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Basically what it says in the title. I want to make Goblin Slayer. While Slayer might literally be in the name, I'm thinking that the Slayer class might be a little too on the nose. I was thinking 3 levels of Ranger to grab Favored Enemy (obviously goblins) and Favored Terrain (caves) and then multiclass with a few levels of Rogue or Fighter.
I'm not sure if I want all of the rest of the class to be all Rogue or Fighter, though. Any other classes work well for this idea? Brawler any good? Definitely no spellcasting classes because while he has used a scroll before, he's not a spellcaster himself.
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This seems... wrong. They be but Goblins! Not to be mistaken with Butt-Goblins, those things are terrible. Lol.
Anyways, no spellcasting, huh? So we won't be feasting on the poor Goblins' innate fear of horses by casting Mount at the beginning of each combat? That's fine, I suppose.
I think this may be a prime opportunity for a Barbarian using Body Bludgeon. Or a Dwarf with Goblin Cleaver/Orc Hewer. If you give me a minute, I might be able to combine Body Bludgeoner and Goblin Cleaver for maximum hilarity.
What level is this all going to be happening?
You will want a really high Perception, because Goblins are sneaky. You will probably want some sort of resistance or immunity to disease and/or poison. You will probably want darkvision.
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Dunno about levels. I have so many characters and keep making more to the point that I doubt I'll EVER be able to play them all. I just like making them because it's fun.
Anyway, GS is human so I'll be going with that. I don't think he has Darkvision but he's so used to caves and other similar places that Low-Light Vision fits well.
I know I'll want to give him Throw Anything. Because he's thrown his sword so many times I'm surprised he hasn't found himself a boomerang to use instead. Though I don't think I want improvised weapons to be his main focus. He's more sword and board most of the time. With some shield bashing in the mix.
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Your initial Ranger levels can give you Shield Slam, but you will probably still want to pick up Improved Shield Bash if you plan on actually shield bashing as a frequent tactic.
I really like the Lantern Lighter Ranger archetype. With the Human alternative racial feature, Heart of the Fey, you can get Low-Light Vision. Lantern Lighter's Enhanced Vision extends this to 3x as far as normal, instead of twice... and upgrades to Darkvision at level 8. You get Poison Resistance that also upgrades to Immunity at level 12. And Cavern Stride specifically for underground nonsense.
The Stunning Light/Paralyzing Light stuffs is awesome with a Glorious enchanted melee weapon. But that is some late level fun. Personally, I like Aasimar for my Lantern Lighters... since they have the Daylight SLA, and access to Heavenly Radiance. But most people never see the levels that this matters, you don't want to be Aasimar, and you are already planning on multiclassing into Rogue. Lol.
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You can take Exotic Weapon Proficiency or Weapon Adept for the "Versatile Design" modified Longsword (or buy the ioun stone for EWP)... put your Longsword in the hammers group, and take Bounding Hammer (or put the Trained enchantment on your Longsword, and put Bounding Hammer there). It technically works, and it would be better than Throw Anything if you aren't going to go down the Shikigami path.
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Others have asked this before.
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Well, the archetypes for rangers that remove spellcasting don't really seem that great. And again, I don't want him to actually be a caster. Hence only the 3 levels of ranger since level 4 is when the spells start.
I've never heard of the Trained enchantment. Can you give a link?
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It's been a long while since i've read the manga, but iirc he's kind of helpful towards his companion, so maybe a Skirmisher Ranger could do the trick?
The variant loses spells, which is something i don't recall GS having and it gives him bunch of neat trick that could be uses to represent skills he picked up through his career of fighting goblin.
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Training weapon enchantment. Not worth it for your main weapon IMO, stick it on a backup weapon.
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Skirmisher loses spells? I must have scrolled right past it when looking before. Those tricks can be pretty handy. And it looks like it only replaces spell so I could keep to the class and not only get the tricks but also the bonus feats and upgrades to favored enemy.
Yeah, Training doesn't look all that helpful for this. Maybe I'll get a throwing weapon and slap Returning on it instead as my backup weapon.
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Wiki says dude sets traps for Goblins... Trapper Ranger removes spells. So that might be a fitting option. You did say you weren't impressed by the Ranger archetypes that remove spells, though.
