Let me hear which bloodline for Sorcerer you guys like the most. Whcich bloodmagic really gets you pumped? I do like Elemental because +3-9 bonus damage on Fireball is fun but if Elemental really better then let's say Dragon?
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Let me hear which bloodline for Sorcerer you guys like the most. Whcich bloodmagic really gets you pumped? I do like Elemental because +3-9 bonus damage on Fireball is fun but if Elemental really better then let's say Dragon?
Wyrmblessed, just on sheer flavor alone. Having played since the 3rd Edition D&D days I've honestly felt the "Sorcerer whose power comes from a kinky dragon in their family tree" trope is more than a little played out. But having a dragon bestow a divine blessing upon your line? That raises all sorts of interesting questions! So many possibilities! Plus, while the divine spell list may be outshone by ones like arcane or Occult, I like the idea of innate divine power from a blessed heritage, like you're a draconic Volsung or Heraclidae!
Undead for me. Since the release of PF2 I want to play an Undead Sorcerer with a specialization in Harm but I've never been able to do so, mostly because this build is a pain to get online.
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Elemental.
I like the flexibility of primal tradition to heal/remove condition and energy dmg. Also the bloodline bonus is pretty welcome and its focus spells are pretty good.
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Aberrant is still my favorite of the official ones, but my heart pines for the return of the 1e Nanite Bloodline someday.
I think they're all cool and flavorful. Though the bloodmagic is too hard to use and/or useless in many cases (Hag, Shadow, Genie). Unfortunately the 1st-level bloodline spells often suck (Shadow, Draconic/Wyrmblessed, Nymph), failing especially in being useful at the earliest levels, which are hard for casters.
The Fey bloodline is really cool as playing a charismatic trickster is natural for a Sorcerer. It's my favorite along with the Harrow bloodline, which requires the Harrower archetype to work great though.
I also want to love the Elemental bloodline, especially for ice & storm flavored magic. But all the non-fire elements dealing bludgeoning damage and Geomancy sucking for anything but Desert/Fire, turns this basically into a Fire bloodline.
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I enjoy Imperial. The ancestral memories ability is really cool and something a GM can do stuff with beyond just "oh you get a skill".
I don't have one. Elemental, Draconic, Harrow, Genie, Nymph, and Shadow all have some interesting abilities. Imperial is nice too, probably a better wizard than a wizard.
I like sorcerers. Probably the best designed of the 6 hit point pure caster classes.
It is quicker to say which Sorcerers I don't like. Hag and Genie.
You can make them work. But they all have so many useless bloodine spells they are just annoying.
Diabolic and Shadow are my favorite Bloodlines.
Big fan of Phoenix and Shadow. Love the vibes and interesting blaster/healer role Phoenix sorcerer fulfills with its options, and Shadow has some perfectly creepy focus spells that also happen to be pretty solid on top of an amazing list of bloodline spells that makes for a great sneaky illusionist.
How about distribution of Traditions? There are a lot of divine bloodlines.
Are there enough arcane bloodlines?
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Shadow has some perfectly creepy focus spells that also happen to be pretty solid on top of an amazing list of bloodline spells that makes for a great sneaky illusionist.
I like the Shadow bloodline, it's one of my fave 1e bloodlines, but what is so great about the bloodline (focus) spells? Dim the Light is an awful design for a 1st-level bloodline spell. Those spells should be a useful staple for casters, who struggle with few spell-slots in the early levels, yet you can't even use Dim the Light until level 5.
There are just 3 granted spells that trigger it: Darkness, Chilling Darkness, and Shadow Siphon; and 2 of those spells are unusable with it! Darkness is a 3-action cast, thus you can't Sneak after Dim the Light, and Shadow Siphon is a reaction, thus you can't cast Dim the Light. Sure, you can add other darkness/shadow spells to your repertoire at higher levels, but having the player search for possible 3+ level spells just so he can use his basic focus spell... that's just horrible design.
I hope the 1st-level bloodline spells get a proper rework, especially Shadow. For why not let Dim the Light trigger on any (non-cantrip) spell instead of just darkness/shadow spells? Why not give Dim the Light some Heightened effects like turning it into a free action or including a Sneak action in the reaction? Or just make Steal Shadow the 1st-level bloodline spell (reduce damage via "reverse Heightened"), and find a new thing for Dim the Light. For example, it could work like a mix between Shadow Siphon and Arcane Countermeasure with a big bonus towards countering Light trait spells, i.e. "Dim the Light". Or you could even make it something like Undermine Reality.
And the Shadow bloodmagic is also very poor, only the Hag bloodline has it worse. It's just sad seeing good flavor, and a beloved bloodline, go to waste mechanically.
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Shadow has some perfectly creepy focus spells that also happen to be pretty solid on top of an amazing list of bloodline spells that makes for a great sneaky illusionist.I like the Shadow bloodline, it's one of my fave 1e bloodlines, but what is so great about the bloodline (focus) spells? Dim the Light is an awful design for a 1st-level bloodline spell. Those spells should be a useful staple for casters, who struggle with few spell-slots in the early levels, yet you can't even use Dim the Light until level 5.
