Ederion should not be a 'principle damage dealer' :P
I'm pretty sure Aster was talking about the ring of protection, rather than the shield.
Actually I think Ederion is the principle damage dealer. Bazzle will contend with that when he gets a sneak attack in, but Tarnagius is the tank of the group. He's gone for the bodyguard/in-harm's-way build. Aster is very resilient, but doesn't hit all that hard.
Yep, Aster is not a crusher of skulls in one hit kind of person. More of a whittler of skulls.
Ring of protection +1 to Bazzle.
Quick Runner Shirt to Aster, throw out objections if you so desire, otherwise it is done.
Belt going to Tarn to shore up his hit points?
Hmmmmm Ederion principle damage dealer - might be lacking. We need... A Barbarian :P
Though me and Bazzle + some flanks... Who knows? ;)
I was thinking an archer or blaster myself. Frontline is getting a little crowded.
Belt is currently going to Bazzle to shore up his hit points. Tarn can fight for it when he gets back.
Frontline is crowded by non frontliners :/
Ederion has terrible Fort, Will and HP... He can't be the main target - he's too brittle, and built to advance with the second wave :D
[I could have easily built him as more of a frontliner, still an Investigator but he would have been an half-orc with definitely good overall saves, a different stat spread, wielding morningstar+shield or polearm ;)]
Curiously enough I did not submit a STR based Investigator because I was already playing one in another game which died away :P
I feel bad for games that die off. Been part of many of them myself.
You guys may not be the unstoppable force, but you're pretty immovable. You have good support skills, defensive options, and a lot of skill utility. Healing is a little limited, but not terrible by any means. I can definitely work with that.
I find that Rise of the Runelords is a bit of a dungeon crawl, while Hell's Rebels has a lot less combat (unless the party opts to solve everything by combat). In many of the adventures, Hell's Rebels offers different ways of achieving the goal, be it by combat, diplomacy, skullduggery, among others.
I gotta agree, we have a good character combo - we'll make t work, I'm sure. It's gonna be a struggle though ;)
It's gonna be a struggle though ;)
That's the fun part!
Yes!!! sorry, happy that worked, at least so far :)
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Here are my thoughts of the encounter:
More refinement of ghosts necessary.
- Though the moan of fear wasn't exactly overpowered for this level at a 1v5, and could definitely be outplayed with retreat, the -2 on saves due to being scared made it very difficult to shake off.
- I also think it would have been beneficial for me to have provided salt and/or holy water for protection or creative solutions. Something that removes fear (like a scroll) might have been a good idea to have been placed earlier in the dungeon.
- There were too many times when people felt like their skills or abilities couldn't be useful in the encounter (especially before manifestation). Activity raised when the illusions popped out, but declined afterwards.
- I need to find a way to convey what needs to be done in order to calm down the ghost before things get too out of hand.
- I think locking the group in the room was a mistake, and I should have made it clear when the group was locked in vs when they weren't.
As written, the book has three Wretchghosts appear and attack you. It's a very difficult fight, but also fairly basic. What I disliked most about this written encounter is that there was no story attached to it. It doesn't show the atrocities that befell the people who were around when the Order rampaged through the Lucky Bones. I'm not saying I did a great job at it either, but it was my goal.
What I was trying to do:
To give ghosts a scary, ... ghostly feeling. In normal play, a ghost simply appears and is either invincible (due to the party not having the right weapons) or just a normal enemy (once the party does have the right weapons). There's no fear or mystery. It's just another monster to kill.
I wanted to have a ghost start out more like a haunt, and then as the rounds pass grow in power and severity. If the ghost manifests, it's a race against time to appease it or destroy it.
I hope there were still some parts that people enjoyed, and I'll make sure to make things way more clear should we encounter any more ghosts. If you'd like to weigh in about this encounter, I'd be happy to hear what you have to say. Thanks.
Fox, this is why I think you are one of the best GMs I have encountered :D
I think your analysis is spot on in all aspects - from my end as a player, these are the more relevant bits:
- I also think it would have been beneficial for me to have provided salt and/or holy water for protection or creative solutions. Something that removes fear (like a scroll) might have been a good idea to have been placed earlier in the dungeon.
- There were too many times when people felt like their skills or abilities couldn't be useful in the encounter (especially before manifestation). Activity raised when the illusions popped out, but declined afterwards.
- I need to find a way to convey what needs to be done in order to calm down the ghost before things get too out of hand.
I also think this is a GREAT idea:
What I was trying to do:
To give ghosts a scary, ... ghostly feeling. In normal play, a ghost simply appears and is either invincible (due to the party not having the right weapons) or just a normal enemy (once the party does have the right weapons). There's no fear or mystery. It's just another monster to kill.
I wanted to have a ghost start out more like a haunt, and then as the rounds pass grow in power and severity. If the ghost manifests, it's a race against time to appease it or destroy it.
Always had issues with the design of this monster exactly because of the reasons you have pointed out. So starting with smaller manifestations which grow in power and danger seems very solid.
I may have missed some detail, but in this specific case, the hard part was to determine what conditions needed to be met to handle this - 'Some sort of traumatic death or unfinished business has warped the magic inherent in the world until the business is fulfilled'
I quite enjoyed it. Though Aster got lucky and could actually try things. I've always hated reading a module and then doing what it says, which would LOSE so much story it was insane. And I like it when it isn't just about skill checks and attack rolls. Those are important of course, very important.
So some way to break out of the fear, like Tarn did with our bedridden temptress(not fear but same idea), would be nice.
The visions gave several ideas of what to do, though the compassion bit was just stumbled on with her attempting to free the ghost. Aster is a nurturing person so it just worked. Tarn might have tried the same thing but might have not been as nice about it and then poop.