How important is his helmet to you in this build? Faceless Enforcer Vigilante is all about their helmet as part of their identity. I think Vigilantes can pull off quite a bit of Rogue stuffs, too, depending on what you were looking for out of your planned Rogue levels. You could have proficiency with shields, and Shield Slam, from your Ranger levels...
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Skirmisher loses spells? I must have scrolled right past it when looking before. Those tricks can be pretty handy. And it looks like it only replaces spell so I could keep to the class and not only get the tricks but also the bonus feats and upgrades to favored enemy.
Yeah i meant that Skirmisher ranger loses access to spellcasting, not spell slots, my bad!
As for the helmet, maybe the Steel Skin traits?
Benefits: You gain the ability to don or remove heavy armor in half the normal time. Additionally, you begin play with a great helm bearing the iconography of your family (this helm grants no special defensive benefits). While wearing this helm with a suit of heavy armor, you gain a +2 trait bonus on Intimidate checks.
Sure it takes heavy armor proficiency, but nothing stops a ranger from getting it, and the Globin Slayer pretty much look like he's in fullplate all the time anyway.
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Yeah, Trapper does fit the theme but traps are hard to set up in most actual games so I wasn't sure it was all that good mechanically.
I was thinking of grabbing 4 levels of Unchained Rogue to grab Debilitating Injury and a little Sneak Attack and then switch out.
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Yeah, traps are hard to pull off as a PC in-game. And if you are the GM, you hardly need a specific archetype to lay as many traps of whatever sorts you wish. Lol.
I'm thinking that if you are going to take 4 levels of Rogue... it might as well be Scout, to get Sneak Attack on a charge. If you have Shield Slam for free Bull Rush attacks, taking Improved Bull Rush isn't a bad idea. I pretty much assume Power Attack is already part of the build.
The bonus is nice, probably unnecessary when you are pushing Goblins around, though. But we want Improved Bull Rush for Rhino Charge, since it allows one to ready a charge as a standard action. Anything that breaks action economy is awesome, and you get Sneak Attack on a charge. You can charge with sword or shield, the latter opening up linebreaker tactics and possible escape routes with the free Bull Rush at the end.
If you like cheese, Spiked Destroyer and armor spikes go very well with Shield Slam. Shield Slam's free Bull Rush is automatic, and without action. Spiked Destroyer allows an attack with your armor spikes as a swift action any time you success at a Bull Rush.
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Spiked Destroyer and Shield Slam seem like a very nice combo. Though when I take what depends on when I take the Rogue levels. Skirmisher looks pretty good so I'll probably have more Ranger levels than anything else.
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Human
... Focused Study replaces Bonus Feat
... Heart of the Fey replaces Skilled
Heart of the Fey is for low-light vision, and that wonderful +1 to Reflex/Will saves. Know Nature and Perception are already class skills for a Ranger.
Focused Study will probably go towards Perception @ 1, Sense Motive @ 8, and something else @ 16.
If you stick with Unchained Rogue for a 5th level, you can grab Sense Motive for your Rogue's Edge/Signature Skill. At later levels, this adds a layer of defense... allowing you to straight up negate incoming attacks with a Sense Motive roll as an immediate action. Although, most characters never see those levels, so it may not even matter.
Ranger
1. Favored Enemy
... Goblin
1. Track
1. Wild Empathy
1(race): Skill Focus Perception
1(level): Power Attack
2(class): Shield Slam
3. Favored Terrain
... Underground
3(class): Endurance
3(level): Improved Bull Rush
Scout UnRogue
4. Finesse Training
4. Sneak Attack 1D6
4. Trapfinding
5. Evasion
5. Rogue Talent
...
5(level): Iron Will
6. Danger Sense +1
6. Finesse Training
6. Sneak Attack 2D6
7. Debilitating Injury
7. Rogue Talent
...
7. Scout's Charge
7(level): Rhino Charge
8. Rogue's Edge
... Sense Motive
8. Sneak Attack 3D6
8(race): Skill Focus Sense Motive
BAB +6
Base Saves +4/+8/+5 (w/ Heart of the Fey & Iron Will)
Although, with the same build, you could use your Rogue Talents @ 5 & 7 for Weapon Focus & Dazzling Display, respectively... then use Focused Study for Skill Focus Intimidate @ 8, and Rogue's Edge for Intimidate, also @ 8... stack Thug on top of Scout to trade Trapfinding & Danger Sense for Frightening & Brutal Beating, respectively.
