How useful is Druid Wild Shape in combat?


Pathfinder First Edition General Discussion


So, I was just curious how useful druid wild shapes would be in combat? Could you make a druid focused primarily on using wild shape for combat? Or would a wild shapeing druid be too weak to keep up with the party? Just how useful is wild shape for combat? And are there ways to improve wild shape?


Go to AoN, search Wild Shape... lots of feats modify it in various ways to can add flavor and combat utility.

Personally, I am not a fan of Wild Shape, but there are those out there that really like their giant lake octopus builds or whathaveyous.


Thank you, i'l take a look for the Wild Shape feats!


the base stat and natural armor bonuses should put you on par with a warrior of your level, raw numbers wise (ie the strength and con bonus make up for your lower hit-die and base-attack and the natural armor boost, your generally lesser armor choices). Everything else will depend on your feat selection and items

It's real strength is the utility of all the special qualities you can pick up and various movement powers and the natural attacks.


It depends on what you mean. It's always useful in combat, even if you're playing a casting focused druid, since air and earth elemental forms provide substantial maneuverability and defenses and can be used without interrupting casting. If you want wildshape to be your main aggressive option in combat, rather than the typical defensive one, then you need the proper stats, feats, items, and so on, just as you would for any other martial type character.

Wildshape stands out for their size options for grappling, their more easily available high number of attacks through various forms, and their environmental flexibility.


just finished a campaign playing a dwarven bear shaman. spent most of my time as an earth elemental doing the tanking for the party. totally viable as a combat character.


If you took away every single ability from the Fighter class except for Weapon Training and gave him Wild Shape he'd still be a good class. Wild Shape is awesome, metal based DR is going to be your one big stopping point but even that can be overwhelmed by transforming into something big with just one huge natural attack and powering over them.


If you're making a melee druid remember that high wis is a luxury, you can't afford an 18 wis any more than a fighter can. That's unless you multiclass into monk or similar of course in which case wis to AC makes high wis doable though perhaps not the absolute best choice.

Notable feats are natural spell, shaping focus and planar wild shape.

Shadow Lodge

Too weak? Hahahahahahahahah!

Wildshape druids are one of the beastliest, brokenest, unstoppable face stomping horrors of pf1.

In my experience, the reason people rarely play druids is because few people want to make spreadsheets for their fun time. Druids take a lot of math and prep work to play.

Wild shape feats:
planar wild shape is extremely powerful
natural spell is pretty much a must
powerful shape if you use forms with grab
quick wild shape if you like to walk around as not an animal and change in combat, though its easy enough just to walk around as an animal all the time.
wild speech only if your gm doesn't let you purchase a ring of eloquence

As for ability scores, you can get away with a starting str of 14 and still be an effective combatant as a druid. High strength is certainly a viable and powerful way to go, but isn't strictly necessary with all the self buffing you will be doing.


Merellin wrote:
So, I was just curious how useful druid wild shapes would be in combat? Could you make a druid focused primarily on using wild shape for combat? Or would a wild shapeing druid be too weak to keep up with the party? Just how useful is wild shape for combat? And are there ways to improve wild shape?

That's a joke, right? WS Druid, even without feats like Planar Wild Shape, mops the floor with the overwhelming majority of martials.

The question isn't whether a WS Druid can keep up with the party, but whether the party can keep up with a WS Druid. It's a tad weaker in combat during the early levels (but not problematically so), but pulls ahead at 6th level when pounce kicks in (a couple levels earlier than the likes of Barbarian!), and being able to get deal with flying/unreachable and invisiblehidden enemies without having to spend notable investment keeps them ahead.

Merellin wrote:
And are there ways to improve wild shape?

Nowadays, yes. In addition to the aforementioned Planar Wild Shape, which is mainly defensive, there're two feats that can add natural attacks (Mutated Shape and Chaos Reigns). Weapon Shift can grant reach and help overcome material based DR; the Improved and Greater versions are probably not worth it until high level.


Have only played two PF1 druids, really. One does not count because it was a version of Dark Sun and many abilities were nerfed -- including wildshape (I had agreed with that upfront.)

The other being "Dag of the Dirt" a dwarven earth/rock/mineral-focused druid who was highly effective and successful every time he wildshaped. played him 1st through 9th level before the campaign ended.

So yea, I found wildshape a fun and very effective.

I have seen table variables where GMs allow dire versions while others enforce it's a quasi-template and not allowed, some GM's allow dino's, others don't, some allow anything that has the Creature Type "animal."


Thanks everyone. =) I was mostly asking because I had not looked into druids too much and what little I had looked at them most of the things I saw was people complaining that Wild Shape was super nerfed from D&D 3.5 so I just decided to ask if it was useful or not.

Seems like everyone agrees that a wild shaped melee druid is quite capable of keeping up with the party, So thank you all!

Edit: To add, I have never played a druid in Pathfinder or 3.5, I had just seen people complain about the nerf, Therefor this thread. Sorry for the trouble!


Merellin wrote:

Thanks everyone. =) I was mostly asking because I had not looked into druids too much and what little I had looked at them most of the things I saw was people complaining that Wild Shape was super nerfed from D&D 3.5 so I just decided to ask if it was useful or not.

Seems like everyone agrees that a wild shaped melee druid is quite capable of keeping up with the party, So thank you all!

Edit: To add, I have never played a druid in Pathfinder or 3.5, I had just seen people complain about the nerf, Therefor this thread. Sorry for the trouble!

