So who here is Super Happy about sticking with Pathfinder?


Pathfinder First Edition General Discussion

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Liberty's Edge

Pathfinder Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

So I keep reading other threads where folks keep trashing Pathfinder in their enthusiasm over the shiny new game that recently has taken the gaming community by storm. It's kind of like going to one friend's house for dinner and spending the entire meal talking about how much you like another friend's cooking. It seems kind of distasteful to me.

I don't want to use this thread to throw that gaming system under the bus. What I do want to do, is find other posters that are staying the course with Pathfinder rather than jumping ship for 5th.

The purpose of this thread is to say thanks to Lisa, Erik, James, Jason, the other James, Wesley and the rest by telling them how great their system still is and why you love it enough to stay faithful to her.

I love the complexity of the rules, the well-written plots of the Paths, and the level of discourse the Paizo staff has always shared with their website visitors.

Who is with me, and why did you choose to stay with Pathfinder?

And let's try to keep the thread positive if at all possible.


Time will always tell. I am here and I suspect a good long while. Its free.


I was in the room at Gen Con when Living Greyhawk got the axe, with nothing to replace it. We were promised the ability to play on line, and that never happened, and then handed a game so easy to play that it was dull.

Paizo understands both gaming and customer service. That's extremely rare, and I remain impressed. The writing for PFS mods improves, and they try hard to deliver a good experience.

If Hasbro wants my business, they're going to have to earn it. So far, haven't seen that.


I quite enjoy it.

I like the options, I like the growth, and I like the complexity that is possible. I especially like the customizability.

Pathfinder is a job well done, and I look forward to good things to come.


i don't see a purpose to 5th , other than to attract players who have never table top gamed before.


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Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber; Pathfinder Maps, Pathfinder Accessories Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Starfinder Superscriber

I'm super happy I can enjoy both. I think 5E is great (though not my game of choice) but that has nothing to do with paizo and pathfinder. I think they're great too.


Not really that fond of the style represented by 5e. Nothing wrong with it being there ... but it isn't my cup of tea.

Liberty's Edge

Steve Geddes wrote:
I'm super happy I can enjoy both. I think 5E is great (though not my game of choice) but that has nothing to do with paizo and pathfinder. I think they're great too.

Agreed and seconded. I like both. I like Pathfinder flaws and all. I'm also not afraid to say that I do. I'm not afraid to tell someone that their feet drink even in their own homes. That just me. I do think the op is blowing the anti-parhfinder sentiment out of proportion. It's one thing to say parhfinder sucks. Which most are not IMO. It's along the lines of switching over to 5E because to some like myself may want less complexity. After all last time I checked we were allowed to discuss topics that are both negative and positive towards parhfinder. If all that is desired is a echo chamber I can do that as well.


I'm sticking with Pathfinder. I have way too much invested in it to abandon ship. I like the complexity, and I love the company as a whole. I like some of the things 5th has done, but I can never forgive them for what Wizards did to my favorite setting. Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice... I just am not ready to risk it at this time.


As for me and my group, we're sticking with Pathfinder. We love the evolution of the 3.x rules and we see no reason to sink tons MORE money into another gaming edition. We ignored 4e and decided to stay with PF. Keep on truckin', Paizo!

Grand Lodge

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Pathfinder Adventure, Rulebook Subscriber; Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber

I'm looking forward to trying out the new system, but I'll still be running Pathfinder/3.5 as my system of choice. Mostly because my players are into it.

Silver Crusade

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RPG Superstar 2015 Top 8

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I like the direction that 5e has gone in. I dislike the little complexities and optimizations in pathfinder-- its distracts from the roleplaying and exploratory aspects of the game. Yes, you can try to just ignore all the little rules, but the way a game goes down at the table does not actually work that way. Rules elicit certain responses from certain players. More gamey, rules mechanic, build and advance a character oriented rules cause many players to focus on those aspects of the game. I like that aspect of the game to a degree, but I am happy to see 5e de-emphasize it a bit.

However, I love Pathfinder for the content. Iron Gods is awesome, for example, and its not the rule mechanics. Techno gadgets that give an opponent a -1 to hit for 1 minute if they fail a DC 12 fortitude save? Who cares. But the fact that the robot was weilding an electrofied neuro-disrupter is cool, regardless of the mechanics.

The monsters in pathfinder are cool. They have lovecraftian horrors, a diverse array of Pleistocene mammals, technological terrors, rat and cat people, alien races, etc..

The adventure paths are awesome. Pirates! Rasputin in a early 20th Russia! Crashed spacecraft and alien races!