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Since I finished adapting my cleric to a gestalt game, I want to come back to this for a while. I was looking through the archetypes again and found one called Dungeon Rover. It gains bonuses to Perception to notice underground hazards. That seems pretty on theme for Goblin Slayer since he's so used to looking for goblin traps.
I think I might ignore going Rogue. Sneak Attack isn't all that much and Debilitating Injury does take 4 levels of the class.
If you're willing to wait until next year, Yen Press will be offering the translated version of the Goblin Slayer TTRPG, based on the famous Sword World RPG rules-set. ;)
PS. There's also gonna be a Yen Press translated version of the Konosuba TRPG too, which makes sense since Yen Press has the translation license for both Goblin Slayer and Konosuba Light Novels/Manga. No idea what rpg system the Konosuba one is though...
PPS. As an added bonus, has some recently released Goblin Slayer Abridged 6 as well. Just because. ;p
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Grimmjack's hilarious. "GAAAWWBLIIINSSS!"
Yeah, I'm going to drop the Rogue levels. I can just go with pure Ranger. I can overlap both Skirmisher and Dungeon Rover. Infiltrator also seems neat. GS does study goblin behavior a lot in order to kill them.
Although, some of the wording for Infiltrator is a little confusing. If you pick an adaptation that needs a specific choice, it's permanent instead of having a timed duration. Does that mean it doesn't count for only being able to use one at a time?
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The Battle Scout archetype for Ranger seems right up Goblin Slayers ally as well...
it ever gets 1 favored enemy type which for Goblin Slayer is perfect, he's hyper focused on slaying goblins to the exclusion of everything else...
it has even greater benefit from favored terrain than an ordinary ranger, and can declare a terrain that isn't a favored terrain as a favored terrain for a short time... again fits well with Goblin Slayer, as he studdies the tactics of goblins so extensively he'd be familiar with any terrain they operate in and can adapt at a moments notice.
The battle scout can rearrange their parties initiative to suit their plans... and if he's had time to scout ahead he gives a bonus to initiatives... Given Goblin Slayers penchant to call the shots in any encounter, this is a phenomenal ability for him...
It won't stack with Dungeon Rover though... since Dungeon Rover adds new creatures to the Animal Companion options for Hunter's Bond and Battle Scout forces your Hunter's Bond selection to be Companion Bond preventing the choice of animal companion... though some DMs might allow them to stack since even though they both technically modify the same ability they don't do so in a way that invalidates the other since a Dungeon Rover can still choose to take the Companion Bond option instead of an Animal Companion...
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Hm.... 4 different archetypes on a single class. Fun.
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On second thought, having Favored Terrain is more important that what Infiltrator can give. So I'm not going to use that archetype.
Now for a decision. Do I keep Dungeon Rover or take Battle Scout? RAW says I can't take both, so this first build can only take one. If I put him into a game, I can ask the GM for permission and adjust from there.
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I wouldn't do Battle Scout since it gets rid of your later iterations of Favored Enemy. This makes you overall less awesome vs Goblins. Dungeon Rover is great though.
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I wouldn't do Battle Scout since it gets rid of your later iterations of Favored Enemy. This makes you overall less awesome vs Goblins. Dungeon Rover is great though.
You misunderstand how Favored Enemy works. When an archetype replaces 2nd Favored Enemy it only replaces the 2nd choice of favored enemy. The increased bonus still happens and is automatically granted to your 1st favored enemy (since you don't have a 2nd to apply it to instead). Its just like with Weapon Training.
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I wouldn't do Battle Scout since it gets rid of your later iterations of Favored Enemy. This makes you overall less awesome vs Goblins. Dungeon Rover is great though.You misunderstand how Favored Enemy works. When an archetype replaces 2nd Favored Enemy it only replaces the 2nd choice of favored enemy. The increased bonus still happens and is automatically granted to your 1st favored enemy (since you don't have a 2nd to apply it to instead). Its just like with Weapon Training.
Huh. Fair enough. Just to be adversarial though, we can argue that losing other favored enemy options COULD make you overall less great vs Goblins. Favored Enemy Animals or Vermin makes you stronger vs typical mounts and Favored Enemy Evil Outsiders makes you strong against the creatures they typically worship like demons and Barghests.
