I was considering making an Eldritch Knight, but I'm a little curious about their spell critical ability. Since it requires a Swift Action to use, you cannot combine it with the arcane armor training feats (or arcane strike for that matter). I was wondering what people can come up with to get around this.
The only options I can think of are:
Use armors with low spell failure chance, such as mithril chainmail.
Rely on mage armor and protective spells/control spells
Rely on bracers of armor and protective spells/control spells
The bracers of armor options seems the best, however it is quite expensive compared to the equivalent AC through a mithril chain shirt.
I don't suppose anyone knows of any item enchants that can reduce arcane spell failure?
Going Dex based with Bracers of Armor really isn't that bad of an option. A +8 bonus to armor is nice, considering it's better than +5 Leather Armor. Add in good Dex and you should be moderately ok.
Also, consider researching higher level versions of Mage Armor if you are in a homegame. I've never had a DM say that my wizard wouldn't be able to figure out how to make a Greater Mage Armor spell of a much higher level in order to get a better Armor bonus out of it, or even add some effects to it that are usually on enchanted armors.
The only problem with Bracers of armor +8 is that they are over twice as expensive as chainmail +5, and they have one less armor. But I like the enhanced mage armor spell. My DM loves adding our own spells so I don't think that'd be a problem.
I was considering making an Eldritch Knight, but I'm a little curious about their spell critical ability. Since it requires a Swift Action to use, you cannot combine it with the arcane armor training feats (or arcane strike for that matter). I was wondering what people can come up with to get around this.
Talk to your GM. Personally, I wouldn't have a problem in changing Spell Critical into "once per round, as a free action" instead of being a swift action. It is their pinnacle ability after all, and if they aren't able to use arcane armor training, I don't who is.
Eventhough he allows that, you might consider using arcane strike instead of arcane armor training. I personally find the 3-4 damage per hit worth it, since I'd properly make an eldritch knight a two weapon fighter, to get the highest crit chance.
Personally I'd rule that a swift action spell is cast so quickly that there's little time for big gestures. So I'd just scratch any arcane spell failure chance for immediate or swift spells. Not the somatic component itself, however.
I was considering making an Eldritch Knight, but I'm a little curious about their spell critical ability. Since it requires a Swift Action to use, you cannot combine it with the arcane armor training feats (or arcane strike for that matter). I was wondering what people can come up with to get around this.
Talk to your GM. Personally, I wouldn't have a problem in changing Spell Critical into "once per round, as a free action" instead of being a swift action. It is their pinnacle ability after all, and if they aren't able to use arcane armor training, I don't who is.
Eventhough he allows that, you might consider using arcane strike instead of arcane armor training. I personally find the 3-4 damage per hit worth it, since I'd properly make an eldritch knight a two weapon fighter, to get the highest crit chance.
I would make the Arcane Armor feats not require an action, and just give flat ASF reduction. That seems totally fine to me.
I would keep spell critical as a swift action, which would mean a choice between constant damage from Arcane Strike and the chance of casting a spell on a crit.
Also, you can't cast spells (even swift ones) while TWF unless you have the ability to use a weapon for somatic components (like Arcane Duelist ability) or the spell has no somatic component. Otherwise, an Eldritch Knight TWF with kukris would be awesome.
Still Spell.
Yes, you give up a level of spells(technically), but you now have no chance of lossing the spell because you are in armor. And you now have one more feat to choose, since Still Spell means you don't need the Arcane Armor feats.
Good for a few spells, but memming all of your spells at +1 spell level is an ugly solution. You won't even be able to with your highest level spells, not to mention the spell slots for your most powerful spells will be taken up by spells a level lower. This has a cascade effect that in turn, reduces your power pretty drastically.
For a few spells it's ok though. A rod of still spell might be nice too, but you'll need to sheathe a weapon, draw the rod, sheathe the rod, and redraw your weapon. Meh.
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Still Spell.
Yes, you give up a level of spells(technically), but you now have no chance of lossing the spell because you are in armor. And you now have one more feat to choose, since Still Spell means you don't need the Arcane Armor feats.
Good for a few spells, but memming all of your spells at +1 spell level is an ugly solution. You won't even be able to with your highest level spells, not to mention the spell slots for your most powerful spells will be taken up by spells a level lower. This has a cascade effect that in turn, reduces your power pretty drastically.
For a few spells it's ok though. A rod of still spell might be nice too, but you'll need to sheathe a weapon, draw the rod, sheathe the rod, and redraw your weapon. Meh.
Or don't use a shield and hold the rod in your hand.
Good for a few spells, but memming all of your spells at +1 spell level is an ugly solution.Still Spell.
