Why specifically would a champion / champion of Irori? In what way do they rely on focus powers? Lay on hands?
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I did not know you get another FP with each ability. I’ve been looking for all of the rules for Focus Points but it’s touch and go when you are on a ship.
It's not each ability, or not necessarily anyway, but many grant additional points, yes.
And why would it be hard to pray, study, or meditate, for 10 or 20 minutes on a ship?
Do you get any back after a long rest?
I believe you start each day with your full amount, yes. Though I'm not sure that's super relevant given the ability to generally get them all back in less than an hour even if that's not true.
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To be honest I am also not quite up to date about focus points and don't know where to look
If someone would give us the rundown of what we know - I would be very grateful (and likrin possibly too)
Certain classes have options to use focus spells. Generally speaking, focus abilities cost 1 focus to use and will state that they give your character a focus pool with 1 point. After combat you can spend 10 minutes doing a specific task (based on your class) to regain 1 focus point.
Some further abilities grant you additional focus spells and also expand your focus pool by 1. We know sorcerer will have a class feat that lets them recover 3 focus points at a time instead of 1.
Okay was mostly up to date except from how the focus pool is put together
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Sorcerers also sound like they can recover focus without doing a specific activity, just having time pass.
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Kind of an old post but I wonder how refocusing works if you multiclass? Especially if you were a class that doesn't get focus powers. If I was a fighter and I multiclassed sorc, would I regain focus he way a sorc does? If I was a monk but took no focus powers and multiclassed sorc, would I have to meditate to get sorc focus points back?
I think the old way of thinking regarding "multiclass" is likely what needs to change. Based on the previews, Your first class, lets say Fighter, is "what you are" and you take a dedication in another class and gain some of that classes capabilities. But you are still a Fighter. I think it is the "feat or ability" that gains you the focus point(s) so you would still "do something fighter like" for 10 min.
At least, that is the way I understand it.
I'd prefer having 1/2 level+class stat mod focus points daily, so you can use several at a time if you need them, rather than 1 per 10 minutes.
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I'd prefer having 1/2 level+class stat mod focus points daily, so you can use several at a time if you need them, rather than 1 per 10 minutes.
That’s the point. If you could spam a bunch of powers in a single combat, they’d need to be weaker. You can get a pool if up to 3 points, and there are various 1/Day in-combat recharge methods.
I think the old way of thinking regarding "multiclass" is likely what needs to change.An alternative viewpoint:
Multiclassing is fine, and being able to play a Fighter 2/Thief 3 that's 60% Thief even if you started out as Fighter is a valuable trait of any dndish game.
The beauty of multiclassing is that you aren't shoehorned into whatever choice you made at level 1.
Just a hot take.
Personally, I much prefer this approach as it makes both more effective characters mechanically and allows for a lot more interesting roleplay/character building options.
I'd prefer having 1/2 level+class stat mod focus points daily, so you can use several at a time if you need them, rather than 1 per 10 minutes.That’s the point. If you could spam a bunch of powers in a single combat, they’d need to be weaker. You can get a pool if up to 3 points, and there are various 1/Day in-combat recharge methods.
No they wouldn't. You still wind up with around the same number per day, but can save them for when you need them most. No rebalancing needed.
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No they wouldn't. You still wind up with around the same number per day, but can save them for when you need them most. No rebalancing needed.I'd prefer having 1/2 level+class stat mod focus points daily, so you can use several at a time if you need them, rather than 1 per 10 minutes.That’s the point. If you could spam a bunch of powers in a single combat, they’d need to be weaker. You can get a pool if up to 3 points, and there are various 1/Day in-combat recharge methods.
I can only say about my table.
1- Players that use no powers since they don't want to expend resources. Would have 1/2 level+class mod most fights but would expend them all when a fight start going south.2- Players that use them willy nilly and need the 10 min adventuring day.
I only see those types, i think the pool with up to 3 rechargeable make a more interesting dinamic for those two.
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No they wouldn't. You still wind up with around the same number per day, but can save them for when you need them most. No rebalancing needed.I'd prefer having 1/2 level+class stat mod focus points daily, so you can use several at a time if you need them, rather than 1 per 10 minutes.That’s the point. If you could spam a bunch of powers in a single combat, they’d need to be weaker. You can get a pool if up to 3 points, and there are various 1/Day in-combat recharge methods.
They don’t want a low level character to be able to nova focus powers in one fight. Your suggestion would allow that to happen and would result in them being nerfed.