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I wouldn't do Battle Scout since it gets rid of your later iterations of Favored Enemy. This makes you overall less awesome vs Goblins. Dungeon Rover is great though.You misunderstand how Favored Enemy works. When an archetype replaces 2nd Favored Enemy it only replaces the 2nd choice of favored enemy. The increased bonus still happens and is automatically granted to your 1st favored enemy (since you don't have a 2nd to apply it to instead). Its just like with Weapon Training.
What? No.
If an archetype replaces a class feature that is part of a series of improvements or additions to a base ability (such as a fighter’s weapon training or a ranger’s favored enemy), the next time the character would gain that ability, it counts as the lower-level ability that was replaced by the archetype. In effect, all abilities in that series are delayed until the next time the class improves that ability. For example, if an archetype replaces a rogue’s +2d6 sneak attack bonus at 3rd level, when she reaches 5th level and gains a sneak attack bonus, her sneak attack doesn’t jump from +1d6 to +3d6—it improves to +2d6, just as if she had finally gained the increase at 3rd level. This adjustment continues for every level at which her sneak attack would improve, until at 19th level she has +9d6 instead of the +10d6 of a standard rogue.
I think it's intended for Battle Scout to progress the first Favored Enemy bonus, though.
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I hope it doesn't stop the increase for the first favored enemy. That would suck.
The combat style is definitely going to be Weapon And Shield. Two-Weapon Fighting at level 2 to bypass the dex requirements. Shield Master at level 6 to eliminate the penalties with the shield altogether. I'll probably do Improved Shield Bash at level one.
I can take Shield Focus and Saving Shield at any time but Greater Shield Focus would have to be one of the bonus feats. I'll put it at level 10 and go with Bashing Finish at level 11 since I'd have the feats it needs by then anyway.
Oh wait. If I take Two-Weapon Fighting as a bonus feat that doesn't need the dex, can I take a feat that has TWF as a pre-req outside of the bonus feats?
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I hope it doesn't stop the increase for the first favored enemy. That would suck.
The combat style is definitely going to be Weapon And Shield. Two-Weapon Fighting at level 2 to bypass the dex requirements. Shield Master at level 6 to eliminate the penalties with the shield altogether. I'll probably do Improved Shield Bash at level one.
I can take Shield Focus and Saving Shield at any time but Greater Shield Focus would have to be one of the bonus feats. I'll put it at level 10 and go with Bashing Finish at level 11 since I'd have the feats it needs by then anyway.
Oh wait. If I take Two-Weapon Fighting as a bonus feat that doesn't need the dex, can I take a feat that has TWF as a pre-req outside of the bonus feats?
If it doesn't require the Dex bonus then yes. If It does, then no. Also, be sure to avoid Greater TWF, it's a trap.
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So as long as it says TWF as a pre-req but doesn't specifically mention a Dex requirement, I'm good? Cool. Of course, by level 11 I should have a magic belt to increase stats so it might be a moot point.
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If you can work it into the build, the Upsetting Shield Style feat chain would be a good fit for Goblin Slayer, due to the fact that he does actually favor a Buckler due to the smaller size making it easier to work with in the confined spaces of caves and tunnels, plus having it strapped to his arm frees up his offhand for when he needs some extra power behind his swings. Even if you can only fit the style feat itself into the build it would fit more in-line with how Goblin Slayer operates.
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Looks good to me.
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So I'm looking at the Skirmisher tricks. Second Chance Strike is a pretty good one - letting you roll again if you miss an attack. Even with the -5 penalty, that's a really good thing to have. Vengeance Strike is a pretty good one too, giving you a free attack if an adjacent enemy hits an ally.
Tangling Attack and Distracting Attack seems helpful as well. So does Upending Strike, but I can't tell if it would provoke an AoO or not from the trip attempt.
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1: Bonus feat – Throw Anything
1: Feat – Improved Shield Bash
2: Bonus feat from list – Two-Weapon Fighting
3: Feat – Upsetting Shield Style
5: Feat – Combat Reflexes
5: Trick – Second Chance Strike
6: Bonus feat from list – Shield Master
7: Feat – Shield Slam
7: Trick – Vengeance Strike
9: Feat – Saving Shield
9: Trick - Distracting Attack
10: Bonus feat from list – Shield Focus
11: Feat – Bashing Finish
11: Trick - Tangling Attack
13: Feat -
13: Trick -
14: Bonus feat from list – Greater Shield Focus
15: Feat -
15: Trick -
17: Feat -
17: Trick -
18: Bonus feat from list - ?????
