| 6 people marked this as a favorite. |
Ironically, I want to point out that in fact the USSR was never a state that banned religion in itself, so comparing Rahadoum with them is not entirely logical. The USSR had problems mainly with the church and other organizations due to potential competition for public sentiment. This distinguishes the USSR, for example, from Albania, where the existence of religious organizations was outright outlawed.
What is this tankie nonsense.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
I do not see how the Laws could be relaxed without making the city a hotbed for religions of all stripes aiming to topple the Rahadoumi regime.
Makes for great stories, but, from the Rahadoumi government's point of view, it makes zero sense.
Do they have enough Pure Legion to occupy every street corner in the city? Do they want to treat a recently ‘liberated’ city like hostile enemy territory?
I think the Rahadoumi regime is smarter than to trade one crushing authoritarian hand for another, especially given that 2e writers have shown more moderation with the state.
I could easily see it as a Hong Kong situation, which was referenced above. Sure, the city starts with a fair amount of freedom, but Rahadoum could very well slowly phase out some of those freedoms and rules, to integrate the city into the greater country. Would actually make a decent AP, with the point being maybe independence for the city (although might be a bit to similar to the whole Ravounel situation).
|
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
I could easily see it as a Hong Kong situation, which was referenced above. Sure, the city starts with a fair amount of freedom, but Rahadoum could very well slowly phase out some of those freedoms and rules, to integrate the city into the greater country. Would actually make a decent AP, with the point being maybe independence for the city (although might be a bit to similar to the whole Ravounel situation).I do not see how the Laws could be relaxed without making the city a hotbed for religions of all stripes aiming to topple the Rahadoumi regime.
Makes for great stories, but, from the Rahadoumi government's point of view, it makes zero sense.
Do they have enough Pure Legion to occupy every street corner in the city? Do they want to treat a recently ‘liberated’ city like hostile enemy territory?
I think the Rahadoumi regime is smarter than to trade one crushing authoritarian hand for another, especially given that 2e writers have shown more moderation with the state.
The AP might be how to navigate between hotheads who would make the city a free-for-all haven for pirates and misfits ala Tortuga (with cultists added because fantasy) and conservative extremists who want to make it a shining example of the virtue of the Laws of Mortality, creature rights be damned.
With agents of Cheliax stirring the pot.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
I could easily see it as a Hong Kong situation, which was referenced above. Sure, the city starts with a fair amount of freedom, but Rahadoum could very well slowly phase out some of those freedoms and rules, to integrate the city into the greater country. Would actually make a decent AP, with the point being maybe independence for the city (although might be a bit to similar to the whole Ravounel situation).I do not see how the Laws could be relaxed without making the city a hotbed for religions of all stripes aiming to topple the Rahadoumi regime.
Makes for great stories, but, from the Rahadoumi government's point of view, it makes zero sense.
Do they have enough Pure Legion to occupy every street corner in the city? Do they want to treat a recently ‘liberated’ city like hostile enemy territory?
I think the Rahadoumi regime is smarter than to trade one crushing authoritarian hand for another, especially given that 2e writers have shown more moderation with the state.
The AP might be how to navigate between hotheads who would make the city a free-for-all haven for pirates and misfits ala Tortuga (with cultists added because fantasy) and conservative extremists who want to make it a shining example of the virtue of the Laws of Mortality, creature rights be damned.
With agents of Cheliax stirring the pot.
Honestly, the option to have different tables spin it different ways could be a lot of fun. Obviously there'd have to be a canon outcome (and my vote is for the above 'release valve for Rahadoumi society' pitch), but individual tables might go for everything from a wild pirate port to a Hellknight city-state.
| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
Positing Khari as a Northern Garund equivalent to Morocco or Hong King honestly makes me wonder if it could go independent, and survive sandwiched between the twin pressures of Cheliax and Rahadoum by pitting one against the other to ensure itself as a relatively neutral meeting ground. Rahadoum gets a port people can set foot without the bother of the Pure Legion, Cheliax keeps its trade foothold on Garund (or at least, doesn't cede it to someone else) albeit being unable to enforce, neither side would be happy but both would be less happy to see the other take it - with the Firebrands there to keep those plates spinning.