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No they wouldn't. You still wind up with around the same number per day, but can save them for when you need them most. No rebalancing needed.I'd prefer having 1/2 level+class stat mod focus points daily, so you can use several at a time if you need them, rather than 1 per 10 minutes.That’s the point. If you could spam a bunch of powers in a single combat, they’d need to be weaker. You can get a pool if up to 3 points, and there are various 1/Day in-combat recharge methods.
Exactly - you could save them for when you need them most. Which would make them more powerful, because you would have more of them when you most needed them. Which would result in the individual powers needing to be weaker.
Kind of an old post but I wonder how refocusing works if you multiclass? Especially if you were a class that doesn't get focus powers. If I was a fighter and I multiclassed sorc, would I regain focus he way a sorc does? If I was a monk but took no focus powers and multiclassed sorc, would I have to meditate to get sorc focus points back?
We already know this, from the multiclass spoilers here.
You gain your bloodline's initial bloodline spell. If you don't already have one, you also gain a focus spell of 1 Focus Point, which you can Refocus without any special effort.
So yeah, in both of your examples you get to regain your focus without special effort. And for the monk that later goes back and picks up Ki powers after multiclassing, that's an interesting boost.
Edit: I'm assuming that there's a typo in tqomins transcription, and it should say "you gain a focus pool of one focus point". Regardless, they did a lot of very helpful work in those transcriptions, for which I'm thankful.| 5 people marked this as a favorite. |
No they wouldn't. You still wind up with around the same number per day, but can save them for when you need them most. No rebalancing needed.I'd prefer having 1/2 level+class stat mod focus points daily, so you can use several at a time if you need them, rather than 1 per 10 minutes.That’s the point. If you could spam a bunch of powers in a single combat, they’d need to be weaker. You can get a pool if up to 3 points, and there are various 1/Day in-combat recharge methods.
Saving and spamming them when needed most is exactly the problem.
You already have a mechanic for that: Spell slots. Those are the things that you have many of, that grow in number as you level and of which you can save the strongest for when needed.
Focus powers fill a different role: Non-spammable but rechargable.
With you suggestion they would fill a similar niche as spell slots... which would not be good design.
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So I'm pretty sure Draconic sorcerers can loop Dragon Wings to fly forever, because the duration eventually becomes 10 minutes. DOOOPE.
Kind of an old post but I wonder how refocusing works if you multiclass? Especially if you were a class that doesn't get focus powers. If I was a fighter and I multiclassed sorc, would I regain focus he way a sorc does? If I was a monk but took no focus powers and multiclassed sorc, would I have to meditate to get sorc focus points back?We already know this, from the multiclass spoilers here.
You gain your bloodline's initial bloodline spell. If you don't already have one, you also gain a focus spell of 1 Focus Point, which you can Refocus without any special effort.So yeah, in both of your examples you get to regain your focus without special effort. And for the monk that later goes back and picks up Ki powers after multiclassing, that's an interesting boost.
Edit: I'm assuming that there's a typo in tqomins transcription, and it should say "you gain a focus pool of one focus point". Regardless, they did a lot of very helpful work in those transcriptions, for which I'm thankful.
That is very interesting and totally what I wanted to hear. I wonder what focus powered things last 10 minutes...
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So I'm pretty sure Draconic sorcerers can loop Dragon Wings to fly forever, because the duration eventually becomes 10 minutes. DOOOPE.
OH myyyyy /takei
No they wouldn't. You still wind up with around the same number per day, but can save them for when you need them most. No rebalancing needed.I'd prefer having 1/2 level+class stat mod focus points daily, so you can use several at a time if you need them, rather than 1 per 10 minutes.That’s the point. If you could spam a bunch of powers in a single combat, they’d need to be weaker. You can get a pool if up to 3 points, and there are various 1/Day in-combat recharge methods.Saving and spamming them when needed most is exactly the problem.
You already have a mechanic for that: Spell slots. Those are the things that you have many of, that grow in number as you level and of which you can save the strongest for when needed.
Focus powers fill a different role: Non-spammable but rechargable.
With you suggestion they would fill a similar niche as spell slots... which would not be good design.
It's good design in my book (inasmuch as it would be preferable). Besides, not every class that has focus powers also has spells.
I don't really see how it's a problem to save them for a critical moment. It's already how you use consumables, especially high-quality ones.
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It's good design in my book (inasmuch as it would be preferable). Besides, not every class that has focus powers also has spells.
I don't really see how it's a problem to save them for a critical moment. It's already how you use consumables, especially high-quality ones.
Because your Focus powers should be your signature moves, that is, something you do all the time. If you're saving it for that one time when you really need it, you are not using it all the time, are you?