19: Feat -
19: Trick -
This is what I have so far. I think I'm going to have to either multi-class before level 18 or move Bashing Finish to level 10 and move the other bonus feats up a slot.
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Given that shield focus isn’t really required for anything in your build… I’d personally move bashing finish up to 10th… and get Shield Focus + Greater Shield Focus later…
also, you should switch Upsetting Shield Style and Improved Shield Bash around… if you intend to go the buckler bash route, then Improved Shield Bash doesn’t do you any good without the ability to first shield bash with the buckler… it would be better to sacrifice the shield bonus to AC for a couple levels… especially since the Attack Penalty that your target suffers from Upsetting Shield Style more than makes up for it.
Speaking of Upsetting Shield Style… with how many open feat slots you still have, you might as well take Upsetting Strike and Upsetting Vengence letting you get an AoO any time a target you have recently stuck with your shield attacks you or an adjacent ally and misses by 5 or more…
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That is a good point, both for the bonus feats and the shield bashing. I think I might put in Double-Slice as well. I should have enough dex by then since I think it mentions needing the dex.
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For trait, I'm looking at Surprise Weapon since he does throw his swords a lot and it'll help with that. And Shield Bearer for the other one.
I'm coming back to this thread as I plan to put him into a gestalt game and will be using this as a place to organize.
I'm going Shield Champion Brawler as the other class. It fits the theme more than most and gives a decent amount of bonus feats. Too many feats, almost.
The archetype gives Greater Shield Focus at level 9, but I will need Shield Focus first. Easy to place that in one of the bonus feats.
Shield Master and Bashing Finish require a BAB of 11 so I'll keep them at the 6 and 10 Ranger bonus feats. Shield Slam needs a BAB of 6 so it needs to stay at level 7.
I think I'll put Shield Focus as the level 5 Brawler feat. I want to put Catch-Off Guard as the level 2 Brawler feat. I didn't bother with it in the original build, but there's more than enough room for it now. And Goblin Slayer can, will, and HAS used whatever he can get his hands on as a weapon. He strangled a goblin champion with human hair once! He used flour to make a fireball!
After that, I'm kinda out of Ranger bonus feats. I'll ask my GM what I can put in there instead once I get to level 14. If I can't do anything, I'll just retrain or something. I don't want to multiclass out because nothing else really fits. I supposed there's Slayer, but I just don't really like the idea for this character. It's a little too on the nose.
I still have the bonus Brawler feats at level 8 and 11 as well as the regular level 11 feat. By 11 I should have a boost to my Dex so I can put Double-Slice there. Power Attack won't be needed as the game is EITR. I think I'll just put Weapon Focus at 8 at 11 as I don't see any weapon groups that have unarmed strikes, shields, and a good non-exotic sword. Unless I just go with the Tribal group and use a club or handaxe. When and if the game gets to level 13, I'll just start picking feats as I go.
So the plan will be this:
1: Feat – Throw Anything
1: Racial bonus feat – Upsetting Shield Style
1: Brawler bonus feat - Improved Unarmed Strike
2: Ranger bonus feat from list – Two-Weapon Fighting
2: Brawler bonus feat - Catch-Off Guard
3: Feat – Improved Shield Bash
5: Feat – Combat Reflexes
5: Trick – Second Chance Strike
5: Brawler bonus feat - Shield Focus
6: Ranger bonus feat from list – Shield Master
7: Feat – Shield Slam
7: Trick – Vengeance Strike
8: Brawler bonus feat - Weapon Focus Tribal Weapons
9: Feat – Saving Shield
9: Trick - Distracting Attack
10: Ranger bonus feat from list – Bashing Finish
11: Feat – Armor Focus or Dodge
11: Brawler bonus feat - Double-Slice
11: Trick - Tangling Attack
Since you don't want casting in this gestalt, I'd combine the brawler with avenger vigilante. At least that will cover your saves. And the Goblin Slayer sort of hides his identity anyway.
FYI, I'm not replacing Ranger with anything in this gestalt. I want him to keep Favored Enemy and the Combat Style feats. Otherwise I'd have to go Dex based to use TWF. Which would mean Weapon Finesse and putting Agile on two different weapons. Or taking 3 levels of Unchained Rogue.
