Iron Gods: Forged into Legends

Game Master polyfrequencies

I'm guessing 'Mending' doesn't fix timeworn technology?

What about higher level spells?

I don't believe there is a way to "fix" timeworn. Except Wish and Miracle.

No; Timeworn is a condition that should be VERY difficult to remove. The spell Memory of Function can't do it, so anything lower level than that shouldn't as well. A miracle or wish could do it, but otherwise, there's nothing in the game at this point that specifically removes timeworn from an item.

Link to post

Of note though. Timeworn only has issues occasionally. Specifically:

• When an item is first used after a month or more of inactivity.
• Anytime a single-use consumable is used.
• When using an item in a way that would drain its last charge.
• When an item requires a d20 roll (such as a skill check or an attack roll) to activate or use, and that roll results in a natural 1.
• When a critical hit is confirmed against the wearer of an active defensive item, such as armor or a force field.

All things we will need to remember to do.

@Basil NaN - You there? Since we are just 3 players, I want to make sure everyone is there. Hopefully you are doing ok. The world is crazy, and I hope everything is fine.

same ^^

Aye, I am there. Apologies...I did post but it seems not to have gone through. My unpaid leave is over and work is...very demanding currently - especially with 3 kids at home and compulsory home office.

I suspect I may have only previewed and forgotten to submit. I will post shortly. I am here, but mostly depending on "new posts" to realize I may need to act.

Happy you are there.

I totally understand the stress of working from home with kids. Its a whole other beast.

Thanks for checking in :)

so...
Light Ballista on a Light Wagon for 350gp of our team funds? XD
Maybe like 10 bolts for it for another 100gp?

@DM Nex: is a light ballista too heavy for a light wagon?

I realized I did not yet spend the money.
I did formally state I spent the time upgrading my blunderbuss, but did not yet update.
When I find some time, I will check exactly how much things cost. Whatever I have left, I will gladly contribute from my personal funds, considering I will likely get to enjoy the Ballistae, if anybody :)

@GM: Are there "durable" Ballistae Bolts? at what cost? I would prefer not needing to track single shots we make that could be retrievable, it's more of a quality-of-life thing.

Anybody have Profession(Gunner)? That's what you need for siege engines as I understand.

My Archetype is Siege Gunner.

I get Siege Engineer and Master Siege Engineer instead of the normal Gunslinger Bonus Feats at 4 and 8.

You only need Profession(Siege Engineer) for a few aspects(like using a Corvus(boarding spike) or Heavy Catapult).
Penalties for size are avoided by even having Knowledge(Engineering).
Also, all Siege Weapons are usually exotic weapons. Luckily, not for me. I am proficient with all Siege Weapons.

So I am taking no penalty and can freely use the ballista. Yay.

I am happy with 50% recoverable ammo on a ballista. I think that is the rule for arrows anyway, so its just scaled up.

I think a light ballista would be fine on a light wagon, though I don't think you can be moving while it's firing.

That makes sense...

All I know is that Catapults are really complicated for the usage. Ballista should be easier in the end. Its really just a big crossbow with a crank.

Seeing as how durable arrows cost 1gp vs 1gp for 20 normal arrows, I'd guess that it's 200gp for a durable scorpion bolt.
at 50% retrieval for bolts that miss their target, we might just want extra bolts xD
(I'll track them on the loot sheet if you want)

Which reminds me, light wagons can carry 1000 lbs and those bolts are 10 lbs each, but what about the ballista? I can't find a number for its weight ^^;;
Based on this wiki page I'd guess that wood stuff that large is heavy enough to weigh more than a person.
Maybe 200~300 lbs?
Up to you @DM Nex ^^;

Ballista specifically points out that it can be mounted on vehicles.

So we should be fine.

As for firing while shooting: That should, technically, also be possible. Albeit at the same penalties as mounted archery, I would assume. (-4 on attack if mount is double-moving, -8 on attack if mount is running)

@Ballista and Durable Bolts: The conceptual idea I had was based on the fact a Ballista Bolt is already significantly more massive than an arrow - I was thinking about making it more like a Whaling Harpoon(but without a rope/retraction/lock mechanism.) Just like, make the whole thing from metal and sturdy enough that some maintainance makes it all good again even if it gets stuck in a tree or hits a rock. *shrug*

Technically, I agree that just getting more Bolts would be easier. But I found out that I hate ammo tracking which is bad if every shot of your weapon costs like ~10 gold. :P I look forward to the time where I can just set aside a fixed budget of "consumables" gold and never worry about ammo again.