| 5 people marked this as a favorite. |
Positing Khari as a Northern Garund equivalent to Morocco or Hong King honestly makes me wonder if it could go independent, and survive sandwiched between the twin pressures of Cheliax and Rahadoum by pitting one against the other to ensure itself as a relatively neutral meeting ground. Rahadoum gets a port people can set foot without the bother of the Pure Legion, Cheliax keeps its trade foothold on Garund (or at least, doesn't cede it to someone else) albeit being unable to enforce, neither side would be happy but both would be less happy to see the other take it - with the Firebrands there to keep those plates spinning.
It might even end up as something like partitioned Istanbul, during the 1920s. Imagine something like tripartite districts - one Chelish, one Rahadoumi, one independent? Fill the place with spies and lounge singers, pirates and priests...
| 6 people marked this as a favorite. |
Positing Khari as a Northern Garund equivalent to Morocco or Hong King honestly makes me wonder if it could go independent, and survive sandwiched between the twin pressures of Cheliax and Rahadoum by pitting one against the other to ensure itself as a relatively neutral meeting ground. Rahadoum gets a port people can set foot without the bother of the Pure Legion, Cheliax keeps its trade foothold on Garund (or at least, doesn't cede it to someone else) albeit being unable to enforce, neither side would be happy but both would be less happy to see the other take it - with the Firebrands there to keep those plates spinning.It might even end up as something like partitioned Istanbul, during the 1920s. Imagine something like tripartite districts - one Chelish, one Rahadoumi, one independent? Fill the place with spies and lounge singers, pirates and priests...
"Of all the taverns in all the towns in all the world to start an adventure, they had to start it in mine."
| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
As a lot of those have already said, I like the feel of the region, but feel they are mainly 2 dimensional. I am not gonna rehash what has been said, here is just my quick thoughts.
I love the aesthetic of Osirion, or at least its start. I have no problem with the use of the Egyptian pantheon, but I feel like it either needs to be explored, or ignored entirely. As it is now, its basically just a "yeah, it's Egypt so here are some Egyptian gods" when it could be so much cooler. What I would love to see is the return of these gods, maybe in different styling than before, as they seek to reclaim dominion over their land. Maybe as a way to show the locals are rekindling their connection to their past and seek to ignore and expel the foreign gods. This could be interesting with their current pharaoh being a cleric of Abadar. I would also like to see more about Nethys and his connection to the region. That is just ripe for a local university or something.
I like city states, so obviously I like the idea of Thuvia, but again feel it falls flat. I want to see the intrigue and politics that comes from a nation built on the sale of one export. I want to see how these city states cooperate with eachother. I would personally like to see an exploration of the different cities having ties to foreign powers, like being in the pockets of Absalom, Cheliax, Rahadoum, etc to highlight that the alliance is kind of hanging by a thread.
For Rahadoum, I feel like the topic is so cool and interesting. By far my favourite. I would be interested in if they have had a flood of immigrants since the Age of Lost Omens, as I would assume many of the small folk might have a lack of respect in the gods now and seek new alternatives. With a flood of new people, Rahadoum might start looking to expand its borders.
Katapesh. So much potential that just gets relegated to "drugs and slaves" which is not great. I think there is some cool alternatives of an uprising, or internal coup attempt against the Pactmasters. An Andoran funded rebellion would be interesting. But yeah, ultimately its just "bazaar the country" currently.
Qadira is really fascinating as a concept, but I just want to see it done justice from writers who are sensitive to the topic. Too much potential for problematic writing. Please just be respectful is all I ask.
Beyond those, I mainly just want cultures for existing ancestries, not that I am opposed to NEW ancestries and heritages I welcome them, but I want to read about desert elves, halflings that live in oases, desert goblins, etc.
