a stage magician, right?

So maybe a Bard is a better starting point for that? Or better yet, a Rogue with either the Charlatan or the False Medium archetypes?

He is a con artist and stage magician, yes, but he is also a tinkerer and inventor.

He knew how to make fireworks, a smoke machine, and a moving image projector (projected onto the smoke from the smoke machine). He also knew how to make a pulley system for dummies to make it seem like they were alive and moving.

This isn't exactly what was said (I don't have access to the movie), but this conversation is helpful to knowing the theme of his skills:

China Girl: Do you grant wishes? The old wizard granted wishes.

Oz: No, I'm not that kind of wizard.

CG: Didn't think so.

*Small skip in conversation*

Oz: In fact, where I come from, there aren't any real wizards. *Pauses* Actually, there is one. Thomas Alva Edison. He made creations with electricity, like the light bulb, and even a picture that moves.

CG: A moving picture?

Oz: Yeah. And the best part of it all, he did it with nothing but a few bits of wire. He was a great man. That's the kind of wizard I want to be.

CG: You are that kind of wizard.

Oz: You think so?

CG: I know so.

I'm thinking maybe an alchemist, as he clearly isn't a wizard, just posing as one, and the alchemical gear of an alchemist can simulate that. While I do recognize it would be easier to be an actual wizard and fluff that you are merely posing as one, it kind of goes against the intent of the character.

But I don't have anything specific so far. So how would you build him?

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VoodistMonk wrote:
I have a Constructed Pugilist Brawler/Golemfist Magus already built. Lol. As well as a Living Weapon Brawler/Mindblade Magus. And a Constructed Pugilist-Living Weapon Brawler/Crossblooded Sorcerer Lich. All are Androids... part of my "51th robot regiment". There's also an Android Gunchemist/Eldritch Archer in there, too.

Try this:

Bladebound Magus//Phantom Blade Spiritualist.

You basically get a Black Blade twice, but one of them replaces the Phantom of the Spiritualist, and thus functions a little differently to keep with the theme of the Phantom.

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Jistkan Artificer//
Constructed Pugilist

I will admit I don't remember how well the two arms would stack as a single arm, but there is no real need for that, as you can simply have both of your arms be replaced, one for each class.

Bonus Points: Play a Kasatha, replace your remaining two arms and your two legs with Clockwork Prosthesis, and get yourself 4 Plasma Blades. You are now General Grievious.

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