Heck, maybe at some point we can get a "Endless Ammunition" Version of the Ballista(it IS a huge crossbow effectively, so should be valid), where I can fire once per round. It's a novelty item mostly, but if there's a game where I can use siege engines, by the gods, I want to make use of it :)
(especially if at some time we can get a siege weapon with scatter for utmost overkill ;) )

Smaller ballista have javelin to short-spear sized bolts. The damage is in the machine not the bolt. Bigger ones are full size spears with massive metal heads on them for extra weight and punch (to go through a ship's hull). It's damage is a based on both machine strength and mass.

That's real world stuff however. Pathfinder on the other hand...IN pathfinder you CAN crit with a siege engine!

=)

I like the siege engines that have dozens of tubes filled with arrows and launch an area of effect shoot!

The Korean Hwacha? (If I'm not mistaken, that thing was literally just a Korean weapon.)
<3 Mythbusters

Sort of, but with no rockets. Basically it is similar to a ballista with a large flat board attached to a frame with tubes. Arrows are placed in the tubes (not very quickly - reload time sucks) and then with a pull of the trigger the board strikes the arrows all at once and they are launched into the air...then they rain down on the target area. Pretty much spray and pray.

@Damage: Aye, but thats why I say, making the ammunition more durable might be possible - the complexity is in the launching apparatus.

@Crit: Well, I do assume that a ballista bolt cutting open your arm in passing is painful, but getting it to the face IS a bit more damaging.

Crits, to me, never were part of the attack process(a higher crit range just meant more options to cause devastating damage in a number of target areas) but more about the defender being hit in a way that causes terrible damage...

@Bolt Scatter:

This massive ballista fires a dozen or more bolts at once in a devastating rain of steel that deals 3d8 points of damage. The crew leader makes a separate attack roll with a –2 penalty against each creature and object within a 60-foot cone, ignoring concealment. Confirm any critical threats separately. This weapon has a mishap only if the first attack roll is a mishap. A manticore’s tail has a hardness of 5 and 100 hit points. Ammunition for one use of the manticore’s tail costs 120 gp and weighs 120 pounds. Source Hold of the Orc Hordes

It would be my dream siege weapon.

If we are ever doing mass combat...this will clean up pretty fast...

...let's get the infinite-ammo cart-mounted ballista first xD

@DM Nex: does a cart count as a container for the purposes of Abundant Ammunition? Gwhahahaha...

I see what you are thinking. I just assumed since you are using a light wagon it really can't hold much on its own. Let alone fire as well. I guess I just made a call in terms of weight. I am not sure how big a smaller ballista would be, I am picturing decently large still. Bigger than a heavy crossbow for sure.

As for the bolts themselves, having one on a chain that you can retrieve would be pretty difficult. It would first need to be a pretty long rope, which would add weight. And they shoot far and fast. Pulling those back would take a good long while. Though if you wish to do it we can come up with something.

@Thawm - I am going to say that Abundant Ammunition does not work for the huge bolts :). Like they have been said it is mostly large spears.

--
All that being said, if you wanted to buy slightly more expensive siege bolts (say 3x the cost) you can get it to be a solid metal one. You would be able to retrieve them, unless they are broken though other means (like right into the side of a robot that crushes it). As for Retrieving them in combat, not really going to work, I think. But it should still let you save some, if you have time to get them back after a fight.

Wagon, Light: Cargo Up to 1,000 lbs. => so there's our cargo limit for a light wagon.
Ballista: A ballista is essentially a Huge heavy crossbow fixed in place.
Heavy Crossbow: 8 lbs
Weight: This column gives the weight of a Medium version of the weapon. Halve this number for Small weapons and double it for Large weapons.
8*2(large)*2(huge)= 32 lbs plus the "fixed in place" - should not be more than 100 lbs total.

@retrieve: I don't want to retrieve them, what I meant was that those "harpoon" bolts are "reusable" - you retrieve them, shoot them again. Apologies for the confusion.
I just meant that solid iron bolts may need some maintainance if they hit something they shouldn't, or pierced some armor, but SHOULD generally be useable again if they can be retrieved. Unlike wooden bolts that may splinter, or bend in a way that can't be fixed(unlike bent iron).
The Harpoon mechanic was simply in that it may hit a target, then get retrieved, maintained, and used again for the next target, because it was designed that way.
I was imagining a "slim"-er bolt with the same weight, made of metal instead of wood. It would have the same "impact"/damage physics-wise(with the head identical), but may be reuseable.
Basically exactly what you suggest at the bottom - Pay an upmark(say 3 times normal price) and only mark down ones "lost", assuming all others to be retrieved after combat. Basically cut down on bookkeeping.
Since "consumables" are usually only part of the WBL that gets replenished, we can even streamline that and make it a one-time investment that gets "stocked up" every time we have the option to do so.(saves you from adding extra treasure in the value of "consumables spent" and us from formally purchasing replacement)