Mainly, I just want good respectful lore. I am also a huge fan of internal political struggle. We don't have a lot of "this country is at war with this country" type of thing. I really like those as backdrops for campaigns and I would love to see it in the setting as a guide.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
People keep talking about Thuvia in a way that clearly tells anyone that has read the Enmity Cycle they haven't actually bothered to pick up the book. It's kinda sad.
I'll be honest, that is definitely the case for me. I have read the Lost Omens books, and several of the rulebooks, but basically only two Adventure Paths, none of the standalone adventures. I had not even looked at The Enmity Cycle until you mentioned it. It looks really interesting from the blurb! If I wasn't about to move across the world I would try to run it! But unfortunately, I won't have the time for awhile to GM... Maybe I can con someone to run it for me to play haha
|
| 3 people marked this as a favorite. |
I love the aesthetic of Osirion, or at least its start. I have no problem with the use of the Egyptian pantheon, but I feel like it either needs to be explored, or ignored entirely. As it is now, its basically just a "yeah, it's Egypt so here are some Egyptian gods" when it could be so much cooler. What I would love to see is the return of these gods, maybe in different styling than before, as they seek to reclaim dominion over their land. Maybe as a way to show the locals are rekindling their connection to their past and seek to ignore and expel the foreign gods. This could be interesting with their current pharaoh being a cleric of Abadar. I would also like to see more about Nethys and his connection to the region. That is just ripe for a local university or something.
Very much agree with this. For a magical steeped culture, with Nethys literally baked into the nation's founding, the sole 'Egyptian-themed' magical society / faction we get is... the Esoteric Order of the Palatine Eye, a bunch of Osirioni-obsessed wannabes in Ustalav? Ugh.
I would love to see some sort of arcane school in Sothis, perhaps intimately tied to the church of Nethys, perhaps bitter rivals for disagreements on matters that even to a wizard could be described as 'arcane.'
*Katapesh*, with it's Pesh magic, has more of a distinctive local magical tradition than Osirion, it seems. That strikes me as weird, like all the Osirioni wizards left for Nex (or Geb) and it's just floundered ever since. (Which is certainly an option, just not one that's I've seen explicitly stated, that there's a 'brain drain' of arcanists fleeing Osirion for more magically-forward-thinking nations like Nex and Geb.)
But really, same for all the nations. More about Thuvian alchemy, and traditions that are not alchemy, and sort of fighting to remain relevant in a land so centered around alchemy. More about Rahadoum's attempts to fill the missing gaps in magical utility from their cutting out divine magic, and turning to arcane (occult, primal?) solutions for their people's needs. Qadira's focus on elemental magic, or magic related to / inspired by genies (I could see a heavy focus on illusion magic and conjuration (creation) spells, since those are associated with genies).
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
I love the aesthetic of Osirion, or at least its start. I have no problem with the use of the Egyptian pantheon, but I feel like it either needs to be explored, or ignored entirely. As it is now, its basically just a "yeah, it's Egypt so here are some Egyptian gods" when it could be so much cooler. What I would love to see is the return of these gods, maybe in different styling than before, as they seek to reclaim dominion over their land. Maybe as a way to show the locals are rekindling their connection to their past and seek to ignore and expel the foreign gods. This could be interesting with their current pharaoh being a cleric of Abadar. I would also like to see more about Nethys and his connection to the region. That is just ripe for a local university or something.Very much agree with this. For a magical steeped culture, with Nethys literally baked into the nation's founding, the sole 'Egyptian-themed' magical society / faction we get is... the Esoteric Order of the Palatine Eye, a bunch of Osirioni-obsessed wannabes in Ustalav? Ugh.
I would love to see some sort of arcane school in Sothis, perhaps intimately tied to the church of Nethys, perhaps bitter rivals for disagreements on matters that even to a wizard could be described as 'arcane.'
*Katapesh*, with it's Pesh magic, has more of a distinctive local magical tradition than Osirion, it seems. That strikes me as weird, like all the Osirioni wizards left for Nex (or Geb) and it's just floundered ever since. (Which is certainly an option, just not one that's I've seen explicitly stated, that there's a 'brain drain' of arcanists fleeing Osirion for more magically-forward-thinking nations like Nex and Geb.)