The Tactician Fighter does look interesting though. I'll keep it in mind.
I talked to my GM and the ruling is that I will need to retrain feats at level 14 and 18 since I'm using up all the feats on the Ranger bonus list before then. I'll figure out what I want to take when I reach them.
I'm also realizing that I don't remember why I put Combat Reflexes in there. I don't have any way of provoking AoOs, which is the entire reason to take the feat. I'm going to take it out and put Weapon Focus in there instead. Then Greater Weapon Focus in at 8. Since I'm giving up spells, I have no way to self-buff and will be taking a penalty from using two weapons. So I need all the boosts I can get.
I'll probably be using a handaxe rather than a sword for my main weapon. The only other weapon group that has shields, other than the throwing shield, is the Close group and 2/3 of those are Exotic. And those that aren't are mostly low damage or making an unarmed strike lethal, which I don't need.
Turns out that this group uses Spheres and while I won't be going fully into Spheres, I can trade in the proficiencies of the Ranger class to get a martial tradition. I can use that to get proficiency with the waveblade, which is a light sword in the close group that's 1d6 with a 18-20 crit range. That saves me the trouble of using a weapon that just doesn't match Goblin Slayer's style or taking the Exotic Weapon Proficiency feat.
Now it's just a matter of writing everything down.
If the group is using Spheres then I would go with the Conscript. It's basically a customization Fighter and getting Favored Enemy is an option for it.
As far as Spheres themselves go I would say Berserker, Brute, Shield and maybe Guardian. the Delayed Damage pool from the Guardian Sphere can really give you the feel of this mean sob who won't go down until he gets one last crack at your head.
No thank you. I'm perfectly fine with just the martial tradition.
I work full time without a set day off so I've only been able to get him into one session so far. It went well though. I didn't always hit, but I hit enough times to do some pretty good damage. I used the Martial tradition to get the proficiency with the Waveblade and a talent that can let you use Str for AC. It's nice because I'll only have to worry about getting enough Dex to qualify for Double-Slice at level 11.
I'm a bit late to this but I've built GS myself for fun and wanted to offer my ideas.
As much as Favored Enemy makes sense there's more to be had with levels in Fighter in my opinion. There's so much he's capable of and all the feats Fighter gets can allow us to reflect that.
First, he (almost)never takes off his armor. This will be troublesome since sleeping in heavy armor has consequences. So, we'll first start with the feat
You may sleep in light or medium armor without becoming fatigued.
Obviously, he hates goblins and we want the flavor of Favored Enemy without multiclassing, so we can take the feats
Benefit(s): Choose a creature type from the ranger favored enemies table except for humanoid or monstrous humanoid.
You gain a +2 bonus on Perception checks, Survival checks, and weapon damage rolls against creatures of the selected type. You can attempt Knowledge skill checks untrained when attempting to identify such creatures.
He often utilizes traps to defeat goblins and most traps are simple in function and don't really require feats, just some brain power and the right supplies. That said, you may find some fun in the list of Ranger Traps via the feat
Benefit: Select one ranger trap. You may use this trap a number of times per day equal to your Wisdom bonus (minimum 1). The DC for your trap is equal to 10 + 1/2 your character’s level + your Wisdom bonus, and it lasts 1 day per two character levels.
If you are not a ranger, you can only set extraordinary traps with this feat; like all extraordinary ranger traps, this decreases the trap DC by 2.
Goblin Slayer has also often killed goblins with a torch. There are several feats available but increasing more than one for this would be inefficient. Catch Off Guard would be the well rounded option in case you want to kill creatures with just about anything you pick up while avoiding that -4 to attack rolls, but I think
Finally, GS has been known to use a scroll on rare occasions. Even with a maximum investment in the Use Magic Device skill, this is very difficult. Fighters have very little skill ranks to begin with so I would recommend avoiding this BUT... if the flavor is worth the investment to you then an obvious choice would be Skill Focus for UMD but
Benefit: You gain a +5 bonus on Use Magic Device checks to use divine spell-trigger or spell completion items or to emulate a divine class feature.
I think the standard Fighter will work really well but as far as archetypes go, Tactitian really adds to the flavor of GS organizing and leading his party to victory.