There are just 3 granted spells that trigger it: Darkness, Chilling Darkness, and Shadow Siphon; and 2 of those spells are unusable with it! Darkness is a 3-action cast, thus you can't Sneak after Dim the Light, and Shadow Siphon is a reaction, thus you can't cast Dim the Light. Sure, you can add other darkness/shadow spells to your repertoire at higher levels, but having the player search for possible 3+ level spells just so he can use his basic focus spell... that's just horrible design.
I hope the 1st-level bloodline spells get a proper rework, especially Shadow. For why not let Dim the Light trigger on any (non-cantrip) spell instead of just darkness/shadow spells? Why not give Dim the Light some Heightened effects like turning it into a free action or including a Sneak action in the reaction? Or just make Steal Shadow the 1st-level bloodline spell (reduce damage via "reverse Heightened"), and find a new thing for Dim the Light. For example, it could work like a mix between Shadow Siphon and Arcane Countermeasure with a big bonus towards countering Light trait spells, i.e. "Dim the Light". Or you could even make it something like Undermine Reality.
And...
Yeah, Dim the Light is a real head scratcher. Penumbral Shroud is available at 1st rank to the Occult list, but it's not exactly an amazing spell. I went and took the Shadowcaster dedication to have a decent spell to use for it at level 2, but that was 2 focus points. I'm hoping they expand it to the void trait at least in the remaster, but we'll have to see when they release it. Otherwise, I do quite like Steal Shadow and Consuming Darkness at least.
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Thematically? Dragon. Dragons are awesome. Unfortunately, having a base bloodline power in Claws that don't even let you use your casting stat and thus feels more like a thing for martials to archetype into feels really bad lol.
This makes me really wonder what changes we already know have to come with the remaster.
We know at least the following for Sorcerers.
1. Bloodline magic is getting a boost.
2. Draconic Sorcerer is getting changed to match the new dragons.
3. By extension, that means a change to the Wyrmblessed bloodline too.
3. Hag Sorcerers will need the same treatment, though what that change will look like we don't know yet.
4. Genie will likely see a small expansion or change with the geniefolk changes with their remaster change.
5. The same goes for Elemental sorcerer with the addition of the wood and metal plane.
Does anyone else know of things for Sorcerers that will need changes? I sadly do not have the funds to buy the remastered material at this time so I can't do an exhaustive search.
And to stay on topic I love the Imperial, Phoenix, and Shadow bloodlines myself, with draconic and Wyrmblessed being good standard options.
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This makes me really wonder what changes we already know have to come with the remaster.
We know at least the following for Sorcerers.
1. Bloodline magic is getting a boost.
2. Draconic Sorcerer is getting changed to match the new dragons.
3. By extension, that means a change to the Wyrmblessed bloodline too.
3. Hag Sorcerers will need the same treatment, though what that change will look like we don't know yet.
4. Genie will likely see a small expansion or change with the geniefolk changes with their remaster change.
5. The same goes for Elemental sorcerer with the addition of the wood and metal plane.Does anyone else know of things for Sorcerers that will need changes? I sadly do not have the funds to buy the remastered material at this time so I can't do an exhaustive search.
And to stay on topic I love the Imperial, Phoenix, and Shadow bloodlines myself, with draconic and Wyrmblessed being good standard options.
Blood Magic is getting boosted specifically. Not only will you get your Blood Magic effects at 1st level from your Bloodline, but also you can pick up additional Blood Magic effects as you level up. The one mentioned was Propelling Sorcery, where when you Cast a Spell, you can make it boost a little bit with magic around, or push people.
Blood Magic is getting boosted specifically. Not only will you get your Blood Magic effects at 1st level from your Bloodline, but also you can pick up additional Blood Magic effects as you level up. The one mentioned was Propelling Sorcery, where when you Cast a Spell, you can make it boost a little bit with magic around, or push people.
Great information. I hadn't heard this information yet. Nice to know we can specialize in "the blood" further via feats, as long as they don't end up feeling like obligatory choices.
conceptually it has to be aberration, shame it kinda sucks. Shadow is my second and at leasts it is good
Blood Magic is getting boosted specifically. Not only will you get your Blood Magic effects at 1st level from your Bloodline, but also you can pick up additional Blood Magic effects as you level up. The one mentioned was Propelling Sorcery, where when you Cast a Spell, you can make it boost a little bit with magic around, or push people.This makes me really wonder what changes we already know have to come with the remaster.
We know at least the following for Sorcerers.
1. Bloodline magic is getting a boost.
2. Draconic Sorcerer is getting changed to match the new dragons.
3. By extension, that means a change to the Wyrmblessed bloodline too.
3. Hag Sorcerers will need the same treatment, though what that change will look like we don't know yet.
4. Genie will likely see a small expansion or change with the geniefolk changes with their remaster change.
5. The same goes for Elemental sorcerer with the addition of the wood and metal plane.Does anyone else know of things for Sorcerers that will need changes? I sadly do not have the funds to buy the remastered material at this time so I can't do an exhaustive search.
And to stay on topic I love the Imperial, Phoenix, and Shadow bloodlines myself, with draconic and Wyrmblessed being good standard options.