But really, same for all the nations. More about Thuvian alchemy, and traditions that are not alchemy, and sort of fighting to remain relevant in a land so centered around alchemy. More about Rahadoum's attempts to fill the missing gaps in magical utility from their cutting out divine magic, and turning...
In fairness to Paizo, at least the Esoteric Order are explicitly culturally appropriating things they don't understand for the aesthetics, and partly a parody of real life people who do so. What they do has extremely little to do with actual Osiriani practices, and I suspect actual Osiriani would be confused or even offended if they learned about it.
Osirion actually does have two magical schools to its name. In the north is the El-Shelad Madrassa which teaches native Osiriani and imported Keleshite magic traditions, while to the south is the more traditional Academy of Scribes which takes kids as young as five up until marriagable age, and those who stay after that train under wizards or join the nearby Nethysian clergy. And in Wati has the Hall of Blessed Rebirth, which takes in alchemists and wizards for tutoring with a focus on the more benevolent side of the Necromancy school. The problem with them is that neither are as large, have the same prestige, or have as much information about them as more detailed Magic Schools like the Acadamae etc. Though in a post-Hakotep world, I would hope the Ruby Prince sees the wisdom of investing in local secular institutions to increase Osirion's magical knowledge and aptitude. Especially if (as is hinted in the third book of Mummy's Mask) Tephu's governor is humiliated enough by events to step down or be stripped of rank, and someone less Nethysian takes over her triple duties of governor, high priestess of Nethys, and head librarian - the more secular Academy might see an increase of prestige at the Nethysians' expense. Combined with the Sothis Nethysians failing to keep the heart of Hakotep safe, a breakin the players hear about offscreen but was conducted by one of their own, even if Nethys is the national founder I could absolutely see his clergy getting cut back down to size when their failures came to light.
| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
Tangential to the above: I’d really like a mechanical option that fit the average Nethysian better, something to blend the arcane and the divine.
| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
Tangential to the above: I’d really like a mechanical option that fit the average Nethysian better, something to blend the arcane and the divine.
The 1e Mystic Theurge prestige class really felt perfect for a Nethysian, though I think you can still emulate it in 2e through Multiclass Archetypes.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
IIRC, Nethys is all magic. Not only Arcane (and Divine through being a god).
The Cascade Bearer's Spellcasting feat of the Magaambyan Attendant archetype is what feels closest to what a Nethysian could aspire to.
True, but in 1e there wasn't the distinction between magical traditions that now exists. Druids still cast divine spells, bards still cast arcane; they just got a few options that clerics or wizards/sorcerers didn't, and the psychic class and spell list didn't exist when it was made. If you could work out an archetype or feat progression that allows tradition-neutral spell learning and casting, that would be pretty appropriate for a Nethysian.
| 3 people marked this as a favorite. |
I very badly want Qadira to Do Something. We hear a lot about the incredible power and wealth Kelesh has at its disposal, but the largest empire in the world's foothold in the Inner Sea has thrown its weight around remarkably little in play. They should cast a shadow over a Golden Road book the way Kelesh does over all of the region's history.
I very badly want Qadira to Do Something. We hear a lot about the incredible power and wealth Kelesh has at its disposal, but the largest empire in the world's foothold in the Inner Sea has thrown its weight around remarkably little in play. They should cast a shadow over a Golden Road book the way Kelesh does over all of the region's history.
I agree. Though even more so the entire empire of Kelesh, Lately there’s been this weird lack of exploration of the Golden Road as a region. Same with Vudra.