Might also need a contingency. If someone came up with the idea of destroying the bodies, they would have been beyond the ability to show compassion to.
Thank you!! Both of you, I really appreciate your support. I'll keep working on perfecting ghosts, because ghosts naturally show up in any story.
I may have missed some detail, but in this specific case, the hard part was to determine what conditions needed to be met to handle this - 'Some sort of traumatic death or unfinished business has warped the magic inherent in the world until the business is fulfilled'
In this case, the noble's traumatic death was that he died lonely and unloved. His unfinished business was that he wanted to feel loved. I didn't make it clear enough, and the backdrop of savagery and cannibalism took center stage. It might have been better to omit death by cannibalism, and instead have had him die alone by overdose.
So some way to break out of the fear, like Tarn did with our bedridden temptress(not fear but same idea), would be nice.
Tarn's situation was me rewarding an out of the box idea from a player, which I was extra inclined to do since the encounter was really going downhill. The fear effect is definitely a pain, but I think if I were to have gotten rid of that -2 penalty for the recovery roll it would have worked out better. What I'm wondering more is the fear effect itself. Telling a player that they can't do anything is pretty rough.
Might also need a contingency. If someone came up with the idea of destroying the bodies, they would have been beyond the ability to show compassion to.
My contingency was that the ghost could be killed. It wouldn't disappear forever, but long enough that you could loot the room and get out. Destroying the body is an interesting idea. I'm not sure what I'd do in that instance.
On adding d6 to rolls, Ederion gets this from two specific sources:
- Swashbuckler Derring-Do (Ex): At 1st level, a swashbuckler can spend 1 panache point when she makes an Acrobatics, Climb, Escape Artist, Fly, Ride, or Swim check to roll 1d6 and add the result to the check. She can do this after she makes the check but before the result is revealed. If the result of the d6 roll is a natural 6, she rolls another 1d6 and adds it to the check. She can continue to do this as long as she rolls natural 6s, up to a number of times equal to her Dexterity modifier (minimum 1);
And
- Investigator Inspiration (Ex): As a free action, he can expend one use of inspiration from his pool to add 1d6 to the result of that check, including any on which he takes 10 or 20. This choice is made after the check is rolled and before the results are revealed. An investigator can only use inspiration once per check or roll. The investigator can use inspiration on any Knowledge, Linguistics, or Spellcraft skill checks without expending a use of inspiration, provided he’s trained in the skill.
Thanks Ederion
Merry Christmas everyone!!! HOHOHO!!! :D
To you as well sir, and to EVERYONE!
Merry Christmas everyone. How are you spending your holidays? I'm staying with my parents for dinner, and then I'll visit my girlfriend and her family. Keeping things really low-key.
Merry Christmas!!!!
In-laws until tomorrow morning, then my parents then a hurried drive home for finally being at home. I like home.
Poor Aster. I like home too.
Just to give you a late heads up: I plan to bot characters on January 2nd. Figured people are out of commission until the holidays are completely over.
As a side note: Tarnagius has been gone since mid October. I'm sad that he never came back, but I think it's time we start considering if we want to hire a new player. A frontliner of some sort.
Agreed Fox - like I said before, I wouldn't mind trying to find a replacement for Tarnagius, but I'll go with whatever the group decides.
As for botting, the next couple days will be busy with New Year and traveling, so I will probably resume posting only on the 3rd January ;)
Yeah, we need a new stabby guy. I hope I didn’t scare him off!
I think he disappeared from the forums completely, not just from here. I hope he is okay. I agree though we should find a replacement.
Yeah we probably need another.
Does anyone have a recommendation for someone who they think would fit in with this game?
Yes Tarn left all of his games. I don't think it was you, Rexandi ^^
Urrrrpppp
Is that a "hey can I play" burp, Phillip?
I unnoo.. need more whiskey.
At least I wouldn't scalp anyone!
Just um...Smash their brains in.
Hmm...
I'll think about it, Andrea1. I'll get back to you ASAP
Andrea1, if you'd still like to join this game, would you please apply for it in the following recruitment thread? I'll make sure to consider our past games together when I select the winner. Thanks!
So for my 4 players: I've put up a recruitment thread to find a replacement for Tarnagius. When the time comes to select a winner, I would really like for each of you to tell me your top 3 picks. So take a look whenever you've got the time and think about which characters you like best.
Will do
You got it, boss!
Am on it ;)
Real talk: Is there anyone here who is not using background skills?
I'm using them.
Aster is as well.
Any thoughts on the applicants so far?
I haven't read enough of them. Sorry sir. I'm stuck in interviewing hell at work, so almost too much reality in the process in it at the moment.
I will though. I promise. Tomorrow?
PM sent RE: Applicants.
I'll send you a PM Fox, but was waiting to see if there are more submissions.
Why do people NOT show up to interviews! They go through all the trouble of setting it up, have plenty of back and forth, and then the time comes and no one, and no email, and no call, and no NOTHING!
Ugh... sorry, venting. I sent in my thoughts on the applicants so far Treasure, as promised. Now will find a game where I can kill things.
Hey just wanted to give you a heads up. I just started a new job and my normal routine has been thrown out the window. I MIGHT get a post in tonight, but otherwise tomorrow for sure. Weekends are now officially my best days for multiple posts.
Sorry if things have been a little slow lately. I'll do my best to get it back on track. Thanks
Real life is important as well, we understand :)
AND Congrats Treasure!!!!!
Thanks Aster.
And if anyone is wondering, no I did not travel out of country to get a job where Aster is hiring.
Regarding the recruitment: I've heard from almost everyone now. If you wouldn't mind taking a look on the 12th for the newer applicants, I'd really appreciate it. Thanks.
That would be pretty cool. I could be like, you know you have a review coming up, do you REALLY want to send a horde of bugbears at me. :)