Yes, you give up a level of spells(technically), but you now have no chance of lossing the spell because you are in armor. And you now have one more feat to choose, since Still Spell means you don't need the Arcane Armor feats.
There are some decent Verbal component only spells at most levels (core rulebook only) to help alleviate the problem.
The only options I can think of are:
Use armors with low spell failure chance, such as mithril chainmail.
Rely on mage armor and protective spells/control spells
Rely on bracers of armor and protective spells/control spells
You forgot what is probably the best option for the Eldritch knight:
Still spell.
I know, I know metamagic hate and what not -- bear with me:
The Eldritch knight has some universal problems:
Low AC (in theory)
Feat starved (in theory)
and Action economy issues (not a theory but solvable).
All these play into each other of course -- unless you take the still spell metamagic feat.
It frees up your action economy since it doesn't require an action (if prepared caster), it doesn't cost as many feats as arcane armor training (and mastery) and it gives you the most bang for your buck with AC since you can now use full plate and a tower shield if you so choose.
Also several of your buffs are things you'll cast before you put your armor on: False life, and extended heroism, what not, or don't need still spell (dimension door).
So what you do is take still spell cast your pre armor spells put the armor on (with the help of your unseen servant) then put on that full plate +5 and pick up the buckler +5 (buckler so you can choose between shield and two handed fighting) -- now you have +20 to your AC (+10 without the magic).
If you are looking for an Eldritch Knight that capitalizes on the Spell Critical ability, you don't want to wear armor. Sorry.
A common misconception is that the Eldritch Knight "does battle" in melee. The only perk of the EK class that makes you think that he is a fighter, is his great BAB. But, it is SO misleading.
Eldritch Knight - can't wear armor. Using the Arcane Armor feats is a feat trap and a waste of time. Using Still spell to overcome this obstacle, even BIGGER waste of a feat and spell slots. Sorry, you are a "pure" Eldritch Knight. This means that you are better than a squishy...you are a plushy.
Eldritch Knight - mediocre spells. You don't get as many spells. It is why I generally recommend going sorcerer, what you lose in versatility can be made up in # of castings, especially since you will be losing caster levels left and right.
Eldritch Knight - wimpy BAB. Lets face it, to qualify for EK, you have to lose 3 potential BAB, this puts you behind the race and means that you really don't want to get into melee, since your iterative attacks will most likely miss.
This probably makes you think, why on Earth would anyone ever consider making an Eldritch Knight? Easy Answer. Hands down, the best arcane archer build possible. Let's explore...
Sorcerer 6/Fighter 1/Eldritch Knight 10/Arcane Archer 3
BAB: 17
Caster Level: 17
The real key here is the synergy. With Rapid Shot and Multishot [and haste] you get +17/+17/+17/+12/+7/+2. This is 6 tries at a crit. With improved critical on your bow you have 6 chances at a 1/10 attempt to get a crit...that is a good chance. Remember a full round attack only uses standard + move...leaving your swift to cast with if you do get a crit.
In addition, the fighter levels give you weapon specialization and point blank master, in case someone does close the distance with you. What is really fun, is to cast gravity bow, get a crit, and use Spell Critical to cast Arrow Eruption.
With this build, distance is your armor class, keep away from the bad guys and fire arrows. Don't let things close on you. If you go with wizard instead of sorcerer, take the conjuration school [teleportation] school so that you can get out of trouble when you need to.
I could go on for a while on this build if anyone is interested. But, the Eldritch Knight does not belong in melee. Just ask Cold Napalm :)
Complete disagreement -- the Arcane Archer is a waste of a prestige class that is only fit for short term campaigns where you want to save some money.
Still Spell is an excellent choice -- you lost a single level off of some spells but gain enough AC in return to put you into the untouchable range -- before spending all day buffing or moving around when things close. With proper spell choice you won't have to worry about spell failure and relying on spell critical is like playing russian roulette -- you shouldn't do it.
Arcane armor training is a trap because it doesn't allow you any choices other that work with each other.
Still spell allows you to choose when you will quicken a spell and if you critical on a round that you are already going to quicken a spell just save the spell you prepared with quicken spell and instead cast a different one.
IF you don't expect to quicken a spell instead use arcane strike which will give you between 15~25 more points of damage depending on build.
Also the idea that somehow anything less than full BAB when you have full spellcasting isn't acceptable is quite frankly insane --
Also your build forgets the -2 from rapid shot, and still doesn't get back ninth level spells (by the way what bloodline -- kind of matters for a few other points). Also why bother with point blank mastery if you aren't going to let things close on you?
Arrow eruption only works on dead things (specifically things that have been dead for a round) and is only useful if there are other creatures within 30 feet of the creature you killed, only granting a single attack against each such creature. Not exactly a great choice of spells -- especially since instead you could go with a higher level spell since spell critical allows any spell currently (there was some chatter about this being errata'ed though -- having seen such yet).
