DRD1812 |
When you're trying to evoke a setting where humans are not the dominate race, what kinds of details do you include? So far my list includes:
-- Differently sized architecture.
-- Inconveniently tailored armor and clothing.
-- Weird foods.
-- Anti-human prejudice.
-- Linguistic difficulties. (e.g. NPCs can't pronounce human PCs' names.)
-- Inhospitable biomes. (e.g. arboreal "roads" without handrails)
Are there any nations or settlements in Golarion that really nail this sort of thing? I'm looking for references at the moment, so anything helps!
SheepishEidolon |
When you're trying to evoke a setting where humans are not the dominate race, what kinds of details do you include?
Nonhumans publicly dominating humans should be very obvious.
Are there any nations or settlements in Golarion that really nail this sort of thing? I'm looking for references at the moment, so anything helps!
There are some that use it as a theme. In Irrisen humans are second-class citizens below monsters and witches. In Geb they are slaves and food for the undead. In the Belkzen there is basically only one pocket of (mostly) human resistance against hordes of orcs, the town of Trunau. In Kyonin non-elves are rarely permitted, though there is a border town mainly populated with half-elves.
Ryze Kuja |
This should probably be in the Homebrew Forums. Anywho in situations like this, I usually try to emphasize the townfolks' demeanor. Let's say you're a group of 5 PC Humans, and you're in a town that is dominated by Catfolk. Some of the Catfolk People are "staring at you through their periphery vision you while trying to seem like they aren't", some people just stop and watch you and overtly stare, others bump into you on purpose with "shoulder checks", etc., some might even hiss at you threateningly if your party of humans show even the slightest aggression or over committing the slightest offense. And then there will be other Catfolk who attempt to repair this "societal damage" from their prejudiced kin by being excessively nice and accommodating to you, and showing you favor and being almost smothering-ly polite and hospitable, such as the tavern girl who always makes sure your drinks are refreshed before she checks on any other patron, or an Innkeeper who offers to clean and press your clothes "on the house" or for a discount.
Reksew_Trebla |
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Linguistic difficulties. (e.g. NPCs can't pronounce human PCs' names.)
I don’t think you know how names work. Humans have difficulty pronouncing other cultures of HUMANS’ names. The other races are biologically similar in mental capabilities. So what makes you think this wouldn’t be true in a “humans are the dominant race” game?
In other words, this does absolutely nothing to show humans aren’t the dominant race.
VoodistMonk |
There are no beds in Kyonin. Lol.
Small buildings. Large buildings.
Door handles and tools and other common things that are clearly designed to interact with NOT human hands... most humanoids have some sort of hands, but maybe you are in a Centaur village and they have hoof-stomp-pads instead of door-knockers.
Do all humanoids go to the bathroom the same way? What if a human walks into the bathroom to take a dump, and the hole is on the wall, not the floor...? Who uses this? How do they use it? More importantly, how do I use this before I $#!+ my pants?
Pizza Lord |
Nothing, outside of human hovels and ghettos, is written in Common. Everything is in the dominant race's language and using or speaking in Common gives an automatic –2 penalty to any checks involved. Things like Intimidation, Persuasion, Performance, and language-dependent saving throw DCs, because it's considered so sub-par, condescending, or just idiotic it can't be taken seriously or understood quickly enough to be as effective (like speaking Pig Latin, it could be sorted out by anyone with even sub-par intelligence, but by the time they did, the message and effect is probably lost).
Hugo Rune |
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I think DRD1812 has covered most of it in his OP.
I make Elven settlements rather freeform and sympathetic with the terrain. I use bike park or ski field tracks for the street network with different colours being different levels if in forests. For dwarves, I take several old english villages and stack them up on the market square which becomes the central mine shaft. Gnomes are similar to Elves, except going down instead of up and with most buildings being sized for small people. Halflings have medieval villages sized for small people. Both gnomes and halflings are more rounded than human settlements. Most goblinoid and orc settlements are based on maori pa's, military tent cities and the like. Hobgoblins follow a geometric pattern, similar to some US cities.