@Abundant Ammunition: Actually a good idea, and considering it's effectively a "Huge crossbow", those would be huge crossbow bolts.
While they may be more spear-like for a human, I figure the spell should still work for a cloud giant with a crossbow...so we'd have a theoretical precedent to make this work ;)

Well, maybe if we have a cloud giant quiver? xD

Didn't there use to be old spells that summoned siege weapon ammo with special abilities? Maybe back in 3.5 D&D.

[side-quest] Find and slay a huge-sized humanoid and steal his quiver

Alas, I am not allowed to simply look at the base value and "upgrade" into a cheaper weapon, since the starting firearm has special restrictions. Effectively, I would need to completely rebuild it.
In which case, I'll go for a Paddlefoot Pistol, which uses a 20-foot cone for scatter and has 20 foot range for bullets, AND allows me to pre-load all 4 barrels with powder+ammo, reducing need for cartridges(thus saving money).
It costs 2500 base, so 1250 in raw materials. Plus 150 GP for Masterwork, or 1400 total for the weapon.
Making it a +1 Magic Weapon is another 2000 raw, or 1000 for crafting.
So in total, I'll spend 2400 of my money to turn my Blunderbuss(total reconstruction) into a +1 Paddlefoot Pistol.
75 more are going towards the 25 Adamantine Bullets from scrap metal, and the other 25 to replenish ammo spent.

In summary, I am out of money simply upping my weapon and getting ammo.

I am fine selling the Veemod to pay for Cart, Horse, Ballista and Ammo?

EDIT: Oh my. Enchantment is halfway between cost and full. So 1500 for +1, which puts me at -500.
If Council is unwilling to dip into 8000 for outfitting, I'll need to run up a debt with you guys, or push to sell more.

But I am dependent on scatter to be effective, and I doubt I'll be able to upgrade easily in the near future, so I absolutely want to have a +1 gun available before we depart...
(worst case I stick with the blunderbuss, but that just makes things more complicated later...)

I told your logic to my wife, and she told me "Sounds like they got you. Also it sounds exactly like your logic"

So here it is:

You can totally cast Abundant Ammunition on a container that can hold the bolts. They just have to be plain wood ones.

The cart can totally shoot and move, but I might have issue with it moving while gauntlet is also summoned. He might be a bit heavy.

I think you could argue for an advance on the gold.

So

Cart, Horse, Ballista, Ammo, "quiver for maybe spells".

Most things I am just going to let go unroleplayed, but things like a horse and stuff I might want to flavor :)

Final sound off, and 3 go aheads and we will push forward.

You have a direction via map. I will show you the map and their suggestion of how to get there tomorrow.

@Basil: no worries, we have team funds to loan you 500 xD
Consider your share 3000 this time and I'll just subtract 500 from your share next time :3
edit2: apparently we can get a loan from the town, so we'll take that instead xD

Also, I'll mark down the cart o' doom's stuff on the doc, and the only thing I need to know before that's done is:

@DM Nex: How much for a huge sized quiver? :3
Or does it come for free with 10 huge sized bolts? xD
(Note: if we were actually shopping in a cloud-giant store, I'd actually expect a free quiver with our 10 bolts, lol)

Lewt notes: I'll just sell the Veemod and the chemalyzer really quick...
edit: we'll be spending 760 instead of 450 of our team funds on a doom-mobile, apparently I misread the price of a light ballista earlier (it's 500gp, not 300gp) and I forgot about the horse ^^;
but the 825gp from the Veemod + Chemalyzer is more than enough xD

@Keldor & Basil: If you've each taken an amulet of natural armor from the lewt pile, please delete that line of lewt ^^
@Basil: Did you add the grenades to your character sheet yet? :3
Apparently, identifying items should enable us to know exactly how they work, so their blast radius etc shouldn't be OOC knowledge at this point...

I deleted the Amulet. I could not find a way to do a Strikeout on the Doc.

excellent ^^
(I think ctrl+S works, but deleting it is probably better)

I gain no use from the amulet at THIS time.
(Due to the Torch Fluids with -2 Dex and +2 Natural Armor :P)
So the question is if we should hold on to it, or sell it now and hope to get another at a later time.
GM stated the fluids effects last months, and I don't even know if we have much downtime in this AP.