On the Golden Road though, I agree that we should expect something big- maybe Qadira is one of the great powers coming to face off another great power in the future?
| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
Kelesh as a whole is a topic for another thread, but in terms of things you could do with Qadira, I think it would be really cool to delve into its Planar pacts. Especially now that there are two whole new elemental planes - Qadira maintains embassies from the elemental planes in the city of Ehur in the Ketz Desert, and the reason Kelesh allowed its wayward Satrapy to annex Osirion was because it was too busy fighting on behalf of its allies on the Plane of Fire. With the recent marriage of Xerbystes to shahiyan Deena al-Parishat, and the resulting reformist spirit in Qadira as the Satrap indulges his new wife, it would be nice to see the ways that Qadira is moving away from exploitation of genies, genie-kin and elementals, the social upheaven as "legitimate businesses" find themselves on the wrong side of the law (including the entire city of Sedeq, which I could see turn pirate), and how elemental-touched are finding new places in society.
Thinking on that, rather than getting drawn into a war with a resurgent Taldor like the Satrap has long itching for, I'd love a story where Qadira finds itself engaging more with Kelesh's elemental pacts, especially since there's two whole new elemental planes to establish trade ties with. There's also another (relatively) nearby nation in the Inner Sea establishing trade ties on the elemental planes - Oprak, which has a connection to the Plane of Earth. Kelesh seems to favour the Plane of Fire more. And both of those planes have no love lost for each other. Oprak and Qadira, two major trade nations with elemental links who really have nothing against each other, being unwittingly drawn into the war between the Peerless Empire and the Dominion of the Flame could be pretty interesting, especially if a mixed team of hobgoblins and keleshites assemble to stop it. And I'm reminded that, so far, the only good Elemental Lord that's been found and released is Ranginori, which could be a really cool way to end the war - unleashing the original rulers and helping them to retake their thrones, Atreia bringing the Ifriti to heel and Sairazul restraining the the Oreads' from pressing the advantage. Given how notorious the City of Brass/Medina Mudii'a is for slavery, Paizo's incarnation might be overdue a regime change. If it averts a war neither Qadira nor Oprak can afford or want, so much the better!
| 5 people marked this as a favorite. |
And I'm reminded that, so far, the only good Elemental Lord that's been found and released is Ranginori,
| 3 people marked this as a favorite. |
I think the rest of them have been free since the advent of PF2, it's just that we only got a front row seat for the one the Pathfinder Society freed.
Based on Archives of Nethys' Rage of Elements update, it sounds like Ranginori is still the only benevolent Elemental Lord who's been freed. But even if they were freed, going to find two Elemental Lords and persuade them to stop a war would still be no easy feat.
| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
Based on Archives of Nethys' Rage of Elements update, it sounds like Ranginori is still the only benevolent Elemental Lord who's been freed. But even if they were freed, going to find two Elemental Lords and persuade them to stop a war would still be no easy feat.
archives of nethys is still just using the blurbs from gods and magic, the write ups in rage of elements itself talk about each of them being freed
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Yeah, AoN doesn’t update deity statblocks after their first printing.
|
|
| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
I think the rest of them have been free since the advent of PF2, it's just that we only got a front row seat for the one the Pathfinder Society freed.
Yes.
Once freed, Ranginori successfully worked on freeing his Good Elemental Lords peers of Earth, Water and Fire.
IIRC it is their release that resulted in the reappearance of the planes of Wood and Metal.
If, as is rumoured, Sarenrae is going to be killed in the upcoming War of the Immortals, what do we expect the effect to be on the Golden Road? Paizo has already ditched the Cult of the Dawnflower, what would the death of Sarenrae look like across the Golden Road? She's an extremely big part of the ecclesiastical community in Thuvia, Osirion and Katapesh, though after the Oath Wars I doubt Rahadoum would feel much other than contempt. But Sarenite clerics champion the poor in Katapesh, Sarenite crusaders roam Thuvia fighting selfish Water Lords and Div cults, and Sarenrae has a major temple in Osirion and a complicated imperial legacy.