So its the content that has me continuing to choose Pathfinder as the game I DM.

The one thing I don't like about 5e is the number of bugs in the players handbook. It seems like it was pushed to release before it was totally ready. Moon druids are way overpowered, for example. Bards are so close to almost being awesome, but while the 5e developers had the insight to make them 9 level spell casters, they didn't seem to have the time to make their spell lists and spell casting mechanic interesting and flavored in a bardic fashion. Little things like that.

But aside from a few bugs, if 5e had the kind of awesome content that pathfinder has, I would switch over.

Liberty's Edge

Pathfinder Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
memorax wrote:
Steve Geddes wrote:
I'm super happy I can enjoy both. I think 5E is great (though not my game of choice) but that has nothing to do with paizo and pathfinder. I think they're great too.
Agreed and seconded. I like both. I like Pathfinder flaws and all. I'm also not afraid to say that I do. I'm not afraid to tell someone that their feet drink even in their own homes. That just me. I do think the op is blowing the anti-parhfinder sentiment out of proportion. It's one thing to say parhfinder sucks. Which most are not IMO. It's along the lines of switching over to 5E because to some like myself may want less complexity. After all last time I checked we were allowed to discuss topics that are both negative and positive towards parhfinder. If all that is desired is a echo chamber I can do that as well.

You are certainly within your rights and encouraged to speak about other gaming systems here; there is even a couple of forums specifically for that purpose. And I'm not saying people can't prefer 5th over PF. Not looking for an echo chamber.

But I do find the "thank God 5th Edition is here to save us from the atrocity that is PF" posts to be in poor taste. I'm happy these people are happy with D&D again. Can't they be happy without crapping on the other system? I vastly prefer PF, but I won't crap on 5th. The two can coexist as you have pointed out; some folks even play both.

I just wanted to tell Lisa and Company that I am remaining steadfast with their product and thought it would be cool to give others a thread to do the same.


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I've looked over the new system and it is ok, but it isn't what I am looking for. I'm in no hurry to leave Pathfinder. Plus, I'm less than 10 items from having everything!

Shadow Lodge

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I don't think anyone doubts the fervor of Paizo fans.

Liberty's Edge

I recently tried 5.0 at a game convention. It was better than 4.0; but not as good as Pathfinder, which offers a much wider range of choices/options for your character. As a D.M. I enjoy Pathfinder's varied and well supported settings for adventures.


Personally I find 5e dull as all hell and streamlined to the point of blurring out anything meaningful.

Skills? You get a few blanket 'proficiencies', which are just flat yes/no checkmarks, no granularity there.

Feats? One every four levels... if you don't want ability score increases. This one really makes me chuckle given that it was almost unanimous agreement regarding 3.5 skimping out on feats.

Classes? Slightly more balanced than 3.5/PF.. slightly. Subclasses are nice, but they're basically just big archetypes and don't do a lot to compensate for the loss of typical in-class variability.

The thing that really killed the game for me is the hideously stupid advantage/disadvantage situation. On the surface it's not too bad: Lots of fiddly combat modifiers are streamlined into advantages and disadvantages... you gain an advantage for being in a situation that makes accomplishing your goal easier and gain a disadvantage otherwise. Attacking an enemy who can't see you is an advantage, squeezing and trying to attack is a disadvantage.

Here's the kicker, to streamline it further, Advantages and Disadvantages completely cancel each other out.

That is to say, if I'm blinded, deafened, squeezing, on difficult terrain, being flanked, injured and doing a hand stand all at the same time... all of that is completely negated if my opponent is poisoned and I can attack them normally.


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*Checks for 5e SRD*

What new system?

Liberty's Edge

Pathfinder Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
TOZ wrote:
I don't think anyone doubts the fervor of Paizo fans.

Tis true. I am a fanboi through and through.


Recently my gaming group has gone to other systems, like shadowrun and iron kingdoms and atomic highway. While they're all fun systems, I'm happy to be getting back to pathfinder. I really enjoy this system and the Galorian campaign setting.

Shadow Lodge

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dmchucky69 wrote:
Tis true. I am a fanboi through and through.

See, I was trying to be nice instead of calling out the brigade. :)


I'm not really willing to jump ship. I'm more than okay with Pathfinder, plus I haven't been playing 3.X for very long compared to a lot of people so I'm still fresh in it.

I have expanded rules for the Beginner Box in case I want to do something simpler. I did that today and it seems to work okay enough.

Also I have a lot of Pathfinder stuff I have yet to use...

I just have no reason to move on right now. Maybe in 10 years I'll bet bored.