In terms of culture, the dominant race's outlook is considered. Elves appreciate art and beauty and have long lives. So etiquette and form, think maori powhiri or japanese tea ceremony, are important and things generally take a long time. Dwarves are gruff and to the point. Pleasantries and small talk are a waste of valuable time. Telling tall tales over an ale is how to get on socially.
Describing vastly different architectures and roleplaying creatures with different value sets are probably the two main ways to show that humans are not the dominant race. Although the same principles could apply to a different human civilization.
Tim Emrick |
Back in AD&D 2E, one of my GMs introduced a parallel Material Plane where ogre magi were much more numerous, and had formed a Magian Empire that ruled over all the usual PC races of their homeworld. When he decided to use that world as the setting for a 3E campaign, he put a lot of thought into dropping constant reminders that humans and "demihumans" weren't the ones in charge any more:
* Architecture had three distinct scales: magian, human, and halfling. Businesses that were upscale enough to cater to all three needed enough space for three different scales of furniture, and so on. (The lower-class places that didn't have magian customers still frequently had tables, counters, etc., on two levels due to halflings being one of the most numerous races.) Most stone buildings were Magian-sized, both because they were usually the wealthiest people in a community, and because their bulk required sturdier construction.
* Magians' magical powers allowed them to demonstrate their superiority on a regular basis--even when not present. For example, the highest-status Magian homes only had entrances on upper floors, which the residents could simply fly/levitate to.
* This world's ogre magi were not as uniformly evil as the rulebook implies; instead, their great numbers meant they had the same range of alignments as other races, but they still tended toward being entitled and expansionist. Overall, they were mostly LN, with evil tendencies most noticeable among the military and ruling class, who had less qualms about using and abusing their power.
* The standard players races were not slaves, but were definitely second-class citizens. Halflings suffered the least prejudice, because magians tended to find them charming, non-threatening, and useful. IIRC, elves and dwarves were a rare sight, because they had resisted the empire longer, and suffered great losses as a result; they rarely lived near communities with a magian presence.
Quixote |
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It's hard to separate race and culture in this way. All of these suggestions, which are great, are really about emphasizing that the culture is different from what a lot of us assume it would be in a typical sword & sorcerery setting.
I like to emphasize that elves, dwarves, etc. are not just humans that look a little different and have different cultures. They are fundamentally *not human*.
In my most serious setting, Elves are xenophobic to the extreme, thinking nothing of killing an intruder, be they goblin or human. They are distant and strange. Their joys and sorrows are deeper than a human's. An elf may laugh at the sight of the first star of evening or the feel of rain on their face. Songs fill them like bread and go to their hearts like wine. An elf left to grief for long enough will die. Etc.
--a lot of that is...really hard to convey in the standard D&D/Pathfinder system. When I run that setting, dwarves have an effective starting level of 5. Elves are 8. And then I can throw in a couple special abilities or whatever to simulate that magical other-ness I'm trying to capture.
Lathiira |
Try this idea. Remove orcs, goblins, kobolds, and other smaller pesky humanoid races. Let humans be the fast-breeding race pushed off into terrain the other races don't care for. Make halflings or gnomes the ones living in the hills or on the plains. Let the other races worry about humans having to expand outside their territories.
avr |
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If you're using the vastly disparate lifespans PF1 comes with by default there's legal or social expectations of adulthood - i.e. ages which most humans won't meet. Maybe the use of magic is restricted to full adults. Owning property, holding official positions, openly buying drugs and alcohol; not 'til you've got three score and ten under your belt.
Mysterious Stranger |
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First thing to do is to make changes to what abilities humans get. The standard human abilities are a very good reason why humans are the dominant race. A bonus to any STAT and an extra feat of your choice means there is nothing a human does not excel in. The extra skill is not so bad, but when added to the other two abilities it means that humans have a huge advantage over any other race.
Figure out what role you want humans to fill in your world and make their stats reflect that. Maybe humans are primitive but hardy fold. So a +2 CON, +2 WIS and a -2 INT might be appropriate. They could also be sly and sneaky, but distrusted. In that case a +2 DEX, +2 INT and a -2 CHA might be appropriate. In either case require them to trade away the bonus feat and skilled traits. The common tongue becomes the language of the dominant race, and humans have their own language.