If Sarenrae does die, does she get replaced and by who? There are a few Empyream Lords who could more than adequately fill the niche she does in THuvia and add some unique flavour to that corner of the Golden Road. And Iomedae's paladins/champions rode to the aid of a Sarenite city, and might be ideally placed to pick up the wreckage in Katapesh. And Osirion has a number of sun gods - Ra, Horus, Khepri - and Ancient Egypt had even more like Amun, Atum, Heryshaf, who may also have been worshipped in Golarion - Mummy's Mask only says that the 20 listed are the cults that survived the Interregnum. After Assassins Creed Origins, Amun kinda shot into peoples' awareness - as the state god of Egypt, the death of Sarenrae could leave a vacuum that Amun's remaining worshippers could fill. Amun's spread in Egypt is also connected with the expulsion of a Near Eastern occupier culture, Theban Egyptians spreading it as they consolidated former Canaanite Hyksos lands And for all her benefits, Sarenrae is still inextricably linked to the Keleshite Interregnum and the Satraps, Sultans and Caliphs who ruled during it. Not that Paizo is obliged to bring in yet ANOTHER real-life god, but if they're aiming for a Fantasy Ancient Egypt then Amun was a pretty important part of it and fills some niches Ra doesn't, even if it's just Ra with a few alternate domains.
I forgot to include Qadira in the previous post, and given how firm Sarenrae's worship is there, and in Kelesh as a whole, one would imagine her loss would be especially keenly felt. There's a pacifist Order of the White Feather that's been agitating in Qadira since 1e, and I recently learned they might be a surviving sect of the Peacock Spirit - another hint that Xanderghul is still active despite being killed. A Runelord using Sarenrae's death to make a play for power in Qadira might be a significant power move - through Qadira he could spread through Kelesh, currently the largest, wealthiest and most powerful empire on Golarion.
| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
Personally, what I would really want from a Lost Omen's book about the Golden Road, is to have enough narrative content as a GM to relatively easily build a campaign where the party travels great distances from city to city along one of the most traveled, but perilous trade routes in Golarion with plenty of rich detail to add to make each stretch of the journey feel unique and different.
I expect the book would be split up by political region, because that seems to be the structure of these world books, but I would be thrilled if it didn't do that and instead really just focused on the actual Golden Road trade route itself, with tangential locations mentioned but not taking up a whole lot of page space. Unless APs set here are going to focus heavily on nation state alliances and politics, (which I would not be particularly interested in personally, I'd rather the region get to exist as a well developed sandbox-ish setting for a while before popping into immediate international war and politics) I think it would be really cool to see a world book centered more on the economic environment of this region rather than a political environment for adventuring.
I think this would be cool because we already have the political environment of the impossible lands so close by for those kind of large scale political adventures, and then we have the Mwangi Expanse Book that focuses a lot on natural environments and more traditional ruins as adventure hooks. I mean I know both would also exist in the Golden Road region and be worth exploring, but as far as offering something new, the overland caravan/economic empire building aspect of Golarion feels pretty under developed yet and this feels like a good fit region for it.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
What is this tankie nonsense.Ironically, I want to point out that in fact the USSR was never a state that banned religion in itself, so comparing Rahadoum with them is not entirely logical. The USSR had problems mainly with the church and other organizations due to potential competition for public sentiment. This distinguishes the USSR, for example, from Albania, where the existence of religious organizations was outright outlawed.
That is actually true. They *just* excecuted the nuns, because they beleive women were incapable of being changing their mind from religion into communism, and force the priests to toe the line and break confession confidentiality.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
I always pictured the Dawnflower cult as a bunch of self deluded heretics who use their very own interpretation of scripture to justify their atrocities, similar to Frolo from the Hunchback of Notredame, that Paladin from the OotS or anyone on the real world who uses feinged religious peity for personal gain like a millionare televangelist. With a few misguided individuals in the lower ranks, like the Gray Gardeners.
Cool villians to be handled with care. Sad they are gone, would have been cool to fight them.
| 3 people marked this as a favorite. |
I always pictured the Dawnflower cult as a bunch of self deluded heretics who use their very own interpretation of scripture to justify their atrocities, similar to Frolo from the Hunchback of Notredame, that Paladin from the OotS or anyone on the real world who uses feinged religious peity for personal gain like a millionare televangelist. With a few misguided individuals in the lower ranks, like the Gray Gardeners.