I wonder if this will be another cleric situation with an already great class getting better while the wizard remains the wizard.
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I wonder if this will be another cleric situation with an already great class getting better while the wizard remains the wizard.Blood Magic is getting boosted specifically. Not only will you get your Blood Magic effects at 1st level from your Bloodline, but also you can pick up additional Blood Magic effects as you level up. The one mentioned was Propelling Sorcery, where when you Cast a Spell, you can make it boost a little bit with magic around, or push people.This makes me really wonder what changes we already know have to come with the remaster.
We know at least the following for Sorcerers.
1. Bloodline magic is getting a boost.
2. Draconic Sorcerer is getting changed to match the new dragons.
3. By extension, that means a change to the Wyrmblessed bloodline too.
3. Hag Sorcerers will need the same treatment, though what that change will look like we don't know yet.
4. Genie will likely see a small expansion or change with the geniefolk changes with their remaster change.
5. The same goes for Elemental sorcerer with the addition of the wood and metal plane.Does anyone else know of things for Sorcerers that will need changes? I sadly do not have the funds to buy the remastered material at this time so I can't do an exhaustive search.
And to stay on topic I love the Imperial, Phoenix, and Shadow bloodlines myself, with draconic and Wyrmblessed being good standard options.
The way bloodlines worked before was inconsistently good/bad or just irrelevant to gameplay. It really can use a revision.
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I like Hag. Not sure why others don't.
I also like draconic, elemental, and imperial bloodlines as well.
I don't care for Hags, but the note that they share their covens with Naga sometimes has made me really crave that reflavoring.
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I like Hag. Not sure why others don't.
All its granted spells are either "range: touch" or "incapacitation" (even the 10th-level bloodline spell); and the blood magic triggers only when someone deals damage to you.
Play a Harrow Sorcerer instead: You get the same occult spell-list and you can Rewrite Possibility instead, to grant yourself or an ally retries on any failed check, including flat checks!!! Right there you should think: Wellspring Mage Sorcerer!
And the first bloodline spell Unraveling Blast deals great damage ("Heightened (+1) The damage increases by 3d4."), targets Will saves, makes an enemy flat-footed (to everyone) on a failed Will save, and stunned 1 on a crit fail.
Oh, and it's also an excellent combination for the Harrower archetype, which is full of flat checks; its Reading the Signs feat lets you draw twice when you Invoke the Harrow (e.g. to give someone a Hammer +4 status bonus to all damage rolls for 1 minute), and it gets you a +2 status bonus on all your divination effects; oh, as it happens, ALL your bloodline spells & granted spells are divination spells (including the counteract checks on True Seeing), except for Suggestion, Shadow Siphon, and Weird.
Harrow >> Hag, by a mile. It has amazing abilities for support & debuff and one of the coolest Pathfinder-exclusive flavors.
I wonder if this will be another cleric situation with an already great class getting better while the wizard remains the wizard.
How so? Almost all changes to the Sorcerer are lore-related, i.e. the Metallic & Chromatic dragons are gone so the Draconic/Wyrmblessed bloodlines need to be changed (similar to how Kobolds are changed); Hags have been changed in Monster Core so the Hag bloodline needs to be changed; the Genies were changed along with the elemental planes (Wood & Metal added), so the Genie bloodline & Elemental bloodline needs to be changed.
One mechanical issue with the Elemental bloodline is also that there are just 2 damage types, fire (for fire) and bludgeoning (for every other element). >_<
Apart from that, the only announced purely mechanical change is blood magic, as that was simply a whacky/clumsy thing. Remember, blood magic only works with the bloodline's granted spells cast from spell-slots or bloodline spells cast with focus points. And most granted spells are simply not spells you can ever use with these effects. For example, a Diabolic Sorcerer needs to hit level 10 before making actual use of its fire damage bonus (via Crushing Despair, Hellfire Plume), unless you want to set ablaze the person you're trying to use Charm or Suggestion on. Floating Flame is the only offensive option before level 10, but blood magic triggers only once upon casting the spell, so a sustained damage-over-time spell isn't a great combination, and Dangerous Sorcery doesn't work here either, as that feat is limited to spells without duration.
Most bloodlines only ever use the defensive/support option, so e.g. the Diabolic Socerer's +1 Deception bonus is pretty useless in encounters (Sorcerers don't feint). Though admittedly he could set himself ablaze with Embrace the Pit for dramatic roleplaying purposes (as the spell would deal as much fire damage to you as it grants you fire resistance); your GM might even grant you a +1 self-immolation bonus on Intimidation!
As for the Draconic/Wyrmblessed bloodline, I hope we get to choose our own tradition (arcane/occult/...) & damage type (fire/cold/acid/...) & blast form (line/cone/burst) so that the bloodline is future-proofed for the (re-)release of more dragons (e.g. Lunar/Solar/Time/Vortex/Astral/Etheric/... Dragons). Optimally there will be feats (or Heightened effects) for the damage types, e.g. Poison getting to ignore poison immunity as it's generally weak and doesn't even have Overwhelming Energy available.
Harrow? Never hear of it.