Marcus Robert Hosler wrote:

*Checks for 5e SRD*

What new system?

This + infinity!!!


I love pathfinder. I'll admit, the fact that most of the basic rules are freely accessible is a BIG bonus. But I like the system, I like the diversity of mechanically unique charcters you can create, I love the mechanical diversity of abilities (too many games you're basically JUST an accountant).

Plus, I've only played one pathfinder campaign up until now (though I am running a second).

Nothing against other systems (heck, I played a game of Dungeon Crawl Classics tonight, and I play WHFRP 2e on tuesdays) but I REALLY want to play some more pathfinder. There's a group that plays adventure paths in the same club as me, but they have nearly a dozen players regularly rotating in & out, so I've got to find something else.


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I love Pathfinder. As a system, it has decent depth while still being easy to modify, and its modular nature allows for a variety of game and play styles. The content and art are also very flavorful. Holistically, it's an amazing product and one of the best tabletop systems I've played. Thank you, Paizo.


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Gnomezrule wrote:
Marcus Robert Hosler wrote:

*Checks for 5e SRD*

What new system?

This + infinity!!!

Here you are!


I playtested and then tried the free 5th stuff. Personally not enough in the system to mechanically engage with. Way too few options for me.

I love PF, not just for all the Paizo stuff, but the ton of great 3PP out there. Kobold, RGG, Interjection, Legendary, Rite and others (those are just my favorites off the top of my head).

Plus that while they are keeping the system intact they are trying things in other design space like the Mythic Rules; and I can't wait to see Unchained.


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Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Lost Omens, Pathfinder Accessories, Pawns, Rulebook, Starfinder Accessories, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

What I don't get is some of the posts where people are quitting the entire game over the 'current direction' the company is taking its materials (usually pointing to gunslingers and technology).

It's like person, you don't have to use those books or material. S%#!, some people only play with the Core and Bestiary 1. Just because the publish it doesn't mean you have to read it or use it in the game your running or be part of a game that is having it.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure, Rulebook Subscriber; Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber

I know we will just be using the PHB for 5E. I don't see why they can't do the same with Pathfinder.


MYTHIC TOZ wrote:
Gnomezrule wrote:
Marcus Robert Hosler wrote:

*Checks for 5e SRD*

What new system?

This + infinity!!!

Here you are!

Toche'

However- Basic rules as in not even the core rules from the players handbook.

Its not the full rules from DMG.

Its not the full content of the monster manual.

I wonder a year from now will it include additional new options that are coming out then like equivalents to the APG, ARG, ACG, Ultimate Magic, and so on and so on.

No Gnomes!!!!

The Exchange

Pathfinder Companion, Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Charter Superscriber

I am also sticking with pathfinder, for the same reason I stuck with paizo when 4e was announced. Way to much invested into it, don't have the time these days to learn a new system, nor do my friends. And there isn't anything really wrong with it, and I like the taste.


MYTHIC TOZ wrote:
Gnomezrule wrote:
Marcus Robert Hosler wrote:

*Checks for 5e SRD*

What new system?

This + infinity!!!

Here you are!

Where is the search function?

Can I type into google "5e Fighter" and go straight to the class table?

*Was aware of free "Basic Rules"*

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure, Rulebook Subscriber; Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber
Marcus Robert Hosler wrote:
*Was aware of free "Basic Rules"*

Then why ask 'what system'? :P


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Oh my it got very 2008 in here all of a sudden!


I've got a ton invested in PF and it continues to please so I'm happy to stay.

Now, I have looked at the 5e books and they are nice. The MM is especially appealing for it's great art but not appealing enough for me to start over with something new.


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TriOmegaZero wrote:
Marcus Robert Hosler wrote:
*Was aware of free "Basic Rules"*
Then why ask 'what system'? :P

Implied: Without an SRD it might as well not exist.


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Yeah, part of it for me is realizing how absurdly expensive WoTC is. 50 bucks for a CRB vs... that same price three times over for a PHB, DMG and MM. And no OGL means you have to buy every single splat to keep up.

Ech, that's a lot of money.

Liberty's Edge

Pathfinder Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
LeesusFreak wrote:
stuff...

Ouch. This was kind of the type of vitriol I was hoping to avoid. While I agree that the system simplifies things further than I'd like....

A) I was trying to state things about PF we like, not things about 5th we don't.

B) There are much more PC ways to state things than this.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure, Rulebook Subscriber; Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber
swoosh wrote:

And no OGL means you have to buy every single splat to keep up.

Ech, that's a lot of money.

I've bought a PHB. I don't know that I will be buying anything else. So I guess I won't be keeping up?