Eliminate the half human races, or at least make them their own races. Half elves and half orcs probably need to be eliminated. The only way I could see them surviving is if their non-human race is the dominant race. If elves are your dominant race then half elves might be ok. In that case they would probably be looked down on kind of like half orcs often are. Races like Aasimar, Tieflings, Ifrit and the like become standalone races not hybrids. I would also eliminate Halflings. While they are a separate race they are too close humans.
DRD1812 |
It seems to me that there are large areas of the Mwangi Expanses that are predominately Elven. They speak Elven, and sometimes Polyglot.
Taldan? what's that?
I often have trouble with the language issue. It tends to get handwaved in practiced because 1) spells make it a non-issue and 2) I don't know Elven. My skills at improvising faux Sindarin can carry me through a scene or two, but I find that the whole "learn to communicate with the locals" thing is good for half a session or so before the players get frustrated.
Set |
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When you're trying to evoke a setting where humans are not the dominate race, what kinds of details do you include?
Green Ronin had a mini-setting (Naranjan?) where dwarves had run the place until recently, and were still a dominant race.
Modifying setting details so that dwarves have a monopoly on both exotic / skymetal crafting, and on inexpensive masterwork armor/weapon crafting, so that they literally set the prices across the continent (and squeeze out any competitors, through means that are *usually* legal and above-board, but not always...) goes a long way to establishing their 'supremacy' at least in that arena. Mithril, cold iron, adamantine and masterwork weapons are all their specialties, and cost more / are harder to even find from non-dwarven crafters. Elves are a minor exception in that they hand down masterwork blades from 'back home' (off-world), and are quite capable crafters of masterwork bows and arrows. (They have a few metal crafters capable of creating masterwork blades as well, in their capital, but, due to the work of dwarven monopolists in Druma, never seem to be able to sell them effectively among the other races.)
In Golarion, I prefer to not erase human dominance, but definitely cut it down. 70% of the Lands of the Linnorm Kings (including 4 out of 5 Linnorm Kings themselves) are dwarves, as are much of the Ulfen 'ethnicity', which includes both dwarves and humans). Druma is closer to 60% dwarvish, with fair numbers of humans, half-elves and halflings (and a smattering of other races, like gnomes, tengu and ratfolk) as well.
30% ish of the human populations of Taldor, Ustalav, Andoran, etc. are halfling. The entire Varisian ethnicity started out as halfling, but these days entire Varisian caravans might consist of half-elves or gnomes or humans, who have adopted their wandering ways.
The entire Shoanti population is half-orc, a race that breeds true and was bred by the Thassilonians as an army, and survived the fall of that culture. (A tiny percentage of Shoanti take after their ancient ancestors and are born 'pureblood' orcs or humans, but their culture ignores any difference in appearance.)
The upper class of Taldor tend to include a fair number of half-elves. Full elves are shunned, but a bit of elven blood is thought to class up the joint, and Taldans tend to use makeup and even sometimes cosmetic surgery to enhance elven traits (in the more human members) or de-emphasize them (for half-elves with more prominent elven features) since there's a fine line between 'just enough' and 'too much' visible elven features).
Without hugely changing the setting, I just sort of fluffed up the relevance of the non-human races (while attempting to play to racial stereotypes, like dwarves being good at metalcrafting and smithing).
Chell Raighn |
Another way to demonstrate humans not being the dominant race is to tackle the reason why humans are normally the dominant race... population growth and life span...
Most other races either have much longer lifespans and mature at a slower rate... as a result these races tend towards smaller populations.
On the flip side you have races with shorter lifespans than humans... these short live races tend to live fleeting lifestyles... a short lived fleeting life tends towards small families with one or two children if any... as a result short lived races have slower population growth than humans on average...
Many of the races with the same lifespan as humans have cultural aspects that limit their population growth... such as Orcs being a largely aggressive race that prizes strength over everything else... that sort of culture ultimately leads to a declining population...
So for a world where another race is dominant, their life spans and cultural norms may need to be altered to properly express why they are the most dominant... similarly the norms for humans would need to be adjusted to show why they are not dominant.