Druids were in contention for most powerful class in 3.5


Merellin wrote:
I have never played a druid in Pathfinder or 3.5, I had just seen people complain about the nerf

Well, people like to complain, especially about changes. Just look at how much the discussion of unchained Monk focussed on the nerfed will save progression, all but ignoring the huge overall power boost.

WS Druid is actually kinda similar. Gone are the days where you can play a WS Druid with maxed out wisdom and tanked physical ability scores, as polymorphing no longer replaces but only slightly alters physical ability scores. On the flipside, the limitation to HD of target animal ≤ Druid Level was removed, as was the restriction to one type of primary natural attack; and dire animals are permitted. The WS progression is also better in Pathfinder with medium/large/huge at levels 4/6/8, instead of 5/8/15, although it takes until 8th level to get rake.

I've seen it before that having played past editions of D&D actually reduces a person's Pathfinder system mastery, as such people often have a hard time accepting PF as it is. Just because a WS Druid in PF is weaker than a WS Druid in 3.5 (as weaker casting means weaker overall character), that doesn't mean it isn't stronger than an ordinay martial in PF.

tl,dr version: Don't listen to "Everything was better in the old days." folks.


Derklord wrote:
Merellin wrote:
I have never played a druid in Pathfinder or 3.5, I had just seen people complain about the nerf

Well, people like to complain, especially about changes. Just look at how much the discussion of unchained Monk focussed on the nerfed will save progression, all but ignoring the huge overall power boost.

WS Druid is actually kinda similar. Gone are the days where you can play a WS Druid with maxed out wisdom and tanked physical ability scores, as polymorphing no longer replaces but only slightly alters physical ability scores. On the flipside, the limitation to HD of target animal ≤ Druid Level was removed, as was the restriction to one type of primary natural attack; and dire animals are permitted. The WS progression is also better in Pathfinder with medium/large/huge at levels 4/6/8, instead of 5/8/15, although it takes until 8th level to get rake.

I've seen it before that having played past editions of D&D actually reduces a person's Pathfinder system mastery, as such people often have a hard time accepting PF as it is. Just because a WS Druid in PF is weaker than a WS Druid in 3.5 (as weaker casting means weaker overall character), that doesn't mean it isn't stronger than an ordinay martial in PF.

tl,dr version: Don't listen to "Everything was better in the old days." folks.

Thank you! I just heard so much complaints so I wanted to ask to see what peoples opinions here where. Thank you for the information! Sounds like Druid Wild Shape is quite useful, I'd have to try it out sometime soon! =D


I found being able to Pounce made me very powerful. (My current brawler can pounce due to gaining a very powerful feat.)

So wild shape into tigers, or the flying sphinx that can also pounce. Unlike a regular (dire) tiger, you have Greater Magic Fang and a higher base BAB.


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Merellin wrote:
Thank you for the information! Sounds like Druid Wild Shape is quite useful, I'd have to try it out sometime soon! =D

You're welcome!

In case you'd like some more in-depth look:
The strength of a WS Druid is not about doing the most DPR under theoretical/ideal circumstances. It isn't bad at that, but far from the best. Where WS Druid shines is in less then ideal circumstances:
Flying/unreachable enemies. Invisible/hidden enemies, or enemies with protection spells like Mirror Image or Displacement. Enemies that stay at range. Swarms. Enemies that enforce saving throws. Those are the challenges that martials most often struggle with, and even having solutions to just some of them makes a martial much more powerful. WS Druid has answers to all those challenges (in order: Air Walk, Echolocation, pounce, blast spells, best save progression).
So a WS Druid can reliably perform in combat, but can it perform well? It's a medium BAB class with only a +1 attack roll boost, after all (the higher strength bonuses from large/huge form are offset with the size penalty). The answer is yes, because while the attack roll may not support using power Attack (depending on the campaign), it's sufficient for a character with multiple attacks at full BAB, and the strength bonus and high number of attacks (with pounce!) result in enough damage being done.
When it comes to non-combat challenges, a prepared full caster is also much better than most martials.

Of course there are some pitfalls.
The most important thing to realize is that while it's still a full caster class, you're not playing a caster. The ability scores should look like other martials', not like a dedicated caster's - strength is the main priority stat (a starting 14 wisdom is fine). The same applies to spell selection - you're not an offensive caster, so focus on buff and utility spells. The occational blast against swarms or hordes of mooks is fine, but don't expect to use offensive spells every combat.
WS Druid is a d8 HD melee with weak reflex save progression, so watch your HP.
AC while wild shaped is also problematic. Or rather, you have to know how to deal with losing your armor. Mage Armor from a friendly caster is doable, and since each size has one clearly best combat form*, buying barding that you equip after polymorphing is feasible (Animal Archive clearly states that armor is an aviable slot for quadruped and saurian animals). And don't forget Barkskin, in either case!
Lastly, Natural Spell is your 5th level feat. That's just how it is.

*) Deinonychus, Dire Tiger, and Allosaurus, for medium/large/huge, or 4th/6th/8th level, respectively.


WS druids should have a decent STR and CON to start with as mentioned above.

I even nerfed WS as a houserule and replaced it with the Shifters wildshape... less forms. The druid still wiped out whole armies without spending too much of his casting power while the rest of the pretty powerful party was busy to survive.

Druid: Full spellcaster blaster plus melee power like a dragon. A big dragon.

If you have to fight a druid, find a way to make him don metal armor. If that doesn't work: RUN.

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