Because your Focus powers should be your signature moves, that is, something you do all the time. If you're saving it for that one time when you really need it, you are not using it all the time, are you?It's good design in my book (inasmuch as it would be preferable). Besides, not every class that has focus powers also has spells.
I don't really see how it's a problem to save them for a critical moment. It's already how you use consumables, especially high-quality ones.
Also like this you (usually) don't need to worry if >this fight< is the right time, you can just cast till you run out and refocus later
If you had a pool which is one time you you could end up either blasting the bbeg with so many focus moves it is not fun anymore or not using enough focus moves and later on thinking 'that could have been more fun'
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It's good design in my book
Maybe, but it's also a complete shift in what those abilities are. As it is right now focus spells are designed to be readily accessible and easy to use, an intermediate step between at-will actions like cantrips and attacking and limited resource abilities like spells.
It's not so much that it's a problem to have abilities you save for an important moment, just that it's a fundamentally different concept than having readily accessible abilities.
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It's good design in my book (inasmuch as it would be preferable).
I really can't let this comment go. Inability to tell the difference between personal preference and good design is one of the biggest barriers to competence in any design field.
The fact that you like the look of a house, does not a well-designed house make.
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Yeah, it's entirely missing the stated design goals of focus powers.
They're supposed to be decidedly different from consumables and spells. They're supposed to be slightly less powerful, but usable more frequently so that you can better realize your character's flavor all day, not just during the boss fight.
Relegating focus points to a backup pool of spell slots is exactly opposite of the reason they were made.
Focus point fill the E in the ADEU lineup. Attack and cantrips are the A, spells are the D. Luckly, compared to the [redacted], pathfinder gives different classes differents balances of ADEU, with martial leaning more to the A, wizard leaning more on the D amd sorcerers focusing (heh) on the E.
I don't have access to the book yet, but I heard there is some ability for Familiars to regain Focus for you.
Not sure of the details or any limitations. Sounds like significant benefit of Familiars to me.
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Darn, that will make it hard to do a Campion of Irori if they have a limited pool and slow recovery of them.In the Paizocon, Sorcerer have a feat that let them recover more focus points per 10 minute intervals.Where did we get this information?Do we know if a 10 minute rest recovers all focus points or just one point?We know it's a single point per 10 minutes.
Most classes have a class feat somewhere around level 10-14 that lets them get 2 focus points back in 10 minutes (assuming that they spent 2 points since their last rest and have a pool of at least 2 points). A few classes also have a higher level class feat (usually 18th level) to regain 3 instead (with equivalent requirements).
Source: I have my CRB
Edited for correctness
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Darn, that will make it hard to do a Campion of Irori if they have a limited pool and slow recovery of them.In the Paizocon, Sorcerer have a feat that let them recover more focus points per 10 minute intervals.Where did we get this information?Do we know if a 10 minute rest recovers all focus points or just one point?We know it's a single point per 10 minutes.Most classes have a class feat somewhere around level 10-14 that lets them get 2 focus points back in 10 minutes (assuming that they spent 2 points since their last rest and have a pool of at least 2 points). A few classes also have a higher level class feat (usually 18th level) to regain 3 instead (with equivalent requirements).
Source: I have my CRB
Edited for correctness
Those feats are really useful if you want to use lots of focus spells, especially multiple in the same encounter. For a focus spell specialist, they are amazing. Assuming rests between fights, you could use a favorite two-action bread and butter focus spell as almost a cantrip to save your spell slots (if you have them), or have a utility reaction focus spell available almost whenever you need it. And if you don't rest as often, you can make it through that many more battles with a slower focus spell rate without running out.
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Also, what's the big deal with resting for 20 minutes to get 2 focus back? How often can you hang out for 10 minutes but not 20?Darn, that will make it hard to do a Campion of Irori if they have a limited pool and slow recovery of them.It's a "once per encounter" kind of thing. While you probably can't use it in every room of the dungeon, you can probably use it sever times in each adventuring day. Also each time you take a new FP ability it increases your FP pool by one, so while you only get one back every 10 minutes, you may have a pool of 3 or 4 per day.
The requirements for the Refocus activity state:
So I think the bold section means that if you spend multiple points in your focus pool before you Refocus, you can only regain one point even if you take multiple 10 minute breaks since you would no longer qualify for the Refocus activity after you use it once. That makes the feats that let you regain more than 1 Focus Point even better than I thought. It's not just that they let you get Focus Points back faster, they also let you regain more than other people can.