Cool villians to be handled with care. Sad they are gone, would have been cool to fight them.
I'll reiterate my position from earlier in the thread that the Cult of the Dawnflower are not an inherently bad idea just because a Good goddess has followers who hurt innocents. You could even make the fact that Sarenrae is a good goddess, and yet their clerics and paladins apparently don't Fall, a plot point - maybe they're not actually Sarenrae worshippers at all, and were hijacked early on by, say, Aldinach, Iaozrael or Nurgal and have been hiding behind another Sun-domain goddess. But you really need to tinker with them to not make them a clear parallel and analogue for Islamic fundamentalism, and after all that tinkering it wouldn't really be the Cult of the Dawnflower any more so you might as well disband them anyway.
I'm on record as hoping the Cult is succeeded by a multitude of more local sects who worship Sarenrae in localised fashion and can draw on the positive influences of Islam - Pesh-smoking mystics in Katapesh, roving knights who protect the oases of Thuvia, a more scholarly and syncretic Osiriani offshoot, and the orthodox Sarenite faith of Qadira tying into the imperial bureaucracy and unhappy at its wayward children not listening to it, to give Sarenite worship more grounding and add texture to the region - but the Cult's role as a warmonger and regime destabiliser needed to end.
Though with the rise of the Firebrands as international agitators, maybe they can pick up some of its slack, at least where Rahadoum is concerned? At the very least, if Sarenrae isn't willing to lend her power to the cause of toppling Rahadoum's militant atheism then some former pirates which not much grasp of the local situation but some moxy and firepower might be more...gullible.
|
|
Though with the rise of the Firebrands as international agitators, maybe they can pick up some of its slack, at least where Rahadoum is concerned? At the very least, if Sarenrae isn't willing to lend her power to the cause of toppling Rahadoum's militant atheism then some former pirates which not much grasp of the local situation but some moxy and firepower might be more...gullible.
Norgorber must surely be on the case already.
Though with the rise of the Firebrands as international agitators, maybe they can pick up some of its slack, at least where Rahadoum is concerned? At the very least, if Sarenrae isn't willing to lend her power to the cause of toppling Rahadoum's militant atheism then some former pirates which not much grasp of the local situation but some moxy and firepower might be more...gullible.Norgorber must surely be on the case already.
Four gnomes in a Sarenite trenchcoat.
|
|
Four gnomes in a Sarenite trenchcoat.Though with the rise of the Firebrands as international agitators, maybe they can pick up some of its slack, at least where Rahadoum is concerned? At the very least, if Sarenrae isn't willing to lend her power to the cause of toppling Rahadoum's militant atheism then some former pirates which not much grasp of the local situation but some moxy and firepower might be more...gullible.Norgorber must surely be on the case already.
They could be 16 Sprites actually.
| 3 people marked this as a favorite. |
A little bit of thread necromancy: what if Gorum's death (and Achaekek's involvement) shake the hell out of the Golden Road?
Letting loose a war (of Immortals, even!) could easily stir up the tense border between Rahadoum and Cheliax, or else finally inspire the bellicose satrap of Qadira to disregard his peace-seeking imperial handler. LO: Firebrands paints Katapesh as a land effectively embroiled in civil war already. Achaekek's cult have a historical presence in Rahadoum, while Sarenites may well call for righteous action against the wicked all over the region. There's also always the chance that Thuvia's city-states fall in upon one another like hungry vultures if, say, their immortality elixir fails...
|
LO: Firebrands paints Katapesh as a land effectively embroiled in civil war already.
Why they keep doing this in setting books rather than adventures (which, besides being better-suited to keep up with the rapid pace and uncertain swinginess of revolution, let you actually play something) will remain beyond me.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
LO: Firebrands paints Katapesh as a land effectively embroiled in civil war already.Why they keep doing this in setting books rather than adventures (which, besides being better-suited to keep up with the rapid pace and uncertain swinginess of revolution, let you actually play something) will remain beyond me.