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Jumping ship? Staying faithful? When was it declared that I have to choose only one?


After having bought a bunch of 4th edition books,and being forced to sell them to buy pathfinder books.The WOTC would have to do something amazing to get me back buying 'D&D' books.
I like the fact that Paizo is a not a huge corporation like Hasbro.
5ed might be good to get new players interested but I don't have much faith in the company as a whole.


Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber; Pathfinder Maps, Pathfinder Accessories Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Starfinder Superscriber
swoosh wrote:

Yeah, part of it for me is realizing how absurdly expensive WoTC is. 50 bucks for a CRB vs... that same price three times over for a PHB, DMG and MM. And no OGL means you have to buy every single splat to keep up.

Ech, that's a lot of money.

You should probably add the price of a Bestiary to the $50 for the CRB to compare apples to apples, but 5e is definitely more expensive if you're planning on buying CRB+Bestiary vs MM/PH/DMG.


Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber; Pathfinder Maps, Pathfinder Accessories Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Starfinder Superscriber
dmchucky69 wrote:
A) I was trying to state things about PF we like, not things about 5th we don't.

It's not really PF-related love, but I'll continue to run my games in Golarion, regardless of system. I really like the thought that paizo put into their flavor material (and its modular nature and ease of ignoring stuff I dont like).


dmchucky69 wrote:
LeesusFreak wrote:
stuff...

Ouch. This was kind of the type of vitriol I was hoping to avoid. While I agree that the system simplifies things further than I'd like....

A) I was trying to state things about PF we like, not things about 5th we don't.

B) There are much more PC ways to state things than this.

Fair enough. I've had the discussion so many times my fuse is incredibly short for it. That said, I am actively playing a 5e game and we're almost through the first book in the AP, which is pretty well written (little weak and cliche at points, but hey, so was Runelords). Playing with two friends who are new to tabletop, is why the DM picked it (and because he had the same "ooh, shiny" reaction many are having).

The versatility of Pathfinder is what I really enjoy. Sure, there are feats broken on both sides of the power curve, some taxes that are worthless (Looking at you, Combat Expertise), but that can all be adjudicated really easily.

Liberty's Edge

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dmchucky69 wrote:


But I do find the "thank God 5th Edition is here to save us from the atrocity that is PF" posts to be in poor taste. I'm happy these people are happy with D&D again. Can't they be happy without crapping on the other system? I vastly prefer PF, but I won't crap on 5th. The two can coexist as you have pointed out; some folks even play both.

I have seen none of the "thank god for 5E to save us from Pathfinder" type of comments. I might have missed such comments I admit. Mostly I'm seeing fans happy with less complexity. Less numbers to keep track off. Easier to run than PF. Martials get more love style comment. I get you like Pathfinder. I still think your overexagerating the hate for the system. If anything I have seen more dislike from the PF fans on certain topics than from the 5E fans in some cases. I admit I dislike a few things with the PF rules myself. For 5E I'm reserving judgement until I have the entire core set.

dmchucky69 wrote:


I just wanted to tell Lisa and Company that I am remaining steadfast with their product and thought it would be cool to give others a thread to do the same.

I can respect that. It could have also been done without the finger pointing towards some of the fanbase who like 5E. It truly was not needed at all imo.

Liberty's Edge

swoosh wrote:

Yeah, part of it for me is realizing how absurdly expensive WoTC is. 50 bucks for a CRB vs... that same price three times over for a PHB, DMG and MM. And no OGL means you have to buy every single splat to keep up.

The only advantage over the 5E prices is that the Pathfinder core is a PHB and DMG in one. Unless your buying on Aamzon the core is 50$. I will grant you that the Bestiary 1 is 10$ cheaper than the 5E Monster Manual. It's not just W0tc I can list a few other companies who have expensive prices for their books. Try being a fan of Shadowrun 5E.

As for having to buy every book because of no OGL. Gimme a break. We D&D fans were just fine before a OGL came along. Do you think myself and others bought every 1E or 2E D&D book. The smart D&D groups bought what they needed. No one was or is forced to buy every book for every rpg. I may not buy the Strategy Guide. My players, the DMs I play with and myself are not going to lose any sleep because were not "caught up".


Most of the campaigns I've been in are home-brewed to such a degree that, other than picking a campaign world (Toril, Oerth, etc.), there is room to use products from any game. Planescape being this to the nth degree but all the others somewhat less so.


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It's not so much happy with Pathfinder as happy with Paizo.

There's no comparison. Customer Service FTW.

*drops the mike*

*walks away*

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