I agree that EKs are really suited for archery. Tho I would say the build should be Fighter 1/Wizard 5/EK 10/AA 4 (or AA 3 and Wiz 6).
That at least nets you level 9 spells. Spell Critical is actually a trap as mentioned on this build, as Arcane Strike will add a good amount of damage over 7 attacks (counting manyshot even tho it isn't an attack roll) and is also multiplied on crits. It would be good for Save or Suck, but chances are you ditched Int to a degree and haven't invested on amping your saves....battlefield control is good, but if it's needed then you probably weren't full attacking that round anyway.
The build gets -2 from rapid shot, and probably even more from deadly aim, but its attacks are still all going to be pretty high bonus wise from everything else.
As for not getting as many spells, a specialist with a bonded object is close to a Sorc, and you're going to be attacking with a bow more than casting, so you really don't need that volume. Having diversity is more valuable, as your spells will mostly be buffs and situational fallbacks.
All that said, if you want to go into melee with a gish, probably better off going Paladin 2/Sorcerer 4/DD 4/EK 10.
I dunno how I feel about still spell to get armor, I think I would have to see it in real action and how it plays out having most of your spells memmed above their level. I think it would start to get frustrating, but I could be wrong.
Honestly I much prefer (overall) a Bard8/Paladin2/EK10 or bard4/paladin2/DD4/EK10.
mechanically level 20:
First:
112 HP(before con) Fort+10 Ref+9 Will+12 BAB +18 Bardic Music +2 (move action) CL 19(after trait) 72 SP
Second:
120 HP(before con) Fort+11 Ref+7 Will+11 BAB +18 Bardic Music +1 +4 strength +2 natural CL 18(after trait) 1 extra feat 56 SP
Both have all their spells in armor without any problems (and with shields as well), Charisma to save throws, the best buffs in the game (considering level, number of targets, stackability, and overall effectiveness), healing as well as battle magic, with excellent skill points.
Witch works really well with EK as well -- the Evil Eye hex can really make up for the slower spell progression on save throw based spells, as well as making a target easier to hit.
The Bard builds are good too. I prefer Sorc because of the spell list and the eventual higher level spells, but your builds are probably more steady in terms of power throughout, if not at the high end.
I'm going to add them to the thread I started trying to compile good Arcane Warrior builds, if that's ok with you.
I'd be interested to see your proposed Witch based build as well. The big problem I see off the bat with that idea is that EK and such do not advance your familiar, which the Witch is very reliant on. It would seem, in that way, to be very easy to kill the Witch's Spellbook. I don't know how often it would happen, as I'm sure it would depend on your DM, but it scares me that as a witch your spellbook is a living creature whose HD and defenses won't advance if you take prestige class levels.
Here's an idea: Take arcane bond (ring) instead of a familiar. By the rules, you can enchant that ring, without the feat, any way you can afford, at half retail. Rings are expensive, but much harder to lose than weapons. If you do lose the ring, you're screwed, but in anyone else's hands, it's just a masterwork ring.
By the time you are into the EK class, your CL will allow you to enchant it as a ring of protection (deflection), which stacks with other bonuses to your AC. Eventually, you could craft it as a ring of wizardry I or II, or even III, letting you cast extended mage armor and shield spells that last a long time, and make you the go-to guy for fighting incorporeal monsters, among other things, and still have a decent AC. It also lets you cast any spell you know, once per day.
In PF, any arcane caster can use a ring of wizardry, as well as wizards. They couldn't use your bonded ring, though.
I don't suppose anyone knows of any item enchants that can reduce arcane spell failure?
Are you restricted to purely Pathfinder material or do you have access to 3.5 books as well?
If the first I don't have a suggestions not already covered.
If the second, look into the 'Twilight' armor enhancement added to mithril Armor. 20% off ASF is nothing to ignore, especially at only a +1 cost.
Depending on your race, you could take a level of Runecaster and turn ALL somatic components into runes from your already existing components bag allowing you to wear any armor you want and not have ASF (other penalties would be applied as normal depending on the armor and your proficiencies).
Also there is a set of bracers from the MIC (Bracers of Arcane Freedom) that are dirt cheap and allow you to ignore arcane spell failure from armor a set number of times per day.
I think there may also be something in 'Races of the Wild' about fey or elven armor craft that can reduce ASF, but I am not sure on that one.
Thistledown Padding could be added underneath armor for another 5% in ASF reduction. There were classes that got it as well (1 level dip in Spellsword FTW). It was really easy in 3.5 to make a gish that cast in full plate with no ASF at all, without even sacrificing much in the way of caster levels or BAB.