Why they keep putting lore in lore books is a mystery for the ages :P
Age of Ashes dedicated a whole book to shaking up policy in Katapesh, influencing the Pactmasters to ban an influential slaving operation that paved the way for this change - it is a result of play.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
There's also always the chance that Thuvia's city-states fall in upon one another like hungry vultures if, say, their immortality elixir fails...Is that likely? I always understood that the sun orchid elixir was the product of highly advanced alchemy that sort of bleeds over into arcane magic, and doesn't have anything to do with the divine.
It's produced by a single immortal alchemist who has some kind of potentially-fraying agreement with Pharasma; given that we're about to spend a lot of time focused on both war and immortality, seeing something happen with all that feels quite likely, IMO.
|
|
Why they keep putting lore in lore books is a mystery for the ages :P
I suppose it's a bit much to expect from a setting that ballooned the length of the Terror from three to forty years, but uprisings don't actually tend to last very long - either overthrowing the government or being suppressed - unless backed far more strongly by foreign powers than Andoran is doing (the Firebrands are a comparative nonfactor and can be discounted). I simply don't buy a long-running Katapeshi Civil War as part of the setting's status quo, as opposed to a brief episode leading to a changed status quo.
Someone didn't read Night of Gray Death…
Also, revolutionary change in nations happening "on screen," in the hands of heroes, really should be the exception and not a common occurrence across Golarion.
Like "involved in an incident that created a revolutionary moment" is fine to repeat, but full on "leading the civil war" or "being heavily involved in the rebuilding process" I think starts to veer into territory that will be bad for the setting.
Firstly, there can be no setting development afterwards because the leaders and heroes of every nation thusly effected would be PCs and thus not characters that can be named and talked about in setting.
Secondly, the leaders and heroes of every nation thusly effected would be PCs, and, more often than not, be characters who come from all over Golarion, with often superficial ties to the original community which is disruptive to logical story-telling.
Occasionally it is fine to have stories where nation building and deep politics are something that the PCs get to be involved in, but if they are setting hinges, it almost always has to be as advisors to the crown or involved with secret networks who's contributions will be kept out of the history books. Like King Maker, Hell's Rebels, Iron Fang Invasion and even Wrath of the Righteous are all adventure paths located in places that many Golarions would either not be able to identify on a map, or if they are well known locations, it is as a place not to go. None of them are in places central to the economies or politics of even most surrounding major nations. Other APs that play with major centers of international politics and economics in Golarion all have much subtler effects, by strong design.
Katapesh in my opinion, is one of those places where it is much better for the political upheaval to be larger and broader than a story about a small group of heroes rewriting history (I.E. stories that, on planet earth, are almost always problematic lies used to justify centralizing authority and power).
| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
It's produced by a single immortal alchemist who has some kind of potentially-fraying agreement with Pharasma; given that we're about to spend a lot of time focused on both war and immortality, seeing something happen with all that feels quite likely, IMO.There's also always the chance that Thuvia's city-states fall in upon one another like hungry vultures if, say, their immortality elixir fails...Is that likely? I always understood that the sun orchid elixir was the product of highly advanced alchemy that sort of bleeds over into arcane magic, and doesn't have anything to do with the divine.
Not to mention that the orchids themselves are getting harder and harder to find in the wild. A few fields get wiped out by some godsrain, and you either have to stop harvesting to let them grow or risk losing the species forever.
|
|
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Not to mention that the orchids themselves are getting harder and harder to find in the wild. A few fields get wiped out by some godsrain, and you either have to stop harvesting to let them grow or risk losing the species forever.It's produced by a single immortal alchemist who has some kind of potentially-fraying agreement with Pharasma; given that we're about to spend a lot of time focused on both war and immortality, seeing something happen with all that feels quite likely, IMO.There's also always the chance that Thuvia's city-states fall in upon one another like hungry vultures if, say, their immortality elixir fails...Is that likely? I always understood that the sun orchid elixir was the product of highly advanced alchemy that sort of bleeds over into arcane magic, and doesn't have anything to do with the divine.
Or the Godsrain mutates the orchids.