If nothing else, I can upgrade it later xD
Just wait until 7th level when I can get Ring of Sustenance, then I'll have all the time to craft xD

But that just means you'll sleep 2 hours instead of 8.

Why not become an Android and never sleep again?
No electronic sheep here.

your ersatz magic doesn't tempt me ;p

The quiver just needs to be something that sits on the cart, it is not as special as something you would wear. I am find with it being part of the cost of the "bolts"

I will make a note that next time yall are at a Giant General store :)

BTW, apparently wagons ("Cart or wagon") travel 2mi/hr, which is the same as a PC with a move speed of 20'
I think our wagon o' doom will mostly serve to double the move speed of our scorpion and allow the horse to spend actions instead of us xD

But that's Oregon Trail Cross Country for a fully loaded wagon.

Vehicles defines the speed as dependent on the draft animal.

With the light load of us and the scorpion, we should be able to easily go with the horses regular speed(well, the loaded regular speed) - ESPECIALLY if we use a road, or what passes for one around here :)

Ah, thanks for finding that, I couldn't find the double animal's max speed anywhere xD
Sounds like during combat the animal can just double move for us or something if we don't change speeds :3

You're welcome :)

Also @Encounters - not every encounter rolled automatically has to be a combat encounter. As said, we are 3 individuals without goods, extensively armed, in our prime. Even raiders or other potential combatants may opt to evade us(making us their random encounter) or approach us in a non-hostile manner.

Just mentioning that - but I don't mind getting a chance to test out our ballistae in the slightest. If one of you assists with loading, we can even shoot once per turn(and roll alternatingly, just to share the fun).
(i.e. I think an overland chase would actually be fun, with one person driving the cart and the other two fighting off wanna-be outlaws.)

Give me one more level and I can actually have Gauntlet fly for short periods. Seeing him 'Launch' from a moving cart would be interesting I think.
=)

Val walks forward with a tightly wrapped bundle "This is for you three. Some fresh baked food, as well as at least 2 weeks of tried food to keep you going if needed. I don't know what type of foodwill be available at Scrapwall"

I presume the fresh bread lasts us a day.

@Keldor, did you spend your sack of gold? (I'm talking about the 60lbs of gold coins, haha
50lbs of that would've been for the hedgecloak thing from forever ago.
Did you want to spend any of the other 500gp?)

Unless told otherwise, I'll assume both that
a) Keldor isn't spending his 500 gp
and
b) Keldor and Thawm's shares of 500gp can be 50pp, so that Thawm can hoard EVERYTHING in her haversack, muwahahhaaha

I thought I spent most of my gps on the cloak.

The 2 weeks are the 14 lbs of trailmix.

The 2 weeks are the 14 lbs of trailmix.

Thanks for the clarification ^^

I thought I spent most of my gps on the cloak.

You did. And then we got a 1500gp prepayment on our reward money so that Basil could afford an upgrade that was 3/4 price instead of 1/2

Which means you have 50pp to spend, if you want. If not, Thawm will keep it with the rest of the loot, muwhahahaha.

I'll make sure to update my sheet ASAP when the kids sleep :) then respond in-game.

yeah, you got that 3k you needed xD
And don't forget the grenades :D
Unless you want Thawm to burn through them xD

@GM: Ummm, can an unseen servant help load the ballista? A single bolt is only half of its max load :D

edit:

Keep it as 'Team Funds' then. Keldor doesn't need it now and he's a Paladin now too, so he wary of losing touch with his good side with too much GPs in hand right now.

Can you strap a grenade or build on into a Balista bolt? Unguided non-magic Missile!
=)

Now all we need is a couple 'javelins of lighting' that will fit into the machine too...
=)

I don't think the Unseen servant has the "skills" to help. But if you find a post arguing that, let me know.

Reminder you all need rest (even the android needs some downtime, right. I see you are immune to sleep effects, but that doesn't mean you don't sleep/shut down. Elves are like that too).

Actually, not quite.

If there is no reason to rest for spellcasting, then an android could simply go on and on and on by RAW.

In a fluff source, an android even states that she has no need for sleep, but still rests, while somewhere else it was quoted that as humanoids, they still eat, drink and sleep.

But with no mechanical enforcement of that - it could as well mean they operate for 80 years, then sleep for 30 before reawakening with a blank mind. It could mean they can operate for 30 days straight, then at some point decide to shut down for 2 days in some deep sleep while they cleanse their system of neurotoxins. It is ill-defined.

I did agree, as compromise, to only do "light" activity for 8 hours per day, as a means of "resting". no crafting or other "productive" work. But Watch Duty IS light activity.
So the other two should split, I should be available for both shifts.